Katha Upanishad: discrepancy in English translations?

[simex]

Greetings.

Recently I’ve discovered Vedanta and consequently have been studying the Upanishads, and I’ve run in to a major discrepancy between translations—I cannot read classical Sanskrit, sadly, so I’m looking to get the opinions of those who can. In some translations of the Katha Upanishad, book I, chapter 2, line 10 reads like this:


Nakiketas said: 'I know that what is called a treasure is transient, for that eternal is not obtained by things which are not eternal. Hence the Nâkiketa fire(-sacrifice) has been laid by me (first); then, by means of transient things, I have obtained what is not transient (the teaching of Yama) In other translations, the line reads more like this:


Yama said: I know that the treasure resulting from action is not eternal; for what is eternal cannot be obtained by the non— eternal. Yet I have performed the Nachiketa sacrifice with the help of non—eternal things and attained this position which is only relatively eternal.

Considering the fact that the Upanishads were kept consistent through a series of checks and balances, my guess is that this section was never directly attributed to a speaker in the first place, and is open to interpretation. But again, I can’t read Sanskrit, so that’s only a guess.

Part of me says that, since it only seems to be Western translators who accredit this line to Nachiketas, it may be that it requires a subtle knowledge of Classical Sanskrit that would only be available to native speakers of Hindi. They’re closely related languages, right? Like middle English and English.

The other part of me says that there may be a bias since all of the Eastern translators are, to some degree, representing their own school of Hinduism. Even the very academic translation of Nikhilananda’s seems to show a little bit of bias towards Vedanta.

Can anyone say with any certainty which translation is correct? The reason I ask is because one of the translations I read, which attributes this line to Nachiketas, is the Penguin Classics version. This is kind of like the standard version you would find in mainstream bookstores in the West. Penguin publishing is a client of the company I work for, so I may be in a position to bring this potential discrepancy to their attention. But I’m not even sure if it’s an error, it might just be the subjective opinion of the translator.

Any help you guys could give me would be most appreciated.
Thanks.

[devotee]

Dear Simex,

I think the above translation you have taken from http://www.sacred-texts.com/hin/sbe15/sbe15011.htm.

According to "Eight Upanishads" published by Advait Ashram, Kolkata, the above lines are attributed to Yama ( the Death). That to me appears logical because Yama has just started teaching & there appears no need for Nachiketa to interrupt at this juncture.

Take care,
Namaste.

[yajvan]

