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yajvan
03 November 2009, 12:52 PM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

Namasté

I have been seeing more conversations as of late on the notion of mantra-s. I thought I could contribute some information regarding these prescribed sounds, yet will not go too deep on this.

My intent is to offer a better understanding on this subject before one picks-up a sound and uses it and finds it may or may not be tailored to one's needs.
I have no desire to subscribe mantras to individuals - it would be wise to pursue this under proper guidance ( other then me).

When we talk of mantra one is in the realm of sound (śabda) and vibration (spanda). An individual would be wise to consider:

Mantra types - purpose and intent
Proper time and place (muhūrta) for the birth (jāti) of the mantra to occur within the individual.
How to kindle the mantra, etc.
Dikbala - or directional strength
etc.Are there other considerations ? Sure, yet if we go deeper and deeper into the subject that may in fact just cause consternation and/or confusion so we will leave it to a few ideas and concepts.

Mantra types
Overall mantra-s can be grouped into ṣaḍ-karma ( or 6 types of actions). They have guṇatā (attributes or qualities ) of satvic, rajasic and tamasic.

śāntiḥ or śānti शान्ति -peace ; those sounds and vibrations that bring, establish and perpetuate peace in the
individual and surroundings ( surroundings = environment, society, universe).
vasikārā वसिकारा - vasi 'a dwelling place' + kārā 'binding, confinement' ; hence vasikārā mantra-s deal with confinement, captivating, binding, attracting to the point of possession.
stambha स्तम्भ - is support , propping , strengthening ; yet this is also means stiffness , rigidity , paralysis , stupefaction. These mantra-s when designed can have two outcomes, that of support or propping up, or those that are used for limitation. Hence stambhana mantra-s are for stopping, halting, obstructing or limiting, making immobile.
uccatanā उच्चतना - ucca is high, loftly; yet it is also intense, violent; tanā is succession , one after another , continually. This mantra vibration brings continual intensity. Its focus is on aversion towards a person, place or thing.
maraṇa मरण - the act of dying , death from the root (√) 'mṛ' dying , death . Those vibrations that inflict stimulate and cause/influence the act of death.This is a start... in a future post we can add to the overall conversation and add a few more items.

praṇām

yajvan
03 November 2009, 01:37 PM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

Namasté

I wrote,



My intent is to offer a better undersanding on this subject before one picks up a sound and uses it and finds it may or may not be taylored to one's needs.

How does perfectly taylored to one's needs occur ? By a guru. What does the guru bring?
This HDF post may assist: http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showthread.php?t=3377&highlight=guru

praṇām

sunyata07
03 November 2009, 02:52 PM
Namaste Yajvan,

Thanks for starting this thread. You don't know how long I've been waiting for someone to offer their knowedlge of mantra usage in general on this forum, without being overly technical or overly simple. As usual, the sanskrit terminology clarifies a lot. My experiences with using mantras has been mostly devotional; I've never had much success with using it for deep meditation purposes or for raising kundalini or anything like that. I've only read Thomas Ashley-Farrand's "Change Your Karma with the Power of Sacred Sound" book, and while the explanations for beej sounds were good, I felt it oversimplified some aspects of mantra use. I ended up showing this book to my sister very early on in my studies of mantra use as part of yoga practice and she was very skeptical, incidentally making me wonder if there was sense in thinking that by chanting a mantra somehow I could win the lottery! If only life were half so straightforward!

I'm now interested in hearing about proper mantra usage, its benefits, what not to do, etc. In particular, this perscription of mantras for different people sounds interesting. Are some mantra sound vibrations better suited for some temperaments and individuals than others? I'm also wondering what you mean by proper time and muhurta for using mantras optimally. I had this notion that dawn/dusk was the best time for any use of mantra meditation. Please correct me if I've been misinformed on this! :) Unfortunately, I have no guru to instruct me on this, and I would be very careful about following the advice of self-help books that seem like a quick fix to all manner of problems we face in everyday life.

yajvan
03 November 2009, 03:30 PM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

Namasté sunyata07,


I'm also wondering what you mean by proper time and muhurta for using mantras optimally. I had this notion that dawn/dusk was the best time for any use of mantra meditation. Please correct me if I've been misinformed on this!

In the coming days we will talk a bit more about this...You can look at this post and it will help: http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showthread.php?t=622 (http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showthread.php?t=622)


Yet one can also consider the proper day (vara - choicest , valuable , precious ) , time (muhūrta), direction( dikbala - N, NE, W, S, etc.), to begin and continue one's practice. This will be some of the ideas we can discuss.
Yet , after its all said and done, its of key import to practice and not get too confused with all the possibilities. I see this occur in ayurvedic practices on eating the right things - people at times get all confused and that does little good to one's overall nourishment albeit the stomach or the mind :) .


