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ScottMalaysia
23 February 2010, 09:35 PM
In the West, it seems that North Indian temples have regular congregational services. Our temple has a Gita class every Sunday (which is in Gujarati). the congregation recites slokas, listens to a sermon on the Gita, sings bhajans and attend an Arati. The Bharatiya Mandir in Auckland has a satsangh on the first Sunday of each month. Even in Malaysia (where North Indians are a minority) the North Indian temples have Sunday satsanghs. ISKCON seems to do the same as well.

I'd like to know - is this sort of congregational worship common in India, specifically North India? In Malaysia, the South Indian temples don't generally have congregational services with bhajans and a sermon - worship is individual. The same seems to go for the South Indian temples in New Zealand (from what I've seen on their websites - I've never been to any myself). So I'd really like to hear from devotees who live in India or have been there, specifically the north of India. I'd like to know if a congregational service is the norm for Indians in New Dehli, Mumbai and the northern part of India or if this is just something that North Indian Hindus living in a country where they are a minority do.

satay
23 February 2010, 10:44 PM
namaste Scott,
I am from Punjab (as you probably know by now). All of the activities that you mentioned are present in Northern temples especially in punjab and jammu. No doubt in delhi also.

For example, the house I grew up in, about a km away is a sat narayana temple (that also included murthis of durga, shiva, ram darbar, ganesh etc.). It still has what you would call a 'sermon'. There is singing, music and story telling of krishna's past times even today in that temple.

On the other side our house there is durga temple. It has people coming to it every morning, evening etc. to do puja and diya. Women gather to sing songs and arti. There is a function called 'jagrata' at least once a year where devotees sing praises of durga all night long (using loud speakers on the street).

This type of thing is very very common in the north.

Are you planning to go to India soon? :)


In the West, it seems that North Indian temples have regular congregational services. Our temple has a Gita class every Sunday (which is in Gujarati). the congregation recites slokas, listens to a sermon on the Gita, sings bhajans and attend an Arati. The Bharatiya Mandir in Auckland has a satsangh on the first Sunday of each month. Even in Malaysia (where North Indians are a minority) the North Indian temples have Sunday satsanghs. ISKCON seems to do the same as well.

I'd like to know - is this sort of congregational worship common in India, specifically North India? In Malaysia, the South Indian temples don't generally have congregational services with bhajans and a sermon - worship is individual. The same seems to go for the South Indian temples in New Zealand (from what I've seen on their websites - I've never been to any myself). So I'd really like to hear from devotees who live in India or have been there, specifically the north of India. I'd like to know if a congregational service is the norm for Indians in New Dehli, Mumbai and the northern part of India or if this is just something that North Indian Hindus living in a country where they are a minority do.

sanjaya
24 February 2010, 12:31 AM
You guys went to temples that had sermons!? Wow, I'm surprised I didn't even know that such a thing existed in Hinduism. Clearly my exposure to North Indian temples is lacking.

ScottMalaysia
24 February 2010, 01:29 AM
namaste Scott,
I am from Punjab (as you probably know by now). All of the activities that you mentioned are present in Northern temples especially in pubjab and jammu. No doubt in delhi also.

For example, the house I grew up in, about a km away was sat narayana temple (that also included murthis of durga, shiva, ram darbar, ganesh etc.). It still has what you would call a 'sermon'. There is singing, music and story telling of krishna's past times even today in that temple.

On the other side our house there is durga temple. It has people coming to it every morning, evening etc. to do puja and diya. Women gather to sing songs and arti. There is a function called 'jagrata' at least once a year where devotees sing praises of durga all night long (using loud speakers on the street).

This type of thing is very very common in the north.

Yes, I thought that might have been the case. I seem to be more attracted to North Indian temples, possibly because the service is closer to a church service than the individualistic South Indian temples.


Are you planning to go to India soon? :)

I'd love to go to India, but I just don't have the money at the moment. I've enrolled for another year at university, because I can't find a job. But it is my ambition to go on a big trip to India where I visit most of the sacred places: Vrindavan, Chidambaram, Rameswaram etc as well as the big cities: Mumbai, New Dehli, Kolkata, Chennai etc.

coolbodhi
24 February 2010, 01:20 PM
Scott,
What do you mean by 'Sermon'?

saidevo
24 February 2010, 10:02 PM
namaste everyone.

Congregational worship takes many forms in South India, specially Chennai, where I live.

