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satay
16 March 2006, 11:58 AM
I have an old old relation with Ma Shakti. Born in a Vaishnava family in punjab india, my family tradition is of shakti. Growing up, me and my brothers and sister were surrounded by the pictures of Ma in our house. Our little temple in the house had pictures of Ma Durga in the center Kali on the left and Hanuman on the right. My mother does diya even now without missing a day everyday.

When I was a kid, I asked Ma for everything: an easy exam, a top mark, a good day, even the courage to talk to that girl in 1st grade! Glad to say that Ma has been listening intently and nurturing every whim and fancy of mine.

My father is a great devotee of Durga. During his younger days he went to Vaishnu devi temple by walking from our home in punjab as a yatra many times! I don't know how he did this but I remember it well that he did it several times when I was a kid.

Jai Mata Di!

satay

Ram
24 March 2006, 07:03 AM
You behave like me too...:)

I am also born in a Vaishnava family but I am very fond of Mata-ji. Same with my parents too. We find Bhagwan and his sister Yogamaya to be inseperable, or differentiable in anyway.

Singhi Kaya
04 April 2006, 03:09 PM
Om Kali Tara Mahavidya Sodrosi Bhubaneswari
Bhairabi Chinnamasta ch Bidya Dhumabatii tatha
Bagola siddhabidya ch Matangii Kamalattmika
etadasa mahabidya siddhabidya prakirtita


Kali, Tara, Tripura, Bhubaneswari, Bhairabi, Chinnamasta, Dhumabati, Bagola, Matongi and Kamala - these 10 are known as the wishdom goddess.


Pardon my poor transliteration:(

atanu
13 April 2006, 04:18 PM
Anandamayi Chaitanyamayi Satyamayi Parame

Devibhakta
17 April 2006, 08:47 AM
My experience is a little different. Born and live in northeast US, for most of my adult life I was unaccepting of traditional forms of Christianity, but was involved in various groups that recognized and worshipped a Father God and Mother Goddess. The closest to this in Christianity is the Mormon which actually recognizes a Divine Mother, but doesn't talk much about it because they don't have any revelations to explain Her. I was there briefly, but moved on because of the lack of attention given to the Goddess. I went through a New Age phase, but finally drifted off into solitary contemplation, in which I was able to clarify my thoughts and feelings about the Goddess, who I was unable to name. But as time went on, I began to recognize that She was the Ultimate, and manifested in many ways over the ages, and that the Father God was one of Her principal manifestations, but that She was the Infinite Energy that created, sustains and dissolves the universe. I knew that this inversion of female -- active and male -- passive was not in accord with Western philosophy and religion, but didn't really know what to do with it, so I kept it as my personal article of faith. At some point, I also investigated Buddhism, and it was through this effort that I stumbled across the worship and devotion to Devi and the Dasa Mahavidya, and everything fell into place!!

I accepted and surrendered to the Divine Feminine, and am at peace.

ramkish42
17 April 2006, 02:04 PM
Idea is good

ananya prokete gathiatra naasti is what I want to say.

Self learning is not lead to eternity. Believe in yourself and when you are ready a guru will appear for you. May lord grant you all his bliss.

We Hindus strongly believe that Man-Woman manifestations are absent in the very god. His diversified manifestations are for us but in reality there is nothing called goddess or god. We still feel bound by such divisions for our language does not allow us to use different genders.

We also trust all sounds that are available in this universe are names of the god. It is only we curtail it to make it mean the specifics

I am discouraging you but want to share the truth.

Devibhakta
17 April 2006, 03:36 PM
Namaste, Ramkish,

What you have said is not at all discouraging. I didn't go into more detail because my post was just an introduction. I do agree that at the right time, a guru will be made known to me, and have no anxiety over that issue. Also, I do think that that above, beyond, or under everything is the undifferentiated reality, which we perceive as descending into the differentiated meanings, and I believe that the earliest form we are able to recognize is that of Devi. That thought is new to me that you have given, that all sounds that are available in the universe are names of the god.