Lets wait till a few more HDF members read this posts above so they can reivew and participate as they see fit.


praṇām

yajvan
05 November 2009, 11:13 AM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

Namasté

Some information from a few previous conversations on HDF that is applicible to this string.


There is a rule of thumb that suggests repetitions depend on the number of akṣara अक्षर (syllables or phonemes) the mantra contains. Pending the number, 1 lac (lakśa लक्ष; 1 lac =100,000) is counted for each akṣara and the total count = the total repetitions that bring siddhi (sidh= to attain or success).
That is why the proper mantra format is of great value. The correct akṣara is considered from the saṁskṛt akṣara format not an interpretation. This has nothing to do with meaning of the mantra but its saṁskṛt (some like to write sanskrit) akṣara count.


Here are some bīja sounds we talked about from another post: http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showpost.php?p=34201&postcount=5 (http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showpost.php?p=34201&postcount=5)
With regard to the bīja (seed) sounds that accompany the mantra i.e. kṛṁ कृं ( some prefer it written kreem) and the like, each seed sound is owned/influenced/stimulated by that bīja (seed) sound. Each sound has a influence, an intent.

As you would suspect this 'k' sound stimulates Mars. What are Mars seed sounds?

क ka - it is a influence of fire hence maṅgala - perhaps saying aṅgāra is better - aṅgāra is charcoal. We think of heat & flame with charcoal; another name of Mars. Also aṅgiras which is a noun of agni and also a family of ṛṣi-s. We can see the connection to aṅgāra and aṅgiras - both deal with luminosity.
ख kha - (my favorite) as it is associated with ākāśa. This HDF post is all about this ākāśa
http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showthread.php?t=4704 (http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showthread.php?t=4704)
This akāśa is expressed by khaṁ खंbīja vibration (from खkha) and this khaṁ is said to be brahman.
ga ग- is rooted in gam; ga is associated with or a noun of gaṇeśa. If you look for gaṇeśa mantra-s, you will find gam prevalent. Hence this tells us by this seed bīja Mars and gaṇeśa have an association.
We will leave this for another time., yet this gam is 'going, moving' . We can see the association of Mars (energy) and gaṇeśa's removal of obstructions - both in going, moving, energy. How long will it take to do 1 lakśa (100,000) repetitions (purascarana) of a mantra? Lets make a few estimates.
For a mantra that is bīja-akṣara¹ (written bījākṣara) lets assume the matra¹ is 3 ,4 or 5 seconds in duration. This also includes the pause matra being each repetition.

3 seconds = 20 per min, 1200 per hour and 83.3 hrs per 1 lakśa
4 seconds = 15 per min, 900 per and hour 111.1 hrs per 1 lakśa
5 seconds = 12 per min, 720 per hour and 138.9 hrs per 1 lakśa One can say I plan on doing 1 hr per day or 2 hrs, etc. and can then calculate the number of days for the completion of 1 lakśa (some prefer to write lac).

Lets go to a prasiddha (well known) mantra that has more then just one syllable:
Śiva's pañckṣara ( 5 syllable ~phonemes~ or akṣara) - namaḥśivāya
It is recommended it should be repeated 5 lac times i.e. 5 akṣara in the mantra X 100,000 = 500,000 or 5 lakśa.
Is there some authority that suggests this number is correct? Yes. The Śiva mahāpurāṇa, Vidyeśvara saṃhitā (section), 17th khaṇḍa (chapter or parvan) 53rd śloka.
Lets continue then with the calculation:

4 seconds = 15 per min, 900 per hour and 111.1 hrs per 1 lakśa ; 5 lacs = 555.6 hours
5 seconds = 12 per min, 720 per hour and 138.9 hrs per 1 lakśa ; 5 lacs = 694.4 hours
6 seconds = 10 per min, 600 per hour and 166.6 hrs. per 1 lakśa ; 5 lacs = 833.3 hrs.So what does one do when talking of these large amounts? One approach is to calculate what matra or personal measure is at i.e. personal metre ( chandas).

Lets say my speed is at 5 seconds per repetition. And this is done for 2 hrs a day ( AM and PM). This then suggests that 347.2 days are needed to complete 5 lakśa.
In this method one does not count the individual repetitions but only the days that pass not getting caught into the detail of each mantra repetition.
With this approach one can also set a 'missed repetition' number. That is, say your mind wanders and you miss a few repetitions. No worries. You say ( and calculate in) that you miss on avg. 2%. So you add in 2% more back end of this practice. That is, you add an additional 13 hrs ( 2% X 694 hrs) to the total or 694.4 + 13 = 707.4 hrs, or a total of 353.7 days ( round up to 354 days).

Atanu-ji offers the following from a past post:


The number of repetitions cannot be same for two different sadhakas of unequal maturity. The rule that I follow is to just continue to do it till it does not go away on its own. Satapatha Brahmana has instruction regarding this. It says that whatever form of Agni one lights up (for worship, contemplation, japa etc.) one must continue with the same for at least one year.
My teacher favored this time period also, he would say it is better to be late by 6 months, then to be one day too early with one's use of the mantra.

