Aham Brahmasmi - 4 - The Way to the Absolute [Archive]

devotee

24 May 2010, 05:23 AM

The Way to the Absolute (Beyond Births and Deaths)

Karma – Any Respite ? :

How to attain the Absolute … the state which is beyond all births and deaths - where there is absolute freedom ? Can good karmas lead us there to ?

Most of the people think that our good karmas can lead us to liberation from the cycles of deaths and births. It is only partially true. Our good Karmas can create favourable conditions for leading us towards liberation … but they are not alone the way to liberation. Why ? Good Karmas or bad Karmas create new possibilities for further continuance of life (of the Jiva) in a particular way whether in this birth or in the next birth. These karmas have good, bad or mixed outcomes depending upon the type the karmas done (Ref : BG 18.12).

Bhagwad Gita tells us that if we become a Karmaphala tyaagi i.e. become unattached to the outcomes of both types of Karmas … we may get liberated. This looks pretty easy but it is actually very difficult because as long as we are encased within this body-mind cage … there are always some desires …. these desires, however, subtle, create conditions for good or bad karmas and due to those desires we are attached to those karmas. Once the karma cycles takes it course … there is no control on the outcomes and further karmas unless one is very- very diligent.

Once the Jnana is attained, all karmas of the seeker are roasted and they don’t create any further binding karmas. This Jnana can be obtained by grace of God by intense bhakti, karma yoga or Jnana yoga paths.

The Path of Raaj Yoga :

Most of the Advaitic schools following Jnana Yoga path rely on Raaj Yoga to roast all karmas in this birth itself and not leave anything on chance. I am not going to talk the entire process of Raaj Yoga here which can be learnt better only under a qualified Guru & it is not permitted to take up this path casually. Here, I am going to give some idea of this path for the interested seekers.

The philosophy and result of spiritual research by ancient Yogis :

It was revealed to our great seers that “Consciousness is Brahman” … Prajnaanam Brahman. This consciousness is whatever is. There is nothing in this manifested world which is not this Consciousness. If that is true then the same consciousness must be within us too. So, the gateway to the Infinite Consciousness which is the material and efficient cause of this phenomenal world which we know as “God” must be within us.

The intensive spiritual research revealed to the seers/yogis that the Individual Consciousness is separated by restlessness (vibration of the consciousness) produced by our own desires …. The degree of this restlessness varies from person to person and is reflected in restless thoughts going through the mind of an individual ….. so, we must do something to get rid of this restlessness and focus our mind to one thought. It was also revealed to the Yogis that there are 7 Chakras in our spinal chord, between our eyebrows and the brain which are the centers of our Consciousness. These locations are :

a) Moolaadhaar Chakra (Base Chakra):
Its literal meaning is Root or base chakra (wheel). The centre is the last bone in the spinal chord. Key issues involve sexuality, lust and obsession. Physically, Muladhara governs sexuality, mentally it governs stability, emotionally it governs sensuality, and spiritually it governs a sense of security.

b) Svadhisthana Chakra (Sacral Chakra):
This chakra is located opposite prostate/ovaries. The key issues involving Svadisthana are relationships, violence, addictions, basic emotional needs, and pleasure. Physically, Svadisthana governs reproduction, mentally it governs creativity, emotionally it governs joy, and spiritually it governs enthusiasm

c) Manipura Chakra (Solar Plexus Chakra):
This chakra is located opposite navel. Manipura are issues of personal power, fear, anxiety, opinion-formation, introversion, and transition from simple or base emotions to complex. Physically, Manipura governs digestion, mentally it governs personal power, emotionally it governs expansiveness, and spiritually, all matters of growth.

d) Anahat Chakra (or Heart chakra):
This chakra is located opposite heart. Key issues involving Anahata involve complex emotions, compassion, tenderness, unconditional love, equilibrium, rejection and well-being. Physically Anahata governs circulation, emotionally it governs unconditional love for the self and others, mentally it governs passion, and spiritually it governs devotion.

e) Visuddha Chakra (Throat Chakra) :

This chakra is located opposite our throat in the spine. It governs such issues as self-expression and communication. Physically, Vishuddha governs communication, emotionally it governs independence, mentally it governs fluent thought, and spiritually, it governs a sense of security.

f) Ajna Chakra (The Brow Chakra) :

This Chakra is also known as the third eye. It is located between our eyebrows. Ajna's key issues involve balancing the higher & lower selves and trusting inner guidance. Ajna's inner aspect relates to the access of intuition. Mentally, Ajna deals with visual consciousness. Emotionally, Ajna deals with clarity on an intuitive level.

g) Sahasrara Chakra (The Crown Chakra) :
It is located at the crown of the head, hence the name. it involves such issues as inner wisdom and the death of the body. Sahasrara's inner aspect deals with the release of karma, physical action with meditation, mental action with universal consciousness and unity, and emotional action with "beingness".

The Common man’s consciousness is bound within the first three chakras i.e. the Moolaadhaar Chakra, Svadhisthan Chakra and the Manipura Chakra. And till his consciousness is within these three chakras … he is full of sufferings and sorrows being tossed into different births at the mercy of kala due to no control on desires and karma generated due to the natural effects of these chakras. He is a puppet in the hands of his sexual and other physical/mental desires. The real spiritual ascension of the man starts when his consciousness ascends to the heart chakra (by the grace of God or Guru or by his own spiritual efforts). Once his consciousness rises to the heart chakra, it doesn’t go down to the lower chakras … his real journey to liberation starts from here.

(shall continue in next post ...)

OM

yajvan

24 May 2010, 01:30 PM

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namast� devotee

How to attain the Absolute �

Thank you for this string and the insights it brings. May I ask a more subtle question? Is the Absolute ( the Supreme) attained ? It suggests to me that there is me, and then there is this other called Absolute i.e. 'me' and 'IT'.
Is it not more about coming to the realization that I too am this ? I am aṅkura� of this brahman. The wise say we are aṅga (limb) of aṅgi ( the whole ).

praṇām

words
aṅkura - sprout, blade, bud

kd gupta

25 May 2010, 12:07 AM

Thanks Yajvanji , very nice observation and I find the answer as....

Dhyaanenaatmani pashyanti kechidaatmaanamaatmanaa;
Anye saankhyena yogena karmayogena chaapare.

Some by meditation behold the Self in the Self by the Self, others by the Yoga of
knowledge, and others by the Yoga of action.

