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Agnideva
18 April 2007, 01:53 PM
Namaste.

Bhairava = "Terrific"

Bhairava is a fierce form of Lord Shiva. I am trying to find some information about Bhairava. I thought I would post anything I find on this thread, and invite others to share their knowledge on Bhairava.

http://photomas.net/images/nepal/katphotos3/i26katbb1a.jpg
Bhairava form in Kathmandu, Nepal

Thanks.

OM Shanti,
A.

Jigar
18 April 2007, 02:30 PM
Namaste Agnideva,
I sugggest to possiblyy look into the root of Rav As I suspect upon a suspicion of wordology.


maste nam,
jigar

Agnideva
18 April 2007, 04:56 PM
I sugggest to possiblyy look into the root of Rav As I suspect upon a suspicion of wordology.

Namaste Jigar,

Bhairava is derived from bhaya (fear), so means fearful or terrific. I checked up on rava for you, and rava means cry or roar. But, I don't think rava is part of the etymology of Bhairava.

OM Shanti,
A.

Agnideva
18 April 2007, 05:13 PM
Shri Bhairava Deva

Bhairava holds within Himself the entire universe by reducing all the Shaktis to sameness with Himself and inasmuch as He completely devours within Himself the entire mass of ideation (which is responsible for sense of difference) - Shiva Sutras, Jaideva Singh

Bhairava means "terrifying" and it is an adjective applied to Shiva in His fearful aspect. Yet in Kashmir Shaivism, the three letters of this name are taken in a different manner. Bha means bharana, maintenance; ra means ravana, withdrawal and va means vamana, creation of the universe.
The Rudrayamala Tantra, quoted in a puja manual Bhairava Upasana, describes the worship of Vatuka Bhairava, or Bhairava as a small boy, and gives his mantra as hrim vatukaya apadudharanaya kuru kuru batukaya hrim. Although the ascription to Rudrayamala is commonly found in the colophons of tantrik texts, these passages do not appear in the modern work now available.

However, the same work gives dhyanas, or meditation images of Vatuka Bhairava as comprising the entire three gunas, and also separately as Vatuka in His sattvik, rajasik and tamasik guises. In his form as the three gunas, He is described as being like pure crystal, effulgent as the rays from 1,000 suns, shining like a sapphire thundercloud and wearing sapphire coloured clothing. He has three eyes, eight arms, four arms and two arms, depending on the preponderance of the guna, has a fanged, fearsome gaping mouth, and a girdle and anklets of live serpents. He is digambara (naked as space), He is the prince-lord (Kumaresha), and is very powerful. In his right hands he holds a staff with a skull on the top (khatvanga), a sword, a noose and a trident. His left hands hold the hourglass-shaped damaru drum, a skull, he shows the mudra bestowing boons and holds a snake in the last.

The sattvik dhyana describes Vatuka Bhairava as resembling crystal, and as white as the kunda flower, wearing celestial clothing and nine gems, of a flaming appearance, adorned with anklets of bells, having a bright, beautiful and handsome face, with three eyes. He has two hands, one of which wields a trident (shula).

The rajasik dhyana says he resembles the rising sun, with three eyes, with red limbs, in his four hands showing the sign bestowing boons, and holding a skull. In one of his left hands he holds a trident and with the other shows the mudra (hand gesture) dispelling fear. He has a blue, bejewelled throat, on his forehead is a fragment (kala) of the crescent moon and he wears clothes red as the banduka flower.

The last, tamasik dhyana, has Vatuka Bhairava as stark naked, blue in colour, with reddened hair, with terrifying fangs, three eyes, anklets of jingling bells, and with eight arms.

The yantra of Bhairava, in all his different forms, is similar to that shown below.

http://www.shivashakti.com/vatuka.gif

From the yogic point of view, if an individual applies the Bhairava Mudra, he or she looks both outwards and inwards at the same time and is one with Shiva-Shakti. Bhairava is terrible, terrifying, because He represents pure consciousness, before which the kleshas (obstacles) and conditioning of an ignorant human being crumble.

Source: http://www.shivashakti.com/bhairava.htm

Jigar
18 April 2007, 07:13 PM
Namaste AgniDeva,
I find that Lord Shiva seems to be at a major confliction within himself issuing a self sense of eternal damnation among brothers.


Om Kara,
jigar

Agnideva
19 April 2007, 11:47 AM
I find that Lord Shiva seems to be at a major confliction within himself issuing a self sense of eternal damnation among brothers.

Namaste Jigar,

The Divine fearful forms are rarely understood in the correct sense. This is one of the reasons why I created this thread. There are fearful forms used in all Hindu denominations. In Vaishnavism, the bhairava form of Vishnu is Ugra Narasimha (http://brooklynsoda.com/narasimha.jpg). Similarly in Shaktism, there are Bhairavi or Kalaratri (http://www.kheper.net/topics/Tantra/ht28.jpg) forms of Divine Mother. The fearful forms go to show that it is not only what we perceive as good and beautiful that is Divine, but so also what we perceive as ugly and bad. Death and dissolution are as much a part of the Divine, as are birth and creation. Otherwise, we will be left with God and the opposite of God (Satan); eternal salvation vs. eternal damnation. The benign and fierce representations are created on purpose to provide balance. One is meant to see the benign in the fierce forms, and the fierce in the benign forms. And then that which is beyond both benign and fierce. This is my opinion on the subject.

OM Shanti,
A.

sm78
19 April 2007, 12:15 PM
We need not bring in the abrahamic concepts of "eternal", "salavation" or "damnation" while discussing dharma. These dogmas make no sense here. Fearful or wrathful are not qualities of Atman but the way the mortal bhakta sees God. The wrath is only against avidya.

Bhairava essentially is the form of Shiva in the Tantras. He is a great buddhist deity as well. I am not sure whether it was the nAstika who worshipped him first or it is the other way round. I'm sure both sides will have claims and refutations on this. In Astika world Bhairava is an aspect of Shiva who is all and beyond all. In the nAstika world bhairava holds much elevated position than Gods including Shiva.

As far as I know Siva as Bhairava is integral to the worship of goddess in any one of the 10 maha vidya forms. Each maha vidya has her Bhairava representing the static aspect of the shakti (Mahakala bhairava with kAli etc). It is said the worship of a mahavidya without worshipping her bhairava results in great sin and can only bring forth kama siddhi. Moksha is impossible without worshipping bhairava or shiva aspect of the shakti.

I'm not sure, I will ask Agnideva to shed more light on this. Is Bhairava worshiped by Saivas also as fearful form of Shiva?? I though for saivas there are other fearful forms of shiva like the vedic rudras and the famous Sharabha Murthi Siva, as also his various Tandav poses. I have never heard Saivas using the term bhairava which is very much tantric.

Agnideva
19 April 2007, 01:39 PM
I'm not sure, I will ask Agnideva to shed more light on this. Is Bhairava worshiped by Saivas also as fearful form of Shiva?? I though for saivas there are other fearful forms of shiva like the vedic rudras and the famous Sharabha Murthi Siva, as also his various Tandav poses. I have never heard Saivas using the term bhairava which is very much tantric.
Namaste Singhi,

There is confusion over this issue, and that is the main reason I started this thread. Bhairava is well known to Shaivas, and is worshipped by Shaivas as well. However, sometimes there is a tendency among some southern Shaivas to say that Bhairava is not Shiva, but a guardian of Shiva kshetras, Shiva temples, etc. Other Shaivas say that Bhairava is Shiva Himself, who manifested in the fearful form when Brahma claimed that He found the upper end of the Jyotirlingam (Infinite Column of Light). Then, there are the Kashmir Shaivas who worship Bhairava as Shiva Himself, and use the 64 Bhairava Agamas, spoken by Shiva in the form of Bhairava unto Shakti as Bhairavi. Southern Shaivas have also used some of the Bhairava Agamas in the past, most notably the Vijnana Bhairava. So, I don’t believe the opinion that Bhairava is not Shiva. The Kauai Adheenam acknowledges that Bhairava is a fearful form of Shiva.

The eight Bhairavas you mention are also part of Shaivite belief, and the guardians of the eight directions, especially in the city of Kashi. They are said to be forms of Mahakala-Bhairava, who is the center.

In Saiva Siddhanta, one of the 25 forms of Shiva is called Kalari (Destroyer of Time) or Kalasamhara-Murti. I have a theory that Kalasamhara-Murti, Mahakaleshvara, and Mahakala-Bhairava are just different names for the same form.

OM Shanti,
A.

shian
19 April 2007, 02:22 PM
Namaste Agnideva,

wow~~~
your Bhairava picture is same to Dharmapala in Tantra Buddhism or Vajrayana, is so like the wrathful manifestasion from Buddha and Bodhisattva, look like Mahakala! http://goldenmother.org/Galleria/Painting/dharmapala/l_mahakala-03.jpg

in Buddhism, Mahakala is manifestasion of Avalokitesvara.

This is Mahakali ! She is protector of Syamatara

http://www.thangka.ru/gallery/img/lhamo_6.jpg

Agnideva
19 April 2007, 04:18 PM
Namaste Shian,

your Bhairava picture is same to Dharmapala in Tantra Buddhism or Vajrayana, is so like the wrathful manifestasion from Buddha and Bodhisattva, look like Mahakala!

in Buddhism, Mahakala is manifestasion of Avalokitesvara.

Thanks for the pictures :).

In Hindu Dharma, Mahakala-Bhairava is a form of Shiva. The descriptions of Avalokiteshvara in Buddhism is very similar to Shiva (and sometimes Vishnu) in Hinduism. I noticed this especially in the Nilakantha Dharani you posted before.

Are there different forms of Mahakala (Bhairava) in Buddhism? Do you know of a Diety called Vajra-Bhairava?

In Tantric Hinduism, there are generally 8 forms of Bhairava (sometimes 64 = 8 x 8). They are manifestations of Mahakala-Bhairava, and guardians of the eight directions, especially in the holy city of Kashi (Varanasi).

North ~ Bhishana Bhairava
Northeast ~ Samhara Bhairava
East ~ Asitanga Bhairava
Southeast ~ Ruru Bhairava
South ~ Chanda Bhairava
Southwest ~ Krodhana Bhairava
West ~ Unmatta Bhairava
Northwest ~ Kapali Bhairava

The center is Mahakala-Bhairava, who is Shiva, Himself.

Summarized from: http://tinyurl.com/yv9g4f

OM Shanti,
A.

Agnideva
19 April 2007, 04:26 PM
Is Bhairava worshiped by Saivas also as fearful form of Shiva?? ... I have never heard Saivas using the term bhairava which is very much tantric.

