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Eastern Mind
21 December 2009, 09:19 AM
I have noticed how some people can go into a particular temple and feel nothing, while at the same time others get really blissed out, and come out saying so. I have a dear friend in India whose impressions on two different temples are exactly the opposite of mine. He thinks Chidambaram is the strongest temple on earth, while Tanjore feels empty to him. For me, it was the opposite.

I am curious to what the reasons are. What do people here think about this? Especially, when its on the same day, in the same temple.

The same thing happens around gurus. Some people will notice, and others will walk right on by.

Ideas?


Aum Namasivaya

heartfully
21 December 2009, 09:25 AM
Namaste,

From a Hindu perspective, I wouldn't know, but your question reminded me of a discourse I was watching on Youtube. He said that as we become more and more attuned spiritually the cells start spinning at a different frequency. This causes a type of magnetic effect where one might feel deeply connected to a certain teacher, etc..

I've been pondering it a lot so I look forward to seeing the responses you receive.

Love to you,
Heartfully

kshama
21 December 2009, 09:29 AM
Namaskar Blessed Members of the Forum,

In my opinion, everyone has different levels of reception of the experience. It can be due to the level of spirituality one has, our gunas at that particular time, and what our intention (our focus) was during that time.

Honestly, I had never felt any vibrations or such in temples so far. Perhaps I have yet to be spiritual enough in order to be blessed such an experience.

Eastern Mind
15 September 2010, 04:44 PM
Vannakkam:

I am reopening this thread by this post as a result of a discussion in another thread. It is interesting to me now that there were no responses before. Am I the only one here that feels this energy? (shakti, grace, darshan, call it what you will) The issue is really logic versus intuition. When we stand in front of the deity and feel His (or Her) powerful permeating presence, surely it is illogical. Atheists and rude fundamentalists would go further than that. They would say it is even stupid. Yet over and over, people throng to our holy temples just to receive a moment of this energy they feel. Tears of bhakti pour out, a well led devotional bhajan can elicit same response. How do others deal with the idea that it is contradictory?

(For me personally, it IS my religion. Far more than any other aspect. Its what brought me home, and keeps me home.)

Aum Namasivaya

Ekanta
15 September 2010, 05:12 PM
(For me personally, it IS my religion. Far more than any other aspect. Its what brought me home, and keeps me home.)

Namaste EM
I think I understand what you say. For me its peace, power, presence. It makes it easier to develop love and control your senses. For me its the source making itself know in a subtle way. A pull, a magnet... its there in a stronger form, but can become part of every day life in due turn... as you said EM "it IS my religion". I would say the same! Beautiful line!

Logic can of course dismiss it, but its convincing in another way, peace of mind is convincing from the bottom of mind and overwhelms you and cant be dismissed, since its self obvious... Something like that.

It would be interesting if someone had some scriptural references to this?

Eastern Mind
15 September 2010, 05:18 PM
Vannakkam Ekanta: It is good to know that someone else is as 'delusional' as me, who also suffers from hallucinations and a vivid imagination. http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Thank you.

Riverwolf
15 September 2010, 05:20 PM
I've yet to feel anything super-dramatic when I go to my local Temple, but I do feel "better" after leaven than when I went in, so I do feel more subtle effects that are usually hard to catch.

Riverwolf
15 September 2010, 05:22 PM
Vannakkam Ekanta: It is good to know that someone else is as 'delusional' as me, who also suffers from hallucinations and a vivid imagination. http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Thank you.

Hey, why should it matter if these are just imaginings and hallucinations? They help us lead better lives and progress spiritually, right? So how can they be bad?

As far as I'm concerned, SOMETHING is happening. Whether it's God doing something, or just the placebo effect, something that is positive is happening. That's the important part, that it's positive. For some, that's not enough. I think for us, though, it's enough.

Eastern Mind
15 September 2010, 05:35 PM
Vannakkam:

The irony to all this is that you can't argue it. Intuition is of the superconscious mind, and logic is of the conscious mind. Although they are both mind, it is from two different chakra levels, two different mind strata, and there isn't any overlap. So there is no way a person stuck in gridded intellect can fathom this. It's beyond that.

Take my experience in India I related before. Driving along a rural highway, we pass an ordinary but new small Ganesha temple. About 200 meters past, I just stop, and tell the driver to turn around as I NEED to go there to worship. There is no logic to this decision. We have driven right past 50, maybe 100 similar temples. But there is something in the air, something like a fermone, and I can sense it. Then when we talk to the priest, turns out we have many mutual friends in common. At that juncture in time, space, the two of us were meant to meet. Maybe he needed cheering up, or I need confirmation, or something. I have absolutely no idea why.