Are there other approaches? Sure. Use the 108 count for each sitting for japa of the mantra. Many like to use multiples of 108. This is where you actually count each mantra. This is usually done with some mālā¹ .

Other approaches? I am sure members of HDF also have some ideas on this matter.

praṇām

words

matra मात्र- measure of any kind ( note not mantra)
praṣṭṛ प्रष्टृ- one who asks or inquires
bīja बीज seed; element , primary cause or principle , source ; syllable which forms the essential part of the mantra of any devatā
aksara अक्षर- the syllable ; also means imperishable
prasiddha प्रसिद्ध- well known
mālā माला- a string of beads , necklace , rosary; also a wreath. Not to be confused with mala - that of a blemish, dirt, etc.

amra
06 November 2009, 03:32 AM
Also a mantra is a telephone line to the deity you are aiming to propitiate. By repeating a mantra you attempt to tap into a divine source. You invite the deity into your consciousness by repeating syllables that correspond in gross speech to the entities subtle form. But an imprtant point is that all letters and words are gross forms. The subtle forces have to be attracted to the mantra. This can only be accomplished by an adept a Siddha. A normal person does not understand the subtle forces and by repeating a mantra may attract forces and then cause disrespect to them. As our knowledge-understanding of the divine worlds is now fading in the modern age, in order to prevent misunderstandings, I would say the only mantra one should repeat is the name of God the formless creator under whatever name one feels comfortable.

kd gupta
06 November 2009, 08:16 AM
Listen the MANTRA with closed eyes....

http://www.totalbhakti.com/bhajans.php?play=739&startPostion=0&singerName=Vinod+Aggarwal&visit=visit

yajvan
06 November 2009, 10:24 AM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

Namasté

amra writes,


Also a mantra is a telephone line to the deity you are aiming to propitiate. By repeating a mantra you attempt to tap into a divine source. You invite the deity into your consciousness by repeating syllables that correspond in gross speech to the entities subtle form. But an important point is that all letters and words are gross forms. The subtle forces have to be attracted to the mantra.

What amra offers is of great import. The mantra on the lips is at the surface level of the mind. Like a ship on an ocean, bobbing hear and there, being moved by the current and large waves. The intent of the mantra is pada-gata ( step + departed from the world) i.e. the movement of the awareness inward closer to pure awareness.


The mantra is a vehicle to take us from sthūla¹ (gross) to sūkṣma¹ (subtle). The devatā reside in the subtle, the finer levels of existence. Hence I have been taught excessive verbal use of ajapa mantras i.e. not repeated on the lips reduces their effectiveness. Why so ? Co-mingling of the gross and the subtle. The devatā being 'called' prefer the indirect method ( so says the upaniṣads) of being addressed - subtle, inward.


More on this matter as the knowledge unfolds and others contribute to the thread.

praṇām

words

sthūla - course, gross; bukly, massive
sūkṣma - subtle; the subtle all-pervading spirit , Supreme Soul

yajvan
09 November 2009, 03:06 PM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

Namasté

With mantra-s as mentioned in post 1, we use them to settle down the mind, to bring peace i.e. śānti शान्ति -peace ; those sounds and vibrations that bring, establish and perpetuate peace in the individual and surroundings ( surroundings = environment, society, universe).
So, lets look at meditation and settling down the mind. First we need to bring in pratiprasava.

pratiprasava is a tatpuruṣa ( a compund word) prati + prasava :
prati प्रति means back , again , in return + prasava प्रसवmeans being set in motion. It also means birthplace and procreation. So when we add this together prati or back, return + prasava or birthplace = returning back, or reversing the birth process , or returning back to the original state.


Meditation is a vehicle for pratiprasava, reversing the birth process. That is, thoughts have 'births'. Meditation is the process of reversing that process. It's like going to work every day. One gets in their car, or public transportation and goes to work. What do you do when you come home? You reverse the process, pratipradava, daily.

But you say 'my mind fly's here and there, how can I settle it down?'. Even Arjuna mentions this concern to Kṛṣṇa. This is where the wise assists us in our understanding. The sage uddālaka āruṇi teaches his son śvetaketu on some key principles in the chāndogya upaniṣad , Chapt 6 (6.8.1). We will use these concepts next to help explain the settling down of the mind.

Consider the mind like a tethered bird to a post (says this upaniṣad). It flaps here and there, yet can go no further then the length of the string. As it grows tired it finally settles down on the post. Like that, the mind goes from here-to-there all day. Many times thoughts are going on, and you may or may not be aware of them , yes? So what is this mind tied to? It is tied to prāṇa, it is born of food, yet it has the ability to settle down each night when one retires and one sleeps (svapiti), and goes to deep sleep.