Thank you for responding, and I hope you will continue.

ramkish42
17 April 2006, 03:42 PM
Namaste, Ramkish,

What you have said is not at all discouraging. I didn't go into more detail because my post was just an introduction. I do agree that at the right time, a guru will be made known to me, and have no anxiety over that issue. Also, I do think that that above, beyond, or under everything is the undifferentiated reality, which we perceive as descending into the differentiated meanings, and I believe that the earliest form we are able to recognize is that of Devi. That thought is new to me that you have given, that all sounds that are available in the universe are names of the god.

Thank you for responding, and I hope you will continue.

You are always welcome. I am much happy to part details with american brethren.

By Guru, I was just indicating to reduce your pre conceived ideas and try to pick up as much material as possible. Many things might come up as contrary to your current ideology but do not neglect it - do learn it. When a guru appears, you are always requested to receive him with open heart.

Jai shree krishna

Devi is another version of Mahamaya, wonder of lord, who is neither male nor female nor eunuch

Namo Narayana
17 April 2006, 03:43 PM
Devibaktha. i wish you were more detail on your devotion to devi. why were you inclined on female form of god ? are youa feminist or something like that ?

Devibhakta
17 April 2006, 04:15 PM
Ramkish, thanks again. I hope always to be receptive to ideas because there might always be truth in the one I choose to ignore.

Namo Narayana, no, I am not feminist, it's just that ever since the time when I was little more than a kid intellectually, I read about patriarchical or Abrahamic religions being unbalanced because they were exclusively masculine. This stayed in my mind as very and absolutely true, and I built on it within my own cultural framework, and later breaking through those boundaries. And in developing my understanding, I followed the path I described. So, devotion to Devi is the finding of what I had been looking for, and as I read and contemplate the Devi Mahatmya it seems more and more real. As Ramkish has advised, I will also be ready to abandon pre-conceived ideas.

ramkish42
17 April 2006, 04:21 PM
Suggest you to read GUNA RATNA KOSAM.

This might be good lunch for your thoughts as it voices in the similar lines

Jai shree krishna

shian
16 March 2007, 10:02 PM
i want to learn more about Shakta,
in my town have ISCKON ashram, Sai Baba Centre, Shiva Temple (and Guru Nanik), Balinesse Temple (pura)

but not have Shakta Temple.

in Indonesia, Jakarta have many Hinduism Temple, like Shakta Temple...

I am is Baghavati Tara Devi bhakta,
the Mantra is "Om Tare Tutare Ture Suoha", everyday i chant Her mantra
i build Tara Shrine (small), with my Root Guru in center, Syama Tara (Green Tara), and Ganesha (in Buddhist Tripitaka, Ganesha is son of Mahesvara and Uma). etc...
...^_^...

i want to go to Devi Ma Temple, homage and chant for Devi, ....

i hope i can go!!!

Agnideva
16 March 2007, 11:25 PM
Namaste Shian,


i want to learn more about Shakta,

I am is Baghavati Tara Devi bhakta,
the Mantra is "Om Tare Tutare Ture Suoha", everyday i chant Her mantra
i build Tara Shrine (small), with my Root Guru in center, Syama Tara (Green Tara), and Ganesha (in Buddhist Tripitaka, Ganesha is son of Mahesvara and Uma). etc...
...^_^...

i want to go to Devi Ma Temple, homage and chant for Devi, ....

i hope i can go!!!

Tara Devi is also present in Tantric Hinduism. She is one of the ten forms (Mahavidyas (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahavidya)) of Shakti. In Hindu Tantra, as far as I know, there is only one form of Tara - Nila (Blue) Tara, unlike Buddhist Tantra where Tara has many forms - Green/Jade Tara, Blue Tara, Black Tara, Red Tara, etc. However, the other Mahavidyas are associated with other colors - like Maha Kali is black, etc. In Hindu Tantra, Saraswati (Nila Saraswati) is equated with Nila Tara, so Tara and Saraswati are the same.

The Tara mantra in both Hindu and Buddhist tantra is the same - Om Tare Tuttare Ture Svaha.

OM Shanti,
A.

shian
18 March 2007, 01:04 PM
wow....
is same "Om Tare Tutare Ture Svaha"??....wow...

you know, some Buddhist Guru said Sarasvati is form of Tara.