Now a scientist of logical person would just say "Bah. Humbug. Purely coincidence. Stroke of luck." or whatever. The chances were one in a hundred, lets say. But then similar one in a hundred chance things happen over and over again. Its simply not logical. He's right. Its not logical. I don't disagree with that at all. The 'problem' only appears when he tells me it didn't happen, and then its only his problem, not mine. http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Aum namasivaya

Ekanta
15 September 2010, 05:41 PM
Vannakkam Ekanta: It is good to know that someone else is as 'delusional' as me, who also suffers from hallucinations and a vivid imagination. http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Thank you.

This guy also suffers from hallucinations:

Quote (forgot exact source so I googled it):

At the first opportunity Narendra (Vivekananda) put him (Ramakrishna) the same question - "Sir, have you seen God?"

But this practically illiterate priest, unlike the erudite Maharshi, replied in rural dialect without mincing words - "Yes, I have seen God. I have seen Him more tangibly than I see you. I have talked with him more intimately than I am talking to you. But my child, who wants to see God! People shed jugs of tears for money, wife and children. But if they weep for God for only one day they would surely see Him."

Riverwolf
15 September 2010, 06:30 PM
This guy also suffers from hallucinations:

Quote (forgot exact source so I googled it):

At the first opportunity Narendra (Vivekananda) put him (Ramakrishna) the same question - "Sir, have you seen God?"

But this practically illiterate priest, unlike the erudite Maharshi, replied in rural dialect without mincing words - "Yes, I have seen God. I have seen Him more tangibly than I see you. I have talked with him more intimately than I am talking to you. But my child, who wants to see God! People shed jugs of tears for money, wife and children. But if they weep for God for only one day they would surely see Him."

Uh... "suffers" from hallucinations? If I'm reading the Gospel of Sri Ramakrishna right, he was ANYTHING but suffering. He was a fountain of pure bliss, almost to a comedic point.

NayaSurya
15 September 2010, 06:52 PM
For me, it happens all the time, even in the most mundane of places. The feeling things are lined up in such a way...you can feel the current tugging at you moving you towards something, someone or some place.

I am always so nervous at the temple...I never can tell what's going on there. The energy is very chaotic to me...so many people and deities. I try to go at off times just to keep it down.

But, I have a special place to pray and it's a very very small room. When others walk into it, the hairs on their body stand on end. It happens to me too.

Eastern Mind
15 September 2010, 06:55 PM
Uh... "suffers" from hallucinations? If I'm reading the Gospel of Sri Ramakrishna right, he was ANYTHING but suffering. He was a fountain of pure bliss, almost to a comedic point.

Vannakkam Riverwolf: Sorry. Ekanta was following my lead in sarcasm as I pretended to present the logical argument put forth in the dispute between logic and intuition. In other words psychoanalysing all darshan or mystical experiences from a western psychologically trained perspective. Sorry for the misunderstanding. Darn sarcasm.

Aum Namasivaya

Ekanta
15 September 2010, 06:58 PM
Riverwolf... I just made a comparison between Eastern Minds use of the word "hallucination" and Ramakrishnas words... It was serious in a joke way.

What I meant was this:
If EM or someone else has some experience of "darshan" or intuition etc and think of it as hallucination only, that might be so.
But I also gave this quote to strengthen their faith in their own experience, since one day that darshan or intuition might grow to Ramakrishnas experience! And thus its not a hallucination, but rather a smaller experience of the same thing (which grows).

Riverwolf
15 September 2010, 07:10 PM
Yeah, sorry guys. I'm terrible at catching sarcasm unless it's grossly exaggerated.

saidevo
15 September 2010, 10:23 PM
namaste EM and others.

The term logic means reasoning, a process of the mind, which is not physical. So the logicality of something need not conform to physical science.

A Hindu temple is not just a building but a conception of Divinity expressed in the art and science of architecture that attracts, preserves and dispenses spiritual energy. Although sunlight is present everywhere, its concentrated presence is achieved by a lens. In the same way, the ubiquitous presence of divinity is concentrated into the sAnnidhyam of a deity at the sanctum sanctorum, over which rests the temple gopuram with a kalasham. The black stone image of must mUlavars--root deity, enhances this effect, since the stone attracts spiritual energy. Here is a link about the architecture of a Hindu temple:
http://www.svbf.org/journal/vol8no1/2006_9_temple.pdf

Thus, the sAnnidhyam of a deity is well established in a temple built according to Agamic rules, although in centuries-old temples due to regular performance of Agamic and Vedic rituals, the sAnnidhyam is more. Still, only a few people are tuned as suitable vessels to receive the spiritual vibrations in a temple. You and Ekanta are gifted in this regard. As for me, I do get moved spiritually with sometimes a tear or two of bhakti in many temples but it is not the same at all times; whereas I get more spiritual at home, when I read a text or perform a pUja.

