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rkpande
13 August 2009, 03:29 AM
I quote from Vivekachudamani:-

sutra 4. The man who, having by some means obtained a human birth, 'with a male body' (inverted quotes are mine) and mastery of the Vedas to boot, is foolish enough not to exert himself for self liberation, verily commits suicide, for he kills himself by clinging to things material.

sutra 5. What greater fool is there than the man who having obtained a rare human body, and a mascuiline body too, neglects to acieve the real end of this life?

What it implies is that it may be easier and faster for men to liberate.
What it definatey means is that human male body is superior than female body for spritual advancement.
Shri Shankra would not say that unless sanctioned by shruti or smriti.

Could somebody please tell me if it is mentioned anywhere else or what did Shri Shankra actually mean.

rkpande
14 August 2009, 12:36 AM
I forgot about Goswami Tulsidas who did mention '.....dhor pasu nari ye sub tadan ke adhikri'

Eastern Mind
14 August 2009, 06:07 AM
I quote from Vivekachudamani:-

sutra 4. The man who, having by some means obtained a human birth, 'with a male body' (inverted quotes are mine) and mastery of the Vedas to boot, is foolish enough not to exert himself for self liberation, verily commits suicide, for he kills himself by clinging to things material.

sutra 5. What greater fool is there than the man who having obtained a rare human body, and a mascuiline body too, neglects to acieve the real end of this life?

What it implies is that it may be easier and faster for men to liberate.
What it definatey means is that human male body is superior than female body for spritual advancement.
Shri Shankra would not say that unless sanctioned by shruti or smriti.

Could somebody please tell me if it is mentioned anywhere else or what did Shri Shankra actually mean.

How about if we forget scripture for but a moment, and reflect on the wisdom that arises from our own heart, and sushumna to the intuitive mind. In other words, what do you think?

Scriptures are only wise guides, (and sometimes not so wise) and these wise guides seem to have lots of contradictions, so the intellect has to choose. Would it not be simpler to meditate, and figure this out on one's own?

Aum Namasivaya

rkpande
14 August 2009, 06:29 AM
Yes I have tried to figure it out in my own way and i will mention it after i learn the opinion of our learned friends. what i think of this may not be what Shri Shankra would have ment.
Shri Shankra is credited with n numer of writings, some where he may have given its meaning, which some body may have chanced upon to read.
I am quite certain in my mind that Shri Shankra with the mind that he had will ever write any thing which is not reasoned, he may have his reasons which we can't figure out..

Spiritualseeker
14 August 2009, 06:33 AM
Namaste,

interesting. Its odd because our Soul is genderless... God him or herself is genderless. I would think a woman has just an equal chance for enlightenment. Afterall it was my wife who influenced me to look again into eastern philosophy. No she is not fully enlightened but I owe a lot to her.

dhruva023
14 August 2009, 07:01 AM
In Hinduism, you dont read scripture as if they are commands. You read them as a guide. This reminds me one of the Shankaracharya ji's quote. He said, I wont believe that Fire is cold even if Veda says that. Why, because I have experienced it.

brahman
18 August 2009, 04:28 AM
I quote from Vivekachudamani:-

sutra 4. The man who, having by some means obtained a human birth, 'with a male body' (inverted quotes are mine) and mastery of the Vedas to boot, is foolish enough not to exert himself for self liberation, verily commits suicide, for he kills himself by clinging to things material.

sutra 5. What greater fool is there than the man who having obtained a rare human body, and a mascuiline body too, neglects to acieve the real end of this life?

What it implies is that it may be easier and faster for men to liberate.
What it definatey means is that human male body is superior than female body for spritual advancement.
Shri Shankra would not say that unless sanctioned by shruti or smriti.

Could somebody please tell me if it is mentioned anywhere else or what did Shri Shankra actually mean.



This is only a translation gap,(find Sanskrit here http://www.scribd.com/doc/4436024/VivekaChudamani)

The Sanskrit term Pourusha means a quality associated with moral behavior.
The true meaning, however, is: it is a quality associated with Purusha. Purushatva does not refer to externals like
dress or other physical features. Thus the terms Purusha can be applied only to the Divine.


