Informations about Nagas

[orlando]

Namaste all.
I am interested to "warrior-ascetics" Nagas.They fascinate me.I saw some photos:naked and with the body full of ash.I did read something about them.Please could someone give informations about these shaivites sadhus?
Regards,
Orlando.

[sarabhanga]

Om namo Narayana!

;)

[Singhi Kaya]

here's a link from sarabhangas own site before he can post;)

http://www.adolphus.nl/sadhus/shiva.html

It has few lines and nice photos on the major shaiva sadhus.
I'll ask you to explore the full site as it is a treat~most well orhanized. Has lots on vaishnava sadhus as well

Nagas in particular are regarded as protectors of Sanatana dharma and I have read that in middle ages in height of moslem agregation they fought and gave thier lives with ease to protect the dharma. May be more experienced members can refer to articles if this is true. In that case they deserve special respect among all respected sadhus.

[sarabhanga]

Hara Hara! Mahadeva!

See also: sarabhanga/creation.html (http://in.geocities.com/sarabhanga/creation.html)

[orlando]

Namaste all.
Shri Sarabhanga,I am afraid to ask this questions:what did happen to the sexual organ of the naga in the image you posted?
Regards,
Orlando.

[sarabhanga]

Sorry Orlando, but I am sworn to secrecy. ;)

[orlando]

Namaste all.
Shri Sarabhanga,I am curious to know a thing.I already know that some white western became sadhus;are there western nagas in India?
If I am not wrong,somewhere in hindunet forum you told that your gurus are nagas.Maybe you personally know that naga without sexual organ in the photo you attached.If it so, and if it is not a secred,may I know the name of that naga?Just curious.

Regards,
Orlando.

[sarabhanga]

Namaste Orlando,

The Naga Akharas have not traditionally allowed "foreigners" to become Nagas. My own Samskara is Avadhuta (effectively a standard Sannyasin). The Avahan Akhara, however, has in recent years allowed the initiation of western Nagas.

The previous photograph was taken in Varanasi, and the Naga belongs to Juna Akhara, but I do not recall his name.

It is rare for Nagas to undergo actual castration, but their commitment to Brahmacarya is total, and the normal procreative desires and functions are strenuously denied by their practice of special Kriyas.

[orlando]

Namaste Shri Sarabhanga.
Thanks you very much for the explanation and for the photo.Very interesting.
Regards,
Orlando.

[orlando]

Namaste Orlando,

The Naga Akharas have not traditionally allowed "foreigners" to become Nagas. My own Samskara is Avadhuta (effectively a standard Sannyasin). The Avahan Akhara, however, has in recent years allowed the initiation of western Nagas.

The previous photograph was taken in Varanasi, and the Naga belongs to Juna Akhara, but I do not recall his name.

It is rare for Nagas to undergo actual castration, but their commitment to Brahmacarya is total, and the normal procreative desires and functions are strenuously denied by their practice of special Kriyas.

Namaste Shri Sarabhanga.
Fortunately I copied in a CD the image of Shri Yamuna Giri before you deleted it.;) :D
I have two questions:
1)Ia the total nudity a strict rule for the nagas?
2)are they "dangerous" like Aghori Sadhus or can I expect a good convesation with a Naga?

P.S:I really admire your discretion.

Regards,
Orlando.

[sarabhanga]

Namaste Orlando,

Traditionally, all Nāgas reside in the Jhāṛā Akhāṛā, which they know as Ānanda; and after Śaṅkara (c. 850), they were gradually organized into various formally established Akhāṛās.

There are now seven Śaiva Akhāṛās ~ Ānanda, Nirañjanī, Junā, Āvāhana, Aṭala, Nirvānī, and Agni.

There are also Vaiṣṇava Nāgas, who began establishing Akhāṛās (c. 1650) in imitation of the Śaiva system.

There was a great massacre of Vaiṣṇava Nāgas by disgruntled Śaiva Nāgas at Nāsik in 1690, and another battle at Haridwār in 1760 that left 1,800 dead.

There is now a kind of truce between the Śaiva and Vaiṣṇava Nāga Akhāṛās, although both parties are always kept well separated at Kumbha Melās !

Very few Nāgas actually go totally naked outside their Āśrama, except at the time of Kumbha Melā.

Very few Nāgas care to understand any foreign language, and most true Nāgas have no desire to meet “foreigners”. So, unless you know some Hindi language and have a reasonably functional understanding of orthodox Hindu Dharma, an encounter with a Nāga could be disappointing.

