A Question of Complexion

[Jodhaa]

Namaste, all,

As some of you know I'm working on a Ramayana Illustration project. I've moved past one chunk of research and I've done the layout for my first painting. But I'm hesitating for one reason. From the beginning of the project I've been debating on what color Rama's complexion should be. In classic depction he is often (although not always) blue. And as Shivafanji pointed out, he is also sometimes depicted as green. The third option is to simply depict him with a natural (but darker - than his brothers') skin tone.

I had settled on giving him a natural skin color, because of plans to depict his transition back to his form as Vishnu later in the series.

I was curious about people's opinion here. I may not change my mind, but the choice strikes me as important - but maybe not. Maybe it's all just the artist's personal preference. :)

Thank you!

[jignyAsu]

Pranam,

Sri Rama has been described as ShAma (dark) by Hanuman, Akampana etc all over Valmiki Ramayana and so certainly He is to be painted dark, as you say.

The blue idea comes from describing Him as: "IndIvara Shyamam" by ShUrpaNakA, Dasaratha etc.

Is it possible to give a tinge of Blue color without making Him look blue?

Disclaimer: I am a very bad artist..cannot draw a straight line with a scale!:D

[Jodhaa]

Is it possible to give a tinge of Blue color without making Him look blue?

Disclaimer: I am a very bad artist..cannot draw a straight line with a scale!:D

Thank you for your comments, JignyAsu :)

Your suggestion about adding a tinge of blue is interesting. I will have to experiment to see.

It's interesting because one of the things you get taught in art school is that you should almost never use black paint to paint anything black. You should mix a dark brown with a dark blue. The reason? Straight black flattens a picture whereas, blue/brown give it subtle dimension.

You don't have to be a good artist to know what you like - everyone has an opinion ;)

[Believer]

Namaste Jodha,

Is it possible to give a tinge of Blue color without making Him look blue?
I think that is a good suggestion.

But if I were you, before embarking on this project, I would ask myself if I truly have reverence for Shri Ramji? Do I consider Him to be an avatar of Vishnu? Have I made peace with my doubts about my perception of Him having abandoned the "love of His life"? And this is not a question of forgiving Him, for no one forgives the Lord, but rather a question of my sharpening my intellect and devotion to understand the complexities of His actions. I say all this because the mental state of mind and the devotion for the Deity is bound to flow into the art created to depict the Deity. And without full devotion, there would be unseen voids in the artwork created, which would make Him appear to be more human and less of a Deity.

Good luck on your project.

Pranam.

[Viraja]

Believer ji,

Isn't entire Uttara Khanda of Ramayana along with Sita's agnipravesha all considered to be later-on additions and not part of the original Valmiki Ramayana?

[Viraja]

deleted.

[Believer]

Namaste,

In Tamil, Rama is described as 'Pacchai pasum kondal vannan' (as green as the 'peas').
That is very interesting. So, do we want a North Indian style depiction of Ramji or a South Indian style depiction? :) He is one deity whose earthly existence did involve traveling the whole country from Ayodhya down to TN and beyond. So, many ethnic groups in India can claim to have had close association with Him; unlike Shri Krishan whose lila revolves mostly around Mathura/Vrindavan, Kurukhestra and Dwarka. My personal preference would be green, just because most of the other deities are shown with a bluish color.

Pranam.

[Jodhaa]

Namaste Jodha,

I think that is a good suggestion.

But if I were you, before embarking on this project, I would ask myself if I truly have reverence for Shri Ramji?

Good luck on your project.

Pranam.

Yes, Believer - I have made ample peace with Lord Rama.:) That is, I have a new, more complete understanding of his actions and their purpose. I don't consider "human-ness" to be an issue, since he needed to be human in some respect in order to fullfill his duty to destroy Ravana.

Thank you for commenting:)

[Jodhaa]

Namaste,

That is very interesting. So, do we want a North Indian style depiction of Ramji or a South Indian style depiction? :) He is one deity whose earthly existence did involve traveling the whole country from Ayodhya down to TN and beyond. My personal preference would be green, just because most of the other deities are shown with a bluish color.

Pranam.

Well now you're just trying to make things complicated for me;) Should I mix my blues and greens together for some sort of middle ground?