Hari Om
~~~~~

Namaste,

Swami Sivananda also addresses this. He suggests Nachiketas never performed the sacrifice /yajya till he received the information from Yama.
In chapt 1, valli 1 sloka 16, it is there that Yama says, I give thee this other boon, the fire sacrifice (yajya) shall be named after thee (Nachiketas) and take thou this many-colored chain. (a garland with gems or necklace).

Therefore how could Nachiketas perform the yajya prior? Hence, this sloka is owned and said by Yama. In fact Yama owns the first 13 slokas. Nachiketas only speaks once in Chapt 1 valli 2 , the 14th sloka, and the remainder is Yama.


This nAciketa नाचिकेत - is a beautiful word. Perhaps sarabhanga can give us its roots. I am taught that his name means one who is unaware of the depth of the questions he is posing.


pranams,

[sarabhanga]

Namaste,

naciketAH asks:


yama, tell us that in which men have this doubt, and which is about the great hereafter.
naciketas does not choose any other boon but that of which the knowledge is hidden.

yamaH replies:


One is more good (sreya), while another is more pleasant (preya). These two having different objects chain a man.
Blessed is he who between them chooses the good alone, but he who chooses what is pleasant loses the true in the end.

The good and the pleasant take hold of man; the wise man extinguishes them.
The wise man prefers the good to the pleasant, but the ignorant man chooses the pleasant for the sake of the body.

naciketaH, thou hast renounced objects of desires and desirable objects of pleasant form, judging them by their real value.
Thou hast not chosen the road of wealth, in which many men perish.

These two, ignorance (avidyA) and knowledge (vidyA), are wide apart and lead to different points or goals.
I believe naciketas to be one who desires for knowledge, for even many desires have not shaken thee.

The ignorant, who live in the midst of darkness but fancy themselves as wise and learned, go round and round, deluded in many crooked ways, as blind people led by the blind.

The way to the hereafter is not apparent to the ignorant man who is foolish, deluded by the illusion of wealth.
‘This is the world,’ he thinks, ‘there is no other’ ~ thus he falls again and again under my sway.

He of whom many are not even able to hear, whom many, even when they hear of him, do not comprehend; wonderful is a man, when found, who is able to teach the self; wonderful is he who comprehends the self when taught by an able teacher.

That self, when taught by a man of inferior intellect is not easy to be known, as it is to be thought of in various ways. But when it is taught by a preceptor who is one with brahman, there is no doubt concerning it, the self being subtler than the subtle, and is not to be gained by arguing.

This knowledge is not to be obtained by argument, but it is easy to understand it, O dearest, when taught by a teacher who beholds no difference; thou hast obtained it now; thou art fixed in truth. May we have, naciketaH, an enquirer like thee!

I know that the treasure is transient, for that eternal is not obtained by things which are not eternal.
Therefore, the naciketas fire has been propitiated by me with the perishable things and I have obtained the eternal.

The end of all desires, the foundation of the world, the endless rewards of sacrifice, the other shore where there is no fear, the praiseworthy, the great, the wide-extended sphere and the abode of the soul ~ all these thou hast seen, and being wise, naciketaH, thou hast with firm resolve rejected all.

The wise sage who, by means of meditation on his self, recognizes the ancient, who is difficult to be seen, unfathomable and concealed, hidden in the cave of the heart, dwelling in the abyss, lodged in intelligence, indeed he renounces joy and sorrow.

Having heard and well grasped this, the mortal, abstracting the virtuous Atman, attaining this subtle self, rejoices, because he has obtained what is cause for rejoicing. I think that the abode of brahman is wide open for naciketas.

naciketa is derived from cit (“to perceive, fix the mind upon, attend to, be attentive, observe, take notice of, aim at, intend, design, be anxious about, care for, resolve, understand, comprehend, or know”), with ciketa as the active singular form of the perfect tense (“I have perceived, resolved, comprehended, known, etc.”). And naciketa is one who has “not perceived, not resolved, or not comprehended”.

naciketa is “innocent, ignorant, or unknowing”.

naciketas was a young brAhmaNa “who did not understand” why his father had sacrificed all of his possessions.

yama himself knows that worldly treasure is transient, for he was the very first mortal, the first one to sacrifice and to die. Therefore, he gave up or sacrificed all mortal things into the incomprehensible fire of unknowing, or into the hearth of naciketas, and thus attained immortality.

yama is praising naciketas as surpassing even himself ~ i.e. naciketas is surpassing yama (as “death”) and is thus approaching eternity.

The text is not explicit as to the speaker, but it seems clear from the context.