Hence if one's mind is aflutter with thoughts, and scattered randomly, then what can one do? Settle the mind down by managing the lord of the mind, prāṇa. And what is the approach? - prāṇāyām. It is considered one of ther 8 means (accessories) of attaining yoga called out in Patañjali’s yogadarśana (the yoga sūtras of Patañjali).
There is a post on prāṇāyām here on HDF - http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showthread.php?t=3351&highlight=pranayama (http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showthread.php?t=3351&highlight=pranayama) .

As a wind drives away smoke and impurities from the atmosphere, prāṇāyām drives away impurities from the body and mind - B.K.S. Iyengar

More on this pratiprasava in a future post.

praṇām

devotee
09 November 2009, 08:18 PM
That was a very valuable post, Yajvan ji. Thanks ! :)

OM

atanu
15 November 2009, 01:04 AM
hariḥ oṁ
Hence if one's mind is aflutter with thoughts, and scattered randomly, then what can one do? Settle the mind down by managing the lord of the mind, prāṇa.
praṇām

Namaste Yajvan ji,

We had a discussion on this earlier. Though the vehicle is the property of the owner, yet the vehicle is vested with the power to lead the owner astray. That is Ganesha, the Buddhi may apparently be scattered by the restless Rat -- the mind.

What I wish to remind is that the prAna, which has remained indivisible is master of the discrete minds. But the MIND, called prAnanAtha, is the Lord of prAna. The MIND was created first, though mind and breath are always together and move together. Gaining control over one is gaining control over the other also.

That the Mind came first is described below:

Satapatha Brahamana

10:1:2:3. Now with regard to the body. The Fire-altar is the mind, the (chant of the) Great Rite the breath, and the Great Litany speech: all these one ought therefore to undertake together, for mind, breath, and speech belong together; as to why the Fire-altar is built first, it is because the mind is prior to the breathings.

-------------------------

It is said that There was nothing whatsoever. It alone breathed on its own.


Om Namah Shivaya

Eastern Mind
15 November 2009, 07:49 AM
Vanakkam:

When we are doing japa, there are two opposite thoughts on time after our due diligence regarding the time spent is over. (whether its 10 minutes, an hour, or a mala round or two)

1) "Thank God this is over. It seems like it lasted forever, and a day."
2) What? I'm done. Feels like I just got started."

Obviously the second thought is the one we'd like to be at.

Aum Namasivaya

sunyata07
15 November 2009, 08:00 AM
Namaste EM,



2) What? I'm done. Feels like I just got started."


I would really love to be able to have more of that kind of feeling after japa, but sometimes it seems like a huge relief to my wandering mind to let it loose and just get up from meditation. Are there any disciplines to still fluttering thoughts? Perhaps it is just a matter of consistency and discipline: setting aside X minutes everyday for the mind's "time out". I have been reading that one of the most basic forms of meditation, like watching the breath and control of prana, is very good for keeping the mind quiet. It seems like the first necessary step for successful meditation, and not just sitting still with your legs crossed, picking a mantra at random and thinking you are making spiritual progress.

atanu
15 November 2009, 08:20 AM
Namaste EM,
I would really love to be able to have more of that kind of feeling after japa, but sometimes it seems like a huge relief to my wandering mind to let it loose and just get up from meditation. Are there any disciplines to still fluttering thoughts? Perhaps it is just a matter of consistency and discipline: setting aside X minutes everyday for the mind's "time out". I have been reading that one of the most basic forms of meditation, like watching the breath and control of prana, is very good for keeping the mind quiet. It seems like the first necessary step for successful meditation, and not just sitting still with your legs crossed, picking a mantra at random and thinking you are making spiritual progress.

Namaste sunyata,

Every one faces such problems, more so since, the garbage has to brought out to be thrown away, before true meditation can take place. I can only indicate what works for me, but I hope that some of the following may be useful.

When both nostrils are open and smooth, it works best. Neti or putting a drop of til oil in both nostrils clears them up. A short practise of Anuloma-Viloma is invaluable.

Often there is not enough time for doing the preparatory practises. So, it is also essential to employ some management principles and practise time management. Finish other chores on time.

It is best not to intellectualise the mantra. Thoughts will only multiply. The only thought should be that there is nothing as important as attaining tranquility and concentration of the mind.

Under any circumstance, however, I find it useful to dilligently watch every syllable or see every syllable of the japa. Soon japa happens on its own and I become the seer.

Best Wishes.

Om Namah Shivaya

sunyata07
17 November 2009, 05:27 PM
Namaste Atanu,

Thank you for the advice. I have read before for optimum benefit, mantra japa should be internalised, although I believe I would be a lot happier trying it out aloud until I am very certain I am pronouncing the syllables accurately with my natural voice.

Some people have told me some mantras should only be used after proper instruction and guidance from a guru through diksha, and that some mantras are even harmful if not used correctly!