Anye twevamajaanantah shrutwaanyebhya upaasate;
Te�pi chaatitarantyeva mrityum shrutiparaayanaah.

Others also, not knowing thus, worship, having heard of it from others; they, too, cross
beyond death, regarding what they have heard as the supreme refuge...gita ch 13

devotee

25 May 2010, 08:53 AM

Namaste Yajvan ji,

May I ask a more subtle question? Is the Absolute ( the Supreme) attained ? It suggests to me that there is me, and then there is this other called Absolute i.e. 'me' and 'IT'.
Is it not more about coming to the realization that I too am this ? I am aṅkura� of this brahman. The wise say we are aṅga (limb) of aṅgi ( the whole ).

praṇām

words
aṅkura - sprout, blade, bud

Your observation is correct. However, please note that there is no word which can describe it correctly. Even Realisation is not really correct. If there is Realisation then there must be an object and a seer. Even "Ankur" word is not correct as ankur must grow into a full tree ... there is something small becoming something "big". But in fact, there is nothing which is becoming what it was already not. Moreover, an ankur always gives a new tree but here after realisation we don't get another Brahman !

The use of "attain" points towards attaining the Absloute state. So there is no change in the substance materially but the it attains a different state e.g. water attaining the state of ice or water vapour or carbon attaing the state of diamond. So, in my opinion, the use of word "attaining" is better.

Truly speaking, we have words which cannot explain the reallity exactly as It is, but we have no alternative but to express ourselves through words alone unless we rise to the status of the Seers & can communicate silently.

Till then, please bear with my limitations and the limitations of words I use. :)

OM

yajvan

25 May 2010, 10:23 AM

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté devotee

yes, the trouble and mischief words bring... I know it well. The inability to capture the fullness of Being ( Reality) in a word...it is unspeakable , indefinable (anirukta¹)

I wrote this previously and thought it applied in this conversation.

हुं huṁ appears in the Chāndogya Upaniṣad 1.13.3 ( 1st khaṇḍa, 13th śloka , 3rd pāda) .

It says, anirukttas trayodaśaḥ stobhaḥ sañcaro huṁ-kāraḥ
The indefinable (anirukta) is the 13th (trayodaśa) stobha (interjection), the sound¹ हुं huṁ-kāraḥ.

A stobha is a chanted interjection in a sāman ( sāma ved chants); The interjections are used in the chant to make them more conducive/musical to the ear , adding sama ( even-ness, consistency) to the chant.

Yet this stobhaḥ , huṁ , is of special interest. It is defined as anirukta, unspeakable. Why so?

It is the sound of the underlying Reality of all. It is considered of indefinite origin. Why ? Because existence, Being (sattā) is without origin - no beginning, no end. It is unspeakable due to its fullness (bhūman) that connot be contained in sound or form . Yet we do the best we can. It is that huṁ or hūṁ and oṁ that is praṇava. Sacred syllables or akṣara.
Akṣara we know means syllable, yet in the same breath is defined as imperishable. It is as if the total ocean could be held in one drop of water.
Such is the value and our ability to hear the resonance of huṁ हुं hūṁ हूं and oṁ ॐ .

praṇām

words

anirukta अनिरुक्त - is 'not explained', indefinable; it is unspeakable, un-uttered
stobha - a chanted interjection in a sāman ( sāma ved chants); .
My view only: The way to this word 'sound' is interesting: sañcaro is sañ+cara. This cara is moving, shaking ; in music it is called mūrchanā. Its meaning in mūrchā = 'melody' ( amongst other things) and melody =mūrchanā
kāra - is a song , hymn of praise

devotee

28 May 2010, 10:21 AM

Namaste,

The Vibration of the Consciousness – the cause of this phenomenal world :

From Mandukya Upanishad we know that the Consciousness has four layers of existence … “This Self has four quarters”. We have discussed in Brahmasmi-1 that the first two quarters are : “Waking” and “Dreaming States”, the “Prajna (God State)” is the third and the Nirugna Brahman i.e. Turiya which is the substratum of all the three states is the fourth. Mandukya Upanishad also tells us that Turiya is the cessation of all activities (of the three states).

We have also seen during discussion in this series of threads that this vibration of the Consciousness which creates three phenomenal states is heard as sound “OM” in our right ear when our mind shuts out other sounds and we try to hear this sound one-pointedly. This “sound” comes from all this manifested world.

This cosmic vibration is echoed in different manner (in the form of different sounds) from different Chakras. So, when during meditation we try to hear this sound, we hear different sounds in our right ear depending upon our spiritual development. The sound of the bumblebees/jingle bells heard during this meditation comes from Moolaadhaar Chakra which shows that we are bound to our animal instincts (please see the characteristics of this chakra) and have made little spiritual progress. We hear clear sound of a deep gong bell (which resembles the sound of "OM") when our heart chakra is activated and our real journey towards Self-realisation has started. When our Ajna chakra (opposite Medulla Oblongata) is activated, it returns a sound of Roaring Sea & that shows attainment of very high level of spiritual state which opens the door to the Infinite Consciousness.

Our Thoughts – an analysis :

Our spiritual progress can also be gauged by our thoughts. We don’t give much value to our thoughts unless we have any desire to turn them into action. However, these thoughts are the sign of our restlessness and need much careful study.

a) What is this “I” which is thinking all this ? This “I” is nothing but a bundle of thoughts. This “I” is an entity created with layers of thoughts over thoughts and is the cause of all our joys, sorrows, action and cycles of births and deaths. This thought is the mother thought of all thoughts.
b) What is “anything” ? There is nothing like “anything” we see and perceive. All perception of “anything” or “nothing” is simply a thought. In reality there is no “second” & there is nothing which is separate from the seer/observer.
c) What is pain or joy ? It is just a thought.
d) What is sleep ? It is a thought of nothingness.
e) What are desires or fulfillment of these desires ? They are nothing but thoughts.

So, our whole life is made up of thoughts. These thoughts create a veil over the reality and we think that we have a separate identity. These thoughts make us miserable by telling us that we desire “such and such thing & unless we have it we won’t be happy” etc. These thoughts create the illusion of this world of sufferings, pains and pleasures. These thought waves need to be brought into control for mastering over our life, our pains, pleasures and sufferings. Maharishi Patanjali says :
“Yogaschittvritti nirodhah” --- Yoga (i.e. the union with the Infinite Consciousness/God/Reality/Brahman/Self) is the control/stoppage of thought-waves in the mind (the thought waves in mind are the Chitta-vritti).

