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orlando
09 August 2015, 09:46 AM
Namaste.

According to Srila Prabhupada and other gaudiya-vaishnava guru,Astanta-yoga is not practicable in Kali-yuga.

Is it true?

Dandavat Pranama,
Orlando.

Eastern Mind
09 August 2015, 10:41 AM
Vannakkam Orlando:

I think it depends who you ask. I personally feel it is practicable, but only for a few really qualified souls. Then there are those who say or think they are practicing, but a closer look indicates they're not. Regardless, there is something to trying, that's for sure. Effort (in any sadhana) means a lot.

But this is just my opinion.

Aum Namasivaya

markandeya 108 dasa
09 August 2015, 10:57 AM
Namaste,

Patanjali Yoga sutras can certainly be a great aid with the study and practice of Bhagavad Gita, how much so will vary on the individual. As far as I know Patanjali yoga sutras is not widely practiced even in India although philosophically and its practical application is rooted in the same wisdom. All Dharmic traditions face challenges in a fast changing modern world, the needs and desires of people will vary aswell. Generally speaking people now lack the right type of concentration, do not have the suitable environment to cultivate the subtleties of any sadhana, some sadhana's maybe totally impracticable, or may not even resonate with the individual due to varying levels of conditioning . So at certain points the Dharma has to mold around its surroundings to fit the landscape, just like the river negotiates its way through the diverse landscape, but without losing its essence or core.


Mediation these days is very popular, but when we compare what real meditation is, Dhyana and Samadhi from the classical descriptions of Shastra's and high level Sadhaka's it is something completely different. So the skill comes with integration on the path the gradual purification of the conditioning.

Can Patanjali system be practiced by the general mass of people, I think not, can his teachings help evolve consciousness if integrated with another practice, I think yes.

devotee
09 August 2015, 11:32 AM
Namaste Orlando,



According to Srila Prabhupada and other gaudiya-vaishnava guru,Astanta-yoga is not practicable in Kali-yuga.

Is it true?

It is true for Gaudiya-Vaishnavas as the whole exercise is against their belief system. It is practicable for them neither in Kali Yuga nor in any Yuga.

For those who follow Patanjali, it is quite practicable in all Yugas. Patanjali never said that his teachings were applicable to a certain Yuga alone.

OM

markandeya 108 dasa
09 August 2015, 11:38 AM
Namaste Devotee,


It is true for Gaudiya-Vaishnavas as the whole exercise is against their belief system. It is practicable for them neither in Kali Yuga nor in any Yuga.

Can you provide proof, Patanjali is often quoted in Gaudia Shastra and held in high esteem, but its simply said that Asthanga Yoga is not practical widescale.

You seem to have something personal against Gaudia.

devotee
09 August 2015, 12:31 PM
Namaste Markandeya,



Can you provide proof, Patanjali is often quoted in Gaudia Shastra and held in high esteem, but its simply said that Asthanga Yoga is not practical widescale.


Can you please tell me what is there in Patanjali Yogsutras which is not practical in Kaliyuga ? What is the authority for saying so ?

Why should have I anything against Gaudiya ? It is simply laughable. Please read this :

Gaudiyas believe that Lord Krishna is the Only God and serving him as a slave is the highest goal. Right ? This is in total contrast to what Patanjali says in Yogsutras. It talks of attaining various Vibhutis through Yoga and doesn't advocate acting as a slave. One leads towards Self-realisation in Samadhi whereas Gaudiya's path leads you towards Salokya in Lord Krishna's abode. If my understanding is wrong, please help me in understanding Gaudiya's path in right perspective and how they see Patanjali's Yogsutras.

OM

markandeya 108 dasa
09 August 2015, 02:06 PM
Namaste Devotee Ji,

I am not saying anything against Patanjali, its one of my favorite texts, but what I will support to some degree that for the majority of people to take as a sole practice it will be difficult, especially without a qualified guru. I am not carving a certain way which is best for anyone else, I'm not a guru or anything close to this, its an amazing teaching and one I carried with my whole trip to India this time, and I see in my own experience and understanding that Patanjali and Bhagavad Gita are compatible to say the least.

What you wrote about Gaudia is totally up to you.

devotee
09 August 2015, 07:05 PM
Namaste Markandeya,

The Eight limbs of Patanjali are practised in one form or the other in the Traditional schools of Advaita SAdhanA including what I follow. So, if someone says (who doesn't tread the path himself) that the same is impractical ... can it be believed ?