Most western authorities assume that jesus is the first and only example of a god being born and suffering death as a man, and so this may be why they assume that it must be the young naciketas who is saying “I know that the treasure is transient” and “I have obtained the eternal”. But it is yama who teaches naciketas the agnicayana (preparation of the sacred hearth) for performing the nAciketa sacrifice, so it cannot be naciketas who claims to have attained eternity by previously making that same sacrifice. And naciketas does not interrupt until the last line of the vallI, when he asks his next question of yama: “That which thou seest as other than virtue or vice, other than cause and effect, other than the past and future, tell me that.”

[atanu]

Namaste Friends,

Sarabhanga has excellently gone into the roots and Yajvan and Devotee have agreed that the context is not of Nachiketa speaking. If one examines the verses before and after, then it is abundantly clear that it is Yama who is teaching.

The particular translation wherein "Nachiketa says" appears is of Muller.

Anyway that is not the main problem. The main controversy is in the essence as shown below:

Katha Upanishad
Translaetd by Vidyavachaspati V. Panoli



1-II-1. Different is (that which is) preferable; and different, indeed, is the pleasurable. These two, serving different purposes, blind man. Good accrues to him who, of these two, chooses the preferable. He who chooses the pleasurable falls from the goal.
-----
1-II-10. I know that the treasure is impermanent, for that which is constant cannot be reached by things which are not constant. Therefore, has the Nachiketa Fire been kindled by me with impermanent things, and I have attained the eternal.

Whereas, the Nikhilananda translation says: "----attained this position which is only relatively eternal."


Both of these translations are from Advaitins, of course.

Personally, I go with the former translation, but I do not know. May be Yajvan, Devotee, Sarabhanga can go to the roots.

-----------------------

Note: However, both translations may be correct. Position of Yama is temporary but the knowledge of Self is eternal. God is naughty.


Om Namah Shivaya

[sarabhanga]

Namaste Atanu,

nitya (or nityam) means “innate, native, one’s own, continual, perpetual, eternal, constantly dwelling, ordinary, usual, invariable, fixed, necessary, or obligatory”.

nityam indicates “always, constantly, regularly, or by all means”.

nitya refers to “the sea or ocean”, and nityam to “a constant and indispensable rite”.

nitya is opposed with anitya, which is “not everlasting, transient, occasional, incidental, irregular, unusual, unstable, or uncertain”; and anityam (“occasionally”) is the opposite of nityam (“always”).

The occasional is sacrificed to gain the constant.
The transient is sacrificed to gain the fixed.
The incidental is sacrificed to gain the necessary.
The unstable is sacrificed to gain the invariable.
The drop is sacrificed to gain the ocean.
The allotted portion is distributed to gain the whole lot.

yama is saying, “I have attained the whole ocean, the invariable, the necessary, the fixed, the constant, the continual, the abiding, the perpetual, the innate, my own true nature or original self”.

“I have attained the eternal” is surely the intention, while the words “only relatively” are the translator’s own interpolation. And “I have gained that which is only relatively everlasting by sacrificing that which is only relatively not everlasting” or “by sacrificing that which is not only relatively everlasting” seems an unlikely opposition, especially coming from lord yama, the perfect twin (who was anciently twice twain and resurrected through his ultimate sacrifice as the one yoke of all yoga).

[atanu]

Namaste Atanu,


nitya (or nityam) means “innate, native, one’s own, continual, perpetual, eternal, constantly dwelling, ordinary, usual, invariable, fixed, necessary, or obligatory”.

----

The occasional is sacrificed to gain the constant.
The transient is sacrificed to gain the fixed.
The incidental is sacrificed to gain the necessary.
The unstable is sacrificed to gain the invariable.
The drop is sacrificed to gain the ocean.
The allotted portion is distributed to gain the whole lot.

yama is saying, “I have attained the whole ocean, the invariable, the necessary, the fixed, the constant, the continual, the abiding, the perpetual, the innate, my own true nature or original self”.



Namaste sarabhnaga,

What you have said accords with my comprehension: "----sacrifice of the non-eternal in favour of the eternal ----".

Yet, I feel that Vac is a bit naughty. This happens with so many sanskrit verses. It is however, predicted and explained in the 'Da Da Da' story. In fact, behavioral psychology has terms called selective cognition and cognitive dissonance, to explain this phenomenon.


Regards,

Om

[simex]

Yes, this makes perfect sense, especially considering Yama's history.

I was only using the Muller translation as an example, since it was floating around the internet. The Penguin Classics version, translated by Valerie Roebuck, translates the verse very similarly.

Thank you so much for sharing your knowledge with me, everyone.

I'm going to bring this up with our contacts at Penguin Publishing, to see if they want to correct it.

Thanks again!

[yajvan]

Hari Om
~~~~~