We are in Control of our restless thoughts :

I will tell you a story here :

On a different forum, once a young man asked for help. He was deserted by his fiancée who had found a better match for herself. He was thinking that he won’t be able to survive without her … he loved her more than anything on this earth … blah .. blah … blah ! I said to him, “I don’t think you love her so much as you claim. It is simply not possible to love anyone the way you are claiming. If you don’t believe me, you may try this test : Sit down calmly. Start thinking of the girl and keep thinking about her alone for half an hour. Just half an hour … it is no big deal. If you really love her than anything else in your life … you can always spare half an hour just for her. During these thirty minutes, you should have no thought of anything … you must think of her alone. If you are able to do that, then I would accept that you really love her so much. And in that case, you will get her back … there is no doubt over this. This is what we believe in Hinduism. (“Jaa par jaake satya sanehu so tehi milahin na kachhu sandehu” --- Goswami Tulsidas).

This young man, came back next day on the forum. He was much relaxed now. He said, “You are cheating. It is not possible to keep thinking about that girlfriend for half an hour without any distraction. It is simply impossible !” I said, “Do you still believe that a girl for whom you can’t spare even half an hour, is really important for you ?”.

****************************

That is the power of thought. We start believing that we must have such and such thing without realising that it is our restless thoughts which are driving us mad. We don’t control our thoughts, we don’t really generate them as we think …. most of the times it is the thoughts which control us. The more we are controlled by our thoughts … the more we have a distorted picture of the reality and the more pains we are liable to suffer.

So, for getting freedom from the sufferings and pains ... the duality of joys and sorrows ... we must gain control over our thoughts. This truth can be verified very easily. Whenever you feel that you are under distress ... try to gain control over your thoughts .... you start thinking rationally and your distress reduces instantly ... though the situation outside has remained the same. If you could gain control over the thoughts fully ... you could be free from that distress completely !

OM

Eastern Mind

28 May 2010, 11:09 AM

Your observation is correct. However, please note that there is no word which can describe it correctly. Even Realisation is not really correct.

Vannakam Yajvan and Devotee:

I hope you don't mind me jumping in in some attempt to add more.

I've heard some other attempts at describing the non-describable that I can share.

"The only experience that's not an experience."

"The Self - you can't describe it."

"If you visualise nothingness all around you on all 6 directions, and then dissolve yourself into that nothingness, that is a way to describe, and yet that nothingness is the fullness of everything"

"In order to realise the self, you have to give up the desire to realise the self"

I find that way out here, in the external world of form and words, its really tough. Its even tough to put words into our own (at least mine) simple attempts at meditating or feeling strong darshan, let alone words about the depths that seers speak of.

Aum Namasivaya

yajvan

28 May 2010, 02:43 PM

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namast� EM (et.al)

Another way of considering this Self/brahman is the following: satatoditam. svāmī lakṣman-jū's offers this word from the Tantrāloka. It is that which has no pause, no break.

This for me really captures the essence of this totality, the fullness. Svāmi-ji says ' It is break-less and unitary. In samādhi it is there and when samādhi is absent it is there. And in sleep it is there; in each and every state of the subjective body it is there.

If I look at this word I see it as sat + a-tu + dita. Which says to me, that which really is (sat) + not (a) +to have authority (tu) + bound or divided (dita). Or that Reality that cannot be bound or divided.

praṇām

Eastern Mind

28 May 2010, 03:43 PM

Yajvan: I remember my first actual sense of this, and it took a Jehovah's witness to bring it out of me. Imagine that. No words can do it justice, but yes unbroken works for me too.

Aum Namasivaya

devotee

28 May 2010, 06:28 PM

Namaste EM,

Yes, you are right and there are many more. However, let's pause for a moment & think : Is it necessary to describe it ? Can you describe the taste of an Alphanso Mango to a person who has never tasted it ? You can't. Actually nothing can be described exactly as it really is. Why ? Because our claim that we know sufficient about that thing to describe it completely is erroneous. We cannot know a thing completely unless we become that thing because the description of anything that you get from your sense-organs is tainted by the limitations of their power of perception of the reality. But when we become that thing ... we cannot describe it as that "experience/perception" is not a relative experience/perception it is direct experience/perception for which we have no words. Let's remember that we can only describe our relative experience or relative perception.

But what I want to stress upon here is that we should not waste our energy to describe it. It is not possible and it is not necessary. We should work towards "experiencing" it the way the ancient masters have taught us. I should be interested in relishing the taste of the mango ... why should I break my head for describing it ?

OM

Eastern Mind

28 May 2010, 07:10 PM

devotee

29 May 2010, 05:41 AM

Namaste,

Before I start discussing the steps towards the Self-Realisation in Raaj Yoga, I must discuss the Ajna Chakra a little in detail.

The Third Eye and the Cosmic Eye :

We have already talked about the 7 centers of Consciousness inside our body. One of the most important of these consciousness centers is Ajna Chakra. This Ajna Chakra is located just behind our Medulla Oblongata between our eyebrows. This chakra is very important from Yoga point of view & needs further deliberation. Medulla Oblongata is considered the window to the Cosmic Cosnciousness.

As discussed in the above post, Ajna Chakra deals with visual consciousness. It gives us intuition, inner guidance and is gateway to the higher Self. And as we have discussed earlier, this chakra is also known as the third eye or spiritual eye because of it being the centre of visual consciousness. Whatever we see in our intuition or in dreams is with the help of this chakra. I shall make it clear here that this spiritual eye is not an imagined eye. It truly exists. While in meditation you don’t have to imagine existence of this eye, you can actually “see” it (with closed eyes). In its clear form it is seen as a blue sphere encircled by a golden halo (this golden halo is the vibration of the cosmic energy. Let’s recollect Isha Upanishad’s verse 15 :
“The door of the Truth is covered by a golden disc. Open it, O Nourisher! Remove it so that I who have been worshipping the Truth may behold It.”
The blue sphere represents the vibration of the Kutashtha Chaitanya. There is a little star in the middle of the blue disc which is the pure light of God beyond creation. To enter into the Cosmic Consciousness the yogi must penetrate this white star.