Here you go Singhi, this is a Saivite perspective on Mahakala-Bhairava.

~A.
-----

Kaala Bhairava - The Lord of the March of Time

Lord Kaala Bhairava is that manifestation of Lord Siva who oversees the march of time.

The inexorable march of time is inexorable only because Lord Kaala Bhairava makes it so.

As the saying goes, time lost is lost forever. There's nothing more precious than time. So intelligent humans should use every moment effectively on the spiritual path. And those want to do this have the divine help of Lord Kaala Bhairava if they request it with sincerity.

Those who tend to fritter away their time on many a trivial pursuit should pray sincerely to Lord Kaala Bhairava if they want to improve their time management skills and if they want to make sure that they use their time intelligently.

Lord Kaala Bhairava is also known as Kshetrapalaka, the Guardian of the temple. In honor of this, keys to the temple are ceremonially submitted to Lord Kaala Bhairava at temple closing time and are received from Him at opening time.

Lord Kaala Bhairava is also the Guardian of travellers. The Siddhas advise us that before embarking on a journey, especially one that involves travel during the night, we should make a garland of cashew nuts and decorate Lord Kaala Bhairava with it. We should light jyothi lamps in His honor and request His protection during our travel.

The vahana (vehicle) of Lord Kaala Bhairava is the dog. Feeding and taking care of dogs is another way of showing our devotion to Lord Kaala Bhairava.

Kaala Bhairava Ashtami, which occurs in December/January is an important day for worshipping the Lord.

There's a shrine for Lord Kaala Bhairava in most Siva temples. The Bhairava shrine in the Arunachala temple is very special. The Kaala Bhairava temple in Kasi (Benares) is a must-see for Bhairava devotees.

The Kaala Bhairava Ashtakam hymn venerates the Lord and is a staple of Bhairava devotees.

May Lord Kaala Bhairava help us use our time effectively on the spiritual path.

Om Salutations to Lord Kaala Bhairava
Om Salutations to the Lord of the March of Time
Om Salutations to Maha Guru Sri Agasthiar
Om Salutations to the Agasthiar Lineage
Om Salutations to the Siddhas

Source:
Agasthiar’s Universal Magazine
Issue 14
Sri-la-Sri Matha Agasthiar Ashram
Thiruvannamalai, Tamilnadu, India
http://www.agasthiar.org/AUMzine/0014-kb.htm

shian
21 April 2007, 12:48 PM
Agnideva, can you tell me what the verse of Nilakantha Dharani is have related with Hinduism? (i am very interested to know, but i know a little, in that Dharani have Mahakala , its have related in Hinduism. And have a Krsna name... but now i want to know more... more... hehe..^_^..)

i think, Buddhism and Hinduism have same Nirvana,
the different of phislosopy about god is not important, coz that is for the begginer. And if we talk about doctrin, an debate about doctrin, somtemies is good, but the most important in Self Realization is our sadhana.
For example:
Shian is clever boy, he have read many of Buddhist and Hindu philosopy and doctrin. But he cant controled his emotion, and he never do sadhana.

Agnideva not understand about philosopy and doctrin, but he do the sadhana with heart, and He can attain the samadhi from sadhana, and he can controled his emotion, so he can realize Nirvana.

...^_^...

Agnideva, Vajra-Bhairava is Yamantaka, you can serach in google about Yamantaka, He is manifestasion of Manjusri and Amitabha.
He very popular in Tibetan Vajrayana and Japan Mantrayana (Shingon).

I chant Kurukulla Mantra, for Vasikarana.

in website i find Hinduism have Kuruklla, that is true?

.......

Agnideva, do you know, why Ganapati called "Ganapati Bappa moriya?" what is the meaning of word "Bappa" and "moriya" ?

Thank you very much

Agnideva
21 April 2007, 07:38 PM
Namaste Shian,


Agnideva, can you tell me what the verse of Nilakantha Dharani is have related with Hinduism? (i am very interested to know, but i know a little, in that Dharani have Mahakala , its have related in Hinduism. And have a Krsna name... but now i want to know more... more... hehe..^_^..)
There are quite a few names actually. I will have to go through the Nilakantha Dharani again and list them for you. I will do this on the Nilakantha thread shortly.


And if we talk about doctrin, an debate about doctrin, somtemies is good, but the most important in Self Realization is our sadhana.
For example:
Shian is clever boy, he have read many of Buddhist and Hindu philosopy and doctrin. But he cant controled his emotion, and he never do sadhana.
Agnideva not understand about philosopy and doctrin, but he do the sadhana with heart, and He can attain the samadhi from sadhana, and he can controled his emotion, so he can realize Nirvana. Yes, Shian sadhana is most important. However, I am not sure that I am the best example for someone who has controlled emotions and performed enough sadhana to attain nirvana :D.


Agnideva, Vajra-Bhairava is Yamantaka, you can serach in google about Yamantaka, He is manifestasion of Manjusri and Amitabha. He very popular in Tibetan Vajrayana and Japan Mantrayana (Shingon). Thanks! I will have to look Him up online.


I chant Kurukulla Mantra, for Vasikarana.
in website i find Hinduism have Kuruklla, that is true? Yes. There is a Kurukulla Devi in Hindu Tantra. I think she is also part of the Sri Vidya tradition as one of the Nityakala Devis associated with different phases of the moon. I don’t know too much about Kurukulla, perhaps SM78 knows more. You can see some information on this site: http://www.religiousworlds.com/mandalam/kuru.htm


Agnideva, do you know, why Ganapati called "Ganapati Bappa moriya?" what is the meaning of word "Bappa" and "moriya" ? Yes, this one I know :). In Maharashtra (state in central India), Ganapati is the most famous and beloved Deity. Every year, there is a Ganapati festival for 10 days beginning with Ganapati’s birthday. So, clay statues of Ganapati are made and worshipped for the festival and then at the end, the statue is ceremoniously submerged in a river or sea. When Ganapati leaves people wish Him goodbye and say, Ganapati Bappa Moraya, Pudhachya Varshi Lavkar Ya meaning “O Lord Ganapati, please come back quickly next year.” Bappa means father or lord. Moraya is actually a name of a saint and devotee of Ganapati who lived ~700 years ago. When the statue of Ganapati is submerged, many people have tears in their eyes because they think Ganapati is leaving them till next year, but the truth is Ganapati is always close to the devotee. Moraya’s name said along with Ganapati’s is meant to remind us that Ganapati never leaves our side, ever!

Jai Ganesha.
A.

shian
23 April 2007, 02:05 PM
so, Ganapati Bappa moraya is mean “O Ganapati my Father, please don’t leave me” ??
thank you..^^

Agnideva
24 April 2007, 09:45 AM
Namaste Shian,

so, Ganapati Bappa moraya is mean “O Ganapati my Father, please don’t leave me” ?? thank you..^^
Yes, you can think of it that way :).

Regards,
A.

shian
16 May 2007, 11:44 PM
who said Shiva and Brahma is lower Deity in Buddhism?
Shiva is the one of 12 Devas Guardian in Buddhism, He is called Isana or Mahamahesvara.

in:
# Taisho Tripitaka Vol. 21, No. 1297 The page of make offering to 12 Devas

Buddha said: The 12 Devas is manifestasion of ancient Buddha!

Shiva in Buddhism :
http://www.upf.edu/materials/huma/central/historia/rutaseda/imatges/4inicis/mahesva.jpg

Bhairava108
18 July 2007, 01:38 AM
Namaste Agnideva,

there is not a whole lot of public information, concerning Bhairava as he is a very powerful Deity! within himself he contains supreme conciousness and supreme power. in other words all power or Sakti is Bhairava! all conciousness is Bhairava! he is deffinatly a deity to which there is no apposeing force! he is in and of himself Supreme! Bhairava can be very dangerous both to the devotee and to those around the devotee this is why public Information is limited. and why Bhairava Sadhana should be approached carefully and with strictness and absolute self controle. Initiation into Saddhana of Lord Bhairava is a must! The Bhairava of Nepal is Many the one in kathmandu in darbar square I believe is Maha Kal Bhairava he is the protector of the people of Nepal! and the country itself! kings take oaths before him. and are sworn into office in his pressence. He is very important to the people of Nepal! like Siva is to shaivites or Vishnu to Vaishanavites. or Sakti to sakta's so is Bhairava to Nepal!

sarabhanga
18 July 2007, 11:18 PM
Namaste,

bhairava (from bhIru) means “frightful, terrible, horrible, or formidable”.

bhIru (from bhI) means “fearful, timid, cowardly, or afraid”, and it indicates “a shadow” ~ and the plural is bhIravaH.

So that bhairava is “one of the fearful ones” (the frightful or formidable one) or “one who is of the timid ones” (fleeting or hidden, or protecting those who are afraid) or “one who is of the shadows”.

bhI is “to fear” or “to be afraid or anxious”.

And ru is “to roar, bellow, howl, yelp, or cry aloud”, “to make any noise or sound”, “to sing” or “to praise”; and ru means “to break, shatter or dash to pieces”, “to kill or to be angry”, “to speak”, or simply “to go”; and ru indicates “sound or noise”, “fear or alarm”, “battle or war”, and “cutting or dividing”.

So that bhIru is “to roar, howl, cry out, etc. fearfully” (either out of fear or invoking fear); or “to praise anxiously”.

rava (from ru) is “a roar, yell, cry, howl, song, hum, clamour, or outcry”, “thunder” or “talk” or “any noise or sound (e.g. the ringing of a bell, etc.)”.

So that bhIrava is “a frightful sound” or “formidable thunder” (etc.), and bhairava is the one connected with such shattering or piercing noises.

bhA means “to shine” or “to be bright or luminous”, “to shine forth or appear”, “to be splendid or beautiful or eminent”, “to show, exhibit, or manifest”, or “to be or exist”.

And bhai is the first person singular present case of bhA ~ “I am shining or luminous”, “I am eminent”, “I am appearing or manifesting”, “I am being or existing”, or simply “I am”.

So that bhairava is the “formidable ‘I am’ roar”, the “fearful cry of being”, the very “sound of existence”.

And bhairava, through the root ru is intimately related with the howling rudrAH (plural of rudra).