Buddhist also homage to Laksmi Devi, Visnu (known as Narayana Deva), Maha Mahesvara, Uma, Rudra, Sarasvati, Brahma, Indra, Surya, Candra, Kurukulla, Ganesha, Kartikeya, Kuvera, Wife of Kuvera, 4 Heavenly Kings, Marici, etc... so many...

because, the universe is one

Some people said, Hinduism Gods is adharmik Gods.
But,.... He/she dont know, when he/she chant the Surangama Dharani....
Surangama Dharani is full of Hinduism Gods name!

When someone open heart to learn Buddhism deeply, he well know to respect Hinduism.

(but a little doubt in "Deva", because the word Deva in Buddhism is beings in the samsara) but in reality, some Hindu Gods is same with Buddha.

Like Tara, Tara is Buddha!

Agnideva
18 March 2007, 01:49 PM
Namaste Shian,

Some people said, Hinduism Gods is adharmik Gods.
But,.... He/she dont know, when he/she chant the Surangama Dharani....
Surangama Dharani is full of Hinduism Gods name!
Can you tell me what is Surangama Dharanai?


When someone open heart to learn Buddhism deeply, he well know to respect Hinduism.

(but a little doubt in "Deva", because the word Deva in Buddhism is beings in the samsara) but in reality, some Hindu Gods is same with Buddha.

Like Tara, Tara is Buddha!The Divine Beings are the same, actually :). In Buddhism, they are called considered Devas and Bodhisattvas. In Hinduism, our interpretation is a little different: we have a heirarchy. There are Devas like Indra, etc. who reside in the astral/subtle plane. Beyond that we have Mahadevas like Ganesha and Kartikeya who reside in the causal plane. All the Devas and Mahadevas are part of samsara. Beyond that we have the concept of Trimurti (Brahmā-Vishnu-Rudra - Creator-Sustainer-Dissolver). Beyond that, we have the abstraction of Ultimate Reality - known as Brahman (in Vedantic philosophy) or Paramashiva (in Agamic/Tantric philosophy).

OM Shanti,
A.

shian
18 March 2007, 10:19 PM
All the Devas and Mahadevas are part of samsara, u mean All Devas and Mahadevas is can be reborn again, and enter the hell or etc?

what about Indra? Indra can rebirth again to the lower realm like human, animal or hungry ghost and hell??

^_^
Surangama Dharani you can find in http://www.tendrel.za.pl/mantry.htm

Agnideva
18 March 2007, 11:01 PM
Namaste Shian,


All the Devas and Mahadevas are part of samsara, u mean All Devas and Mahadevas is can be reborn again, and enter the hell or etc?Technically only the Devas in the astral/subtle plane can be born again and again, not the Mahadevas in the causal plane. The Devas of the astral/subtle plane are positions occupied for a certain amount of time. The Mahadevas of the causal plane reside in their causal bodies guiding lower beings, until the dissolution of the universe.


what about Indra? Indra can rebirth again to the lower realm like human, animal or hungry ghost and hell?? Yes, Indra is a position held for a period called a Manvantara (306,720,000 human years). In every Manvantara, there is a new Manu, leader of men, on earth, and a new Indra, king of Devas, in Svargaloka.


Surangama Dharani you can find in http://www.tendrel.za.pl/mantry.htmThanks. I could only recognize some of it, like the mantras. What language is it? Dutch? It doesn't look like Bahasa. So, is Surangama Dharani based on Tibetan Buddhism? I saw some Tibetan script on that page.

OM Shanti,
A.

shian
19 March 2007, 01:37 PM
no... thats not bahasa. ^_^

no... Surangama Dharani not only Tibetan, manya Mahayana sadhaka chant Surangama Dharani, Chinesse Buddhist have chant Surangama Dharani.

Surangama Dharani is use Sanskrit , is originally from India.

shian
30 March 2007, 09:17 PM
Agnideva,
the Mantra of Tara "Om Tare Tutare Ture Svaha" is from which text or scriptures?

thank you...^_^..

Agnideva
31 March 2007, 09:48 AM
Agnideva,
the Mantra of Tara "Om Tare Tutare Ture Svaha" is from which text or scriptures? thank you...^_^..