[Believer]

Namaste,

Well now you're just trying to make things complicated for me;)
Frequent changes are a sign of cleanliness; so my mind must be really clean. :)

Since I find a precedent for use of green color among Tamils to depict Him, I prefer that because in the illustrations, that would be brighter/more pleasing to the eyes. But it is your call; per the community both colors are acceptable.

Pranam.

[ShivaFan]

Namaste Jodhaa

Good luck on your artistic project, since it has a lot of devotion in it and you are very artistic, you will know what to do.

I am curious, what medium are you using? Pastels, water color, acrylic artist paint, oil paint?

Just f.y.i. if you are using oil paints you can affect a lot of the outcome by first treating your canvas to a few coats of gesso. If you are drawing an outline on the canvas to have a schema of your painting, many avoid using lead since it has a tendency to bleed into the oil paint. Also, some of the more cheaper paints look colorful when first applied and initially dried, but then take on a faded or even dirty look after months. What you mix with the paints obviously also effects the initial presentation and dried presentation. If you like to have some very fine art effects to the color tones of Rama's skin tone, of Hauman's etc., you might research a type of oil paints called "lakes" though these can be expensive.

In my opinion, the finest oil paints are "Old Holland" brand, which range from moderate to expensive but all are good. How you finish your painting with different protective coatings can add shine, or purposely lessen such in your painting.

Whatever your medium, it is extremely rewarding. I am also working a couple of painting projects, one of Annapurna and just starting one of Hanuman.

All the best!

Om Namah Sivaya

[Jodhaa]

Namaste Jodhaa

I am curious, what medium are you using? Pastels, water color, acrylic artist paint, oil paint?

Whatever your medium, it is extremely rewarding. I am also working a couple of painting projects, one of Annapurna and just starting one of Hanuman.

All the best!

Om Namah Sivaya

Nameste, Shivafan!

I didn't know you were an artist! You should share your work with the forum! :) Thank you for the advice and the recommendation. I don't use oil paints, although I love how rich the colors can be. I don't have the proper ventilation. I'm using watercolor and gouache - a type of matte, opaque watercolor that goes on smooth and works really well for the kind of intricate detail I like to paint. It can be very expensive and many of the colors are impossible to find in brick and mortar art stores anymore - so I have to find them online. I love working with them though.

You reminded me of something! I wanted to try and mix my own yellow, using turmeric, and my own red using kumkum. I know there is a way to do it, but I have to experiment.

Good luck on your own creative endeavors!:D

[philosoraptor]

Believer ji,

Isn't entire Uttara Khanda of Ramayana along with Sita's agnipravesha all considered to be later-on additions and not part of the original Valmiki Ramayana?

Pranams,

Sita's agni-pariksha is part of the original - it occurs at the end of yuddha-kANDa and there are plenty of references to it in other canonical literature as well as in traditional Hindu culture.

As far as Sita's subsequent banishment as narrated in the uttara-kANDa, I would opine after reading it that it probably is authentic as well. There are references to this event in other texts, most notably the 9th Canto of the bhAgavata purANa.

[philosoraptor]

As far as the original question is concerned, I would recommend going with blue.

Whenever Rama's complexion is described in the Valmiki-Ramayana, it is usually as being "blue" but sometimes described as "brown." I have never seen Him described as green in Valmiki.

You should consider what it is you want to do with your art. So much of what is conveyed in art is done so without words. Rama's "human-ness" is an overstated principle especially in popular culture; His divinity is often less emphasized, which is unfortunate. If you want your art to to portray Him as the Godhead Himself, and induce reverence and devotion in others, then blue is your best choice. If you go with brown, it will make Him look more "human," which in turn will induce very different feelings from those who see it.

[ShivaFan]

Namaste Jodhaa
Well I guess its nice to try art, not sure if I would call myself an artist but art is certainly one way to perform Bhakti!

I have done a little gouache myself. I just might share a painting on the forum, but now you inspired me to do an art painting of Ram! I am reading an English version of a Bengali Ramayana, and this has Ram shown in a green. Actually, the version is enjoyable, but not the best I have read but still rewarding. Still, I may use a green blue or blue green approach as follows, Old Holland Earth Green, it won't be exectly green as you start out because it is very dark and can almost be black, good for edges, eye lashes, as you work towards the highlighted tones on the skin but before areas where light would strongly strike, thinking of thinning it out and let it brighten. In the lighted areas then mix in Old Holland Warm Gray Light. It will become both greenish with blue. Contrast Rama with adjacent backgrounds of yellow and gray.

