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atanu
14 October 2007, 12:43 PM
[quote=yudhamanyu;17173]Well, my dear Satay, I see that based on your deep ignorance , ---------.

[quote]

yudhamanyu,

And everyone can see that you are judging everyone. Does Ravi Shankar Ji teach devotees to judge others as dumb, ignorant etc.?

Om

satay
14 October 2007, 03:59 PM
Namaste all,
I thought to create this thread where all the offshoot posts will go from the 'yudhamanyu discussion' thread.

It is my purpose to keep that thread focused on the discussion points listed in post 1.

Znanna
14 October 2007, 05:09 PM
Namaste,

I would be interested in exploring the notion that attaining power (as a result of taking responsibility) is a viable goal. To me, it seems that "attaining power" is aking to "seeking enlightenment" ... in other words, I'm saying that to me it's not about seeking but instead, doing. Perhaps this is what Ur guru means by accepting responsibility?

It seems to me that when power is a goal, ego is the result. When doing is its own end, then balance might be achieved.

As Mommy would say, "how does this serve your purpose?"




ZN

yudhamanyu
15 October 2007, 12:54 AM
[quote=yudhamanyu;17173]Well, my dear Satay, I see that based on your deep ignorance , ---------.

[quote]

yudhamanyu,

And everyone can see that you are judging everyone. Does Ravi Shankar Ji teach devotees to judge others as dumb, ignorant etc.?

Om

I have no idea where the rest of the thread is ,as that would put things in perspective.

As for Sri Sri, while he sees and emphasizes the positive in others , he also criticises the negative in others in a manner of constructive criticism.



In here, you can see that Satay first indulged in the vilification of Swami Vivekananda calling him as " some swamis " , which prompted me to censure him, and he apologized later.

However , he then started talking about Sri Sri in a very disparaging manner, having no idea of Sri Sri 's highly substantial contributions to HInduism , hindu society , India and the world.

Though in the beginning, I just saw it as the typical ignorance of some hindus regarding hinduism, and subtly asked him to tone down his vilification campaign, he still kept on incessantly disparaging Sri Sri non-stop.

Now this is inexcusable. That Sri Sri is a highly honoured and revered spiritual master of Hinduism, is common knowledge in India and the world.

And yet Satay dares to keep on with his disgraceful tirade against Sri Sri , in spite of my protests. And that too from the ' moderator' of a hindu forum.

First Vivekananda, now Sri Sri , who next.....

I consider these illustrious figures as my gurus, and I have no intention of letting anyone disparage them or vilify them and get away with it.

Sri Ramakrishna Paramahamsa himself states clearly that it is the duty of the disciple to safe-guard the honour of the guru. The Guru is beyond honour or humility, but it is the duty of the disciple to exert himself to
undo all wrongs against the Guru, as per Ramakrishna.

atanu
15 October 2007, 07:09 AM
Well, my dear Satay, I see that based on your deep ignorance , ---------.

As for Sri Sri, while he sees and emphasizes the positive in others , he also criticises the negative in others in a manner of constructive criticism.

In here, you can see that Satay first indulged in the vilification of Swami Vivekananda calling him as " some swamis " , which prompted me to censure him, and he apologized later.

However , he then started talking about Sri Sri in a very disparaging manner, --
----.

Namaste,

You are not Shri Shri Ravishankar and neither his agent that you have the right to disparage other people. Satay at least apologized. You do not even realise that you are abusive.

Then Satay has a valid point on Shri Shri, based on the way you write. I am greatly influenced by Shri Shri and I derive peace from him. His utimate teaching is silence.

But the way you place him, he comes as a business man -- franchising people to conduct past life regression etc., and earning money from that. This view is solely based on your poor representation and not an insult to Ravishankar Ji at all.

Finally pay heed with calm mind to what ZN has written.


----when power is a goal, ego is the result. When doing is its own end, then balance might be achieved.

I will add that when Yoga with God is the aim, power is incidental and not ego builder.

Best Wishes and no hard feelings. We all are in the same boat and we should not sink the boat.