In essence, bhairava is an avatAra of rudra.

sarabhanga
19 July 2007, 12:42 AM
श्री कालभैरवाष्टकं
|| śrī kālabhairavāṣṭakaṁ ||


देवराजसेव्यमानपावनांघ्रिपङ्कजं व्यालयज्ञसूत्रमिन्दुशेखरं कृपाकरम् ।
नारदादियोगिवृन्दवन्दितं दिगंबरं काशिकापुराधिनाथकालभैरवं भजे ॥ १ ॥
भानुकोटिभास्वरं भवाब्धितारकं परं नीलकण्ठमीप्सितार्थदायकं त्रिलोचनम् ।
कालकालमंबुजाक्शमक्शशूलमक्शरं काशिकापुराधिनाथकालभैरवं भजे ॥ २ ॥
शूलटंकपाशदण्डपाणिमादिकारणं श्यामकायमादिदेवमक्शरं निरामयम् ।
भीमविक्रमं प्रभुं विचित्रताण्डवप्रियं काशिकापुराधिनाथकालभैरवं भजे ॥ ३ ॥
भुक्तिमुक्तिदायकं प्रशस्तचारुविग्रहं भक्तवत्सलं स्थितं समस्तलोकविग्रहम् ।
विनिक्वणन्मनोज्ञहेमकिङ्किणीलसत्कटिं काशिकापुराधिनाथकालभैरवं भजे ॥ ४ ॥
धर्मसेतुपालकं त्वधर्ममार्गनाशनं कर्मपाशमोचकं सुशर्मधायकं विभुम् ।
स्वर्णवर्णशेषपाशशोभितांगमण्डलं काशिकापुराधिनाथकालभैरवं भजे ॥ ५ ॥
रत्नपादुकाप्रभाभिरामपादयुग्मकं नित्यमद्वितीयमिष्टदैवतं निरंजनम् ।
मृत्युदर्पनाशनं करालदंष्ट्रमोक्शणं काशिकापुराधिनाथकालभैरवं भजे ॥ ६ ॥
अट्टहासभिन्नपद्मजाण्डकोशसंततिं दृष्टिपात्तनष्टपापजालमुग्रशासनम् ।
अष्टसिद्धिदायकं कपालमालिकाधरं काशिकापुराधिनाथकालभैरवं भजे ॥ ७ ॥
भूतसंघनायकं विशालकीर्तिदायकं काशिवासलोकपुण्यपापशोधकं विभुम् ।
नीतिमार्गकोविदं पुरातनं जगत्पतिं काशिकापुराधिनाथकालभैरवं भजे ॥ ८ ॥

कालभैरवाष्टकं पठंति ये मनोहरं ज्ञानमुक्तिसाधनं विचित्रपुण्यवर्धनम् ।
शोकमोहदैन्यलोभकोपतापनाशनं प्रयान्ति कालभैरवांघ्रिसन्निधिं नरा ध्रुवम् ॥

॥ इति श्रीमछंकराचार्यविरचितं श्री कालभैरवाष्टकं संपूर्णम् ॥



devarājasevyamānapāvanāṁghripaṅkajaṁ vyālayajñasūtraminduśekharaṁ kṛpākaram |
nāradādiyogivṛndavanditaṁ digaṁbaraṁ kāśikāpurādhināthakālabhairavaṁ bhaje || 1 ||

bhānukoṭibhāsvaraṁ bhavābdhitārakaṁ paraṁ nīlakaṇṭhamīpsitārthadāyakaṁ trilocanam |
kālakālamaṁbujākśamakśaśūlamakśaraṁ kāśikāpurādhināthakālabhairavaṁ bhaje || 2 ||

śūlaṭaṁkapāśadaṇḍapāṇimādikāraṇaṁ śyāmakāyamādidevamakśaraṁ nirāmayam |
bhīmavikramaṁ prabhuṁ vicitratāṇḍavapriyaṁ kāśikāpurādhināthakālabhairavaṁ bhaje || 3 ||

bhuktimuktidāyakaṁ praśastacāruvigrahaṁ bhaktavatsalaṁ sthitaṁ samastalokavigraham |
vinikvaṇanmanojñahemakiṅkiṇīlasatkaṭiṁ kāśikāpurādhināthakālabhairavaṁ bhaje || 4 ||

dharmasetupālakaṁ tvadharmamārganāśanaṁ karmapāśamocakaṁ suśarmadhāyakaṁ vibhum |
svarṇavarṇaśeṣapāśaśobhitāṁgamaṇḍalaṁ kāśikāpurādhināthakālabhairavaṁ bhaje || 5 ||

ratnapādukāprabhābhirāmapādayugmakaṁ nityamadvitīyamiṣṭadaivataṁ niraṁjanam |
mṛtyudarpanāśanaṁ karāladaṁṣṭramokśaṇaṁ kāśikāpurādhināthakālabhairavaṁ bhaje || 6 ||

aṭṭahāsabhinnapadmajāṇḍakośasaṁtatiṁ dṛṣṭipāttanaṣṭapāpajālamugraśāsanam |
aṣṭasiddhidāyakaṁ kapālamālikādharaṁ kāśikāpurādhināthakālabhairavaṁ bhaje || 7 ||

bhūtasaṁghanāyakaṁ viśālakīrtidāyakaṁ kāśivāsalokapuṇyapāpaśodhakaṁ vibhum |
nītimārgakovidaṁ purātanaṁ jagatpatiṁ kāśikāpurādhināthakālabhairavaṁ bhaje || 8 ||

kālabhairavāṣṭakaṁ paṭhaṁti ye manoharaṁ jñānamuktisādhanaṁ vicitrapuṇyavardhanam |
śokamohadainyalobhakopatāpanāśanaṁ prayānti kālabhairavāṁghrisannidhiṁ narā dhruvam ||

|| iti śrīmachaṁkarācāryaviracitaṁ śrī kālabhairavāṣṭakaṁ saṁpūrṇam ||

Agnideva
19 July 2007, 10:30 PM
Namaste Bhairava,

Thanks much for the info. I don’t know much about Bhairava from the Shakta Tantric perspective. Much of what I’ve found out about Bhairava comes from Saivite traditions, which I will share here (some might be redundant with previous posts in this thread).

In the Puranas, we find that Siva is twice insulted. First He is insulted by Brahma and then again by his son, Daksha-Prajapati. In the first instance, Bhairava emanates from Siva and cuts off the fifth head of Brahma. In the second instance, Virabhadra emanates from Siva and cuts off the head of Daksha. Therefore, both Bhairava and Virabhadra can be seen as Siva Himself, but at the same time they are also His fiery emanations.

The same is reflected in Saiva theology. Bhairava is Siva Himself, and at the same He is the guardian of Siva-kshetras (Siva’s lands).

Seen as a guardian of Siva-kshetras, Mahakala-Bhairava guards the nation of Nepal, which is owned by Lord Pashupatinath. The same is true for the Siva-kshetras in India, most notably the city of Kashi (Varanasi), which is owned by Lord Vishwanath and also guarded by Mahakala-Bhairava. The kalabhairavastakam hymn posted by Sarabhangaji praises Bhairava as the Lord of Kashi. That Mahakala-Bhairava is One, but in His eight forms He becomes also the guardian of eight directions. He is both the center and all the directions, both divided and undivided, both many and one.

Seen as Siva Himself, Bhairava reveals the 64 Bhairava Agamas to Shakti (Bhairavi), which are the source of Kashmir Saiva philosophy. In Kashmir Saivism, Bhairava is said to be derived from bha (bharana; maintenance) + ra (ravana; withdrawal) + va (vamana; bring out or create). So, Bhairava is Siva Himself, the supreme, who brings forth, sustains and withdraws creation back into Himself.

In the Vijnanabhairava Tantra, Bhairava teaches most beautifully of Bhairava:

Understand that the spatial reality of Bhairava is present in everything, in every being, and be this reality. (verse 124)

Bhairava is one with your radiant consciousness; singing the name of Bhairava, one becomes Siva. (verse 130)

O beloved, when the mind, intellect, energy and (the notion of) limited self vanish, then appears that wonderful Bhairava. (verse 138)

aum bhairavaye namah.
A.

Bhairava108
20 July 2007, 01:03 AM
In the Vijnanabhairava Tantra, Bhairava teaches most beautifully of Bhairava:

Understand that the spatial reality of Bhairava is present in everything, in every being, and be this reality. (verse 124)

Bhairava is one with your radiant consciousness; singing the name of Bhairava, one becomes Siva. (verse 130)

O beloved, when the mind, intellect, energy and (the notion of) limited self vanish, then appears that wonderful Bhairava. (verse 138)

aum bhairavaye namah.
A.

that is actually the next text I want to read. I am currently really into learning about Bhairava in all his aspects according to the various traditions. I also want to read and study Osho’s contemporary interpretation of the secret teachings of the 4000-year-old Vigyan Bhairav Tantra, in "the book of secrets OSHO".

sarabhanga
20 July 2007, 05:39 AM
In Kashmir Saivism, Bhairava is said to be derived from bha (bharana; maintenance) + ra (ravana; withdrawal) + va (vamana; bring out or create).


Namaste Agnideva,

This derivation seems rather forced, in order to fit the desired meaning.

bharaNa indicates maintenance (bearing, supporting, or nourishing).

And vamana indicates emission (ejecting, vomiting, or offering oblations to fire).

In Sanskrit, ravaNa can mean “roaring, yelling, crying, howling, singing, etc.”, “sonorous”, “sharp or hot”, or “unsteady or fickle”; indicating either “a sound”, “brass or bell-metal”, “a camel, a bird, or a bee”, or even “a large cucumber”. And rAvaNa means “causing to cry or lament”; indicating “the act of screaming”, and naming the famous ten-headed chief of the Rakshasas. But the suggested sense of “withdrawal” does not occur.

In Tamil, however, ravANA indicates “sending or passing”, which could perhaps be stretched to mean “withdrawal”.

Although rAvaNa, in the sense of “causing lamentation” might also apply as a figurative term for the “withdrawal” phase of this grammatical Trimurti.


Also, there is mahAkAla (the one rudra ~ the all-devouring eternity of time and space) and kAlabhairava (one of the rudrAH ~ the inexorable passing of time and space as it is divided or measured out).

mahAkAla is the whole unmarked ruler (the pure expanse), and kAlabhairava is the dark continuum of its marked divisions (the infinite measured out).

At Ujjain, kAlabhairava consumes gallons of whiskey, while mahAkAla consumes the flesh of Brahmans (the pure ash of one Brahman corpse every day).

Agnideva
20 July 2007, 06:47 AM
Namaste Sarabhanga,


This derivation seems rather forced, in order to fit the desired meaning.
I have heard it is a rather fanciful derivation, and is not really based on etymology of the term Bhairava. I suppose the intention there is more to ensure that Bhairava is fully identified with Shiva.


