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Aartee
10 October 2008, 11:15 AM
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reflections
10 October 2008, 12:19 PM
Namaste Aartee,

If you would not have been already married, I would have suggested you to reconsider the marriage because interfaith marriages are very difficult to make work. It needs a lot of maturity and understanding from both the sides.

Since you are already married, I will suggest you different option. According to Hinduism marriage is a spiritual union. Wife is known as 'Dharma Patni'. I will suggest you to work on it.

If possible, avoid faith discussions for few days. When you both are in good mood, tell him that you dearly love your religion. That offers you ultimate spiritual satisfaction. Tell him very politely that he has right to refuse coming to pujas and yagyas, you can still go to Church to show him your support. However he does not have right to stop your freedom of worship. Tell him that you rever your spirituality as much as he does his own. Tell him that 'he can force you to not attend worship, but your heart is temple of krishna/Shiva/deity, and it will remain irrespective of his pressure. If he will co-operate then your respect for him will multiply, If he will not, then also you will still worship Hindu deities.'

Don't raise your tone but show that you are firm. Also tell him that you respect his individuality and see how it goes.

Plus, as you are now married, please give a thought about your future children. Best option should be do expose them to both the religions and let them make their own decision when they grow up.

Hope that helped you.
Jai Sri Krishna ,

reflections.

Aartee
10 October 2008, 02:11 PM
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yajvan
10 October 2008, 06:05 PM
Hari Om
~~~~~



Namaste my friends,

My story to you all today is on my marriage, this is one of the reasons why i joined this forum, looking for some advice. You see, I being a Hindu and my husband being of the Christian faith, is always and constantly preeching to me about converting.
My dear friends he and I have been together two and a half years before deciding to get married.. he knowing I am a Hindu from day one. I thought this religion difference would not come up, but it is slowly becoming the topic of frustration in my marriage. We only got married in March of this year. Which was a Hindu ceremony. and already i feel stressed, exhausted and frustrated on the topic.
He keeps pressuring me to go to church with him. And told me that he wont go to satsangs and yagnas with me cause he will not partake in such things.
I am a stronger believer in my faith and get plenty fufillment from it. I have no intentions of converting. He does want me to participate in puja when my parents has them. This is bothering me alot. But i say that it's what I have in my heart he cannot take away and the prayers a meditation that i may say, he will never know.
I love him very much, and I do want to spend my entire lifetime with him, but it hurts me that he does and partakes in everything in his faith and wants me to ignore mines. I tell him that if he dont want me to pray in my faith i will be without God for the rest of my life then. Because i will not be a part of something that constricts you and brain washes you about aother faiths. I do not try to convert him to hinduism. Plese if anyone can give me some advice, I willing apriciate it... Anita.

Namaste Aartee

First let me say I do not have your answer. Yet I do notice one thing, that both of you have a common theme, a common focus, that of the Lord. Your spouse may call the Lord by another name, but his Lord is still anuttara, Supreme, as is your Lord.

There is commonality there. Is this not a good place to start the conversation - that of sameness? He chooses to rejoice or worship in one way, and you another. This adoration is still going to sattā, Being, the Supreme, the Lord.

Worship is differernt - Lord is not.


pranams

Aartee
10 October 2008, 06:27 PM
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Aartee
13 October 2008, 10:42 AM
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Eastern Mind
13 October 2008, 03:03 PM
This may sound a bit harsh, but.... It is never too late to undo a wrong. We have the ability to think freely. I know that there are societal and inner pride challenges, but sometimes...and it seems he is already suggesting it.. divorce may be the best solution. I have witnessed it a few times, and mostly I thought it was for the best. I can think of 3 examples off hand.

One was where the husband was just plain disorganized and lazy yet demanding, as a consequence the children were starving. Wife left with the kids mostly for their sake.

Another was an interacial interfaith marriage. Husband reconnected with his religion (Hindu) after 3 kids, wife wasn't very understanding, so divorce happened by mutual consent. (this one wasn't so ugly as the first.)

The last was a wife who got very religious (not by my definition) but lets say into a yoga guru, and practise.. ridiculous long hours at a time, and hence there was no time for anything else, especially the marriage.

Regardless, best of luck in your choice. Aum Namasivaya

Harjas Kaur
14 October 2008, 04:28 AM
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Aartee
14 October 2008, 08:18 AM
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saidevo
14 October 2008, 09:17 AM
Namaste Aartee.