Also, what are people's opinion of some of the darker mantras that are used? I have been recently introduced to the Bagalamukhi mantra and I hear that, while it is actually used as a protective mantra against slander, it causes damage to one's enemies? Is this a form of black magic, or could somebody enlighten me on this? Are some mantras destructive in their nature, and even dangerous?

yajvan
17 November 2009, 08:03 PM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

Namasté EM, sunyata07 (et.al)



Vanakkam:
When we are doing japa, there are two opposite thoughts on time after our due diligence regarding the time spent is over. (whether its 10 minutes, an hour, or a mala round or two)

1) "Thank God this is over. It seems like it lasted forever, and a day."
2) What? I'm done. Feels like I just got started."
Obviously the second thought is the one we'd like to be at.
Aum Namasivaya

This also suggests an indication of proper approach...
there is japa and ajapa ( on the lips and within the mind respectively).
When the mind calms and goes inward, time is not there; When the mind sails on the ocean of thoughts , time remains a contender.

Yet this mind, when it has a chance to get back to 'change' and to diversity , to go from one thing to another as a bee looking for pollen flower by flower, will pull the mind out of this silence.

praṇām

words

japa जप - muttering, whispering
ajapa अजप - without muttering on the lips; infers internal japa. This word is also (the female gender) the name for the formula called haṃsa. Much can be said about this haṃsa. The 'all ' of creation and expansion can be found in this vibration - this is some of the wisdom of kaśmir śaivism.

sambya
17 November 2009, 09:11 PM
Namaste Atanu,

Thank you for the advice. I have read before for optimum benefit, mantra japa should be internalised, although I believe I would be a lot happier trying it out aloud until I am very certain I am pronouncing the syllables accurately with my natural voice.

Some people have told me some mantras should only be used after proper instruction and guidance from a guru through diksha, and that some mantras are even harmful if not used correctly!

Also, what are people's opinion of some of the darker mantras that are used? I have been recently introduced to the Bagalamukhi mantra and I hear that, while it is actually used as a protective mantra against slander, it causes damage to one's enemies? Is this a form of black magic, or could somebody enlighten me on this? Are some mantras destructive in their nature, and even dangerous?



there are three forms of japa --vaachik(with loud utterance) , upaamshu( low murmuring) and manasic(mental) . out of them manasic japa is considered the best and most effective . however the other two can also be followed . specially with beginers it is seen that they cannot concentrate on the mantra for a long time . during this time it is better to go for vaachik or upamshu japa . it is also advisable when the mind is deeply agitated . however diksha mantras are usually guhya mantras(secretive) and are not supposed to be told or heard by a third person other than the recipeint himself . hence if someone wishes to practice vaachik japa he must check that the sound doesnt reach upto the ears of other people .

all these restriction are applicable to diksha mantras and bija mantras . hymns and glorification mantras in forms of stuti , stava does not require such followings . there are however some texts like durga saptashati chandi , which is not usually read aloud by non brahmin individuals . for personal reading it is okay . but for ceremonial reading or chanting there is a strict and definite set of instructions and rules which have to be followed even by brahmins . as this particular form of text is considered highly ugra and potent , people generally do not break these laws.

bagalamukhi mantra( if it is an ordinary stava stuti or bija mantra) cannot be of any harm in itself , but if followed in the correct procedure it might come in help for occult practises . however the person doing the balck magic or intending someone's harm , is not above the laws of karma . eventually the bad karma of wishing a jiva harm , falls on him and ruins his life too . its best to stay away from such malpractises of mantrashakti .

atanu
18 November 2009, 02:09 AM
Namaste Atanu,

Also, what are people's opinion of some of the darker mantras that are used? I have been recently introduced to the Bagalamukhi mantra and I hear that, while it is actually used as a protective mantra against slander, it causes damage to one's enemies? Is this a form of black magic, or could somebody enlighten me on this? Are some mantras destructive in their nature, and even dangerous?

Namaste Sunyata07,

I think sambya has given correct idea. Mantras, if not given by Diksha, are said to be useless, similar as an instruction by atanu to Finance Minister of India is useless. Finance Minister needs to be instructed only by the PM.

But I think the highest teacher is Param Atman Himself. I do not think that meditating on OM or stuti mantras would require such injunction, since such is not told specifically in Gita (as far as I remember). Moreover, one cannot just wait indefinitely for a Guru to appear in person and initiate. Rather, one can take Krishna or Durga or Shiva as Guru; Or even any true unembodied Guru, who pervades regions by the teachings.

IMO, what is more important is the intent. It is said that the egoless-desireless renunciates do not gain anything by action, except that they attain their svabhava (true nature), which is of pure bliss. But detractors gain the negativities and friends gain the positivities of whatever acts such a renunciate appears to go through.

A teacher said: Teachers are many. The teaching is One. Hold fast to the teaching.