Also, there is mahAkAla (the one rudra ~ the all-devouring eternity of time and space) and kAlabhairava (one of the rudrAH ~ the inexorable passing of time and space as it is divided or measured out).

mahAkAla is the whole unmarked ruler (the pure expanse), and kAlabhairava is the dark continuum of its marked divisions (the infinite measured out).

At Ujjain, kAlabhairava consumes gallons of whiskey, while mahAkAla consumes the flesh of Brahmans (the pure ash of one Brahman corpse every day).Thank you much. I was wondering about mahAkAla and kAlabhairava of Ujjain also.

OM Shanti,
A.

sarabhanga
20 July 2007, 10:48 PM
kāśikāpurādhinātha kālabhairavaṁ bhaje !

Arjuna
10 August 2007, 06:21 AM
Namaste.

Bhairava = "Terrific"

Namaste,

Sri Bhaskararaya in LS-Bhashya provides quite specific ethimology of Bhairava, producing it from "bhIru", women.
Cologne Sanskrit Lexicon lists this meaning as "pl. of a class of Apsaras".

Since Tantras say that every man has a nature of Bhairava, this points out to a specific doctrinal moment: man is the Bhairava by virtue of a woman, because she is vimarsha-rUpiNI, she gets him to know himself as Atman.

atanu
10 August 2007, 11:40 AM
Namaste,

------
Since Tantras say that every man has a nature of Bhairava, this points out to a specific doctrinal moment: man is the Bhairava by virtue of a woman, because she is vimarsha-rUpiNI, she gets him to know himself as Atman.

Namaskar Arjuna,

This is just stupendous; can you please expand a bit?

Regards

Om Namah Shivaya

Arjuna
10 August 2007, 07:01 PM
Namaskar Arjuna,
This is just stupendous; can you please expand a bit?

Namaste Atanu,

This is based upon Paradvaita doctrine of prakasha & vimarsha. Of course we cannot speak of pure prakasha as such when some kind of objectivity is referred to, but on a relative level masculine is reflection of prakasha, while feminine of vimarsha. Then, every individual is affected by malas thus being limited consciousness (essentially there is no affection, but solely voluntary self-limitation of Maheshvara). Since prakasha is static pole of Chiti, it is inert. And it is only vimarsha (shakti) which can remove limitations, transforming Anu into Shiva. On the absolute level vimarsha is the power of awareness by which Chiti (or Anuttara) knows itself; on level of manifestation vAmA (woman) is the power that enables self-realisation. For this reason Tantras speak about Vamachara.

Shiva-sutra say "udyamo bhairavaH". What is udyama?
udyama m. the act of raising or lifting up, elevation; undertaking , beginning; the act of striving after, exerting one's self, exertion, strenuous and continued effort, perseverance, diligence, zeal.
Basically udyama is same as ArohaNa, power symbolized by Murugan's Vel ("shakti" in Sanskrit). This elevation, ArohaNa, is direct manifestation of spanda-shakti, vibration of Consciousness, the pulse of Tattva-hridaya. The most intense ArohaNa is brought about by love and aesthetic feeling. It leads to the state technically called chamatkAra in Kashmir Shaivism and kAmakalA in Shrividya.
Bhairava is "related to women" – yoginis of Samvitchakra, while he resides in its center. This mandala doesn't imply primitive physical models (say that women are necessarily to be numerous), but shows certain principle. Shakti is Chakreshvari, and she can be the whole Samvitchakra in one and the only woman. Bhairava is attracted towards shakti and aroused, and by knowing shaktichakra (the circle) he realises himself as the center, bindu.
In this context the doctrine of KulayAga (aka 5M) should be understood. The 5 makaras are rays of the shaktichakra. And, "tadbhoktA bhairavassvayam".
Ultimately the whole manifestation is realised as shaktichakra, which results in divine ecstasy, jagadAnanda.

In addition I provide a small passage which i posted smwhere on Yahoo groups more than a year ago:

As Shakti is the self-awareness power of the Absolute (Anuttara), vimarsha, while Shiva is the light of pure consciousness, prakasha, so in the manifested existence these two are represented in the forms of women and men. In this sense we can understand the verse of Shaktisangama-tantra saying that “all men are forms of Mahakala and all women are of the nature of Kali and Tara” (Kalikhanda, 5. 4–5). In the process of upasana it is women who elevate men for the provided reason – all activity is done by vimarsha, prakasha being the static pole, Linga.
That is why Tantras underline again and again that without company of a woman there is no complete perfection. The love feeling manifested between woman and man is the primal vibration of the Godhead, spanda. It is this process which is the direct means to self-realization urged by the direct impact of divine power of grace, shaktinipata. What exists in Tantric practice as its sexual side is a vessel for the descent of anugraha, being more its result rather than its cause. That is why it is clearly told that only love saves; from perfect love naturally evolves erotic aspect, kama. It is by this kama Devi is pleased and served through. In this course we can notice that women is a cause of the self-realizing, svatma-sakshatkara. In every relation with a woman sadhaka can unite with a certain aspect of vimarsha – this is a kind of inner maithuna which is prescribed in Tantras to be practiced with any woman one likes. Its nature is of consciousness and need not be necessarily reflected in actual sex.
What is essential for the proper understanding and application of the most sacred Tantric doctrine is the rasa-darshana, meaning “mystical vision through feeling”. If Tantra is taken to be mere technical ritual (be it radical or conventional) it turns to be useless as well as if it is taken as a dry theory – like what had mostly happened with Kashmir shaivism and partly with Srividya.

sarabhanga
11 August 2007, 01:41 AM
Namaste Arjuna,

Good to see you back on HDF. :)




Sri Bhaskararaya in LS-Bhashya provides quite specific etymology of Bhairava, producing it from bhIru or “women”.
Cologne Sanskrit Lexicon lists this meaning as “pl. of a class of Apsaras”.




bhairava (from bhIru) means “frightful, terrible, horrible, or formidable”.

bhIru (from bhI) means “fearful, timid, cowardly, or afraid”, and it indicates “a shadow” ~ and the plural is bhIravaH.

So that bhairava is “one of the fearful ones” (the frightful or formidable one) or “one who is of the timid ones” (fleeting or hidden, or protecting those who are afraid) or “one who is of the shadows”.

bhIru (“fearful”) can mean “inducing fear” (i.e. terrible), but also “full of fear” (i.e. timid).

The masculine plural is bhIravaH, and its vocative singular is bhIro.

The neuter plural is bhIrUNi, and its vocative singular remains bhIru.

The feminine bhIrU particularly indicates “a timid woman” and also “a shadow”, and it is especially used in the vocative case (bhIru) as “O timid one!”. And the plural is bhIrvaH or bhIravaH.

bhIru or bhIro (and thus bhairu or bhairo) refers to both “the terrible” and “the timid”, and (by association) especially “a woman” or “a shadow”.

The plural bhIravaH (and thus bhairavaH) refers to “the terrible ones”, “the timid ones”, “the women”, or “the shadows”.

bhairavaH is masculine ~ the vocative singular is bhairava, and the plural is bhairavAH.
bhairavam is neuter ~ the vocative singular is bhairavam or bhairava, and the plural is bhairavANi.
bhairavI is feminine ~ the vocative singular is bhairavi, and the plural is bhairavyaH.

The feminine bhairavA is another name for nirRti (“dissolution”). And the plural bhairavAH (either shadows or nymphs) indicates the apsarasaH (who move in the waters).

atanu
11 August 2007, 02:55 AM
Namaste Atanu,

---That is why Tantras underline again and again that without company of a woman there is no complete perfection. The love feeling manifested between woman and man is the primal vibration of the Godhead, spanda. It is this process which is the direct means to self-realization urged by the direct impact of divine power of grace, shaktinipata. What exists in Tantric practice as its sexual side is a vessel for the descent of anugraha, being more its result rather than its cause. That is why it is clearly told that only love saves; from perfect love naturally evolves erotic aspect, kama. ----.

Namaste Arjuna,

Thank you for the detailed explanation which is educative for me. There seems to be no doubt that Man and Woman can partner through the journey, mutually benefitting.

But what I find hard to agree about is that without company of woman there is no perfection. Through Vijñänabhaïrava tantra, Lord gives 112 ways and instructs that mastering any one method is sufficient. In the above list only one method involves a partner of opposite sex (and I take that as a way for the married or for lovers). What it means to me is that lovemaking of lovers can also be sadhana. But there are 111 other ways also.

Finally, what happens naturally happens. So, everything is just fine.

OM.

Arjuna
11 August 2007, 06:07 AM
Namaste Arjuna,
Good to see you back on HDF. :)

Namaste Sarabhanga,
I am glad to see U too :). Unfortunately we again couldn't meet while being in India, but i hope it gonna happen sooner or later :).

Thanks for explanations. I have already checked with Cologne Lexicon, but Ur info is even more detailed :).

Arjuna
11 August 2007, 07:10 AM
Namaste Atanu,


But what I find hard to agree about is that without company of woman there is no perfection.

Firstly, this is just AgamAj~nA (command [of Bhagavati] given in Scriptures), with all consequences. Either one accepts it as truth or not, that is matter of personal choice. Maybe it is true only in the context of Tantric path, since other scriptures may say very different things. However i do not think that every path leads to the same result. And thus "perfection" (siddhi) may mean different things in each darshana. Every individual [from his own limited level] is free to choose what he wills and act accordingly. If say someone wants to achieve the aim of Sankhya (and now i do not speak about its ultimate possibility or whether it is indeed good & worth), it would be logical and necessary to meditate upon and apply correspondent metaphysical schemes. The point is that nature of method must be same as nature of its result.

Then, there are several levels of interpretation (artha) that are to be taken in account if we good deep into the topic.
Just for example, above mentioned dictum can be seen as practical injunction (in order to achieve perfection company of woman is needed [for a man]). But it also can be understood as giving a sign, criterion (if one is perfect, he will be in woman's company). These both points exist in Shrividya practice: first refers to Kamakala-dhyana, second is mentioned as a sign of mantra-siddhi.
And this is but two examples. In fact this matter is indeed not simple – Tantras always use the word "rahasya" while speaking about these doctrines. Obviously it is logical to assume that neither me nor U understand the whole of the matter, since it is at the heart of the Doctrine which is known only to Bhairava & Yogini :).

Thirdly, in divya-bhAva (that is, for a Siddha or Yogini) no methods are needed since the result is achieved. Whether one manifests his/her divine glory or not – it doesn't affect his/her true state. Essentially he/she is already in perfect sAmarasya, in the totality of ecstasy (jagadAnanda).
But I deem that though God (Consciouness) is in everything, His ultimate manifestation is Beauty (saundarya). And when every capacity of individual is perfect, this is better than when he is lacking in something. From this angle, perfect love relationships is an objective reflection and outcome of perfect realisation of the Self. (But not necessarily in the sense of physical relationships with certain person.)