This Ajna chakra as stated above also connects us to the inner Guru & so it is also called the Guru Chakra. It is also called the “eye of Shiva”. As it is the doorway to our inner Guru, the activation of this chakra holds a great value for the yogi. Due to its importance, in Hinduism, there is a custom of applying a dot or a mark on this point. This helps in unconsciously drawing our mental focus towards this very important point of consciousness and this increases our power of intuition and deepening our relationship with the inner Guru.

OM

devotee

11 June 2010, 08:13 PM

The Basics and answers to some questions :

We have talked of Chakras (the Centres of Consciousness in our Spine) and their characteristics. The aim of Yoga-Sadahna (practice) is to move to the higher Centres of Consciousness. How do we attain it ? As I have mentioned in the earlier posts that a common man has its Consciousness centered around the first three chakras and according to the characteristics of these chakras, remains attached to earthly desires.

Let’s try to answer some common questions here :

a) Can we simply focus on higher chakras and move our consciousness to the higher chakras ?

It is not so easy. In fact, as we are dealing with the individual Consciousness and the door to the Infinite Consciousness, we have to know the obstacles which throw a veil over the mouth of Truth. Patanjali charts out a well defined path and the Yogi must take to this path with utmost patience and reverence. Depending upon one’s karma and guna, these obstacles can be very strong and any head-on collision with them can prove dangerous. So, it is important to have the blessings of a Guru.

b) Should we not try to become thoughtless directly as Yoga is the cessation of all mind-waves ?

This too is not recommended, though it is the most popular notion going around on net. This cessation of mind-waves is the final stage of Yoga (it comes naturally by following the previous steps) and trying to do it directly/forcibly can give undesirable results … can attract spirits of negative vibrations if that matches the vibration of the practitioner and can also harm the practitioner.

c) Is Yoga not only for the Jnana Yoga ? Why should a seeker of Bhakti Yoga learn this ?

This again is a myth. There are varied paths within Bhakti Yoga and quite a few of them practise Yoga in different ways. Some meditate on a particular form of God, some on some Mantra etc. Vishnu Purana explains how one should meditate on the form of Vishnu and how should move slowly from gross to the subtle & finally how to meditate on Self.

It recommends as given below :

“ Stage 1.

Meditate on Vishnu, the Dweller in the heart of all beings, seated on a lotus within the rays of sun, his body luminous, adorned with diadem, necklace, earrings and bracelets of great luster and holding conch shell and mace in hands.

Stage 2.
Then the Yogi should meditate on upon the luminous, benign form of the Lord, without the conch shell and mace but adorned with ornaments.

Stage 3.
Slowly the mind would become concentrated on the form. Then the yogi should meditate on the form without ornaments.

Stage 4.
Meditate upon his Oneness with the luminous form of the Lord.

Stage 5.
Let the form vanish and meditate on the Self. “

This is just one example. With slight variations, the meditation is adopted in various paths leading to the same Truth. In fact, the kirtan, bhajan, intense devotion to God too lead us to the same stage & that we will learn in coming posts.

d) What does Raj yoga think of God ? Does Patanjali talk of God ?

Some schools try to propagate that “Yogis try to become God themselves” and therefore, lack in necessary Shraddha (devotion). This is not at all true. God is not denied by Patanjali. Let’s see what he says :

Ishwarpranidhaanaadva.

=è Concentration may also be obtained through devotion to God.

Kleshakarmavipaakaashayairparamrishtah purushvishesha Ishwara.

=è Ishwara is a special kind of being untouched by ignorance and the products of ignorance, not subject to Karmas or Samskaras or the results of action.

Tatra niratishaya sarvagnatvabeejam.

=è In Him, knowledge is Infinite; in others it is just a germ.

Sa poorveshaamapi guruh kaalenaanvachchedaat.

=è He was the Guru of even the earliest Gurus, since He is not limited by time.
=è Tasya vaachakah pranavah.

The word that expresses Him is OM.

e) Is not Yoga just the physical exercises or the breathing exercises being taught in various yoga schools ?

This again is wrong. Only a limb has been identified with the whole body in such cases. Yoga has eight limbs. The Yoga postures come in the Asana part of the Yoga and breathing exercises come in the Pranayama (in fact, it is not Pranayama too, in real sense). We shall deal with all these in detail in the coming posts.

***********************

So, how to start ? Let’s first understand these clearly :

1. A fit body and mind are a must for a yogi :

The body is the vehicle for all dharmas (Sharira maadhyam khalu dharma saadhanam”. So, the first most important thing to remember is that we must maintain a healthy body and mind for the saadhana.

Patanjali says :

“Sickness, mental laziness, doubt, lack of enthusiasm, sloth, craving for sense pleasure, false perception, despair caused by failure to concentrate and unsteadiness in concentration --- these are the obstacles to knowledge.”

Let’s remember what Lord Krishna says in Bhagwad Gita :

“Yoga is not for the man who overeats or for him who fasts excessively. It is not for him who sleeps too much or for those who don’t sleep at all. This, yoga, the reliever from all sufferings, is attained by those who are moderate in eating, recreation, action, sleep and wakefulness.”

So how to keep fit for Yoga ?

a) Yogic exercises :

The Yoga Guru teaches a set of yogic exercises which one should do with full discipline regularly. This will make the body strong and fit for yoga.

b) Yogic food :

The yogi should neither take excessive food nor too less food. He should not take stale food. The Rajasik and Tamsik foods should be avoided. The Rajasik food and Tamsik foods have been described in Bhagwad Gita by Lord Krishna. Consuming meat is hindrance to yoga practice, so that should be avoided as much as possible. The Yogi should take green vegetables, fruit, milk, sprouted cereals, honey which are full of life. The canned food should be avoided. These are dead food and would create diseases. The intake of water should be well regulated. Taking water while taking food and immediately thereafter should be avoided and it should be taken in good quantity after 1 to 2 hours after meal to wash out the toxins in the body. Taking 2-3 glasses of water in the morning just after getting up from bed is advisable.

The body needs sunlight and pure air too in sufficient quantity. This should be kept in mind and one should try to have sufficient exposure to sunlight and take as much fresh air as possible.

c) Rest and sleep :

The yogi should take rest and should sleep in moderation so that it is not too much and it is not too less.

2. Thoughts :

Thoughts are very powerful which affect our body and mind in a great way and leave deep impressions in our mind which is carried as samskars from one birth to the other. So, a yogi should carefully guard against negative thoughts. Thoughts which attach us to the worldly things or increase our worldly desires should be avoided as much as possible. Yogi should always remind himself that he is not the body-mind entity and he is the all pervading Self/ the Infinite Consciousness which is peaceful and blissful. Lusty thoughts make our will power weak and they also make us prone to physical/mental diseases.