Namaskar Shian,

I am told that the Om Tare Tuttare Ture Svaha mantra is from the Tantraraja Tantra. I have not, however, read this book.

OM Shanti,
A.

sm78
31 March 2007, 12:50 PM
Namaskar Shian,

I am told that the Om Tare Tuttare Ture Svaha mantra is from the Tantraraja Tantra. I have not, however, read this book.

OM Shanti,
A.

I'm told it is also in Brihad Nila Tantra ~ however I too have not read anything myself.

btw, i think the "Om Hrim Strim Hum Phat" is mantra of Tarini as worshipped by Hindu's. "tare tuttare.." is mentioned, but not sure if it is the primary Tarini mantra for hindus.

yajvan
02 April 2007, 07:20 PM
Hari Om
~~~~~

i think the "Om Hrim Strim Hum Phat" is mantra of Tarini as worshipped by Hindu's. "tare tuttare.." is mentioned, but not sure if it is the primary Tarini mantra for hindus.

Namaste sm78,
This mantra, Hrim Shrim Hum Phut - very close to the one you posted, is very powerful as it contains key bija (seed) vibrations.
The overall mantra is that of Sri Tara ( also that vibration is found in Jupiter)... now, Vasistha muni suggests, Hrim Strim Hum Phat.
So, here's the story behind the story...
Vasistha-ji tried various mantra's of ekajata ( the one given first) and failed to receive it's fruits. He then was advised by Sri Tara to use the mantra you have suggested w/o Srim and subsitute Strim ( pronunced Streem).

For me, this Srim (too) is vary auspicious as a seed mantra, and is the vibration of Sri Lakshmi and also of my favorite Ram. [ Om Sri Ramaya Namaha]
Now this Hreem ...to the tantric's this Hreem is = to Om in it's importance. It's also called lajja bija or shyness or bashful bija seed vibration. Hreem for me is of great import, as it's the sound of akasha. And who owns this space from a tantric perspective? Bhuvanesgwari. It is via this bija sound one is able to make one's awareness as vast as possible ( since it owns akasha, the vast, unbounded). Via this vastness, one is associated with the infinte, and gains infinite peace.


pranams,

sm78
03 April 2007, 04:02 AM
Namaste yajvan,

Hrim/Hreem is certainly the king of bija mantras is as respected as pranava among shaktas ~ often called shakti pranava. Thanks for pointing out its relation to Akasha.

I knew the story of Vasistha Ji and his trouble with tarini sadhna. It is said that initiation in Tara sadhna will cause various material trouble for the sadhak due to Vasistha's curse. Tara has her left foot forward as opposed to sri dakshina kalika who has her right foot forward~ indicates the sadhak sees a reverse perspective in many things in life ~ the essence of viparit achara or vama achara.

All this from a smartha perpective ~ for kaulas and vajrayani's tara is a very compassionate devi ~ I'm told. But I don't have 1st hand knowledge about these things.

shian
30 April 2007, 10:18 PM
I see in photo,
The Devi Maa temple is full with blood, so...weird...

why must kill cow, etc for ritual?

sm78
01 May 2007, 01:09 AM
I see in photo,
The Devi Maa temple is full with blood, so...weird...

why must kill cow, etc for ritual?

Not cow... male goat (occasionally buffalo bulls, no female species allowed) .

Cow is the sacred mother.
_____________________________________________________________

Why is it a problem to offer it to the goddess the stuff you eat anyways?

However animal sacrifice is not a sattvic rituals and as such prescribed only
for some castes, in the worship of a few forms (Ugra) of the Goddess.

However it is only superstition and cultural downfall that people is some regions
get into a sort of frenzy ~ thinking that they will gain something by offering
more animals. I am talking more about kAli ghAt in WB. This thing happens when
there is no one to guide dharma and puja is done for Kama siddhi instead of
moksha. When people go to temple wishing for chariots and elephants, what
more can be expected ?

That said, when done as per shastras, I see nothing wrong with animal sacrifice.

yajvan
01 May 2007, 09:10 PM
Hari Om
~~~~~~


Not cow... male goat (occasionally buffalo bulls, no female species allowed) .