Through Vijñänabhaïrava tantra, Lord gives 112 ways and instructs that mastering any one method is sufficient.

Vijnanabhairava is not a self-sufficient text, but an integral part of Bhairavagama canon, and this has to be taken in account. And not any of 112 methods leads directly to the samAvesha, since they are subdivided according to 3 upAyas – and ANavopAya as such cannot lead to perfection.

Then, there is an interesting point. Usually it is considered that the highest method is shAmbhavopAya (and anupAya as its higher part), which is of course exclusively inner "practice", and from this point of view the highest doctrine comes to be Pratyabhijna. But another classification, into two prakriyAs, puts kula-prakriyA (which deals with sexual matter) above Tantra-prakriyA (which includes Pratyabhijna as its part). I am not interested to develop at this point a kind of convincing theory to support this view since it is of questionable necessity and requires much time and study of KSh canon. However it is a fact that for a certain reason almost each & every esoteric doctrine (and not only Indian) gave tremendous importance to sexual love. This is true in regard of KSh, Shrividya, Kalikrama, Bengali Tantrism (both Shakta and Vaishnava) and even Buddhist Vajrayana. The latter also states that the stage of completion is impossible without karmamudrA, a sexual partner.


Finally, what happens naturally happens. So, everything is just fine.

Totally agree ;).
As Vatulanatha-sutra puts it, mahAsAhasavR^ittyA svarUpalAbhaH.

Nuno Matos
12 August 2007, 12:30 AM
Namaste Arjuna

"Then, there are several levels of interpretation (artha) that are to be taken in account if we good deep into the topic.
Just for example, above mentioned dictum can be seen as practical injunction (in order to achieve perfection company of woman is needed [for a man]). But it also can be understood as giving a sign, criterion (if one is perfect, he will be in woman's company)"

I do agree with you; what i think you are forgetting is the women criterion or point of view and her personal path. Unless you forced her by some means other than her natural will to be with you ( i am not talking of you personally), how can you say that if some one is perfect from the tantric point of view, he will be in woman's company? I think if he is perfect or wants to be perfect; from a tantric point of view he will be in the company of a/the goddess and not in the company of an ordinary woman. So the feeling of having many womans or the desire to have a woman or the idea that you are a god are nothing but expectations and projections of your false ego and only lead to misery and suffering to both, you and the women.
The same apply to woman's!
So the feeling of having many womans or the desire to have a woman or the idea that you are a god are nothing but expectations and projections of your false ego and only lead to misery and suffering to both, you and the women.And its true a prefect being has always many woman's and man's and animals around naturally but their are not his women or his man or their animal's they are god children's they have a life of their own.
If you strive for a Women the only thing you will get is children's or a state of precarious satisfaction ( consumerism ).
The same apply to woman's!
I believe in free natural love not in hypnosis or mesmerism ( primitive animal behavior). So i am not looking for a limited body that i may think i can control in order to gain power over it ( satisfy the small ego).

As you say " The point is that nature of method must be same as nature of its result.

Om jaya Kali ma!!
Om namah shivaya!!

atanu
12 August 2007, 01:34 AM
Namaste Atanu,

Firstly, this is just AgamAj~nA (command [of Bhagavati] given in Scriptures), with all consequences. -----


Totally agree ;).
As Vatulanatha-sutra puts it, mahAsAhasavR^ittyA svarUpalAbhaH.


Nicely written explanations thank you. I will point out that for different people there may be different commands, perhaps?



---------------------------
mahAsAhasavR^ittyA svarUpalAbhaH

sarabhanga
12 August 2007, 02:55 AM
Namaste Arjuna,

It is true that unless Shiva is united with Shakti there is not perfection.

However, just as Ardhanarishvara should not be taken as a recommendation for perpetual physical coitus, neither should the above truth be taken in such human terms as to suggest that man cannot achieve perfection without the company of women (or vice versa)!

Arjuna
12 August 2007, 05:43 AM
Nicely written explanations thank you. I will point out that for different people there may be different commands, perhaps?

For sure. This depends on their level and on their aims.
(Truely speaking, Ajna is one, but its apprehension differs.)

Arjuna
12 August 2007, 06:00 AM
Namaste Arjuna,

It is true that unless Shiva is united with Shakti there is not perfection.

However, just as Ardhanarishvara should not be taken as a recommendation for perpetual physical coitus, neither should the above truth be taken in such human terms as to suggest that man cannot achieve perfection without the company of women (or vice versa)!

Namaste Sarabhanga,

This is quite specific Kaula doctrine which is not present in other darshanas. And of course it isn't understood primitively as perpetual physical sex :). I have mentioned about aspects of interpretation, and usually they all have to be taken into account. (It is a common mistake to oversimplify and select one level and state that nothing else needed. Good example is 5M: in fact it is neither only "yogic", nor only physical or ritualistic.) Maybe later i will write upon this in more detail if anyone interested.

atanu
12 August 2007, 07:07 AM
Namaste All,

Actually, it seems that a man in perpetual samadhi has his atma (which is he) and its consort 'the pragnya' in perpetual coitus. This possibly answers ZN. My POV.


And possibly Bhairava is that angry one whose coitus gets interrupted or gets delayed. It is said that Bhairavi neutralises the anger of Lord. (To avoid the risk of misinterpretation I clarify that this is the great coitus of Atma).

Om Namah Shivaya

Arjuna
12 August 2007, 08:28 AM
To avoid the risk of misinterpretation I clarify that this is the great coitus of Atma

But does anything exist apart from Atma? :D

Any coitus acc to Kaula-shasana in of Atma (Consciousness); body exists only in Consciousness and as AkAra of Consciousness (by power of vimarsha) and not "separately as such"...

Arjuna
12 August 2007, 08:36 AM
Namaste Arjuna
Unless you forced her by some means other than her natural will to be with you

There is no point of forcing anyone, never. Kaula-naya has nothing to do with such manipulations, which are clearly termed as nIchAchAra (downward path).
As it is said, "thou hast no right but to do thy will".


are nothing but expectations and projections of your false ego and only lead to misery and suffering to both, you and the women

Desire as such is pure spontaneous manifestation of Samvit-spanda. But identification with its supposed result in supposed-to-be future brings suffering. U do confuse different things ;).

atanu
12 August 2007, 10:16 AM
But does anything exist apart from Atma? :D

Any coitus acc to Kaula-shasana in of Atma (Consciousness); body exists only in Consciousness and as AkAra of Consciousness (by power of vimarsha) and not "separately as such"...

Namaskar,

Yes, I agree. But I also pray that fewer should be drowned in the power of vimarsha, of which a more than fair chance may exist. ----

Forget it.

These are just thoughts which have no meaning. Thoughts alone is karma --- I pray that you may truly avoid that.


Personally, I consider it an easier task to worship Her as mother, knowing fully well that worshipping as a partner or as a daughter may be equally good.

Why will not mother grace?


Om Namah Shivaya

Znanna
12 August 2007, 10:30 AM
Namaskar,

Yes, I agree. But I also pray that fewer should be drowned in the power of vimarsha, of which a more than fair chance may exist. ----

Forget it.

These are just thoughts which have no meaning. Thoughts alone is karma --- I pray that you may truly avoid that.


Personally, I consider it an easier task to worship Her as mother, knowing fully well that worshipping as a partner or as a daughter may be equally good.

Why will not mother grace?


Om Namah Shivaya


Namaste,

However you choose to worship, it is a reflection of HEr infinite expression, IMO.

Whatever allows blessed union is Holy!

"Beloved"

(YMMV)


ZN

sm78
13 August 2007, 04:37 AM
Maybe it is true only in the context of Tantric path, since other scriptures may say very different things. However i do not think that every path leads to the same result. And thus "perfection" (siddhi) may mean different things in each darshana. Every individual [from his own limited level] is free to choose what he wills and act accordingly. If say someone wants to achieve the aim of Sankhya (and now i do not speak about its ultimate possibility or whether it is indeed good & worth), it would be logical and necessary to meditate upon and apply correspondent metaphysical schemes. The point is that nature of method must be same as nature of its result.

This is wise. At least from relative level of human understanding. Thanks for the posts.

Arjuna
13 August 2007, 02:27 PM
Thoughts alone is karma

I totally agree with U, Atanu ;)

sarabhanga
14 August 2007, 04:15 AM
Unfortunately we again couldn't meet while being in India, but i hope it gonna happen sooner or later :).

Namaste Ajuna,

Yes, I was expecting to see you, perhaps at the Kumbha Mela (where you there?) or at least in Varanasi afterwards.

yajvan
14 August 2007, 07:44 AM
Hari Om
~~~~~

Namaste Arjuna,

It is true that unless Shiva is united with Shakti there is not perfection.

...in such human terms as to suggest that man cannot achieve perfection without the company of women (or vice versa)!

Namaste,
Perhaps this is the wisdom of grhastha (householder) and purusartha, the development of the heart? ...expanison of compassion to round out ones full ashrama experience.

pranams,

sarabhanga
14 August 2007, 06:46 PM
Perhaps this is the wisdom of grhastha (householder) and purusartha, the development of the heart? ...expanison of compassion to round out ones full ashrama experience.

A kula is “a herd, troop, flock, swarm, assemblage, or multitude” (of animals or things), and particularly “a race, family, community, tribe, caste, company, or gang” (of humans).

kula indicates “the residence of a family or seat of a community” (specifically “as much ground as can be ploughed by two ploughs each drawn by six bulls”), “a house or dwelling”, “a noble or eminent family or race” (and thus “high station”).

kaula therefore means “relating or belonging to a family, extending over a whole family or race, heritable in a family, or sprung from a noble family”.

kaula is the vidyA of gRhastha, the esoteric science of the noble householders.

kaula promotes eternal life and prosperity (at least for the family or community) here on earth.

atanu
16 August 2007, 07:34 PM
Namaste All,

Actually, it seems that a man in perpetual samadhi has his atma (which is he) and its consort 'the pragnya' in perpetual coitus. This possibly answers ZN. My POV.


And possibly Bhairava is that angry one whose coitus gets interrupted or gets delayed. It is said that Bhairavi neutralises the anger of Lord. (To avoid the risk of misinterpretation I clarify that this is the great coitus of Atma).

Om Namah Shivaya

Namaste,

I have been forced to come back on this since I was made to realise that the latter paragraph was just a random thought, nor scriptural neither meditative. Bhairava is protector of Dharma.

Om Namah Shivaya

Arjuna
17 August 2007, 03:51 AM
Namaste Ajuna,
Yes, I was expecting to see you, perhaps at the Kumbha Mela (where you there?) or at least in Varanasi afterwards.

Namaste Sarabhanga,
I think i was in South by that time... Usually i don't spend much time in UP. Only Bengal/Assam and South India.
Anyway, we'll try to meet up in India again :).

yajvan
05 November 2007, 11:36 AM
Hari Om
~~~~~


Namaste Arjuna,

It is true that unless Shiva is united with Shakti there is not perfection.