Namaste Atanu,

nitya (or nityam) means “innate, native, one’s own, continual, perpetual, eternal, constantly dwelling, ordinary, usual, invariable, fixed, necessary, or obligatory”.

nityam indicates “always, constantly, regularly, or by all means”.

nitya refers to “the sea or ocean”, and nityam to “a constant and indispensable rite”.

nitya is opposed with anitya, which is “not everlasting, transient, occasional, incidental, irregular, unusual, unstable, or uncertain”; and anityam (“occasionally”) is the opposite of nityam (“always”).



Namaste,
I think the verse is tena nityam praptavan asmi ... please correct any blemishes as you see fit.

IMHO here's how i read this - this is not opposed to any of the views offered. I thought if the veribage was offered it may perhaps be useful.

tena तेन - on that account , for that reason , therefore , in that manner
nityam or nitya नित्य - per sarabhanga's post above
praptavan - rooted in prApaka प्रापक - causing to arrive at , leading or bringing; establishing , making valid
asmi अस्मि - I am

I am attained/established that eternal/ocean by that ( on that account).

Swami Sivananda writes it as, ' I have attained the eternal by that'

pranams

[atanu]

Hari Om
Namaste,
-----
tena तेन - on that account , for that reason , therefore , in that manner
nityam or nitya नित्य - per sarabhanga's post above
praptavan - rooted in prApaka प्रापक - causing to arrive at , leading or bringing; establishing , making valid
asmi अस्मि - I am

I am attained/established that eternal/ocean by that ( on that account).

Swami Sivananda writes it as, ' I have attained the eternal by that'

pranams

Namaste Yajvan,

Let me take a bit of liberty.

--- by that without break I am that I am.

Om

[sarabhanga]

I think the verse is tena nityam praptavan asmi

Namaste Yajvan,

The actual line is: tato mayA naciketashcato agnir anityair dravyaiH praptavAn asmi nityam

[sarabhanga]

By that without break I am that I am.




advaitena ahambrahmAsmi

[syvedi40]

Simex has mentioned "Yama said: I know that the treasure resulting from action is not eternal; for what is eternal cannot be obtained by the non— eternal. Yet I have performed the Nachiketa sacrifice with the help of non—eternal things and attained this position which is only relatively eternal". Simex also acknowledges that there is some doubt about the translation.

It is an known fact that Upanisads tell the principles in short and succinct manner and to understand them one has to learn Upanisad from Guru directly through discussions, as many things are not explained in the Upanisad per se.

For example the level of evolution of the mind and the erudition of Naciketa is not brought out explicitly and left to the imagination of the student by inference from other statements made. Having obtained such great boons from Lord Yama whether Naciketa returned to earth and how long he lived and what happened to his progeny etc are not known.

Katopanisad does not clearly say how Naciketa, a young lad could go to Yama's house. In sloka 5 First Valli of Chapter 1 Naciketa says he has been first amongst many students and has not been the last and Sloka 6 simply says he reaches the house of Lord Yama.
In Sloka 7 it appears others (may be the gate keepers of Lord Yama) seem to advise the arrival of Naciketa as a guest and they say it looks like Lord Agni himself has come!

Lord Yama seems to be totally unnerved as he addresses Naciketa "namasya athithi" which means a guest who deserves to be honoured and requests Naciketa "brahman me swasthi astu" which means let me beget all Mangala (Good things). This indirectly shows that having failed to entertain a venerable guest, Lord Yama might be doomed and hence he offers three boons which he requests Naciketa to accept! This is a unique situation where the God is offering boon without being asked by the donee!

If we look at the way the lad structures his boons it really shows a great mind at work. First he takes care of his father and second he asks what Yagna men should do to reach Swarga Loka and third and at last only he asks where do people go after death. The order of boons is first for his father, second for other people in the world and the last only for himself!

When Lord Yama tells him the method of doing the rites (the Yagna) and asks him to repeat the method, Naciketa does so without any fault and Lord Yama was extremely pleased and gives a boon without his asking that the Yagna will be named after Naciketa!

