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yajvan
07 June 2008, 09:01 PM
Hari Om
~~~~~

Namaste
I was thinking of Brahman ब्रह्मन् - from the root bRh ( some write bRMh)- to grow great or strong , increase to expand, greater then the greatest. This is the classical definition of Brahman, yet Brahman is considered beyond all conceptualization.

This Brahman is considered Fullness (bhuma) in the Upanishads. Yet as one reviews this Brahman more, it is considered nirguna, or the transcendent Absolute, some call pure consciousness or pure intelligence. Brahman is also, yet not limited to saguna, or the field of creation and the cosmos, everything thing, in time space and cause. When you consider niguna and saguna, Brahman is the totality of everything. There is no-thing in time, space or cause that IT is not - IT is ubiquitous.


I was thinking just how expansive, how infinite this Being is. Yet how much this Greatness has to throttle down to become a puruṣa¹ a person, or people as we know it.
As I think how vast, how much intelligence, how infinite this Brahman is, its as if one was taking the entire ocean and fitting it into a sesame seed. That is, anuttara becomes aṇu i.e. anuttara¹ or Reality, of which there is no higher, becomes aṇu - finite or a human being.

So what then gets constrained? From a Trika point of view I see this as the principle of saṇkoca¹, constriction, limitation. I see this as the kañcukas. This is also discussed as kośas on another HDF post¹. Yet for me, these 5 kañcukas are very descriptive. Let me offer these 5 and see what you think, your comments, suggestions and POV's are warmly welcomed.

Vyāpakatva or all pervasiveness, Omni-presence is condensed to niyati or restraint , restriction. This niyati is the closest to aṇu - finite.
We as humans have the distinct experience of being a digit, a single being. I started with this with this kañcuka as most if not all of us have this experience, that of multiplicity. We look into creation and see diversity and multiplicity. We look to ourselves and see individuality. As I talk to others, read and listen, this is the first experience that melts away with the experience of higher states of being, when the mala of ignorance is removed.
Sarvakartṛtva or omnipotence is condensed (āṇava) to kalā. This kalā is individual authorship, skill or creativity of the individual. There is creativity, yet limited.
Sarvajñatva or omniscience is condensed to vidyā or knowledge. Knowledge of discrete things and subject matter vs. all things at all times.
Pūrṇatva or all fulfillment , this notion of bhuma, fullness, completeness. This becomes condensed to rāga or desires. Why so? The fullness of Being of Brahman is contentment, yet as it throttles down, then the desire(rāga) for this fullness comes into play.
Nityatva or timelessness ( eternity) becomes condensed into time or kāla. And what do we know time does? It measures eternity second-by-second, and we take this time to be real.
Svantantrya is the notion of perfect freedom without bounds. Some call this icchā śakti or the will of the Almighty. With perfect freedom, there is no limitations. Yet this becomes condensed to cause-and-effect or karma. Actions and reactions. In perfect freedom there is no two, no duality. Where then can there be a reaction. In perfect freedom and pūrṇatva or completeness where is the need for acquiring. In perfect freedom and vyāpakatva or being all-pervasive, where is there '2' to have a reaction to if everything is your SELF?pranams

1. Words used

puruṣa पुरुष - a person; human being ; people , mankind
kośas is from the root kuś कुष् - to enfold, yet in the dictionary you will also see the following: to force or draw out , extract :to knead; to tear asunder
HDF Post : http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showthread.php?t=1768&page=4&highlight=pranamaya (http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showthread.php?t=1768&page=4&highlight=pranamaya)
saṇkoca ( some prefer saMkoca) संकोच - contraction , shrinking together , compression ; limitation , restriction
aṇu अणु (aNu) - fine , minute , atomic; an atom of matter ; an atom of time; ~ human being
āṇava आणव - fine , minute ; exceedingly small
anuttara अनुत्तर - chief , principal ; the best, highest i.e. Reality
kalā कला - skill , ingenuity ; also a digit or one-sixteenth of the moon's diameter yet; a division of time
sarva सर्व is used above - it means whole , entire , all , every ; total
bhuma is from bhū भू - to be on every side of ; thrive or prosper ;saturate , soak ;place of being , space , world or universe
rāga राग - vehement desire; passion; also the act of coloring or dyeing - red is associated with rāga, passion.
kāla काल to calculate or enumerate ; a measure of time; it also is a black or dark-blue color associated with another name of śani ( Saturn) who is suppose to meter out the time and dark-blue color
niyati नियति - restraint , restriction

yajvan
06 July 2008, 04:38 PM
Hari Om
~~~~~