Most of what Patanjali says is there in Bhagwad Gita and many scriptures of VedAnta. You can have complete idea of this path in this thread :

http://hindudharmaforums.com/showthread.php?5798-Aham-Brahmasmi-4-The-Way-to-the-Absolute

OM

markandeya 108 dasa
10 August 2015, 04:58 AM
Namaste Devotee Ji,

I am not in disagreement with integrating the system of Patanjali, the eight limbs are included in most Hindu based Sadhanas, they constitute the backbone of all practices in one way or another. Personally as I have said I find the yoga sutras very helpful. The sutra itself can be summed up in the first 4 verses, how one deals with the modifications of the mind and applies the practice to arrive at atma tattva will vary among different schools. But is asana and pranayama exclusive to all practices, I think not, this is where a lot of the practices may divert into their own form. Although within Patanjali there is reference to having an ista deva and using of japa to control the mind, within classical patanjali the external form is one of a person meditating deep in Samadhi, suspending the senses, controlling the modifications of the mind and entering into Samadhi. This system in and of itself is very difficult, as so many people are finding out through meditation practices, the hardest thing for most people is the control of the mind and senses. Within Gaudia the view is that by chanting and performance of karma yoga is more practical for a more wide scale audience. If one can do the full system of patanjali to reach Samadhi, then good luck to them, if one practices a slight variation but still in line with the Dharma then I see no problem there too. I did hear that some devotees will write a book on Patanjali and also Adwaita Dasa gives seminars on patanjali and has no problems with the integration of the yoga sutras with Bhagavatam.


So, if someone says (who doesn't tread the path himself) that the same is impractical ... can it be believed ?

I am not sure who you are referring to here.

devotee
10 August 2015, 06:24 AM
Namaste Markandeya,



I am not in disagreement with integrating the system of Patanjali, the eight limbs are included in most Hindu based Sadhanas, they constitute the backbone of all practices in one way or another. Personally as I have said I find the yoga sutras very helpful. The sutra itself can be summed up in the first 4 verses, how one deals with the modifications of the mind and applies the practice to arrive at atma tattva will vary among different schools. But is asana and pranayama exclusive to all practices, I think not, this is where a lot of the practices may divert into their own form. Although within Patanjali there is reference to having an ista deva and using of japa to control the mind, within classical patanjali the external form is one of a person meditating deep in Samadhi, suspending the senses, controlling the modifications of the mind and entering into Samadhi.
This system in and of itself is very difficult, as so many people are finding out through meditation practices, the hardest thing for most people is the control of the mind and senses.

I think we are coming to the same wave length now. See, if you read Chapter 3, 4, 6, 18 ... most of the practices that Lord Krishna advises, is along the path of Patanjali. What are the Eight limbs ? As you know it well, they are :

a) Yama, Niyama, Asana, PrAnAyAm
b) PratyAhAr
c) DhyAn (meditation), DhAraNa, Samadhi

In whole of Bhagwad Gita, Lord Krishna keeps repeating importance of Yama and Niyama in one form or the other. Asana, PrANAyAm, PratyAhAr and DhyAna are mentioned in Chapter 5, Chapter 6 and Chapter 18. Similarly, Samadhi too is referred to in Bhagwad Gita but not in detail. Yama and Niyama are common to all spiritual practices. How much you succeed in following that depends upon you. Asana is related to PrAnAyam and DhyAna and later stages. PratyAhAr is an essential requirement for succeeding in spiritual pursuit. DhAranA and SamAdhi are not easy to attain ... but are attained by those who are steadfast in their practices.


Within Gaudia the view is that by chanting and performance of karma yoga is more practical for a more wide scale audience.

This is a popular and easier path and if one can attain the higher stages in Bhakti path which is followed by Gaudia and many other sects, it would also lead to PratyAhAr, DhyAn, DharaNa and SamAdhi (savikalpa). PratyAhAr is turning the sense organs and mind away from sense objects and it comes naturally with intense Bhakti. Once that is achieved, Heart Chakra and then Visuddha Chakra get activated. This leads to vision of and interaction with God in the chosen form. Keeping mind focused on chosen deity day-in and day-out leads to flow of thoughts in one direction uninterrupted and that finally leads to blissful SamAdhi. This is not Nirvikalpa SamAdhi but Savikalpa SamAdhi. I am saying this keeping the experience of Ramkrishna Paramhansa in mind.

OM