Again he asks indirectly to teach him about Brahman and how to realise self by asking an innocent question what happens after death! All the wealth and fortune and long life offered by Lord Yama were ignored with the argument that all these lost only as long as Yama lasts! (Here one has to understand the Lords Brhama, Yama also exist only up to the particular heavenly years where as Brahman the Supreme is permanent) See Sloka 27 of First Valli First Chapter where he says "yavat tvam irshisyasi jeevishyamaha" meaning (with all these boons you offer) we live as long as you live!

In sloka 3, Second Valli of Chapter 1, Lord Yama openly praises Naciketa for not choosing glittering jewels and in Sloka 4 Lord Yama says he considers Naciketa as a person who pursues Vidya (True Education) leaving Avidya (Education about wealth and other worldly things). He also praises Naciketa openly for his perseverance to know the truth and he says, "Let us get sishyas (students) like you".

All this undoubtedly show that Naciketa was very learned and has done lot of tapasya and has gained extraordinary powers so that he could reach Lord Yama's house in person i.e. in flesh and blood. Hence I am not inclined to agree with the interpretation of the meaning of the word as given by learned Sarabhanga where he says:

"Naciketa is derived from cit (“to perceive, fix the mind upon, attend to, be attentive, observe, take notice of, aim at, intend, design, be anxious about, care for, resolve, understand, comprehend, or know”), with ciketa as the active singular form of the perfect tense (“I have perceived, resolved, comprehended, known, etc.”). And Naciketa is one who has “not perceived, not resolved, or not comprehended”.

Naciketa is “innocent, ignorant, or unknowing”.

Naciketa was a young brAhmaNa “who did not understand” why his father had sacrificed all of his possessions"

I tend to agree with the interpretation given in Wikipedia that Naciketa "is derived from 'na chiketas,' that which is unpercieved and refers to the quickening Spirit that lies within all things like fire latent in wood". Obviously his father has not perceived the intelligence latent in the lad! One dictionary gives the meaning of the word as "Agni". But I am not sure. May be somebody in this forum could find the correct meaning for the word "Naciketa

Now coming back to the main question of Simex how could one achieve eternal things by offering non-eternal things.

The word "Sevadhi" in Sloka 10 of Valli 2 of Chapter 1 is translated as the benefit accrued by offering non-eternal things - karmaphala. It means the benefit of doing yagnas with material things. Here one has to go to Bagavadh Gita. In Karma Yoga, Chapter 3 Lord Krishna says there are two ways to attain the Moksha, the way of offering yagnas and other way of saints by Atma Vichara meaning meditation about Self. He also adds neither method alone cannot bring the result of realising Self! If one does the Yagnas with the material things made available to man by Gods without desiring any benefit and does this only for the benefit of the whole world and sacrifices that benefit to Gods one could realise Self. This requires lot of reading of Gita and Katopanisad again and again. One will find practically same slokas appearing in both!

Gita is the essence of Upanisads and Vedas and explains beautifully the concepts for understanding them in an easier way!

[yajvan]

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

Namasté

I thought to add to this post, as I am revisiting the kaṭha upaniṣad also written kaṭhopaniṣad. It is considered one of the 10 principle¹ Upaniṣad-s. There has been some very good discussions above. I only wish to add an insight or two that just came to me in my recent study.

kaṭha कठ is an interesting word. As the title of a upaniṣad always gives a hint of what will be in the upaniṣad, kaṭha gives us this information. This follows the rules of sambandha¹.
kaṭha कठ is a pupil or follower of kaṭha. That is, a pupil of vaiśampāyana and founder of a branch of the yajur-veda , called after him.
kaṭha is also a brahmin. Used as a noun it can mean distress.Many times this upaniṣad is considered kathā ( note the long a) - this now means a conversation , speech , talking together, a story. It also means a story that is personified.

What is beautiful about the kaṭhopaniṣad is these definitions apply to the knowledge offered. In the kaṭhopaniṣad, as the story, Naciketas (a brahmin) is the pupil. He is having a conversation with Yama यम (death personified) who is acting as the teacher. So this word kaṭha & kathā are being fulfilled.