We had a woman colleague in office who was a Hindu and her husband a Christian. They were classmates in school and the acquaintance developed into marriage. I don't know about the parents of the couple, but the couple themselves are happy together, leading a life of a dual religion, both of them performing the rituals of both the religions, and having images of Hindu gods and Jesus at home.

Unfortunately, such accommodation seems to be not there in your newly wedded life, nor the willingness to accommodate each other religiously. You both stand rigid on your own religion because of personal convictions, and therein lies the problem. I hope you beware that the problems would be much more complicated once you have children.



Please I come here to get peace of mind and be around the people who understands me. And also those who can help me to help him understand our religion. Other than my prayers, I seek help here.


Does he know that you have signed up here? Why not invite him too? HDF members can help him understand our religion if he is interested in such discussions and joins the Forum, so why not invite him too? Keep praying though, for prayers can be precursors to miracles.

PS: If he is rational about God and religion, I think you can encourage him to read Theosophy, which highlights the Hindu concepts--specially karma and rebirth--in a way that suits the westerners. After he has enough acquaintance with Theosophy, he can turn his attention to the core ancient wisdom it is based on, and this can automatically lead him to know about and understand Hinduism.

Harjas Kaur
14 October 2008, 05:47 PM
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atanu
14 October 2008, 11:41 PM
But as I'm already married, I take it upon myself to make it work. I have told him those words before and still he insists that our marriage is not going to last if i continue this way. Anita.

Dear Anita,

I missed your post for a long time. You have a big problem, which may tear you apart before showing you the light. I have been through such an unsolvable problem.

The problem is hidden in your statement: I take it upon myself to make it work. God has given you this problem and He will take it away, when the Ego -- the bull, prostrates at His feet. I am not being curt or harsh. This is the truth. Both of you are haggling over non-issues, which however are greatest issues for the egos -- not your alone. Egos grow through egos.

The fact is that you married your husband not for your religion or his religion. You married him because you loved him. But how things change after marriage?

I am sure that your and his insistences on sticking to each one's way of faith has nothing to do with God, but it has to do with the Bull -- the Ego. If Ego rules both of you then it may be better to call it a day immediately.

On the other hand, if you make a joint prayer to Good Lord, (let the images of Lord be different for him and you), then both of you will benefit in an unlimited way. Had I been in your place, I would have remained silent on my own demands and accompanied him to his prayer places and prayed to God to show him that Rama and Jesus are no different. I would have given at least 3 months to this endeavour. However, now I know that whatever the egos do, the drama is scripted and will take its own course. Best is prayer and goodwill.


I understand that you are in a very difficult situation.
May God lift you out of this. I expect Satay to say the final word.

Om Namah Shivaya

atanu
14 October 2008, 11:51 PM
"I love him very much and I know he does too. He can never pull me away from my devotion because he can never change my heart, it's untouchable.


Anita,

This is wrong. Heart is the Love. And it does not change -- it remains Love.

Om

God opens doors no man can close, and closes doors no man can open...

sm78
15 October 2008, 03:12 AM
[COLOR=Black]Your prayers cannot change his mind. It doesn't work that way. This suffering world is meant to be a medicine for spiritual ailments. If you believe suffering won't come to you, you will be sadly disillusioned. The way to minimize the suffering which accrues from our karma, our past bad choices and faulty understanding, is to make good and positive choices, healthy choices. Don't cling to poison or suffering is sure to follow. It's Divine law. ...... ................................................

There is wisdom in the above post which other suggestions lack completely (my egotistic opinion).

Atanu,

Religious identity (social identity) may be a thing for the Ego but, so is marital identity, being a wife of someone, loving someone, being a father to someone and everything else .... really.

atanu
15 October 2008, 03:42 AM
There is wisdom in this post which other suggestions lack completely (my egotistic opinion).

Atanu,

Religious identity (social identity) may be a thing for the Ego but, so is marital identity, being a wife of someone, loving someone, being a father to someone and everything else .... really.

Namaste SM,

You have hit upon the bull's eye. Exactly what I missed but which I knew I was missing. Thank you for the opportunity to expand a bit further. You are correct that Religious identity (social identity) and also the marital identity are basically ego identities. Spiritualists need not argue on this.

In everyone's life, there are interactions of such diverse identities -- some sweet, some not so sweet, and some outright poisonous. But all these identities (I believe) are partners on the road to same goal. All identities that you interact with are there to propel you to the pure goal. There are no enemies but only partners, who are meant to benefit each other. Lord Shani is considered the best teacher not for nothing.