I was thinking of Brahman ब्रह्मन् - from the root bRh ( some write bRMh)- to grow great or strong , increase to expand, greater then the greatest. This is the classical definition of Brahman, yet Brahman is considered beyond all conceptualization.

This Brahman is considered Fullness (bhuma) in the Upanishads. Yet as one reviews this Brahman more, it is considered nirguna, or the transcendent Absolute, some call pure consciousness or pure intelligence. Brahman is also, yet not limited to saguna, or the field of creation and the cosmos, everything thing, in time space and cause. When you consider niguna and saguna, Brahman is the totality of everything. There is no-thing in time, space or cause that IT is not - IT is ubiquitous.


Namaste,
An additional consideration -Paramabrahman or paramaśiva is also called uccārarahitam vastu¹. This is anuttara¹, that which is unsurpassable. Abhinavaguputa says this anuttara, this Being, the Experient of all, there is no other that can make IT his/her object of experience.

But what of this uccārarahitam vastu? A most interesting idea. It is the notion that this Reality (vastu) is devoid (rahita) of utterance or pronunciation (uccārá or uccārita).
The notion is, Brahman/paramaśiva cannot even be uttered in definition. Why so? As soon as you choose a word or sound, as soon as you try and describe IT, you have limited its vastness, its greatness.

We know that Brahman is rooted in bṛh - to grow , increase, expand. But trying to describe it, brings limitations. For this, Brahman is indescribable, uccārarahitam vastu.

pranams

words used

vastu वस्तु - Reality or essence ; any really existing or abiding substance or essence , thing , object , article
rahita रहित - deprived or void or destitute ; left , quitted , forsaken , deserted , lonely , solitary;
uccārá उच्चार - pronunciation , utterance or uccārita pronounced , uttered , articulated
uccārarahitam vastu - Reality that is devoid/deprived of utterance or pronunciation
bṛh बृह् -grow, expand, increase
anuttara अनुत्तर - chief , principal; yet it is that which is unsurpassable

TatTvamAsi
06 July 2008, 07:34 PM
Hari Om
~~~~~

"...yet Brahman is considered beyond all conceptualization...

...I was thinking just how expansive, how infinite this Being is..."


Namaste Yajvan,

As Ramana Maharishi has stated, the obove two words that I have emphasized present a paradox. The fact that the mind (manas) is ultimately limited and has to be transcended in order to realize the Absolute, makes imagining or characterizing the nature of tat (Brahman) is impossible.

In fact, once one assigns any attributes to Brahman, however subtle they may be, Brahman ceases to be nirguna! Of course, this is speaking strictly from an Advaita perspective.

Perhaps the "condensed" or "collapsed" Brahman with the attributes you have listed is the Atman! (?)

Subham.

TatTvamAsi
06 July 2008, 07:38 PM
Hari Om
~~~~~
Namaste,
As soon as you choose a word or sound, as soon as you as you try and describe IT, you have limited its vastness, its greatness.
pranams


Namaste Yajvan,

This is simply superb because I feel Quantum Mechanics has shown this to be "real" in the physical world as well! QM states that potentially ALL states (expanded consciousness) is at all times possible. When one "measures" it or attempts to do so (description etc.), it collapses into a SINGLE state! Thus, limiting the intrinsic quality of that which is measured/described! Likewise, if we attempt to describe or measure tat, we are ultimately limiting its true nature!

It is remarkable that sages thousands of years ago arrived at this truth whereas the so-called rationalists/scientists and others have just barely scratched the surface!

Subham.