What of Naciketas ? His name has come up before in the posts above - http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showpost.php?p=18892&postcount=4 (http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showpost.php?p=18892&postcount=4) . What more can I add? There is one view that we did not entertain when the original posts were made.

naciketa नचिकेत- of a man; is rooted in cit to perceive , fix the mind upon , attend to , be attentive , observe , take notice of ;
'na' is not , no , nor , neither. Hence na + cit is to not take notice of, or be attentive or know.
keta केत desire , wish , will , intention ; is also rooted in cit ; Hence na + keta is without desire or wish - we will see below, this applies to worldly attainmentsNaciketas ( then) is he who has not taken notice, or attentive of three things as I see it:
1. He did not understand why (na + cit) his father did not perform the sacrifice to the best of his ability - this we get in the very beginning
of the story.
2. He was also not aware of (na + cit ) of how profund the questions that he asked of Yama. This is shown when Naciketas asks ' some say the departed continue to exist, some say they do not. I (Naciketas) taught by you (Yama) would like to know its truth. Of the boons, I choose this as my 3rd.' This is the 20th śloka, 1st vallī¹.

Yama replies ' even the gods (deva-s) of old had doubt about this point. It is indeed not easy to understand. O Naciketas choose another
boon, Do not press me on this. Give up this one for my sake ' (21st śloka, 1st vallī) .
Yama continues and says 'choose children, grandchildren of a 100 years life, cattle a plenty, elephants, gold and horses…' etc ( 23rd śloka, 1st vallī).

Now we can go to point 3:
3. Naciketas is without worldly desire - his motives were pure . When asked from Yama to pick a boon, his resolve was not of worldly attainment. He says, ' O end-maker Antaka ( i.e. the maker of all endings, see yama¹ below) , ephemeral as all these things are (the things Yama offered to Naciketas in lieu of fulfilling the 3rd boon mentioned) , they wear-out the vigor of the mortal man. All life is short indeed. '

So we note how Naciketas' name was selected perfectly for this kathā, or story and how it binds, sambandha, beautifully i.e. Naciketas as a man ( naciketa, representing humanity), a kaṭha or brahmin with high insights, his questions profound, and his intent is without desire (na + keta ) for material gain.

praṇām

words and references

10 principle Upaniṣad-s see this HDF post: http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showpost.php?p=15825&postcount=2 (http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showpost.php?p=15825&postcount=2) Some believe there are 13 - see this post http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showpost.php?p=15712&postcount=27 (http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showpost.php?p=15712&postcount=27)
sambandha सम्बन्ध- binding together, joining, close connection. But of what? the connection between the title of the śāstra and the subject matter i.e. The title (abhidhāna) and the subject matter (abhidheya). for more on this consider the following HDF Post: http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showpost.php?p=26187&postcount=2 (http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showpost.php?p=26187&postcount=2) posts 2,3 and 4.
yama यम - as a noun twin-born , twin , forming a pair ; the act of checking or curbing , suppression , restraint ; of the god who presides over the pitṛs and rules the spirits of the dead; also the graha Saturn .
Yama is also addressed as Antaka अन्तक - making an end , causing death , the king of death.
vallī वल्ली- creeper , creeping plant ; used to designate a 'sub-section', as it is attached to a body of work. This vallī would be equal to a parvan पर्वन्- a division, joint, limb , member conntected to the main body, or sakta सख- the tree.
So the order of the kaṭhopaniṣad is the following: There are 2 adhyāya अध्याय or chapters, (lessons or lectures) They in turn have 3 vallī-s per each adhyāya, for a total of 6 vallī-s to this body of work.