!
yathalokena dipasya kiranair-bhaskarasya ca |
jnayate dig-vibhagadi tadvac-chaktya sivah priye ||

just as parts of space are known by the light of a lamp
or the rays of the sun, in the same way, Siva is known
through Sakti. ...Vijnana Bhairava - sutra 21, Swami Lakshmanjoo


A beautiful and most insightful treaty i.e. Vijnana Bhairava for ones consideration, one of the foundational agamas. It is considered the essence of Rudrayamala Tantra. This is a boon as the total works of Rudrayamala Tantra is now incomplete and lost due to time.


pranams,

izi
05 November 2007, 12:55 PM
The following describes a statue of Bhairav in Kathmandu, said to have miraculously fallen from the heavens.

" He wears an ornate golden headdress, snakes writhe from his ears instead of earrings and coil about his neck, and in his hands holds an upraised sword, a chakra, a trident, severed heads and a bowl so reddened with vermilion it might contain blood. Carved flames dance about the tableau.

Purists would have the statue cleaned of its colour but here it is unnecessary, the black figure hung with red arid yellow and white against a raw cobalt sky in which are set a vermilion and yellow sun and moon with human faces, projects a stunning force no ordinary stone could achieve. There is sacrificial blood on the figure which appears necessary for so powerfully primitive a god who instils majesty with fear and protects with terror.

From dawn till late evening there are worshippers at the spot, mostly women wrapped in shawls and making offerings of rice, vermilion, incense and oil lamps and flowers.

How so massive a statue was brought to where it now stands in the old palace square, miles apart from where it was discovered, is yet another riddle that attaches to the image.

When it was raised in its present position, guarded by two stone lions and attended by a panel of ashtamatrikas, it took on a new quality.
People accused of cheating or lying were brought before the Bhairab to swear their innocence. If they lied, they would surely die of a mysterious bleeding. Modern justice has discontinued the practice, but it is possible that in dark ceremonies no passersby see, oaths are still taken before the frightening presence. "

From The Mystery of the Black Bhairab - http://www.nepalitimes.com/issue/11/Culture/8882

There was a period for a week or so about two years ago where I was doing nothing but Bhairav meditations and studying the Vigyan Bhairav text. I went to Marshalls (it's this closeout store of designer department store stuff) I was sifting through the import goods and I happened upon a nice bronze face mask of Bhairav! Quite a vicious looking on too, with skulls and fangs. What are the chances of finding this in the fundamentalist Christian suburbs of Tennessee?

It was only $3. I took it to the register. A african american lady picked it up and exclaimed "Ew what do you want with this ugly thing?" I smiled and said "Some people use them as protection for their houses, they hang them on the outside of the door." As she rung it up she asked "So you don't believe god will protect you?" I laughed and replied "Yes, he is a god!"

She didn't say anything to me after that....

Eastern Mind
05 November 2007, 05:20 PM
Lady H:
Nice funny story about the store. Hindu icons encountered in western stores often make for funny culture clash stories. The two people involved just are so very far apart. Although I adopted Hinduism formally some 28 years ago now, I met a westerner who had been to India as a yuppy/tourist. He asked the origin of my name so I told him "Hindu". he absolutely insisted that I couldn't be one as you have to born one. He would not back down so I went on my merry way with a chuckle, and later that day found myself prostrating to Lord Vinayaka at our local temple, and of course to Bhairava for letting me in. I don't mess around with Bhairava here, as he is the real guard, so I just humbly thank him every time I go. http://www.mahaganapathytemple.com/frames.html

Aum Namasivaya

yajvan
05 November 2007, 05:40 PM
Hari Om
~~~~~




... Bhairava is said to be derived from bha (bharana; maintenance) + ra (ravana; withdrawal) + va (vamana; bring out or create). So, Bhairava is Siva Himself, the supreme, who brings forth, sustains and withdraws creation back into Himself.


Namaste,

On A fews posts there has been mention on the etymology of Bhairava's name. I thought to perhaps offer the audit trail on this, and a view on how Kashmir Shaivism may view this name; this is from some current studies and thought to pass it on.

Bhairava is found in the Tantraloka by Abhinavagupta muni which includes, the contents of all the three branches of Kashmir Shaivism (Trika-Shastra), i.e. Agama, Spanda and Pratyabhijna, in a summarised form.
If one looks in the first chapter (ahnika), God is called Mahabhairava, or Lord (pati) and Supreme Siva [stotra I.95 ].

We find Bhairava related to his activities, Chapt 1, stotra 96
visvam bibharti purana
dharanayogena tena ca bhriyate
savimarsataya rava
rupatasca samsarabhiruhitakrcca

He who carries the whole universe, who nurishes and supports it,
and who is carried by it , He is the sound who by His power of awareness
protects those who are frightened by the world of transmigration (samskra).


Now lets look at the insightful post sarabhanga offers.


bhairava (from bhIru) means “frightful, terrible, horrible, or formidable”.
bhIru (from bhI) means “fearful, timid, cowardly, or afraid”, and it indicates “a shadow” ~ and the plural is bhIravaH.

So that bhairava is “one of the fearful ones” (the frightful or formidable one) or “one who is of the timid ones” (fleeting or hidden, or protecting those who are afraid) or “one who is of the shadows”.
bhI is “to fear” or “to be afraid or anxious”.
And ru is “to roar, bellow, howl, yelp, or cry aloud”, “to make any noise or sound”, “to sing” or “to praise”; and ru means “to break, shatter or dash to pieces”, “to kill or to be angry”, “to speak”, or simply “to go”; and ru indicates “sound or noise”, “fear or alarm”, “battle or war”, and “cutting or dividing”.
So that bhIru is “to roar, howl, cry out, etc. fearfully” (either out of fear or invoking fear); or “to praise anxiously”.
rava (from ru) is “a roar, yell, cry, howl, song, hum, clamour, or outcry”, “thunder” or “talk” or “any noise or sound (e.g. the ringing of a bell, etc.)”.
So that bhIrava is “a frightful sound” or “formidable thunder” (etc.), and bhairava is the one connected with such shattering or piercing noises.
bhA means “to shine” or “to be bright or luminous”, “to shine forth or appear”, “to be splendid or beautiful or eminent”, “to show, exhibit, or manifest”, or “to be or exist”.

And bhai is the first person singular present case of bhA ~ “I am shining or luminous”, “I am eminent”, “I am appearing or manifesting”, “I am being or existing”, or simply “I am”.

So that bhairava is the “formidable ‘I am’ roar”, the “fearful cry of being”, the very “sound of existence”.


From a Kasmir Shaivism orientation Bhairava is all pervading as He carries the whole universe.
Now this fear bhI is “to fear” or “to be afraid or anxious” - Kasmir Shaivism's orientation is Bhairava liberates beings from the fear. Fear of what? samsara, as mentioned in the stotra samsarabhiruhitakrcca.
And he illumines everything with His bhA - bhA means “to shine” or “to be bright or luminous”, “to shine forth or appear”, “to be splendid or beautiful or eminent”, “to show, exhibit, or manifest”, or “to be or exist” - per sarabhanga.
And they see Bhairava as the nature of Pure I (Aham); This is the alignment with Siva, Being, Aham.This bhA is of key import as it is Divine illumination that takes away the darkness of ignorance, of avidya. MOre central to this Saivism Bhairava eliminates abuddaha. This abuddha: a or 'not' + bhu 'to become or exist' ; or budh ' to elighten , to know'. So it is without the knowledge of enlightenment or SELF referral. Kasmir Shaivism points to this as absolute unawareness of the SELF, completely lost in the field of prakriti with no sense of Aham.


I think combing sarabhanga's post + Agnideva's + some info found in studies¹, it helps one understand the depth and breath of Bhairava, and why He is viewed as Mahabhairava.

pranams,


1. Books for reference: Siva Sutras, Vijnana Bhairava , Spandakarikas, Kasmir Shaivism - all books are from Swami Laksmanjoo's parampara

izi
16 November 2007, 03:02 PM
beautiful thanks for sharing that yajvan, it seems very truthful, and I like it when things come to light like that...

Eastern Mind - very cool but unfortunately all of the photos are broken, you are very fortunate to live near such a temple...

shockti
17 December 2007, 09:05 PM
This thread has been enormously helpful to me. I've been interested in Bhairava for some time, and have been digging up information on him online and off. So thank you for your very learned & scholarly posts! My question is neither learned nor scholarly, but sincere. Here it is:

Am I correct in assuming that Mahakala is the Buddhist counterpart to the Hindu Bhairava? I've also seen him referred to as Mahakala Bhairava, which is confusing. It also confuses me when I see in the oldest Tibetan thangkas a very graphic Mahakala trampling on Bhairava, the latter dwarfed and in apparent agony under Mahakala's feet.

What attracted me to Bhairava was his seemingly callous lack of concern for his subjects. It's this "tough love" aspect of God that tends to get the bad rap; how could a loving God do such & such? But in fact this manifestation of Shiva is the destroyer of ego-based delusions, and as such possibly our best friend in the spiritual plane.

I look forward to finally having the Mahakala/Bhairava connection explained. Thanks.

Nuno Matos
17 December 2007, 09:54 PM
namaste shockti

I am not an expert in Budist Hindu connections but as I have learned here and somewhere Mahakala means Time, or to be more precise Big Time, as Kala means part, Mahakala is the "Great part". Now Bhairava it´s wild virgin formed nature, like prahdana which is ruled by Mahakala in it's subtlest and predominant element. Time.
When someone dies you could say that Mahakala as done is work over Bhairava. This hole universe is made of time. Time is.

Om namah shivaya!

yajvan
17 December 2007, 10:02 PM
Hari Om
~~~~~

This thread has been enormously helpful to me.
I look forward to finally having the Mahakala/Bhairava connection explained. Thanks.

Namste shockti (et.al)
Perhaps sarabhanga's post http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showpost.php?p=13729&postcount=22 will assist you... the root of your initial answer is offered here.