Thoughts are what we are. If we think that we are strong, we are strong …. If we think we are weak, we are weak. If we think we are good, we become good and if we think we are bad, we become bad. If we think we are healthy, we become healthy, if we think we are sick, we become sick.

3. The environment and company of people around a yogi :

The people around us and the environment where we live in have positive or negative vibrations. We should associate ourselves with Satvik people which accentuate our positive vibrations and help us keep moving on the path. Living in an environment which has negative vibes disturbs our peace and distracts us from the Path. Noisy environment is hindrance to yoga. So, a yogi should try to avoid such noisy places.

4. Study of Scriptures, Tapas and Karmayoga :

Patanjali says :

Tapah-swadhyayaeshwarpranidhaanaani kriyayogah.

=è Austerity (Tapas), study and dedication of the fruits of one’s work to God --- these are the preliminary steps towards yoga.

Study of scriptures make our doubts clear and promotes our spiritual progress.

Tapas/Austerity should not be misunderstood as “mortification of body and mind”. The mortification of body and mind is prohibited in Yoga-sadhana. The middle-path is the key-word here. The Bhagwad Gita talks of three types of austerity :

a. Reverence for the Devatas, the seers, Gurus, and the sages, straightforwardness, harmlessness, physical cleanliness and sexual purity -à This is called the austerity of body.
b. To speak without ever causing pain to another, to be truthful, to say always what is kind and beneficial and to study the scriptures regularly --à This is called austerity of speech.
c. The practice of serenity, sympathy, meditation upon Self, withdrawal of mind from the sense objects and integrity of motive is called the austerity of mind.

OM

devotee

19 June 2010, 08:00 AM

Namaste,

The Ashtaanga Yoga :

What is Ashtaanga Yoga or the Yoga with eight limbs ? Patanjali has described eight requirements for Yoga (Union with God) & they are called Ashta anga of Yoga or eight limbs of Yoga. These are :

Yama-Niyamaasan-PraaNaayaam-Pratyaahaar-DhaaraNa-Dhyaan-Samaadhayoashtaavangaani.

a) Yama :

The Don’ts or what a Yogi shouldn’t do. The Yamas are :
i) Ahimsa (Non-injury to any other being)
ii) Satya (Truthfulness, freedom from flasehood)
iii) Asteya (Non-stealing)
iv) Brahmacharya (Chastity, freedom from idea of sex)
v) Aparigrah (Abstention from Greed for collecting wealth)

The above are actually opposite of what a Yogi should not do. However, the nature of these practices are of stopping oneself from evil-doings and that is why they are called Yama.

b) Niyama :

The Niyamas are what a Yogi must do. These are :

i) Shauch : Purity (both physical and mental)
ii) Santosh : Contentment (Be happy with whatever one has)
iii) Tapa : Austerity of deeds, thoughts and talk
iv) Swaadhyaaya : Study of Scriptures
v) Iishwar-pranidhaan : Devotion to God

Patanjali lays a lot of emphasis on Yama than on Niyama. He says Yama must be observed without fail in all circumstances without any consideration of birth, place, time or purpose. Yajvan ji has started good threads on Yama and Niyama in the sub-section, “Patanjali” under “Yoga” section :
http://hindudharmaforums.com/showthread.php?t=2970 (http://hindudharmaforums.com/showthread.php?t=2970)
http://hindudharmaforums.com/showthread.php?t=2960 (http://hindudharmaforums.com/showthread.php?t=2960)

etc.

If we look at these Yamas & Niyamas we find that these are generally accepted good human practices in almost all religions. But why is it necessary for the Yoga ? For Yoga we must be immune to the worldly attachments and the mind-waves being produced.

The five Yamas viz. Injury to anyone, falsehood, stealing, uncontrolled sexual urges, greed for accumulation of wealth lead us to criminal acts against other Jivas and accumulate bad Karmas. We can’t expect to get united with God by accumulating bad Karmas … and that is quite obvious. If we examine closely, these acts (forbidden under Yamas) are related with our lower Chakras of consciousness and bind us to the worldly attachments. So, any such act strengthens bondage of our consciousness with the lower chakras and therefore, they must be avoided.
The observance of five Niyamas slowly takes us away from the worldly bondage and moves our consciousness towards higher chakras. Let’s note one thing here that by the reverse is true in observance/non-observance of Niyamas and Yamas and the movement of consciousness to higher/lower chakras. The upward movement of consciousness towards higher chakras makes us fit for easy observance of Yama-Niyamas and observance of Yama-Niyamas move our consciousness to higher chakras.

Some Questions on Yama-Niyamas :

1. Strictly following Yama and Niyamas by an ordinary man is extremely difficult in the beginning. These Yama-Niyama are listed as the first requirements in the Ashtaanga Yoga of Patanjali. Should we first be firm in Yama-Niyama and then try other limbs of Yoga or what shall we do ?

=è By reading books of different schools I found two schools of thoughts. Some schools believe that one should first be firm in Yama-Niyama & then only should proceed to other limbs of Yoga. But then it closes the doors of Yoga for the common people like us ! L

However, some schools are not so strict. They do emphasize observance of Yama-Niyama but don’t stop the practitioner to go ahead with other limbs of yoga without attaining firmness in observance of Yama-Niyama. In fact, after careful study of the path prescribed, it appears to me that strict observance of Yama-Niyama is possible only after PraaNaayaam and Prataayaar ( we shall discuss these in posts to come). Finally, it all depends upon Guru … we must follow what our Guru tells us.

2. There are some nagging issues to deal with :

a) Non-injury : What should a Kshatriya do in the battlefield or what should we do when our life is in danger and killing the enemy is the only option left ?
b) Satya (Truthfulness) : What is the definition of Satya ? Speaking Truth at all times ? If by speaking truth an innocent person’s life is put to danger … will it called by Truthfulness ? Will it not violate the first Yama i.e. Non-injury ?
c) Asteya (Non-stealing): If the only option before me for saving the life of a hungry child is by stealing … should I steal or leave the child to fend for himself ? If the child dies of hunger, is it not the violation of the first Yama i.e. Non-injury ?
d) Brahmacharya (Continence) : What should a married man/woman do ? He has no hope ?
e) Aparigrah (Non-accumulation of wealth) : What will happen to future of our family of we don’t save & accumulate wealth ?