[yajvan]

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

Namasté


Naciketas is without worldly desire - his motives were pure . When asked from Yama to pick a boon, his resolve was not of worldly attainment. He says, ' O end-maker Antaka ( i.e. the maker of all endings, see yama¹ below) , ephemeral as all these things are (the things Yama offered to Naciketas in lieu of fulfilling the 3rd boon mentioned) , they wear-out the vigor of the mortal man. All life is short indeed. '

So we note how Naciketas' name was selected perfectly for this kathā, or story and how it binds, sambandha, beautifully i.e. Naciketas as a man ( naciketa, representing humanity), a kaṭha or brahmin with high insights, his questions profound, and his intent is without desire (na + keta ) for material gain.

I mention Naciketas' orientation on his questioning and ethics. This falls into 2 catagories:

preyas प्रेयस् - more agreeable; that which is pleasant here and now ( these are Yama's words)
śreyas श्रेयस् - superior, excellent or distinguished ; that of the highest value (again Yama's words)This preyas is concerned with existing comfort, ease of life and conveniences. Who does not what this? Most in society are desirous of dāreṣaṇā (spouse) , putreṣaṇā (children), vitteṣaṇā (wealth) - these are called tri-eṣaṇā or the 3(tri)-eṣaṇā desires (eṣaṇā) or requests.

These are healthy things, yes? And without them we would not have a functional society. It is when there is excess, when more and more of the tri-eṣaṇā-s are desired , when they are elevated beyond reason that one gets stuck in them, and are caught-up in them. One's personal progress is hindered and the cycle of birth-after-birth continues.

The īśāvā upaniṣad suggests whose wealth is it anyway ? It is none other then the ownership of the Supreme.

Now enter śreyas, considered sādhu or virtuous , honorable , righteous. This is the path Naciketas chose.
When Yama offered Naciketas wealth, children, long life, chariots, etc. Naciketas responds that these things wear out ones vigor and life is too short for this (1st adhyāya 1st vallī , 25th and 26th śloka ~verse ~). Yama says ' You did not choose the garland of wealth that chains you up ( that binds). Many (there) are who sink therein' . That is , many in life take the path of preyas, which is understandable, yet many do not even know - or recognize - that śreyas is an available option. Yama says, ' the wise fully surveying them ( the choices) discriminates (viveka¹) and chooses śreyas in preference of preyas ' (1st adhyāya 2nd vallī , 2nd śloka).

Due to this choice of consistently choosing śreyas over preyas Naciketas is considered a uttama adhikārin - uttama is the highest, elevated, best, excellent + adhikārin¹ or spiritual aspirant ('fit for').

So , Why do I mention this? It is to offer that this kaṭhopaniṣad also brings the reader more then the account of what happens after death.

praṇām

words

uttama उत्तम - upper most, highest, greatest, most elevated , principal
adhikārin अधिकारिन् - a rightful claimant, possessing authority , entitled to , fit for
viveka विवेक - discrimination, right judgement , the faculty of distinguishing and classifying things according to their real properties

[yajvan]

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

Namasté

On another post I wrote the following


It is this thought ' this world is all that there is, and there is nothing beyond ' keeps one embedded in moha मोह - bewilderment , perplexity , distraction , infatuation , delusion; some consider these people mūḍha-s मूढ perplexed or confused, or gone astray, adrift in foolishness.
When the Upanishads deal with the notion of ignorance (avidya¹) they use different ways of describing this condition. Moha is one name as it suggests a level of delusion of what is real and unreal. The deluted are known as mūḍha-s मूढ perplexed or confused.

The īśāvā upaniṣad¹ suggests the a mūḍha is one that is ātmahantā¹ or to ātmahanuka - the one that kills the Self. Yet in the kaṭhopaniṣad this condition of ignorace is liked to a child - bāla.

Now why do the wise choose this word - bāla ? Could it be due to the notion of immaturity? Perhaps not fully-grown or developed? The kaṭhopaniṣad suggests the notion of bāla is one that goes after external pleasures. That is, like a child they are enamored with external objects of color,size, shapes, noise. The object feeds the mind and entertains it. But yet the senses are easiy coaxed from object to object with the notion that the next 'thing' will bring more pleasure or enjoyment then the last, just a the child goes from toy-to-toy.