• The most classical and scriptural form of it are the homas--fire rituals, performed everyday or on certain days in a week. While this is common in many ashrams, it is also held in some temples, specially the modern temples constructed by the ashrams. For example, in the SkandAshram temple in SelaiyUr, Chennai, an elaborate chaNDI homam is performed every day with an abhiShekam to the image of meru mountain. This temple has sannidhis for its main deities GaNapati, Murugan, PratyankarA DevI, Sharabheshvarar, and Pudukottai ShAntAnanda SvAmigaL. At the outer prakAram, it has a dhyAna maNDapam--meditation hall, and sannidhis--compartmental rooms, with images of Hanuman, GaruDAzhvAr, LakShmI NarasiMha, Ayyappa and so on. Almost all the images are gigantic, raising up to 15-20 feet and made of copper or panchaloka. The temple also performs annadAnam--charity of food to around 500 people or so, every day; the food comprises sAmbAr sAdam and buttermilk rice with one vegetable.

AbhiShekam, ArAdhAna, trIkAla--three sessional, pujas and and homAdis are regular features of almost all temples in Tamilnadu, attended by a good number of devotees. Only in addition to these worship rites, are the individual archAnas performed in the temples, for devotee who ask for it.

• One new practice of congregational worship is what is known as pArAyaNa. Women (from all sects) gather in the temples at specified times in a week and chant stotras such as the LalitA SahasranAma. Men (from all sects0 gather to chant the ViShNu SahasranAma. These pArAyaNa are also held in the homes of the householders who sponser it, with some ceremonially prepared food for the participants. We had one pArAyaNa of LalithA SahasranAma at our home on our Wedding Day last year, which was attended to by around 25 women and lasted for over two hours.

The women groups who do such pArAyANa have an overall target of say one crore chantings to be completed in a period of six months, and this is done purely for loka-kShema--welfare of the world. A similar event for men is the congregational performance of GAyatrI Homa done monthly at various places in the Chennai city, with a target of AvRttis--repetitions, for the loka-kShema.

In addition to the pArAyaNas, what is called DivyanAma SankIrtana--singing the names of God, are held in temples and homes. There are troupes who are experts in such worship; they sing stotras and bhajans on different deities and sages in their performances.

• A third type of congregation worship are the bhajan events conducted when a sage (e.g. SriSri Ravi Shankar) visits a town. Such events are almost a daily event in most North Indian towns. In Tamilnadu, the TyAgarAja Utsava where KarnAtic music artists come in large numbers to his native town TiruvaiyAru, Tamilnadu and sing in unison, the TyagarAja kRtis.

• A fourth type is the satsangha pravachana--spiritual lecturers, held in sabhas--public halls, almost daily, in one place or another in the Chennai city. The pravachana could be on any spiritual topic: UpaniShads, GItA, RAmAyaNa, PurANas and so on.

• Another famous form of congregational worship in Tamilnadu is the bhakti--devotional, worship characterised by singing and dancing--the Hare KRShNa type. These are held in ashrams such as that of shrI KRShNa Premi, and on occasions in temples and homes. VaiShNavas sponser annual events such as the RAdhA KalyANam--RadhA's wedding with KRShNa, in temples and ashrams, attended by a large number of people. These events are sometimes held in old age homes, with annadAna for the inmates.

• And then we have the congregatonal worship done at homes on festive occasions and special days such as the Fridays in the month of Thai--Jan 15-Feb 15. Household women sponser it, inviting their friends to partake the worship and gift the participants with religious articles, a blouse bit, and prasAdam like the suNDal--made of boiled lentils such as the white and black channa, peas, and so on. The most famous occasion of such worship is during the NavarAtri time.

• The shikaram--peak, of all congregational worship are the Hindu festivals held in temples, such as the Thai pUsam for Murugan, VinAyaka Chaturthi, ShivarAtri, VaikuNTha EkAdashi, NavarAtri and others.

It is such congregational worship that softens the effects of Kali in this Kali Yuga.

**********

ScottMalaysia
24 February 2010, 11:09 PM
Saidevo,

Thanks for your reply. I've never seen anything like this in Malaysia, so Malaysian Hindus either may not be as devout as South Indian Hindus, or they may not have preserved the traditions as faithfully. People do gather at the big temples for puja and abhisheka, but they simply stand, watch and pray while the pujaris offer the puja or perform the abhisheka. I've never seen a large congregation in a South Indian temple all sitting and singing bhajans, or listening to a sermon (religious discourse) on the Gita or Hindu Scriptures.