Om

sambya
18 November 2009, 05:44 AM
dear yajvan .

i think the correct translation of the term ajapa would be that which is never chanted instead of mental japa . because the ajapa or 'ham.....sa' starts right since the birth of an individual and continues till his death in form of inhales(ham) and exhales(sah) irrespective of the whether he is spiritually inclined of not . it can be loosely translated as that japa which is effortless .

all as per my own limited understanding ...............:)

yajvan
18 November 2009, 11:29 AM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

Namasté sambya,

dear yajvan .
i think the correct translation of the term ajapa would be that which is never chanted instead of mental japa .
What you offer is insightful . Lets take it just a bit deeper, okay?


ajapa - If we look at its root 'jap' it's defined as to utter in a low voice , whisper , mutter ; also to invoke or call upon in a low voice. It also means to whisper repeatedly.

Now we add 'a' to this word which means 'not' , or a negation of the next term. so a+japa means to 'not invoke or whisper, mutter or call upon in a low voice' repeatedly. It simply means the aspirant is no longer voicing a prayer or mantra via the lips and the expulsion of words coming of the mouth does not occur. This word (ajapa) has and is used for mental prayer, invocation, mantra use as it implies no outward movement.
Simply put the mantra is not voiced, but still occurs in the construct of the mind. A subtle difference wouldn't you say?

Also note another definition is the mantra or formula called haṃsa - consisting and or accompanying by a number of inhalations and exhalations of breath. It is said our breath does this automatically, which each breath ( knowingly or unknowingly ) this mantra continues.

One more definition that is worth looking at ; ajapa is another name for a goat-herd. How do we get there? 'aja' is a troop, a drove. And 'aja' is a he-goat , ram. Hence the connection.

We can see how 'aja' can be applied then to ajapa - as one is doing a 'group, a herd' of chanting. Also note ( and this is a bit more esoteric) 'aja' is also another name ( a noun) of indra , of rudra , of one of the maruts and a few others. It is though one's japa or ajapa that one may invoke one of these devatā.

How can we say this? Due to the a+ja definition. Note the 'a' = not +' ja' = born - so aja is the 'not born'. And who are they? The devatā. So we can see there is a richness in this a+japa, jap, aja, and a+ja.

praṇām

sunyata07
18 November 2009, 11:47 AM
Thanks for the explanation and the terminologies Sambya, Atanu and Yajvan!

I can learn so much more here on HDF on the topic of mantra than I would learn in a whole year reading specialist books. :)

Namaste

yajvan
18 November 2009, 07:27 PM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

Namasté


It is best not to intellectualise the mantra. Thoughts will only multiply. The only thought should be that there is nothing as important as attaining tranquility and concentration of the mind.

Atanu give wise council here. How so? By engaging the intellect, we engage in action. It is the notion of meditation to settle-down the mind - and as atanu suggests thoughts multiply. That is the nature of the mind.

What to do? Remain simple my teacher would say. That is, expect nothing ( during meditation). Expectations create effort and this too slows the inward march ( reversing the birth process) of the mind.

Kṛṣṇa advises in the Bhāgavad gītā, chapt 2, 40th śloka. He says in this (yoga) no effort (abhikrama) is ever lost and no obstacle (pratyavāya¹) exists. Even a little of this dharma delivers (one) from great fear (bhayāt).

The wisdom of the ages: withdraw then withdraw from the withdrawal. If this captures your interest, more can be reviewed on this matter as this HDF post: http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showpost.php?p=24421&postcount=6



praṇām

words
pratyavāya प्रत्यवाय- decrease, diminution, reversed, reverse, contrary course, opposite i.e. obstacle

yajvan
22 November 2009, 11:11 AM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

oṁ gajavaktraṁ namaḥ
ॐ गजवक्त्रं हमः

Namasté

I wrote in a previous post ( different folder): http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showpost.php?p=35457&postcount=7 (http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showpost.php?p=35457&postcount=7)

Lets end this post with the seed-sound of gaṇeśa, gaṁ गं. Holding this vibration we hold gaṇeśa-ji
I thought to expand this idea a bit on seed (bīja¹) sound and offer the mūla¹ mantra of gaṇeśa-ji and its review.

If you recall we discussed bīja sounds above in post 5 above.
Please be advised that this offering is for the deep appreciation of this mantra and its origin - it is not for instructional purposes.

This knowledge takes some time to ~sink in~ so let me offer this in two posts.

Part 1 - From where does it come ?
This knowledge comes from the atharva veda, gaṇapati atharva-śiṣra. It is worthy to review this name atharva ; It is for atharvan, brahmā's eldest son. We also know that naming of ṛṣi-s and seers have a deeper meaning.