Now enter the wisdom found in the Chāndogya Upaniṣad¹, where Sanatkumāra is instucting Nārada and says, nālpe sukham asti or finite (alpa) things do not (na) contain happiness (sukha).

So , what is one to do? The kaṭhopaniṣad and the chāndogya upaniṣad gives us some hints. We can take this up in the next post.

praṇām


words

avidya अविद्य - unlearned, unwise of the Truth
ātmahantā आत्महन्ता is ātma +hantā ātma or ātman is the essense of th individdual , the Self + hantā is hana हन killing
īśāvā upaniṣad - 3rd śloka.
bāla बाल - young , childish , infantine , not full-grown or developed
bālā - young, female child
nālpe = na न or 'no' + alpa अल्प or ' trifiling. small , minute '
sukham is sukha सुख - happy, prosperous. Originally meaning 'having a good axle-hole' i.e. a good fit. How this appiles I do not know!
asti अस्त - set aside , given up , cease , vanish , perish
Chāndogya Upaniṣad - Chapter 7.23.1

[Visvamitra]

Thanks for posts 15-16 yajvan. I'm trying to understand the Katha U. now.

[Visvamitra]

So , what is one to do? The kaṭhopaniṣad and the chāndogya upaniṣad gives us some hints. We can take this up in the next post.

Does this part in the 2nd chapter have something to do with a solution?

"The word that all the Vedas disclose; the word that all austerities proclaim; seeking which people live student lives; that word now I will tell you in brief - It is OM! [v. 15] For this alone is the syllable that's Brahman! [How is this so?] For this alone is the syllable that's supreme! [I guess this is not a comparison to mantras.] When, indeed, one knows this syllable, he obtains his every wish. [v. 16] This is the support that's best! This is the support supreme! And when one knows this support, he rejoices in Brahman's world. [v. 17]"

Brahman I think is not transient. Naciketas in verse 10 says, "for by fleeting things one cannot gain the perrenial." Yama/Vaivasvata states that one "rejoices in Brahman's world" through the syllable OM, and Naciketas says in verse 10 "by things eternal I have gained the eternal".

[Visvamitra]

Katopanisad does not clearly say how Naciketa, a young lad could go to Yama's house.

Syvedi40 said that the K. U. does not clearly say how Naciketas could go to Yama's house. In ch. 2 v. 12-13 Yama says to whom his house is open. I'm not sue if Naciketas grasped this doctrine before he had gone there.

[Visvamitra]

finite (alpa) things do not (na) contain happiness (sukha)

The good, which is beneficial, and the gratifying both bind according to v. 1 ch. 2, though the former leads to what is good and the latter does not lead to the goal. The wise choose the former [v. 2]. Naciketas notes that it would be hard for one with insight of those who are beyond death/old age to delight in long life among the treasures ["what you call a treasure, I know to be transient" ch. 2, v. 10] in this transient existence [ch.1, v. 27-28].

The heaven world is where those who abide and transcend hunger/thirst are beyond Yama's grasp. Naciketas wants to understand the fire-alter which is its [heaven] foundation and leads there [ch 1. v. 13-14, 18-19] since Yama is learned in it [ch. 1, v. 13]. Yama says that the fire-alter is in the heart [ch.1, v. 14]. One abandons sorrow/joy when this is perceived, "The primeval one who is hard to perceive, wrapped in mystery, hidden in the cave [which I think would be in the heart as per ch. 1 v. 14], residing within th'impenetrable depth - regarding him as god, an insight gained by inner contemplation [ch. 6, v.19], both sorrow and joy the wise abandon." [ch. 2 v. 12] Apparently Yama describes its form [type/quantity of bricks and how they're laid] and Naciketas repeats those descriptions back to Yama. The fire-alter named after Naciketas is the beginning of the heaven world [ch.1, v. 15]. Verses 17-18 [ch.1] is a bit confounding to me. It seems the gold disc is the trinaciketah and this along with the fire-alter leads to heaven [ch.1, v.19].