I am looking forward to your work if you share it. Blue of course is wonderful. As with things of quality, it takes time, use the time and heart, you seem a natural for this, it must be the blessing of the Divine.

Om Namah Sivaya

[Jodhaa]

Namaste Jodhaa
Well I guess its nice to try art, not sure if I would call myself an artist but art is certainly one way to perform Bhakti!

I have done a little gouache myself. I just might share a painting on the forum, but now you inspired me to do an art painting of Ram! I am reading an English version of a Bengali Ramayana, and this has Ram shown in a green. Actually, the version is enjoyable, but not the best I have read but still rewarding. Still, I may use a green blue or blue green approach as follows, Old Holland Earth Green, it won't be exectly green as you start out because it is very dark and can almost be black, good for edges, eye lashes, as you work towards the highlighted tones on the skin but before areas where light would strongly strike, thinking of thinning it out and let it brighten. In the lighted areas then mix in Old Holland Warm Gray Light. It will become both greenish with blue. Contrast Rama with adjacent backgrounds of yellow and gray.

I am looking forward to your work if you share it. Blue of course is wonderful. As with things of quality, it takes time, use the time and heart, you seem a natural for this, it must be the blessing of the Divine.

Om Namah Sivaya

Thank you for your kind words, Shivafan. :) Today I too will be doing some experimenting with color. One of the challenges I am working through is that, to make Rama both blue and dark, I risk looking the definition in his features - unless I make the blue a sky blue such as in some traditional depictions. I have one idea for a solution - to outline the features in a lighter color so that they stand out.

I will share my painting when it is finally complete. I hope you will share as well! This project has just begun and yet it does already make me feel closer in my devotion. I have been to two separate temples to ask for Sri Ram and Sri Sita's blessing for the project. I won't know if they have, of course, until it is complete so we shall see. :) I try to be an optimist.

Peace to you and best of luck on your paintings!

[philosoraptor]

"Always bet on blue"

:-)

[charitra]

Namaste,
both Rama and krishna should be idially painted in BLUE hue. Sometimes we see white marble stone sculptures of their murthis, thats because blue stone is a very rare find.Green or other colors are not accepted by the majority.

[Jodhaa]

Thank you to everyone who contributed their opinions. :)

After some experimentation this is what I've found:

- Mixing a blue hue into a darker skin tone color just makes a muddy, grey-green color, so unfortunately, that won't work.
- a blue green is a lovely color, but for my style it has the effect of making Rama look a little under the weather.
- However, after painting with several shades of blue I think I've struck on a combination that is both visually effective and allows me to be true to the most commonly accepted image of Rama.

Once the painting is finished I will certainly post a picture of it so that it can be harshly scrutinized by the forum;)

Thanks again everyone!

[jignyAsu]

Thank you to everyone who contributed their opinions. :)

After some experimentation this is what I've found:

- Mixing a blue hue into a darker skin tone color just makes a muddy, grey-green color, so unfortunately, that won't work.
- a blue green is a lovely color, but for my style it has the effect of making Rama look a little under the weather.
- However, after painting with several shades of blue I think I've struck on a combination that is both visually effective and allows me to be true to the most commonly accepted image of Rama.

Once the painting is finished I will certainly post a picture of it so that it can be harshly scrutinized by the forum;)

Thanks again everyone!

Excellent! Maybe your difficulties in giving shades of blue will actually explain why He is often painted in green..just a thought.

But I had one more question. Valmiki Ramayan goes into amazing depths in describing His lovely form. Are you keeping these other descriptions in mind? Like broad shoulders, long arm, hidden collar bone, symmetrical shape, shining skin and attractiveness. I guess the art should also display His qualities which, again, are in great detail -> firm, calm, strong etc.

Each of His divine aspects of His form has been noted in great detail and I am afraid that any work done in hurry may actually go against what reside deep in hearts of Hindus. Just a suggestion that's all.

[Jodhaa]

Hello JignuAsu,

Yes, your concerns are definitely noted and I have spent quite a few hours perfecting the rest of Rama's physical features. While my style departs slightly from natural human form (I tend to exaggerate the facial features for the sake of expressiveness for example) I think I've done a good job in making him symmetrical, tall and attractive. I'm even accounting for his age change as the story goes on.

I have tried to put the same care into Sita's design too. :) There is nothing I want more then to depict them both in the best way I can.

Thank you for your suggestions!