Atharvan can be viewed as a+thar+van ; 'a'= not, or no + 'tha' = is fear, danger, some define it as weak or vascillating + 'van' = to conquer, win or become master of. So a+thar+van is he that has no fear (a+tha) or conquers (van) weakness and becomes master (van).
Now we can look at this word associated with gaṇapati atharva-śiṣra. We understand the signifinace of atharva , now what of this śiṣra ? It means the head, skull - the seat of the mind and intellect. It is also the upper part, the tip or top i.e. our head is the upper part of our body, and the upper part of the skull-head-mind is the intellect.
So śiṣra is an epithet for intellect. But one asks what then is the top/upper part of the intellect? It is mokṣa. Now we have the story for this section of the atharva veda's gaṇapati atharva-śiṣra.
It is that section that deals with knowledge directed to overcome and conquer weakness or vacillations that leads the intellect to the Divine (gaṇapati). Note gaṇapati is specifically used here i.e. gaṇapati atharva-śiṣra, IMHO because it also infers a devotee of the Divine based the following definition of gaṇapati - Lord of the multitudes:

gaṇa is a flock , troop , multitude , number , tribe , series , class + pati is Lord, master.
Yet this pati is also 'husband' when uncompounded. It also can be used as 'wife' when taken as female gender use.
Hence this word can be used for those devotee's of gaṇeśa i.e. the group/tribe (gaṇa) that are husband or wife (pati) of gaṇeśa.I mentioned 'the upper part of the intellect - mokṣa' , lets make another connection.
Another name for gaṇeśa-ji is gajavaktra (the One with the elephant's mouth or face) and it has much to do with the number 4, 8 and 12.
In fact one definition for gaja is a name for the number 8 ; gaṇa as in gaṇapati is also a metre with 4 instants or beats. Note that the 4th house ( or bhava from the root √ bhū coming into existence , birth , production , origin ) in jyotiṣ is a mokṣa house, as is the 8th and the 12th.

We also know that ketu¹ is the grāhaka¹ representative of gaṇeśa-ji. How so? Ketu is the kāraka¹ of mokṣa, liberator from the world. Ketu is also without a head, the same condition gaṇeśa-ji experienced. This is symbolic of not being attached to the world.

And who owns the 4th tithi (caturṭa or caturthī ) ? Gaṇeśa. And this notion of the 12? If you recall gaṇ - is to count , number , enumerate , sum up , add up . With this we can then take 8+4 and arrive at 12, another mokṣa house. Yet another look - start at the 4th house , add 4 (4+4) we arrive at the 8th; add 4 (8 +4) we arrive at the 12th. All mokṣa houses.

That gives us some foundation for 4+4=8=gaja and our ability to look at gaṇeśa-ji's mantra rooted in gaṁ.

What is the link to 8? The mūla mantra is made up of 8 akṣara-s (syllables ~phonemes~); Hence all that we have just said above is the foundation to appreciate why this mantra's 8 akṣara-s have value. We will then pursue the mūla mantra in the upcoming post.


praṇām


words for this post and next


ketu केतु is the decending node (south) ; ketu means bright appearance , clearness , brightness 'rays of light' ; intellect , judgement , discernment . How is it associated with intellect? Because the word is rooted in cit चित्to perceive , fix the mind upon , attend to , be attentive , observe , take notice of.
Ketu is the kāraka¹ of mokṣa, liberator from the world. That is, he has no head - no mind for worldly pursuits i.e. non-attachment. Ketu is a kāraka of intelligence, non-attachment, keen and deep insights, psychic abilities.
kāraka (kAraka) कारक- the action making , doing , acting , who or what does or produces or creates; instrumental in bringing about the action . A kAraka is a significator or entity ( in this post a graha or ~ planet) that signifies various matters on this good earth;
grāhaka ग्राहक- one who seizes or takes captive ; from grāha ग्रह- seizing , laying hold of , holding i.e. a grāhaka ~seizes~ or influences the circumstances of the native. This is done via the tattva they manage and control.
bīja बीज seed; element , primary cause or principle , source ; syllable which forms the essential part of the mantra of any
mūla मूल - basis , foundation , cause , origin , commencement , beginning; mūlāt , from the bottom , thoroughly

yajvan
26 November 2009, 12:38 PM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

Namasté


the seed-sound of gaṇeśa, gaṁ गं. Holding this vibration we hold gaṇeśa-ji

To take this discussion further it was most appropriate to move Part 2, the continuation of post 23 above, to the Uttara folder. It is posted as 'gaṇeśa's bījākṣara & mantra ' http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showthread.php?t=4867 (http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showthread.php?t=4867)

praṇām

kd gupta
06 December 2009, 07:01 AM
Namaste
What Krsn says…..
Yam yam vaapi smaran bhaavam tyajatyante kalevaram;
Tam tamevaiti kaunteya sadaa tadbhaavabhaavitah.
Whosoever at the end leaves the body, thinking of any being, to that being only does he
go, O son of Kunti (Arjuna), because of his constant thought of that being!
COMMENTARY: The most prominent thought of one’s life occupies the mind at the time
of death. It determines the nature of the body to be attained in the next birth.