With this perspective, I will suggest to try to transcend the ego identity to help each other. But, if that was not possible at all (under great duress), even then I will suggest parting as a friend and a partner -- counting the blessings. But before throwing in the towel, the truth of life's challenges should be understood in the light of Goodness of God.

ਜਿਉ ਸੰਪੈ ਤਿਉ ਬਿਪਤਿ ਹੈ ਬਿਧ ਨੇ ਰਚਿਆ ਸੋ ਹੋਇ ॥੩॥
jio sanpai thio bipath hai bidhh nae rachiaa so hoe ||3||
As is wealth, so is adversity; whatever the Lord proposes, comes to pass. ||3||
~SGGS Ji p. 337


Om Namah Shivaya

sm78
15 October 2008, 04:55 AM
Namaste SM,

You have hit upon the bull's eye. Exactly what I missed but which I knew I was missing. Thank you for the opportunity to expand a bit further. You are correct that Religious identity (social identity) and also the marital identity are basically ego identities. Spiritualists need not argue on this.

In everyone's life, there are interactions of such diverse identities -- some sweet, some not so sweet, and some outright poisonous. But all these identities (I believe) are partners on the road to same goal. All identities that you interact with are there to propel you to the pure goal. There are no enemies but only partners, who are meant to benefit each other. Lord Shani is considered the best teacher not for nothing.

With this perspective, I will suggest to try to transcend the ego identity to help each other. But, if that was not possible at all (under great duress), even then I will suggest parting as a friend and a partner -- counting the blessings. But before throwing in the towel, the truth of life's challenges should be understood in the light of Goodness of God.

ਜਿਉ ਸੰਪੈ ਤਿਉ ਬਿਪਤਿ ਹੈ ਬਿਧ ਨੇ ਰਚਿਆ ਸੋ ਹੋਇ ॥੩॥
jio sanpai thio bipath hai bidhh nae rachiaa so hoe ||3||
As is wealth, so is adversity; whatever the Lord proposes, comes to pass. ||3||
~SGGS Ji p. 337


Om Namah Shivaya

Namaste,

I am grateful that you can are able to reply positively to my otherwise sarcastic manner of posting ~ but it will not change.

I agree, we have friends and foes in this world, both are ego impressions and both of them help propell us towards the same goal.

Yet, treating the foe as a friend is not necessarily the best way to transcend the ego. I feel we get lost around this point in our attempt to get around ego and in reallity become ensnared by it.

Sama Dristi - (looking with an equal eye, equality), is regarded as one of nobel qualities in Yoga sadhana. In practical terms this might imply that we should look everyone with an equal eye regardless of their strature, religion, previous crimes etc... This is a favorite theme of religious teachers.

Yet, does this mean we should treat a muderer with same respect as a soldier?? Many people all around seem to imply -> "YES".

... And, therein lies my problem.

atanu
15 October 2008, 05:22 AM
Namaste,
Yet, does this mean we should treat a muderer with same respect as a soldier?? Many people all around seem to imply -> "YES".

... And, therein lies my problem.

Dear Friend,

Your problem is my problem. See, with testimony of Anita, one cannot brand her husband a murderer. Can one? Anita will know better and she repeatedly says that she loves him.

-------------------------
In general terms (regarding treating a murderer and a soldier similarly), Advaita masters do not teach us to use a table and a table lamp in same fashion but teaches that the Seer of both these objects is ONE and pervade equally. However, the former incorrect view is how Dvaitic minds interpret Advaita.

Moerover, a soldier of the enemy country often does not count as a soldier. And a terrorist bearing same ego ideology as me may not count as a terrorist. Till God gives me the strength to accept the happenings, whether adverse or favourable, as play of Guna alone, I may simply not be able to evaluate and distinguish the Good and Evil in pure terms.

Om

sm78
15 October 2008, 08:31 AM
Dear Friend,

Your problem is my problem. See, with testimony of Anita, one cannot brand her husband a murderer. Can one? Anita will know better and she repeatedly says that she loves him.

-------------------------
In general terms (regarding treating a murderer and a soldier similarly), Advaita masters do not teach us to use a table and a table lamp in same fashion but teaches that the Seer of both these objects is ONE and pervade equally. However, the former incorrect view is how Dvaitic minds interpret Advaita.

Moerover, a soldier of the enemy country often does not count as a soldier. And a terrorist bearing same ego ideology as me may not count as a terrorist. Till God gives me the strength to accept the happenings, whether adverse or favourable, as play of Guna alone, I may simply not be able to evaluate and distinguish the Good and Evil in pure terms.