Brahman

rkpande
18 August 2009, 05:26 AM
I have quoted from a translation by swami madhavananda, published by Advaita Ashram, Kolkata

atanu
18 August 2009, 06:10 AM
Namaste Friends,

One may remember the scripture, wherein it is Prajapati who is deluded and lust after His own daughter, who all the while knew that it was a wrong thing because she was none but His light only. Of course, there is another side to it, again from the Veda. Yami insists to engage in sex with Yama, who actually being her brother, refuses.

Both stories together teach me that it is for the man to understand the strength of Maya and stabilise himself and protect himself from the delusion. Maya will always be Maya -- it is no other but the Purusha himself.


A third Veda verse is about Surya's bridal, wherein, the sage sings her praise as the Surya, who has married at three levels. First with Soma, then with Gandharva, and finally with a mortal man. The song sings her praise and requests her to guide the menfolk of the house in the straight path.

-------------------------

Sometime back, I suffered from Chikungunya. At the peak of the infection, I had to travel on official work and thus, I visited my Homeo doctor for advice. While waiting for my turn, I noticed a very attractive lady seated in the clinic. I am not ashamed to say that some impure thoughts rose in me momentarily.

While being seated there, I felt that something was amiss and I would not be able to reach home on my own. And then I sunk and lost consciousness. When, I came back to senses, I found myself lying on the floor beside the chair on which I was sitting and the lady was feeding me water with a spoon.

There were many men but it was the sole female who took care. I understand what the female form is. However, that does not mean that the male form is any less divine -- only, IMO, the male form is more deluded and egoistic and thus needs sadhana.


Om Namah Shivaya

Eastern Mind
18 August 2009, 06:38 AM
Atanu: So when you came to, did you think you were in heaven?

Aum

atanu
18 August 2009, 06:43 AM
Atanu: So when you came to, did you think you were in heaven?

Aum

Not really. But the eyes moistened.

Eastern Mind
18 August 2009, 06:51 AM
The one time I passed out, (fell backwards off a flatbed truck onto a stone in the middle of my back, on a very hot day) I came to, with a friend's hand in my mouth, trying to make sure I didn't swallow my tongue and choke. I had the sensation of seeing my whole life pass before my eyes in about 60 seconds. I found that part interesting. That evening for the first time in my life, I used the F bomb in front of my mother. When explaining the experience, family members thought it must have been painful, not 'neat' as I was insisting. As the argument progressed, I finally said, "I don't care what you think? It was f...in neat." The look on my mother's face was priceless, until it turned into a hearty laugh.

Aum

atanu
18 August 2009, 07:13 AM
---I used the F bomb in front of my mother. When explaining the experience, family members thought it must have been painful, not 'neat' as I was insisting. As the argument progressed, I finally said, "I don't care what you think? It was f...in neat." The look on my mother's face was priceless, until it turned into a hearty laugh.

Aum

ha ha. I have a habit of passing out now and then on account of irregular blood pressure. The initial coming on feel is terrifying -- sinking into a bottomless pit. But the swoon itself wipes away a lot of accumulated tension.

Actually, the Nirvikalpa is similar, except that one dives in to that bottomless pit knowingly and with full consciousness. And the beginning (to the beginners) is frightful -- an experience of landing without any landing ground.

Om Namah Shivaya

bhaktajan
18 August 2009, 11:39 AM
Q. Is male [body] better for achieving liberation than female body?
A. Yes.

It is the pinicle of the maxim:
One will learn life's lessons one of two ways: "By the Carrot or by the stick"

The question is:
Q. Is Female [body] at a disadvantage for achieving liberation than male body?
A. No.

The hidden idea in the original posted question is, that life is all-consuming . . . and women are more susceptable to being lulled by 'Maya'.

bhargavsai
06 September 2009, 02:05 AM
I have quoted from a translation by swami madhavananda, published by Advaita Ashram, Kolkata

Swami Madhavananda is a human, he also can be wrong ;)