Cow is the sacred mother.
_____________________________________________________________

Why is it a problem to offer it to the goddess the stuff you eat anyways?

However animal sacrifice is not a sattvic rituals and as such prescribed only
for some castes, in the worship of a few forms (Ugra) of the Goddess.

However it is only superstition and cultural downfall that people is some regions
get into a sort of frenzy ~ thinking that they will gain something by offering
more animals. I am talking more about kAli ghAt in WB. This thing happens when
there is no one to guide dharma and puja is done for Kama siddhi instead of
moksha. When people go to temple wishing for chariots and elephants, what
more can be expected ?

That said, when done as per shastras, I see nothing wrong with animal sacrifice.

Namaste sm78, et.al

Sooner or later we need to have a conversation on this pasu-yajya.
This sarifice of beings, is not of the rishi's teaching, yet is allegorical that is , symbolics. Think of what Adi Shankara brought to India on this matter. Where there animal sacrifices? No doubt. Yet based upon the wrong knowledge. What is consumed in the yajya fires of the Rig Ved rishi's were the lower instincts that are animal-like, that is, the beast being offered.

Again this will or may cause much disturbance on this HDF forum, yet my readings and teachings suggest that the muni's of the Vedic period did not offer living beings into the fire. Could others ? (based upon ignorance), perhaps so and I cannot argue these actions. Yet when I think of the rishi that knows Brahman, a brahamavit, and knows all is an extention of his SELF in nature, then the offering of another being into fire must be obtuse to his values and tradition.

pranams,

Agnideva
02 May 2007, 04:51 PM
Namaste Shian,


I see in photo,
The Devi Maa temple is full with blood, so...weird...
why must kill cow, etc for ritual?

This is not true of all Devi/Shakti temples, only some. In some branches of Tantric Hinduism, animal sacrifices are allowed. Also in folk/shamanistic sort of traditions in rural India/Nepal, animal sacrifices take place. Many times the animal sacrifices take place because there is a belief that the ugra (fearful) forms need appeasing. Many people in the rural areas have a belief (superstition) that if Devi is not appeased, there will be no rains, the crops will fail, there will be disease, children will starve, and so forth. In some places, this is slowly changing, as the mindset begins to change, and the animals are replaced with pumpkins, etc.

OM Shanti,
A

Agnideva
02 May 2007, 05:03 PM
Namaskar Yajvan,


Sooner or later we need to have a conversation on this pasu-yajya.
Yes Yajvan, I agree. No time better then the present.


Think of what Adi Shankara brought to India on this matter. Where there animal sacrifices? No doubt. Yet based upon the wrong knowledge. What is consumed in the yajya fires or the Rig Ved rishi's were the lower instincts that are animal-like, that is the beast being offered. If I'm not mistaken, sacrifice of animals in the context of vedic yajna is no longer performed. Some scholars give credit to the Vaishnava and Shaiva Agamas for doing away with animal sacrifice, as they command that only fruit, flowers, and sattvik food should be offered. What we have today is largely animal sacrifice in some Tantric practice, and in rural folk-shamanistic practice.

OM Shanti,
A.