Om

I was not implying that Anita's husband is a murderer, btw. :) We should hardly be able to comment on her situation.

I understand universalims and advaita are 2 different things. But r we careful always in practical matters?

Good and Evil can be evaluated in relative terms and we can have increasingly broader reference frames (good-evil for my own body-self, good-evil for my family, good evil for my country, good-evil for the society at large, good-evil for humanity in general ...)

As long we exist in a mortal frame we must make our choices.

atanu
15 October 2008, 09:53 AM
As long we exist in a mortal frame we must make (and do make) our choices.

Namaskar Singhi (and Anita),

OK. A few words more. OM.

Making a choice in such torn apart situation is the impossible part, since the options are 'this' or 'that' and this impossiblity gives the constant tearing apart feeling. Had the marriage been bitter and spent out, then possibly, it would have been easier. It may be easy to say "Divorce" and also a bit easier to run away. But running away from a problem will land one into another similar situation sooner or later, because the cause would have been left untreated. My experience has taught me that the ability to isolate ego from these torn apart situations mitigates pains by integrating 'this' and 'that', irrespective of the result. But it is easier said than done and requires faith, bhakti and meditation on scripture, which teach:


As is wealth, so is adversity; whatever the Lord proposes, comes to pass. ||3||
~SGGS Ji p. 337Several views are there for Anita to consider but it is she who has to cope. She should not fix her opinions at present bitter time, when Hindu -Christian bad vibes are ruling. The opinions will be fiery and destructive.

I wish the couple happiness, whatever the decision and the outcome.

Om Namah Shivaya

atanu
15 October 2008, 10:22 AM
Dear Anita,

I do not know whether you and your husband have got done a horoscope match or not? If not then, IMO, Shri Yajvan (or me) may be able to help you. Hindu way of Kundali matching will reveal the strength of the realtionship. If the match is good then you may rest assured and bide the bad vibe time patiently.

To do a match, birth date, time, and place of both of you will be required. I suggest you may correspond with Shri Yajvan to his e-mail address.

Best Wishes.

Om Namah Shivaya

Aartee
15 October 2008, 11:03 AM
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reflections
15 October 2008, 11:12 AM
Hi Aartee,
Namaste,
Is it due to recent Hindu-Christian tensions that took place in India, which made him more intolerant of Hinduism? Where in both groups were right and both groups were wrong.

May be if you let some time pass, it will get diluted.

I appreciate that you want to make your marriage life work and you are taking initiative for it. The best thing at this point is to create a pluralism and acceptance in your husband's mind. It seems that you are already doing what people have suggested. I don't have answer, what next. Just, keep your faith strong. Pray with sincerity. I will also pray for you.

Aartee
15 October 2008, 11:22 AM
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Aartee
15 October 2008, 11:25 AM
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atanu
15 October 2008, 11:43 AM
Namaste Atanu..

No we have not done one of these horoscope match. I do want to have one of these done. and do appreciate you help with all my heart...

Hari Om

Namaste Aartee,

You are welcome and I respect your decision. I am sure Shri Yajvan will help. Or I may also check up, in case he is away or busy. Please let us know. God opens doors no man can close, and closes doors no man can open...


Best Wishes

sm78
15 October 2008, 11:16 PM
My experience has taught me that the ability to isolate ego from these torn apart situations mitigates pains by integrating 'this' and 'that', irrespective of the result.

I agree with you fully, what I might disagree with you is about what it means to "take ego out of the equation".

Harjas Kaur
15 October 2008, 11:41 PM
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atanu
16 October 2008, 12:34 AM
I agree with you fully, what I might disagree with you is about what it means to "take ego out of the equation".

Namaste Singhi,

I agree to you fully.:)

Om

dhruva023
16 October 2008, 08:38 AM
I agree with Ms, Harjas Kaur.
Although, I am too young for this matter, I feel like she is right.

Aartee
16 October 2008, 10:16 AM
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Aartee
17 October 2008, 10:45 AM
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Aartee
17 October 2008, 11:16 AM
......

dhruva023
17 October 2008, 10:50 PM
Don't worry, take it as a positive action of god.
Whenever something happens in my life that I don't want to be happening, I think about it as if it will give me good result later on.
If I get really angry about any bad event in my life, I just start talking to Keshav, like he is standing in front of me. Obviously, He wont answer me in words. But I do get answer in action. Many times, later on, I have realized that, whatever happened in past was good.