I will like to hear the words of other esteemed members of this forum on these difficult issues.

OM

Eastern Mind

19 June 2010, 08:55 AM

Vannakkam Devotee:

Thank you for posting on this. I honestly believe that living a life according to the Yamas/Nyamas is a goal and one should do this to the best of his/her abilities with a sense of intellectual with oneself honesty in that. It is obvious we cannot follow them to the letter. Then again, we can certainly try. It's a fine emotional line. You will hear people say, "I can't give up meat." Perhaps that is true for that person's state of consciousness, yet for people like me, who found it so easy to do, I find it preposterous. So the whole thing is so very individual.

I do believe in the point of view that yamas must be mastered before genuine spiritual awakening that the rishis described is possible. But then it's just a point of view, not necessarily correct for all. The spiritual awakening happens form the niyama side. It does no harm, in my opinion, to practise these in some way before mastering yamas, but real hardcore genuine practise is nigh impossible. Kind of like smelling or tasting food but not eating it. It helps us retain the goal in mind.

Aum Namasivaya

NayaSurya

19 June 2010, 11:01 AM

Kind of like smelling or tasting food but not eating it. It helps us retain the goal in mind.

Sooo true. This is day four of fast and I am still making full meals for everyone off on Summer break from school. I make delicious nutricious lunches for husband who is very very thin (128 pounds and 6'4).

This has been very interesting:p , but also good for my spiritual development.

Nothing like defying the body to bring yourself nearer to the Beloved.

devotee

20 June 2010, 04:39 AM

Namaste EM,

I honestly believe that living a life according to the Yamas/Nyamas is a goal and one should do this to the best of his/her abilities with a sense of intellectual with oneself honesty in that. It is obvious we cannot follow them to the letter. Then again, we can certainly try.

Yes, it is very important that we try to do as much as possible but following Yama 100% to the letter is possible only after Pratyaahaar, imho.

It's a fine emotional line. You will hear people say, "I can't give up meat." Perhaps that is true for that person's state of consciousness, yet for people like me, who found it so easy to do, I find it preposterous. So the whole thing is so very individual.

It shows your status on the path of spirituality. If my consciousness is badly bound to the lower chakras ... it appears very difficult to control any sense organ. However, we find that there are people who can do it very easily ... why ? Because they are at a higher state on the levels of spirituality.

I do believe in the point of view that yamas must be mastered before genuine spiritual awakening that the rishis described is possible. But then it's just a point of view, not necessarily correct for all.

Yamas, as I stated in my earlier post, has been given extra importance by Patanjali. So, it is highly important ... no doubt about it and your point of view is held by some schools of Yogis. However, what I find & what I have learnt from my Guru ji is that real Yama is possible only after Pratyaahaar unles your earlier-births-sanskaars are very favourably strong.

The spiritual awakening happens form the niyama side. It does no harm, in my opinion, to practise these in some way before mastering yamas, but real hardcore genuine practise is nigh impossible. Kind of like smelling or tasting food but not eating it. It helps us retain the goal in mind.

That is why the importance of Yama is underlined again.

*************

But what about the dilemmas I have pointed out ? What is your take on that ?

OM

Eastern Mind

20 June 2010, 08:22 AM

2. There are some nagging issues to deal with :

a) Non-injury : What should a Kshatriya do in the battlefield or what should we do when our life is in danger and killing the enemy is the only option left ?
b) Satya (Truthfulness) : What is the definition of Satya ? Speaking Truth at all times ? If by speaking truth an innocent person�s life is put to danger � will it called by Truthfulness ? Will it not violate the first Yama i.e. Non-injury ?
c) Asteya (Non-stealing): If the only option before me for saving the life of a hungry child is by stealing � should I steal or leave the child to fend for himself ? If the child dies of hunger, is it not the violation of the first Yama i.e. Non-injury ?
d) Brahmacharya (Continence) : What should a married man/woman do ? He has no hope ?
e) Aparigrah (Non-accumulation of wealth) : What will happen to future of our family of we don�t save & accumulate wealth ?

I will like to hear the words of other esteemed members of this forum on these difficult issues.

OM

Vannakkam Devotee.

I personally think that in such situations, we have to look to our own hearts or to our own Guru's teachings in such matters, but I'll give you my own POV anyway, since you asked. Not to restart some debate, but just my own POV, partly from heart, and partly from Guru.

a) It is rare to have a necessary war. Guru's guru said, "If the tiger enters the village, you may have to kill it." Notice he used the word, 'may'. So in extreme cases such as a burglar or worse entering my house, I would try me best to disarm him. if I had the opportunity to flee, I would. Protecting my spouse and children would come first. As you may have heard, recently the Palestinians hired some Gandhian experts to advise them. So the result was a non-violent protest, which ended in the Israelis killing 9 or so innocents. This in turn got the Israelis in trouble with traditional allies, even America. So they lifted the blockade to some degree at least. The Palestinians lost a few people, but much better results were had this way than if the same 9 people would have ventured into Israel as suicide bombers. Also, personally, I do not believe in Kshatriya class any more. Our soldiers are mostly hard-up or brainwashed people looking for a job or adventure. Wars are far more complicated that in the old days. Defense of one's boundaries is sensible, but foreign aggression in the guise of defense fools a few people but it usually comes crashing back like a wave hitting a wall.

b) I think you always have to look at the big picture, and ask yourself which is doing the greater harm. It's very clouded. In the childrens' novel "Number the Stars" set in Denmark during WW2, the brave Danes are always lying to the Germans as they smuggle Jews to freedom in Sweden. (A great novel to kick off a class discussion on this very topic, which of course, I always did.) So that all seemed okay to me. But lying to protect oneself from a punishment or arrest is truly wrong. Then one has to accept the responsibility and fess up. I would turn in my own son to authorities if I knew he committed a serious crime. For something smaller like littering or minor speeding, I would take care of it via counselling, hopefully.