yajvan
02 May 2007, 07:11 PM
Hari Om
~~~~~~

Namaskar Yajvan,


Yes Yajvan, I agree. No time better then the present.

If I'm not mistaken, sacrifice of animals in the context of vedic yajna is no longer performed. Some scholars give credit to the Vaishnava and Shaiva Agamas for doing away with animal sacrifice, as they command that only fruit, flowers, and sattvik food should be offered. What we have today is largely animal sacrifice in some Tantric practice, and in rural folk-shamanistic practice. OM Shanti, A.

Namaste AD,
thank you for the post. Yes, we should start a seperate post on this.
Today it is possible that animal sacrifice is practiced. I am not as knowledgable on Tantric practice of this nature. I am sure there are reasons for this approach that are beyond my scope of reasoning.

For yajya done today ( that I participate) , 16 offerings are standard fare. We have reviewed this in a previous post.
I think of what Krsna says - just a fruit, a leaf, some water, I will accept this, when done with sincerity and well-intentions. I cannot hear him say - give me a goat. I mean no dis-respect to those that may choose to do this, it is beyond my understanding and teachings.

pranams,

sm78
03 May 2007, 06:45 AM
Again I am not the person who should talk about Vedas, but I think it is difficult to argue that animal sacrifice is against the vedas or vedic dharma. Sure it can be said rightly that literal animal sacrifice is not what the rishis meant and it is not the essence of the vedic religions. But that is a different thing from saying that animal sacrifice is wrong or against vedic dharma. I think, if I am not wrong, Kanchi Paramacharya held the same view. I'll try to dig it out.

Smartic rules disallow the practice for dwijas, but khatras are sure allowed to practice the same.

Tantras or Shakta Agamas ofcourse endorse the practice for the Vira Sadhak in vamachara stage. One cannot do justice to hindu rituals without practicing them ~ I am very sure , bali has great psychological impact on the practitioner.

However all such practices have some rules and are to be performed by specific people in specific times. The only thing I have problem with is when 1000 people turn up each day to offer a goat to the goddess.

Agnideva
03 May 2007, 08:33 AM
Namaste Singhi,


Again I am not the person who should talk about Vedas, but I think it is difficult to argue that animal sacrifice is against the vedas or vedic dharma. Sure it can be said rightly that literal animal sacrifice is not what the rishis meant and it is not the essence of the vedic religions. But that is a different thing from saying that animal sacrifice is wrong or against vedic dharma. I think, if I am not wrong, Kanchi Paramacharya held the same view. I'll try to dig it out.
Smartic rules disallow the practice for dwijas, but khatras are sure allowed to practice the same.
I am not a person who should talk about the Vedas either, but from my little reading about this issue, I think what you've said is correct. I have also come across the same writing from the Kanchi Paramacharya, and I take his view as the official Smarta view on the subject.

The argument that is made, however, is not that animal sacrifices did not take place in vedic ceremonies, but that they were a later introduction into the yajnas. In other words, it was the widespread ignorance of the kaliyuga that brought animal sacrifice into the Vedic rituals. This was the view held, for example, by Maharshi Dayananda of Arya Samaj. The Nastika arguments against animal sacrifice may have played a key role in ridding of the practice in vedic ceremonies. There was once a belief that the animal would go directly to heaven if sacrificed in a vedic ritual. The Lokayata materialists had criticized this belief by saying something like, "if the sacrificed animal goes directly to heaven, why not sacrifice your father instead."


Tantras or Shakta Agamas ofcourse endorse the practice for the Vira Sadhak in vamachara stage. One cannot do justice to hindu rituals without practicing them ~ I am very sure , bali has great psychological impact on the practitioner.I think one difference between the Vedic method and Tantric method of sacrifice is how the animal is killed. In the Vedic method, the animal was strangled. In the Tantric method, it's a single blow (jhatka method). Guru Gobind Singh also recommended the his followers (Sikhs) only eat animals killed by the jhatka method (as opposed to the Islamic halal bloodletting), but then again he was well-versed in Shakta practices.

In Indian Hinduism, due to the puritanical and ahimsa movements of the last 2000 years or so, animal sacrifice is now a minority thing, and largely considered a tamasik act (at least by those who shun it). It may be surprising to know that in Balinese Hinduism, animal sacrifice is a mainstream ritual practiced in almost every temple. Ahimsa movement has also arrived there, and now the society, I'm told, is divided on the issue.

OM Shanti,
A.

sm78
03 May 2007, 09:16 AM
Namaste AD,

I would say you have put the matter very well and in correct perspective in your above post.

shian
17 May 2007, 12:13 AM
Namaste,
can someone help me to trenslate this sanskrit mantra?

" OM TARE TUTARE TURE JAMBHE MOHAYA DANAMEDEHI SVAHA"

JAMBHE=Destroy
MOHAYA=???
DANAMEDEHI=Give me dana (money or wealth)

i dont know the meaning of MOHAYA,
but i know MOHA is the darkness of mind (like avidya)

but if become MOHAYA i dont know........

thats Mantra of Prosperity Tara, the one of 21 Tara
http://www.iloveulove.com/images/04-tara_famine.jpg