ॐ नमः िशवाय

pranams

sm78
01 January 2008, 03:16 AM
bhairava (from bhIru) means “frightful, terrible, horrible, or formidable”.

I like most others often have wondered why in our dharma and buddhism to an extent depicts the same god (or just God) as both the most kind and peaceful in one incarnation while most terrible and frightful in another.

While philosophic answers, (which have been provided in this forum before) as to how creation and destruction are both part of this universe and are 2 aspects of God, make intellectual sense, it does not answer why we need at all to worship a God in his/her terrible aspect ?? Why can't we just worship his sweet form only and attain liberation ??

While many will say that it is not required to worship the terrible aspects of Gods to attain liberation ~ this is not the case if one follows any of the tantric / agamic paths of sadhana. Whether shakta or saiva, wrath of the divine is an unavoidable object of worship. Why?

I believe the iconography of terrible aspects of divine has more to do with secrets of sadhana than just making a theological point. Those of us who have not worshipped both sweet and terrible aspects of the divine for many many eons would perhaves never grasp true significance of bhairava beyond an intellectually satisfying idea. Others like christians will find it demonic and anti-god and we can hardly blame them (in a way!).

yajvan
01 January 2008, 12:31 PM
Hari Om
~~~~~


While philosophic answers, (which have been provided in this forum before) as to how creation and destruction are both part of this universe and are 2 aspects of God, make intellectual sense, it does not answer why we need at all to worship a God in his/her terrible aspect ?? Why can't we just worship his sweet form only and attain liberation ??


Namaste singhi,

A well reasoned question. I do not have an answer to this... But I do know we live in a violent universe at large. And this Creative Intelligence manages the whole matter accordingly. I think of the first few lines of Sri Rudram -Namakam¹ as it recognizes this power.

Yet when I think of this Comic Intelligence, I do not see it as 'terrible' that it wishes to do harm with malice of intent. I see it as carrying out Its purpose.

'We' ( that would be me) are so small, granular in this whole creation. Our galaxy is but a particle in this Being's vast expanse. Yet we float along relatively peacefully out side of turmoil that must go on each minute - galaxies colliding, black holes swallowing everything in its path, super novae, all that. Yet here we are on this beautiful blue island at a comfortable 72º (± some places more, some places less), water, wind in our face, etc.
So, we see the calm side of this creation, sometimes we see the destructive side of tornadoes, earth quakes, and the like, yet not the total annihilation that one can view going on in space.

Now will that time come when we are part of that annihilation? Sure. Yet the depth and breath of this Creative Intelligence from delicate to destructive is the bandwidth of this Being. I think that is the part one rejoices in when addressing His/Her attributes.

pranams,

1. Anuvaka 1
Om namo bhagavate rudraya
Namaste rudramanyavautota ishhave namah
Namaste astu dhanvane bahubhyamuta te namah

Oh! Rudra Deva! My salutations to your anger and also to your arrows.
My salutations to your bow and to your two hands.

Yata ishhuh shivatama shivam babhuva te dhanuh
Shiva sharavya ya tava taya no rudra mridaya

Oh! Rudra! By favor of your arrow, bow, and quiver, which have shed their anger and turned auspicious, please render us happy.

shockti
16 January 2008, 08:34 PM
I like most others often have wondered why in our dharma and buddhism to an extent depicts the same god (or just God) as both the most kind and peaceful in one incarnation while most terrible and frightful in another.

Whether shakta or saiva, wrath of the divine is an unavoidable object of worship. Why?



Why indeed. There are many faces to that which we call 'God', and we naturally gravitate toward those which bring us comfort. We find it incomprehensible that a loving God could be wrathful, terrible, or frightful. But the question is, to what does God direct its wrath? Is it not toward deception and delusion? What exactly is Bhairava burning away? And what in us is terrified? One needn't dig too deeply to realize the answer to these questions: EGO. All fear originates and ends at this place. The Self does not fear annilhilation, as it carries no threat.

bhargavsai
23 January 2008, 04:03 AM
I am very happy reading all this information. Thank you.

It is amazing how Siva takes different forms which are all very different yet amazingly fatherly to us. Here Shakti and Siva are one and the same with no distinction except in names which shows there is but 'One' whom some call Durga, some Siva, some Vishnu.

srivijaya
11 March 2008, 06:22 AM
Bhairava is "related to women" – yoginis of Samvitchakra, while he resides in its center. This mandala doesn't imply primitive physical models (say that women are necessarily to be numerous), but shows certain principle. Shakti is Chakreshvari, and she can be the whole Samvitchakra in one and the only woman. Bhairava is attracted towards shakti and aroused, and by knowing shaktichakra (the circle) he realises himself as the center, bindu.
In this context the doctrine of KulayAga (aka 5M) should be understood. The 5 makaras are rays of the shaktichakra. And, "tadbhoktA bhairavassvayam".
Ultimately the whole manifestation is realised as shaktichakra, which results in divine ecstasy, jagadAnanda.

In addition I provide a small passage which i posted smwhere on Yahoo groups more than a year ago:

As Shakti is the self-awareness power of the Absolute (Anuttara), vimarsha, while Shiva is the light of pure consciousness, prakasha, so in the manifested existence these two are represented in the forms of women and men. In this sense we can understand the verse of Shaktisangama-tantra saying that “all men are forms of Mahakala and all women are of the nature of Kali and Tara” (Kalikhanda, 5. 4–5). In the process of upasana it is women who elevate men for the provided reason – all activity is done by vimarsha, prakasha being the static pole, Linga.
That is why Tantras underline again and again that without company of a woman there is no complete perfection. The love feeling manifested between woman and man is the primal vibration of the Godhead, spanda. It is this process which is the direct means to self-realization urged by the direct impact of divine power of grace, shaktinipata. What exists in Tantric practice as its sexual side is a vessel for the descent of anugraha, being more its result rather than its cause. That is why it is clearly told that only love saves; from perfect love naturally evolves erotic aspect, kama. It is by this kama Devi is pleased and served through. In this course we can notice that women is a cause of the self-realizing, svatma-sakshatkara. In every relation with a woman sadhaka can unite with a certain aspect of vimarsha – this is a kind of inner maithuna which is prescribed in Tantras to be practiced with any woman one likes. Its nature is of consciousness and need not be necessarily reflected in actual sex.
What is essential for the proper understanding and application of the most sacred Tantric doctrine is the rasa-darshana, meaning “mystical vision through feeling”. If Tantra is taken to be mere technical ritual (be it radical or conventional) it turns to be useless as well as if it is taken as a dry theory – like what had mostly happened with Kashmir shaivism and partly with Srividya.

Namaste Arjuna,
I have taken my time to contribute to this thread as the study of the connection between Bhairava and my own Buddhist tantra is obscure but, nevertheless important.
Tibetan tantric practice ultimately derives from India and there was much transformation over time. It seems the form of Bhairava tantra, which was adopted by tantric Buddhists was adopted from a Shaivite sect called the Kapalikas.

I have a translation by David Grey and it appears to be a radically different document to the Vigyana Bhairava Tantra. The Vigyana Bhairava Tantra lists ways one can enter deep meditative states whereas the Kapalika/Buddhist material is much concerned with esoteric instructions in magic (including animal and human offerings) charnel ground practice, alcohol taking and all kinds of obscure references which have not stood the test of time or the transformation from one culture to another.

The Tibetans (under Tsongkharpa) were keen to demote the sexual aspect of tantra, as it sat badly with monastic vows and a result of this 'suppression' has been, in my opinion, the construction of an edifice of ritual and superstition which entirely contradicts the aim of tantra in the first place.

The Vigyana Bhairava Tantra instructions demonstrate the "revealing" aspect of Siva (Bhairava). Techniques which bring us into the moment - without mental proliferation.
The sexual stuff is necessarily powerful as everyone finds sex compelling. Here it is clearly designated as an object of samhadi (no easy feat).

http://www.otantra.net/oTantra/VBTv1/chapter33.html#048

When the prana flows downward it is called Maya shakti. If we can reverse the flow then it ascends to cause great bliss. This certainly can happen in coitus but only if the prana is reversed and the act is an object of renunciation into samhadi. Thus, it becomes an act of worship, not a common sexual act.

It is claimed that karma mudra practice causes the mind to go more deeply into samhadi than other methods - therefore it is considered superior. Perhaps this is because, together, a man and a woman close the circuit. Alone we are incomplete - united we build a totality.

Once the mind has found the pathway into deeper states the karma mudra practice falls away, as the true totality is found within ourselves. Some Tibetan masters claim that it is then sufficient to merely recall the dakini in order to enter the deepest levels of the clear light mind.

This is just my take on this wonderful being which I salute with reverence. I hope I have not caused offence and caution that it is still very much a work in progress for me.

Namaste

Arjuna
19 April 2008, 08:00 AM
Thank U, Srivijaya.
I am aware of these things. By the way the reform of Tsonkhapa had political reasons and not mystical. Geluk used every means to suppress and even physically destroy adepts of the original tibetan tantrism...

srivijaya
19 April 2008, 04:09 PM
Thank U, Srivijaya.
I am aware of these things. By the way the reform of Tsonkhapa had political reasons and not mystical. Geluk used every means to suppress and even physically destroy adepts of the original tibetan tantrism...

Hi Arjuna,
Yes, this was unfortunately the case. There was also a shift in emphasis regarding the supreme state. It was previously taught by the Indian masters (as in Shaivism) to be bliss and awareness. Tsonkhapa had a very strong agenda to promote a supreme state known as bliss and emptiness.
This "emptiness" was considered to be the triumph of Tibetan Buddhism - the very peak of the Prasangika system. I have studied it at some length and concluded that it is largely a philosophical stance and at variance with experiential teachings within the tantras, but that is just my somewhat controversial opinion.

namaste

Arjuna
20 April 2008, 07:49 AM
Hi Arjuna,
Yes, this was unfortunately the case. There was also a shift in emphasis regarding the supreme state. It was previously taught by the Indian masters (as in Shaivism) to be bliss and awareness. Tsonkhapa had a very strong agenda to promote a supreme state known as bliss and emptiness.
This "emptiness" was considered to be the triumph of Tibetan Buddhism - the very peak of the Prasangika system. I have studied it at some length and concluded that it is largely a philosophical stance and at variance with experiential teachings within the tantras, but that is just my somewhat controversial opinion.


The concept of emptiness was borrowed from Shaivagamas again – it existed there as abhAvavAda. Abhavavada is criticized in Spanda-karikas :). Although it may be mere apophatic theological formula, in practice i believe this theory brings more confusion and thus i agree with Spanda adepts.
And yes, original concept of Vajrayana was same as that of Hindu Tantrism.

yajvan
20 April 2008, 09:07 AM
Hari Om
~~~~~

The concept of emptiness was borrowed from Shaivagamas again – it existed there as abhAvavAda. Abhavavada is criticized in Spanda-karikas :). Although it may be mere apophatic theological formula, in practice i believe this theory brings more confusion and thus i agree with Spanda adepts.
And yes, original concept of Vajrayana was same as that of Hindu Tantrism.