Perhaps it is like a class full of students where some students readily pick up more of the teacher's words with less reading at home, while most others don't have the ability, and need to pick up only by reading at home.

Ekanta
15 September 2010, 11:10 PM
I get more spiritual at home, when I read a text or perform a pUja.

And then you share it here for our benefit, I'm so glad for that (the sharing)!

I like temples and wish I could access one easier... but I have to sit at home meditating, with hearing protection on since there are so much noise from neighbors and children and my wife snores in the morning/evening. Its kind of ironic but whatever works...

Eastern Mind
16 September 2010, 07:09 AM
Vannakkam : There is another factor I forgot to mention. Some people simply get used to it. If you walk from -30 to +30 in temperature, it feels hot, or vice versa. If you go from +29 to +30, you probably don't notice.

I was with a priest once about 10 minutes after a very powerful puja. I asked, "How can you even drive after that?" He replied "We're used to it."

This is why often that first temple experience is so powerful. It's a new energy, a new feeling. So in Saidevo's situation, living in India, maybe it's just more normal, but for people like me, on pilgrimage there, its like "Wow!!"

But what Saidevo says regarding agamic architecture etc. is so true. That is not to belittle or suggest other non-agamic temples have less energy, but they are different when there is less focus on the magnifying lens effect. There energy is more spread out.

Aum Namasivaya

Sahasranama
16 September 2010, 07:39 AM
There's a large dichotomy in the atmosphere (vatavaran) of modern culture and that of Hindu spiritual culture. If you get used to it, you become part of it and it becomes a part of you. But sometimes it's good to feel the difference between the two. I have never been in India, but I get those feelings very easily when listening to bhajans, doing puja, reading texts.

Ganeshprasad
16 September 2010, 09:51 AM
Pranam EM and all

I am sorry you did not have much response previously, perhaps the timing was not right then, it certainly was not for me. But I am glad you have opened it again. There are some mystical experiences and vibrations one may not want to share, for various reasons, it sure happens but to a logical mind it is all mumbo jumbo.


Vannakkam : but for people like me, on pilgrimage there, its like "Wow!!"

Aum Namasivaya


 
As you know I like to travel on pilgrimage and I have been fortunate in that department, I try and narrate my two beautiful and most wonderful experience which I shell treasure all my life.

My last trip to Kailash in june, we were at Mansarover, I woke up in the middle of night, could not sleep, so I decided to venture out . It was cold night, the sky was clear, you could not but admire the beautiful stars so clearly visible, occasionally I could hear the barking of a dog breaking the silence off the night. I was facing the calm waters of Mansarovar and on my left is Mt. Kailas a sight to behold. My eyes caught a glimpse of what look like a flash in the distance behind the mountains , I did not think twice about it but then I saw some thing never experience ever before, it appeared twice going up and down behind the peak, a circular colourful lights. I would not want to guess what it was, my mind is still wondering.
A few minutes later I was privilege to witness some thing even more beautiful, I saw a peak glowing it became stronger, at this point I did not know what to think, then I saw many more outline of peaks lit up and I became calm as I could relate as to what was happening, guess what it was not a sun rise but a crescent off the moon appeared from behind the peak that I first saw as a glow, slowly the whole crescent lit up the sky and the lake started glistening. Wow.

The other was two months prior, when I went to Haridwar Kumbhmela, as I entered the town, the vibration was electric, I can not describe it, It was a wonderful experience, the shear weight of people congregating for one purpose alone to have a dip in mother Ganga, and millions of sadhus gathering in one place, I am not surprise that the atmosphere was charged up.

 
On the subject of pilgrimage and its affect be it positive or negative, a story,I heard in my childhood, I will recall as best I possible can.

Many may have heard of Sravan, he was once taking his old parents on pilgrimage carrying both on his shoulder in a kavad. After some time they passed a particular point when Sarvan felt agitated and cursing his luck, mum noticed the change in her son behaviour but kept quite. After some time when they passed that spot of land, Sravan started lamenting and wondered how could he think so low, that is when mother said, my dear son please do not blame your self over it, it is not your fault, what do you mean the son said I was cruel how could I possible think and behave in that manner, so she said it was not your fault it was the bhumi(earth) if you don’t believe me here hold this, she gave a piece of earth she was holding in her hand. Immediately the old feelings of hate became to overcome him. Mother explained this the place two (demon)brothers had a quarrel and fought till death (I think).