[Sudarshan]

Aren't Nagas monists? Then what exactly are Shaiva and Vaishnava Nagas? And what are they fighting for?

The battles appear scary.:)

[sarabhanga]

Namaste Sudarshan,

The following lines quoted from just one of your recent posts.

Majority opinion is convincingly in favour of Vaishnavism.

Shaivism finds lesser support than Vaishnavism in the Vedas.

Many neutral authorities have no doubts in classifying Shankara’s commentary as a far fetched one and beyond the scope of the sutras, and against the very word of sutras.

Shankaracarya refers only to Vishnu wherever he addresses Saguna Brahma. This is undeniable.

There is rarely anywhere in his works he ever refers to Shiva, leave alone use superlatives.

He based his authority on Vaishnava Puranas rather than on Shiava Puranas.

His bias towards Vaishnavism is not questionable to somebody who views his works impartially.

Shaiva Puranas are classified as Tamasic, and Shankara must have accepted this as well.
I would invite you to repeatedly insist on such things before a Shaiva Naga equipped with sacred weapons ~ and perhaps you could add that it is surely most appropriate for Vaishnavas to bathe before Shaivas at the Kumbha Mela, because that is what Shankaracarya would have intended.

[sarabhanga]

All Dashanami Sannyasins receive a sacred Mahavakya from their Acarya at the time of Samavartana, and the very suggestion of perversions such as “attatvamasi” for “tattvamasi” is highly offensive to Sannyasi tradition.

If Vaishnavism depends on the ideal of “Thou art NOT That” and (just like Islam) cannot tolerate anyone who understands otherwise, then the massacre of Vaishnava Nagas (who never even existed before the British arrived in India) is quite understandable!

:6804382843:

Shaiva Sannyasins and Muslim Sufis had become fairly well reconciled during the time of Islamic rule in India. The Christian authorities of British occupation in India, however, saw Shiva as Satan and Krishna as Christ, and I suspect that the sudden rise of militant Vaishnavism was instigated by the East India Company and covertly supported by the subsequent English Christian rulers.

[Sudarshan]

All Dashanami Sannyasins receive a sacred Mahavakya from their Acarya at the time of Samavartana, and the very suggestion of perversions such as “attatvamasi” for “tattvamasi” is highly offensive to Sannyasi tradition.


Are you suggesting that Vaishnava Nagas were followers of Madhva line of thought? I know of no other tradition that does this. But it is just another opinion, and Madhva is quite intelligent to find complete basis in the scripture. I have seen Madhva interpreting tatvamasi as well, in another place. His goal was to oppose all forms of monism, strict or relaxed versions of it, and that includes Vishistadvaita too. He just exercised his basic rights as a philosopher - freedom of thought.

But there is absolutely nothing in his teachings that promote any physical violence. His modus operandi were the traditionally accepted forms of debate, in which all schools have indulged in - not just Madhva. Madhva did the same that Shankaracharya did in his times. Srivaishnavas never had a global program, and hence are primarily confined to the state of Tamil Nadu and Karnataka, where it originated, though many other later movements of Vaishnavism base their teachings on Srivaishnvism rather than on Madhva.( very few Hindus would concede that there is a second entity to God)

[satay]

( very few Hindus would concede that there is a second entity to God)

why would hindus think there would be a second entity to god? but we do have the trinity.
do vaishnavas believe in the trinity? just curious.

[Sudarshan]

why would hindus think there would be a second entity to god? but we do have the trinity.
do vaishnavas believe in the trinity? just curious.

Yes, Vaishnavas have a trinity, which go by the name of Sankarshana, Pradyumna and Aniruddha, which correspond roughly with the standard Hindu trinity of Shiva, Brahma and Vishnu. Above these trinity is Vasudeva( Para Vasudeva).

These four forms of Narayana, are the same as the quartet mentioned in the Mandukya Upanishad.

[Sudarshan]

Namaste Sudarshan,

The following lines quoted from just one of your recent posts.

I would invite you to repeatedly insist on such things before a Shaiva Naga equipped with sacred weapons ~ and perhaps you could add that it is surely most appropriate for Vaishnavas to bathe before Shaivas at the Kumbha Mela, because that is what Shankaracarya would have intended.

What is a sacred weapon? Is it some mantra by which I would be cursed?;)

I wouln't be afraid to confont such a Naga anyway. Actually, I have contacts with other Advaita sanyasins and discuss and talk with them on many issues

edited by satay: the rest of your post had nothing to do with the topic of this thread.