Namaste Arjuna ( et al.)
Hope its okay to join in the conversation...
This emptiness you are discussing - are you referring to sūnya ( sUnya)? Some like to call this void and hence emptiness.

We have talked a bit on this ( via several BobG posts , as part of Buddhism). It is through my studies and opinion that there is no doubt this sūnya exists, but should net be confused with Ultimate Reality. Does this viewpoint make sūnya any less attractive or real? Not in my assessment.

There is a reasonable conversation in the Spanda-kārikās, chapt 1.12 and 1.13 discusses this matter.

Perhaps if we wish to discuss this, we can begin a new thread.

pranams

Arjuna
21 April 2008, 10:27 AM
Namaste Yajvan,
Nobody doubts the possibility of experience of emptiness; the point is that it may be soteriologically harmful to denote the ultimate Reality as the void (shUnyatA) as madhyamaka does. Some advaitins seem to have similar misconception, which in fact contradicts the Shruti.

yajvan
21 April 2008, 12:19 PM
Hari Om
~~~~~~
Namaste Yajvan,
Nobody doubts the possibility of experience of emptiness; the point is that it may be soteriologically harmful to denote the ultimate Reality as the void (shUnyatA) as madhyamaka does. Some advaitins seem to have similar misconception, which in fact contradicts the Shruti.

Namaste Arjuna,
I think we said the same thing?
my last post suggests
but should net be confused with Ultimate Reality

So Yes, I concur. Yet where I am now scratching my head is this it may be
soteriologically harmful

This word is new to me , and as I look it up I get the following definition:
soteriological - the theological doctrine of salvation as effected by Jesus.

So lets say we use it as soteriologically, the application of soteriological and without the Jesus implication. This then suggests that shUnyatA is harmful becase one would think it is Reality in its fullness. The harm comes from the notion that shUnyatA is the final, and Ultimate, where in fact it is not. Is this notion you where outlining?

Note - I am not finding issue here, just trying to insure I comprehend your post in the correct way.

pranams

Arjuna
21 April 2008, 04:47 PM
Namaste Yajvan.

Soteriology is just "doctrine/science of salvation" and is not restricted to christianity.
Yeah, U are right regarding a tendency to restrict Reality to void. But the problem isn't mainly philosophic. Practical consequence of shUnyavAda which is "soteriologically harmful" is implicit denial of Life (Spanda principle) as such. In the context of shUnyavAda (by which i mean not only madhyamaka, but also respective trend in Hindu advaita) beauty, love, grace and bliss make no sense. Such a view is an obstacle to any spiritual progress.

sm78
22 April 2008, 03:01 AM
Practical consequence of shUnyavAda which is "soteriologically harmful" is implicit denial of Life (Spanda principle) as such. In the context of shUnyavAda (by which i mean not only madhyamaka, but also respective trend in Hindu advaita) beauty, love, grace and bliss make no sense. Such a view is an obstacle to any spiritual progress.

Ultimate truth for the sannyasin is un-born (aja). And the higest doctrine is that of ajAtivAda.

For the tantric, the world holds the potential of ultimate bliss and shaktivAda is the highest doctrine.

For the bauddha lama highest truth is in emptyness and non-being.shuNyavAda.

One cannot simple conclude generically that one vAda is practically harmfull etc. The best practical thing nature has devised is to make all of them available before the human.

I concur, for a kaula, the concept of ajAtivAda and seeing the world as nothing more than a illusionary dream may seem as spiritually harmful. But such statements should come with a caution: only for kaulas.

Thanks.

My studies and opinion is that all of shuNya, lokAdnanda and nirvikalpa samadhi are real and true states. It is no way possible to understand which is the highest except for believing in scriptures and teachers (whom you regard as highest teachers). advaita tradition of sankara holds all to be true to a extent, highest truth being un-born to be experienced in only in a nirvikalpa samadhi. Philosophically I find this most flawless and the leanage of sankaracharya most exhalted. We all have to make our choices.

Note shuNya, lokAnanda and realizing the aja, ALL holds the promise of freedom from birth, death, delusion and bondages of human existence. This was the essential problem at hand we seek to solve. Not the highest truth ~ the concept of highest truth is a psychological necessity than anything else. Who would prepare to work if they don't believe their own path to be the highest ?

Arjuna
22 April 2008, 07:50 AM
I did not speak about Shankara's tradition or Tantric Buddhism in general, but about specific *interpretations* of their doctrines (which aren't the only). And obviously there may exist such a thing as a wrong interpretation, won't U agree? :)

srivijaya
24 April 2008, 04:29 AM
I did not speak about Shankara's tradition or Tantric Buddhism in general, but about specific *interpretations* of their doctrines (which aren't the only). And obviously there may exist such a thing as a wrong interpretation, won't U agree? :)

Within Buddhism there are many interpretations and attendant practices (some are quite dualistic). I find the most sublime to be within the traditions of Mahamudra and Dzogchen.
The key Dzogchen text of the "Supreme Source" accords naked awareness (rigpa) the status of a 'ground of being' (in a similar fashion to some Shaivite schools) it does not advocate emptiness as the ultimate state, rather rigpa is considered to be both beyond samsara and nirvana.

So, whilst "wrong" interpretations do exist, there may also be a case of different levels which accord to the capacity of the student.

Namaste

Arjuna
24 April 2008, 06:07 AM
Namaste Srivijaya,

Exactly, Mahamudra and Dzodchen are very close to Atimarga Hindu traditions – Kula, Trika, Krama and Srividya.
All these doctrines are regarded as the highest.

ramsg10
12 June 2008, 01:31 AM
Namaste all,

Could somebody share with me the Kala bhairava gayatri. Thanks.

neel.1237
30 June 2008, 09:52 AM
om mahabhiravaye vidmahe kaal rudraye dhimahi tanno kammo bhiravkledinitya prcodayat
iti... Sri Kalika Puran

yajvan
28 March 2009, 04:11 PM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~
Namasté



On A fews posts there has been mention on the etymology of Bhairava's name.

From a Kasmir Shaivism orientation Bhairava is all pervading as He carries the whole universe.
Now this fear bhI is “to fear” or “to be afraid or anxious” - Kasmir Shaivism's orientation is Bhairava liberates beings from the fear. Fear of what? samsara, as mentioned in the stotra samsarabhiruhitakrcca.
And he illumines everything with His bhA - bhA means “to shine” or “to be bright or luminous”, “to shine forth or appear”, “to be splendid or beautiful or eminent”, “to show, exhibit, or manifest”, or “to be or exist” - per sarabhanga.
And they see Bhairava as the nature of Pure I (Aham); This is the alignment with Siva, Being, Aham.This bhā is of key import as it is Divine illumination that takes away the darkness of ignorance, of avidya. More central to this Saivism Bhairava eliminates abuddaha. This abuddha: a or 'not' + bhu 'to become or exist' ; or budh ' to elighten , to know'. So it is without the knowledge of enlightenment or SELF referral. Kasmir Shaivism points to this as absolute unawareness of the SELF, completely lost in the field of prakriti with no sense of Aham.

I think combing sarabhanga's post + Agnideva's + some info found in studies¹, it helps one understand the depth and breath of Bhairava, and why He is viewed as Mahabhairava.

Bhairava defined from a different perspective - the view of Gautam Chatterji as he translates Abhinavagupta's Tantṛālokaḥ. He suggests the following:

bha is bharaṇa भरण - maintaining , supporting , nourishing
ra is ravaṇa रवण- Gautam Chatterji suggests this means withdrawal from manifestation or projection; yet a dictionary view on this matter suggests ravaṇa as the following: roaring , yelling , crying , howling , singing
ra र is acquiring or possessing ; this is the only word (IMO) then that may apply for an approximation of ~withdrawal~ as it is rooted in rā which = acquiring , possessing
rava is roaring, yelling; it is rooted in ru रु- to make any noise or sound i.e. to roar , bellow , howl , yelp , cry , sing, bee's buzzing, etc.
vaṇa वणa sound , noise
va is vamana वमन emitting , emission Hence I see why Gautam Chatterji would find Bhairava attractive as bha + ra + va; as it fits nicely with the view that Bhairava creates and emits this Universe (va) + nourshies & maintains (bha), and He that takes it back again (ra).
Or Bhairava =Brahma (va) + Viṣṇu (bha) + Śiva or Rudra (ra).

praṇām

Kumar_Das
21 July 2010, 06:52 PM
Man I wanted to find information about Lord Shiva as Bhairava and this thread has so many differing opinions, none of which seems to be conclusive.

I am so confused right now, I think I have to travel to different temples of India and do a research by myself.

Eastern Mind
21 July 2010, 07:26 PM
Vannakkam Kumar Das:

Such is the case in this vastness. Glory at the many POV's all acceptable to each individual, yet confusing! http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/images/icons/icon7.gifBut you stated the 'correct' way for each, and that is to decide for oneself. Happy researching.

Aum Namasivaya

yajvan
21 July 2010, 09:15 PM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté Kunar_das


Man I wanted to find information about Lord Shiva as Bhairava and this thread has so many differing opinions, none of which seems to be conclusive.

I am so confused right now, I think I have to travel to different temples of India and do a research by myself.

Confusion is not our intent (obviously :) ) but the depth and breath of this great knowledge is humbling. EM says it correctly - All glory to this vastness of wisdom and POV's.

Yet the pickle is this - there are so many levels of knowledge on HDF that for some this is 'just right' for others, 'too much' and for others 'which way is up ? ' .

We are here to help to the best of our ability. I hope HDF continues to assist all that wish to expand their level of knowledge and to promote a deeper thinking on the wisdom. Sometimes we hit the mark, other times, well not so much.

oṁ śipiviṣṭāya namaḥ
oṁ I bow (salutations) to śipiviṣṭāya
the One encircled in rays of light

praṇām

Advaita
02 June 2012, 01:24 AM
I was wondering if any one of you knows 108 names of Bhairava or if you know where can i find those names written in sanskrit and translated in english?