Jai Shree Krishna

Eastern Mind
16 September 2010, 05:39 PM
Namaste Ganeshprasadji:

I enter the Ganga on January 13, 2011 for the first time this lifetime, and hopefully not the last. I presume it will be colder even than usual. But there's no way I'm making the effort to get to Haridwar and standing there shivering on some ghat. You are so fortunate to have seen what you have seen. Regarding sharing this information, I personally don't go to the real deeper stuff, as you suggested. If mere mortals like ourselves get these feelings, I can't imagine the bliss some of our greatest saints must have felt. My understanding is that they have to try to come out as hard as we have to try to go in. How odd it must be to have samadhi as the natural state of the mind, consciously, all the time.

Aum Namasivaya

Maya3
26 November 2010, 06:31 AM
What a great thread!

I love reading your experiences.

I can feel it too. For me it comes and goes, I have it for months at a time and then it's gone or very low for months at a time.
Certain places definitely have more energy than others. My Ashram for example has a lot of it. It is truly an amazing place.

Our temple there has a very strong energy, I have had incredible meditations in there. It's usually a place for silence unless it's a holiday and we have a ceremony in there and as soon as I go in there I feel Nadam very strongly.
And then the meditation becomes very deep with a lot of energy.
I have felt this in other places too, not as powerful, but still felt it.
Places in nature or other places of worship, there is a church near me that has this energy as well.

I do think that it depends on the mood of the day for you to feel it.
If I have had a stressful day or if I'm in a bad mood, I can't feel it.
Or if I'm too tired, then I just fall asleep when I meditate.

Maya

kahanam
27 November 2010, 01:01 AM
I felt great at Thiruchendur Murugan Temple, Vallioor Murugan Temple in Tirunelveli District in Tamil Nadu, India and at Thiruvannamalai. I also feel at peace when I pray in front of Adhishtanams, Brindavans and Samadhis of Great Saints interred.These may be the "vibrations" that people talk about.:) :) :)

Eastern Mind
27 November 2010, 06:05 AM
Vannakkam Kahanam:

Yes there is something electric about Murugan temples. I've been to Tiruchendur as well. Very magical place, and so off the beaten track. Exactly 4 weeks from today, my wife and I are off for the traditional Arupadaveedu pilgrimage., in the prescribed order. I've already been to 3 of them, but she's only been to Palani. I think Palani is the most famous. I remember speaking to a Keralite here who when hearing of my fondness for India, started telling me about this 'must see' temple just across the border a bit into TM. Guess which one? There are just too many 'must see' temples. I love them all.

Aum Namasivaya

Ekoham
13 July 2011, 11:59 AM
Namaste Eastern Mind,

Any devotee who is truly in love with almighty would experience these kind of subtle vibrations (this is sattvic energy that flows through the body of devotee) every time he thinks of his/her lord or is fully immersed in lords bhajan. Sometimes even a glimpse of his/her lord can send deep vibrations through devotees body.

Yes, I have been experiencing it very often and many times, at will, I simply chant the lords name to enjoy those vibrations and the flow begins.

"As Saideo has rightly mentioned---only a few people are tuned as suitable vessels to receive the spiritual vibrations in a temple" also reception of individuals differ depending on the extent of their spiritual practices. So this answers one of your question why different people have different experiences.

I would tell you a trick how to enhance this experience--- just simply surrender at the holy feet of lord you worship-- just surrender completely and take lords name you will experience the same magical vibrations, you don't have to be in the temple for that (remember god is omnipresent.)

Temples are the nucleus centres of positive energies, as so much of faith of so many devotees is attached there, making it even more special.

These vibrations can be photographed as your aura pictures (Kirlean photography), I have done that and photographer couldn't believe those energies, they were so great.

There are times when these vibrations are so intense that you feel as if your whole body will be dissolved in it...... Thats what we call LAYA YOGA in bhakti.

One important factor I must mention, one need not be Hindu to experience these vibrations, its just the faith of devotee towards its deity/guru which should be complete and AS MENTIONED EARLIER THE COMPLETE SURRENDER can make it intense.

OM

heather.s
15 August 2011, 09:21 AM
Whenever I even say a small mantra to myself at home, I feel more spiritually connected than I do any other time of the day.

On more difficult nights, I have chanted myself to sleep and actually dreamed of being on a plane above earth.