c) I once had a 'other kids lunches' thief at my school in my class. The response by the principal was to treat it with corporal punishment, showing his Christian programming of "Spare the rod, spoil the child". By this time she had gotten to grade 6, and had a huge file of psychological tests, and the pattern had been the same for the 5 previous years. (This school was in a middle class area, where everyone assumed poverty or neglect didn't exist.) The other kids, being kids, and not capable of deeper understanding put the poor child at the bottom of the pecking order. After a couple of months of observation and meeting the mother, it became clear to me she was hungry, both for love and for food. I started providing her with food, and some attention. Lo and behold! She stopped stealing. So I would do my very best to find an alternative solution. But if a kid had to steal for food, I would begrudgingly accept that it is okay. But honestly, in today's world, no kid or person should go hungry. We have the brains to rearrange the distribution of wealth and as a consequence, the distribution of food. We can stop growing so much cane for example, as sugar is prety much unnecessary. Natural sugars from fruit are enough. But the greedy can't handle the idea of maybe losing their wealth and the phony security that comes with it. People like you and I get our security from faith.

d) I believe in brahmacarya before marriage, and sex within marriage only so there is no conflict here for me. I think Patanjali wasn't saying that it is sex just for procreation. I think there are other reasons such as family harmony, intimate expression of marital love, for sex. The idea of sex for procreation only, I believe is harmful for the person who is not ready for it. Then it is repression, not transmutation. For the renunciate, this is a different matter. In that case, I believe in total brahmacarya, but only if the individual is actually ready which is determined by Guru. (It may interest you to know that only about one fourth of the young men entering the monastic order I am familiar with actually stay, and this would be the main reason - guru and themselves determine they are not ready. So this order simply will not take any Tom, Dick, or Harry off the street.)

e) My political stance is called faith-induced Marxism. Instead of taking the money from the rich via force, and banning religious activities, we 'spiritualise' the rich and they then become more charitable. Wealth is then more evenly distributed because everyone wants to. Wealth is a great thing, if used wisely. Accumulation for accumulation sake is wrong. I'll use the personal example of my mother in law versus my father. My father gave up his inheritance before he died. My siblings and I all received money when we needed it, although spit 5 ways, it wasn't much. He kept just enough to support himself. My MIL, on the other hand, hoarded. This was as a result of living and remembering the depression, so it is forgivable and understandable in that sense. But her daughter, my spouse, could have used it earlier. I will be like my father.

So those who do, by circumstance, or karma, run into wealth need to share in the bounty. Other wise they can look forward to a few lifetimes of poverty. Karma can be a harsh but fair judge.

So you got my opinions. Hopefully in some way it was valuable to you. I'm sure others who have actually sat down and thought about such things would differ. I also think the answers would vary a lot from people based on geography, and the current living conditions that are in.

Aum Namasivaya

devotee

20 June 2010, 08:54 AM

Namaste EM,

Wonderful ! Nice analysis of situations and point of view!

Actually, the dilemma is arising from our state which is not ripe for Yama fully. Patanjali says :

i) Ahimsa (Non-injury):

Patanjali assures that such a situation has no place for a man who has mastered Ahimsa truly.
"Ahimsapratishthayaam tatsannidhau vairatyaagah"

When a man becomes steadfast in Ahimsa, then all living creatures cease to feel enmity in his presence.

ii) Satya (Truthfulness):

Likewise he says : "Satyapratishthaayaam kriyaaphalaashrayatvam"

He who has become steadfast in Truthfulness gets the fruits of actions (as he desires) without performing required actions.

This echoes my Guru ji's saying : "Don't run after accumulating wealth. You can have a will-power which will bring to you whatever & whenever you need ... work towards developing that will-power with yogic discipline."

iii) Non-stealing :

Asteyapratishtaayaam sarvaratnopasthaanam

When one becomes steadfast in non-stealing (desiring to have what is not his), all wealth come to him.

iv) Brahmacharya :

Brahmapratishaayaam Viryalaabhah

When one becomes steadfast in Brahmacharya, he acquires spiritual strength.

v) Aparigrah :

Aparigrahsthairye janmakathantaasambodhah

When a man becomes steadfast in aparigrah (free from greed for accumulation of wealth), he gains knowledge of his past, present & future existence.

OM

devotee

20 June 2010, 09:03 AM

double post ... deleted

amith vikram

22 June 2010, 06:13 AM

i have a silly question- if say ajna chakra opens,then is there a possibility that it'll be closed again?

Eastern Mind

22 June 2010, 06:53 AM

i have a silly question- if say ajna chakra opens,then is there a possibility that it'll be closed again?

Vannakkam amith: It is a rare soul indeed who can keep awareness at that level. All I can truly speak of is what I have read and heard. I have been told it is somewhat like memory. You might briefly encounter the ajna chakra, but then forget about it for years, or at least not be able to consciously with will get back there.

I am also quite sure that the terms, 'open' and 'close' regarding chakras are not accurate words in the translations. The whole idea of consciousness rising and falling is more like waves, I believe. Awareness ebbs and flows. I remember my Guru saying, "I'm not interested in how high you can go, I'm interested in how low you can go." In other words, which of the lower chakras (By this I mean the ones below the muladhara) are permanently blocked off. Then it becomes like the ability to permanently practise yamas.

The seven chakras below the muladhara (many people don't even know about them) are described here: http://veda.wikidot.com/the-chakras

Aum Namasivaya

devotee

22 June 2010, 11:16 AM

Namaste Amith,

i have a silly question- if say ajna chakra opens,then is there a possibility that it'll be closed again?

My Param Guru ji says that the real spiritual journey starts after activation of heart chakra when the seeker can clearly hear the "OM" sound coming from every pore of the universe. After that he never goes back to lower chakra as his attachment to worldly enjoyment is lost. Ajna chakra is two stages higher than heart chakra and it is just below the highest chakra (Crown chakra). So, if Ajna chakra is "really" activated then it cannot be deactivated as sensual desires can't affect this seeker which can bring down his consciousness back to lower chakras. When the Ajna chakra is activated the seeker starts having vision of God day and night .... there is unbroken feeling of God's infinite love ... why would anyone like to ever lose that paradise again ?

OM

rainycity

23 June 2010, 02:03 AM

My Param Guru ji says that the real spiritual journey starts after activation of heart chakra when the seeker can clearly hear the "OM" sound coming from every pore of the universe. After that he never goes back to lower chakra as his attachment to worldly enjoyment is lost.

the evidence suggests its not possible to lose sexual desire

rainycity

23 June 2010, 02:07 AM

The seven chakras below the muladhara (many people don't even know about them) are described here: http://veda.wikidot.com/the-chakras

Aum Namasivaya

It doesn't seem likely that there are chakras governing aspects of consciousness below the muladhara because that kind of psychic energy isn't felt anywhere below the muladhara.

devotee

23 June 2010, 03:46 AM

the evidence suggests its not possible to lose sexual desire

"evidence" ? Who has gathered such evidences ?