This is not something that I am making up, I do really talk to him, and I get all the answers.
I have attached 2 pictures, Carefully analyze both picture. Put yourself in place of Arjun, and talk to Keshav, You will really feel the difference.
God is always with us, we just need to realize it.

Infinite Regress
18 October 2008, 05:08 AM
I dont know if it was saved but here is a picture of my husband and myself...

I don't see how this picture is relevant to the subject matter. But anyway, the best course of action is divorce.

devotee
18 October 2008, 08:58 AM
[quote=Aartee;25042]
I am sadden to know that i am thinking of finalizing my decision on this matter. I think that it is indeed headed for divorce. I know that I will disappoint my parents, my friends and family. but the matter has worsen as of last night.[quote]

Namaste Anita,

I would say, there is a need to give each other his own space & some time to ponder over related issues before deciding straightway to "divorce". The question is, "Is it the real issue ?" or is it something else which is coming in the garb of this excuse to get separated ?? Trying to cling on somehow is dangerous & jumping to a decision of divorce is not less dangerous. OK. There is a matter of dispute between us ... so let us separate giving each one the necessary personal space & time to think it with a cool-head.

Ask him, "What will happen when he realises that what he considers God's voice today comes out to be his own creation ? What happens if it is too late by that time to set things right what are going to be damaged with this decision ?" I think there may be something else which is bothering him. There may be some pains of failure in material life lying deep within which he wants to escape.

Tell him that if God wanted everyone to embrace Christianity then he would have designed human brain accordingly to make it simple & effective. Why God talks to him only & not to Anita ? Is Anita created by some other God ? If She is wrong why he doesn't show her the "correct path" ?? Tell him that the path that this "God" wants him to trade is not the path of love ... it doesn't unite but divide hearts ... & so it cannot be the voice of God. Can God advocate policy of hatred just because soemone calls Him by some other name ? Not even a human father does that. Is God worse than even human beings ?

If a Hindu's God & a Christian's Gods were different then Sun would not shine equally in the same way upon the two ... then the earth would not treat both of them equally. Tell him without fear that he has got trapped in the dogma of the Church & actually going far away from God. The Path of Church divides ... God's path must unite ALL. God the father of all cannot discriminate between his own children. Tell him that if he is so religious & a true man of God, let him debate on this issue on this forum. If he is able to prove that only Jesus is the True God, you will convert to Christianity & this Devotee i.e I will too become a Christian.

I wish your husband sees reason & your marriage is saved but if you are not able to save this marriage ... may be it is good for you. Try your best .... but accept the WILL of GOD !

Blessings of Lord Krishna .

Devotee

Aartee
18 October 2008, 10:15 AM
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Harjas Kaur
19 October 2008, 12:40 AM
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satay
19 October 2008, 12:30 PM
Namaskar,
I haven't read the whole thread yet. However, I would like to say that my prayers are with Aartee. I think that you are trying your best to make the marriage work. Sad to see that religion has come in between.

I would like to say also that there are many successful inter-religion marriages as well. Mine is one. My wife is a christian and we have worked out the religion thing in the beginning years of our marriage. We decided that we will not force each other to anything and let things happen with logic and exposure if they must. This gave me exposure to christianity. I tried to study it and found it to be pompus and useless for my own personal self. My wife is fine with that. On the other hand, my wife is exposed to hinduism, hindu rituals, and traditions. She accepts them well and see the logic in most of them. The ones she doesn't, she is not forced into. I did have trouble with some of her family members when we had just got married who tried hard to 'convert' me over to christianity but I gave them a copy of the gita and said, "how about you read this and I will read the bible and we will compare notes in a few weeks". I never heard back from them about religion. We also decided that if we had kids that we will expose them to both religions and let them decide. We have a daughter. We used to take her to church and mandir when she was very young. Now that we have no time to go to church or mandir we just pray at home. My daughter seems to be a devotee of Shiva as we often find her sitting in a trance in front of shiva statue in our home. It is sort of weird to see a child sitting there without saying a word. She often plays with rudraksha beads that hang around the neck of the murthi. She often sits with me as I do japa.

The point of sharing this story is that a marriage can still work even if partners have different religions.

reflections
20 October 2008, 05:36 AM
Dear Aartee,
If Divorce is the only way, I pray that the almighty gives you strength to go through it. However, it seems you both still love each other. So, don't hasten to a decision which will effect you life and his.

Aartee
20 October 2008, 08:18 AM
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Aartee
20 October 2008, 08:19 AM
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