Om

satay
15 October 2007, 10:07 AM
namaste,

I think that yudhamanyu due to your emotional attachment, you have misrepresented your own guru here on HDF. Perhaps time to actually listen to what he says and medidate on the message...

sm78
15 October 2007, 10:18 AM
Yudhamanyu and Satay: I have been reading these posts with interest. Some gurus say that the best way to judge a guru is by watching the disciples. I don't know if I buy this, as it would depend on which disciple you're watching. I have browsed the internet about Sri Sri and have found various points of view, mostly positive, yet some negative too. This is basically true of all swamis, gurus. There are always two sides. Personally, I will not judge unless I have the experience of sitting in their presence. Only then can I try to intuit the aura, and mystique, and make a personal 'judgment' based on my own observations, not the words of others. (The words of others, especially those who are followers are always biased based on their own experiences, and if that swami is the one they chose to follow, then they'd better think or she is the best one out there, (or else they should switch to the one they deem better) I have only met (sat in a lecture, or in passing at an airport) 3 or 4 swamis outside my own parampara, and I touch their feet if possible. I feel if they are not legitimate, and making claims about their own powers etc., then that is clearly their problem, not mine. I am far too ignorant in mystic knowledge to see it very deeply. When charging for classes, it is the devotee who is willing to pay. So it is their choice, same as any other consumer item. And sometimes you feel ripped off, and other times you feel you got your money's worth. As far as getting into arguments about whose guru is the best, I learned my lesson well about 15 years ago, when discussing Sai Baba with a Sai devotee. Well, he was a Sai devotee, and I'm not. Of course he should think the way he does about Sai Baba. We had a long discussion that eventually turned emotional on both sides, with each of us acting like babies and lowering ourselves to criticism of each other's gurus. It destroyed our friendship. If either of us would have done the manly thing, and not brought it up, or just remained civil, the friendship wouldn't have been destroyed. (Actually we are now on civil talking terms, but neither of us want to repeat the same performance, so we don't bring it up.) To each his own. Aum Namasivaya

There is indeed no point in criticizing Guru's except to the extent of making a personal choice.

However teachings needs to be looked into and criticized if required. Ravi is a teacher of universalism which from an orthodox standpoint we have perfect right to criticize as we know it does much harm to the hindu communities ability to sustain external aggression. This may be more relevant to Indian society.

yudhamanyu
16 October 2007, 10:27 AM
Namaste,

You are not Shri Shri Ravishankar and neither his agent that you have the right to disparage other people. Satay at least apologized. You do not even realise that you are abusive.


I am Yudhamanyu, and that is more than enough for me to condemn injustice and hypocrites and ignoramuses whereever i see them.


Also Satay has not apologised for his condemnation of Sri Sri , contrary to what you say.

It really is a serious matter , considering the fact that he is a moderator.





Then Satay has a valid point on Shri Shri, based on the way you write.

And what is his valid point on Sri Sri based on my writing, atanu dude.




I am greatly influenced by Shri Shri and I derive peace from him. His utimate teaching is silence.



And you show your gratitude to your upaguru , by not at all defending him when satay is disparaging and vilifying him. Great gurubhakti, atanu.





But the way you place him, he comes as a business man -- franchising people to conduct past life regression etc., and earning money from that. This view is solely based on your poor representation and not an insult to Ravishankar Ji at all.


Oh really, time for you to get rid of your rose-tinted glasses atanu.




Finally pay heed with calm mind to what ZN has written.


ZN will get my anwers as well,atanu.




I will add that when Yoga with God is the aim, power is incidental and not ego builder.

Power is not for building up the ego, but to get things done.





Best Wishes and no hard feelings. We all are in the same boat and we should not sink the boat.



Yeah, me too.

atanu
16 October 2007, 12:46 PM
--
And you show your gratitude to your upaguru , by not at all defending him when satay is disparaging and vilifying him. Great gurubhakti, atanu.
----

Namaste,

Gurus do not need advertisements and that is my service to upaguru.


Power is not for building up the ego, but to get things done.

That Yudhamanyu will get things done is wrong knowledge called ego.

Om

satay
16 October 2007, 01:57 PM
Admin Note

I noticed here on several threads that forum rules are being broken by a new member. Please be advised that though you may harras me I will not allow the harrasment or personal attacks on any of the members of HDF.

A gentle reminder to please review the rules of the site.

Eastern Mind
16 October 2007, 06:29 PM
I, for one, (and I've noticed others who are avoiding all posts in such discussions) am sick of the petty bickering and name-calling. Its a waste of my time to read all this stuff over and over. I came here to learn, to share, to grow, etc. and I have, I believe. If civility cannot occur here, then just where can it occur? No wonder the people of vastly different beliefs can't get along, when like minded individuals can't. Aum Namasivaya