Today’s human mostly is the bundle of all evils, if I am right then the main reason is the deteriorating effects of technology , he is slave of the comforts provided and at last he remains in and around it at the death time .He comes again in with unfulfilled desires and is far far away from spirituality.I think an animal when attacked may remember parmatma and get the moksha even .As shruti says…marta amartyasya te bhuri nam manamahe .rig.
So bhagwadbhajan is the mere remedy…Shravanam etc.

yajvan
06 December 2009, 11:34 AM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

Namasté kd gupta


Namaste
What Krsn says…..
Yam yam vaapi smaran bhaavam tyajatyante kalevaram;
Tam tamevaiti kaunteya sadaa tadbhaavabhaavitah.
Whosoever at the end leaves the body, thinking of any being, to that being only does he
go, O son of Kunti (Arjuna), because of his constant thought of that being!
COMMENTARY: The most prominent thought of one’s life occupies the mind at the time of death. It determines the nature of the body to be attained in the next birth.

What Kṛṣṇa offers and you bring forth is quite profound . Upon death and the process thereof, mutiple things are occuring. To pick up on a particular thought and to keep it will be a high achievement. What is implied by what Kṛṣṇa offers is do not wait until death to groom the mind.
IMHO he offers, be established in yoga ( union) of the SELF, then at ones end, there is total peace. The body goes its way, as you are in full control of your facilities, possessed of the Divine. Then 'Kṛṣṇa' is totally on ones mind, as the SELF is the extention of HIM. Of what need will there be to have any other thought?

praṇām

yajvan
07 December 2009, 01:43 PM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

Namasté

I wrote,


ajapa - If we look at its root 'jap' it's defined as to utter in a low voice , whisper , mutter ; also to invoke or call upon in a low voice. It also means to whisper repeatedly.

Now we add 'a' to this word which means 'not' , or a negation of the next term. so a+japa means to 'not invoke or whisper, mutter or call upon in a low voice' repeatedly. It simply means the aspirant is no longer voicing a prayer or mantra via the lips and the expulsion of words coming of the mouth does not occur. This word (ajapa) has and is used for mental prayer, invocation, mantra use as it implies no outward movement.
Simply put the mantra is not voiced, but still occurs in the construct of the mind. A subtle difference wouldn't you say?

One may note that sounds/mantra can come to a aspirant in a few ways. They can come from ( and be applied) from gross to subtle.

What is meant by gross is that closest to duality, to the diversity of life. Gross as discussed here is not suggesting mala-s or blemishes but that level of energy fully manifest and co-mingling with all the other diversities of sight, taste, touch, etc.

So, one can see this inward march to subtle, closer to pure awareness. Hence we can see mantra's come to the aspirant ( and applied) in a few ways :

likhita लिखित - means 'written' ; it also means a writing , written document , scripture. This in my view can also be a yantra, where the mantra takes shape as a graphic.
A yantra is defined as a symbol for holding and fastening. But what is it holding? One's attention via sight.


vaikharī वैखरी- sound; the faculty of speech ; We often hear this is how mantras are communicated - through vāk ( vāc) - speech , voice , talk , language. This was is considered an effective vehicle as the vibration comes by sound and received by ear.
upāṃśu उपांशु- in a low voice , in a whisper ; through whispering. As just mentioned, one may receive a vibration via
the lips of the guru or instructor, via the facility of speech ( vaikharī ) but most likely done in the low voice or whisper.
One may also apply what is learned via japa , or repetition of the mantra in a whisper or muttering.
manasa मनस- mind; through thinking. A mantra could be transmitted to the aspirant via the mind, it is possible. Yet in this case I am suggesting the mantra is used via the mind internally. This is considered ajapa.Note that upāṃśu IMHO can also be considered japa जप, as it is considered by definition muttering, whispering. Manasa is internal, with out an outward sound and therefore can be considered ajapa अजप - without muttering on the lips.

Overall, the attention is directed inward, the march of the mind to end up in no-mind. Finer-and-finer levels of awareness as one settles down the mind. Withdrawing inward till the finest thought is transcended and one arrives at this pure awareness condition. We call this inward march of the mind parivṛtya. This is the notion of turning around and going back. But to what? To one's original state of existence.

This march is also called pratiprasava ; 'prati' = back , again , in return + prasava. This prasava has a few meanings which apply:

prasava is setting or being set in motion;
its 2nd definition means pursuit or acquisition.
and its 3rd definition is birthplaceLets put it all together and we get returning (prati) back , setting in motion the return and acquisition of one's birthplace. And this birth place is full-awareness or the Self ( ātman).

Hence the use of likhita + vaikharī + upāṃśu + manasa is the march ( the return of) of one's self to one's SELF . This is the march within or pratiprasava.

praṇām


references
more on this can be read at this HDF post:
http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showpost.php?p=24473&postcount=8