[sarabhanga]

The Vaishnava Akharas were created in the late 17th century by Shri Balananda, in direct opposition to the established Shaiva Akharas.

Four (Shaiva) Akharas were founded before 1600 AD ~ i.e. the Ananda, Niranjani, Juna, and Avahana Akharas ~ with the Atala Akhara formally established around 1650, and the Nirvani Akhara in about 1750.

The first seven Vaishnava Akharas (Digambara, Nirvana, Nirmohi, Niralambhi, Santoshi, Mahanirvani, and Khaki) became associated with each of the four main Vaishnava sects ~ i.e. Ramanuja’s Shri Vaishnava Sampradaya, Nimbarka’s Namavat Sampradaya, Madhva’s Brahma Sampradaya, and Ramananda’s Vairagya Sampradaya.

Madhvacarya is considered by his devotees as an incarnation of Vayu, descended particularly for the purpose of opposing the teachings of Shri Shankaracarya. And Madhvacarya simply revived the old teachings of Kumarila Bhatta, which had already been discredited by Shankara 400 years earlier! :metallicblue:

[sarabhanga]

Namaste Sudarshan,

A small portion of the Juna Akhara’s sacred armory is illustrated below.

And Nagas consider the entire world and all action as the embodiment and effect of Mantra. ALL objects and actions are essentially linked with particular Mantras ~ and no Naga is permitted to use any weapon without knowing the appropriate Mantras.

[orlando]

Namaste Shri Sarabhanga Giri.
I am eager to learn more and more about these warrior-ascetics.I very appreciated the picture with the naga equipped with two long sacred swords.
1)Could you describe Nagas' hierarchy?
2)Are they monist shaivites (like the follower of Kashmir Shaivism) or bhaktas of Lord Mahadeva(like followers of Shaiva-Siddanta and Vira-shaiva)?
3)According to nagas,what are the means to obtaining moksha?
4)Are they vegetarian?Is a strict rule to be vegetarian for them?
5)Again I ask you if nagas are dangeruous like Aghori Sadhus:would a naga come near to me and insult me or hurt me without any reason?
6)Do they respect other hindu traditions?
7)What kind of weapons do Nagas use?
8)Apart from learning an hindi language,what doctrine of hindu dharma should I learn in order to not have a disappoint encounter with a Naga?
9)Please could you attach other pictures of nagas?

I really hope that my several questions are not a problem.I will not mind if you will not reply.
Regards,
Orlando.

[sarabhanga]

Namaste Orlando,

The hierarchy within (and between) the Akhadas is a rather complex matter. There are many defined positions, each with its own particular sacred responsibilities and level of authority within the group.

I have previously noted that Nagas may be Shaiva or Vaishnava, and there are Nagas who follow all of the well-known schools of philosophy. The Dashanami Akhadas are all basically Shaiva, but each Akhada has its own particular Ishtadeva, and (generally) a distinct Guru Parampara with its own specific traditions.

All Nagas are basically “lacto-vegetarian”, with various degrees of dietary restriction (sometimes quite severe) within that range. And most Nagas prefer to cook for themselves, very rarely accepting meals that were prepared by an unknown shop-keeper or purchased from a restaurant or hotel.

Nagas certainly respect all authentic Hindu traditions, and no Naga would ever deliberately insult or assault you without any reason! In fact, when I was first traveling in India (as a relatively naïve “foreigner”), I regularly encountered support from various Dashanami Nagas. For example, arriving at Kurukshetra station, very early in the morning after a long journey, I had no idea where to go in the dark, so I sat down on the platform with my luggage, and promptly fell asleep. When I awoke at dawn, an unknown Naga was sitting next to me, having watched my unsecured belongings through the night. He led me to a tea-stall and provided some breakfast, along with a few very helpful instructions, and then he disappeared, asking nothing in return. A simple illustration, and perhaps I have been rather lucky, but many such incidents (all over India) gradually led me into their company.

However, I would strongly suggest that (along with some Hindi language) you first get some experience with the traditional etiquette and routines of orthodox Hindu temples and ashrams (preferably in India or Nepal). And some experience is also required to even recognize a true Naga ~ one ashen man with matted hair and dressed in a simple cloth looks basically the same as any other, and there are many imitators who are happy to take advantage of naïve foreign aspirants.

[sarabhanga]

Shri Shailam Mallikarjuna

[sarabhanga]

auM TAT sat

[sarabhanga]

And the divine forces are assembled before the dawn, in preparation for heroic action ...