Saidevo, a question about temples in South India. In Malaysia, most of the temples are South Indian ones, and most of them are Saivite, dedicated to Amman, Shiva, Ganesha, Murugan, Kali or Muneeswarar. I've seen (only from the outside) a South Indian Vaishnava temple in the city of Klang, and I was told that there is another one in Puchong (another town).

Is this the same in Tamil Nadu? Are there far more Saiva temples than Vaishnava ones? Or are there a significant number of temples with Vishnu/Krishna/Rama as the main Deity?

saidevo
25 February 2010, 02:09 AM
namaste SM.

• It is not that Malaysian Hindus are less devout or care less to preserve their traditions; only that such practices are much easier in a Hindu-majority society. I understand that Hindus in the US periodically meet in satsangha, hold discussions, do pArAyaNa, teach their children--even conduct religious games and competitions for them, and thus foster Hindu ways of devotion and spirituality.

• Congregational worship except in the form of daily temple pujas are only rarely, if ever, seen in the Hindu temples in Tamilnadu which are under the financial administration by the State. Usually they flourish in the modern temples built by individual trusts, ashrams, etc. and maintained by them.

Actually in the purAtana--ancient temples, one can see maNDapams--pavilions with 100 pillars, 1000 pillars and named after the number of pillars eg, '100-leg-pavilion'. These pavilions in the olden days were used for satsangha and pArAyaNa. Today the atheistic government of Tamilnadu uses them as dining halls in what they advertise as sama-pankti-bhojana--congregation feasts involving all castes, purely with a view to catch votes. And the government uses the pavilions outside the outer prakAra by leasing the space to private religious stalls and earning money that is scarcely used for the temple welfare and maintenance. While most ancient temples have one or more ponds, the government's arrangement for their maintenance is horrible, in spite of the tradition that bathing in these ponds are supposed to be religiously meritorious and even remove a devotee's disease. Any agricultural lands at the backyard where there are gardens and groves are also leased out to privately (read to vested interests) with financial malpractices. The main reason for all these anti-Hindu practices is that the governmental temple maintenance committee has atheist and corrupt politicians or their sycophants in key positions. For these reasons, when I happen to visit temples maintained by the state, I don't drop money in the hundy boxes there, but drop my contribution on the plates of the priests, so that it can augment their usually meagre earnings.

• Although Saivite temples are more, every village in Tamilnadu where there is a Shiva temple, usually will also have a PerumAL (ViShNu) temple; towns and cities have more number of VaishNavite temples than in the villages. There are some Saivite temples which have a sannidhi for ViShNu, and in many Shiva temples, LakShmI has a small sannidhi and resides there in the name ViShNuDurgA (PArvatI is ShivaDurgA).

There are certain things that look curious: Anjaneya in Shiva temples wears vibhUti streaks, while he wears the VaiShNavite vertical marks in ViShNu temples. Such is also the case with any elephants belonging to the temple.

Ganesha has a separate sannidhi in all Shiva temples, but in ViShNu temples he only has a pillar at the entrance allotted to him, where he is carved. There are usually no worship rituals conducted to Ganesha in ViShNu temples. With all such differences in tradition, however, people of both the sects frequent the temples and ashrams of the other, although these may not be practicable for the temple priests themselves.

Worshiping in Shiva and ViShNu temples are unique experiences on their own. If I like the smell of vibhUti prasAdam of a Shiva temple, I would love the taste of tuLasi and cardamom in the tIrtha prasAdam--divine water, offered in a ViShNu temple. The mUlavars--(usually) stone images in the sanctum in a Shiva temple are usually small compared to the hefty, nine to ten feet tall images of ViShNu, beautifully and divinely proportioned in its physical features, and these evoke different bhakti bhAva--devotional mindframes. It is a devotional treat to watch the abhiShekams performed to the mUrtis--images, in the sanctum. These days one can watch it every early morning in the TV channels.

The advaita bhakti of visiting all temples and worshiping all Gods is indeed a unique spiritual and devotional experience, known only to those who have and practice it.

TatTvamAsi
25 February 2010, 03:46 PM
The advaita bhakti of visiting all temples and worshiping all Gods is indeed a unique spiritual and devotional experience, known only to those who have and practice it.

Namaste Saidevo,

Simply superb!

It is an honor to be able to go to all the temples regardless of differences. In fact, it emphasizes the multiplicity of Tat!

JAI HIND!