Yes, when there is anti-Hindu feeling and a person is out to prove something with vested interests then he can fabricate any number of such seemingly impossible "evidences".

If a person has fallen prey to sexual desires after activation of heart chakra or beyond then imho, he never experienced activation of Heart chakra and beyond in reality and he was telling lies ... but if he was not lying then the "evidences of his falling prey to sensual desires" must be false.

OM

upsydownyupsy mv ss

23 June 2010, 05:37 AM

Eastern Mind

23 June 2010, 06:37 AM

the evidence suggests its not possible to lose sexual desire

Vannakkam rainycity:

Celibacy is and has been an integral part of yoga for eons within Hinduism. In my opinion, in the west, because people lack the self control, they invent the idea that there is no such thing just to excuse their own continued sexual behaviour.

It is the same energy, the sexual energy, when transmuted, that drives the kundalini upward. So the evidence collected by western psychologists still listening to Freud might support your idea, but that ignores the mindset of the east, which isn't quite so Freudian.

Did you bother to go to the link I posted on lower chakras? Traditionally, it is said Lord Pillaiyar himself sits on the muladhara, where dharma begins. So just where is the consciousness of people not aware of any dharma?

Aum Namasivaya

devotee

23 June 2010, 08:37 AM

It doesn't seem likely that there are chakras governing aspects of consciousness below the muladhara because that kind of psychic energy isn't felt anywhere below the muladhara.

This is because it is the realm of darkness in the lower chakras & therefore are not described as the centres of consciousness but in reality, they are of lower centres of consciousness even lower than consciousness of a normal human being. The whole cosmos is represnted in this body. At the macrocosm level, the whole universe is divided into 14 Bhuvanas or lokas or realms and they are reflected within this body as centres of cosnciousness. These are :

i) Bhuloka ---> or this world where we are ---> Moolaadhaar Chakra
ii) Bhuvarloka ---> Subtle world higher than Bhuloka ---> Swadhisthaan Chakra
iii) Swarloka ---> Higher than Bhuvarloka ---> Manipur Chakra
iv) Maharloka ---> Higher than Swarloka ---> Anahat Chakra or Heart Chakra
v) Janaloka ---> Higher than Maharloka ---> Vishuddha Chakra
vi) Tapoloka ---> Higher than Janaloka ---> Ajna Chakra
vii) Satyaloka ---> The highest heaven ---> Sahasrar or Crown Chakra

These Swargas (heavens) are in spine. The lowest is the Bhuloka where we normally start as human being. With spiritual efforts we slowly move towards higher chakras. Within the Mooladhaar, Swadhishthan & Manipur chakras, the consciousness is clouded with cravings or lust and greed. When the consciousness travels to heart & the mind dwells there then man experiences his first experience of his spiritual awakening. He sees amazing spiritual light everywhere and hears "OM" sound.

When mind reaches the fifth centre i.e. the Vishuddha chakra located opposite throat then he starts enjoying the freedom from ignorance and delusion. Afte reaching here he enjoys only hearing and tralking of God and nothing else.

When mind reaches the sixth or the Ajna Chakra, he has "direct" (more real than "real", seen without eyes) vision of God day and night.

When mind reaches seventh Chakra he attains Oneness with God ... Samadhi is attained & he becomes knower of Brahman and non-different from Brahman Itself.

..............................................
The lokas of darkness & sufferings are called Patalas. There are seven Patalas & these are their places and subjects :

viii) atala ---> hips ---> fear and lust
ix) vitala ---> thighs ---> raging anger
x) sutala ----> knees ----> retaliatory jealousy
xi) talatala ---> calves ----> prolonged confusion
xii) rasatala ---> ankles ----> selfishness
xiii) mahatala ---> feet----> absence of conscience
xiv) patala ----> soles of feet ----> malice and murder

It would be very unfortunate for a human being to allow his consciousness going below Moolaadhaar. We have to go upwards to the heavens & not to the lower worlds.

OM

NayaSurya

23 June 2010, 10:22 AM

I have been through periods of celibacy in my life and I will assure you. Pure celibacy without desire exists...just as a place beyond thinking about food when fasting. The body simply shuts it off.

Anyone that has made it several years in the state of pure celibacy will tell you that the desire completely dies. But, you can not touch yourself...at all. That will continue the situation. It's all or nothing. You have to avoid triggering that in any way.

I have several years of college psychology and I can tell you now. Freud, Skinner...they all had some serious issues.

My son goes off to school to become a doctor of psychiatry this Fall...and one thing I have begged of him is to help the modern era of this ridiculous idolatry of Freud and his obvious tendency to assume all of us must be as sick as he(honestly his mother must have propped a bottle in his mouth and put him in front of the tv)....and B.F. Skinner who abused his own children for the sake of his sick science.

I was horrified that most of our modern studies revolved around such men.

Our vessel is an animal, no doubt. But our soul is not...it's completely operating this decaying structure of flesh.

We are in control?

I answer this mostly yes....as I have triggers...most do.

But, I can promise you...there is a place past desire if you have the strength. You have to make sure to be dilligent stay out of the places that could trigger relapse until you get there. Once there, as with food....you simply lose the desire.

upsydownyupsy mv ss

23 June 2010, 11:01 AM

I have been through periods of celibacy in my life and I will assure you. Pure celibacy without desire exists...
:confused: Without anny desire? Not even the desire to reach god or desire that everything must be happy? Not even the desire to reach 'Nirbana'(leaving the arrow called {subtlest of} body)? Maybe its true. I had an experience, but fail to recall it properly.
I had some feelings of happiness and divinity, but fail to recall it completely.
As per my memory, I could see violet like light mixed with darkness, rotating like 'SO-HAM (yang-yin) (violet light and darkness)' rotating. I was everything, all pervasive and beyond time and felt everything, just after wards I felt a white serpent like thing booming out of my head making sounds same as that of a cracker. In all those events, I felt 'Uninterested in Everything' and got the weird feeling of 'after yagnya (that state of being Vibhuthi or ash, which is left when fire burns certain things)'. Is that the state of not having any desires?

Not having desires- This is a Tedious statement. It is to be noted that this world has been born out of the desire of Prakriti half of Consciousness.
Desire is the cause of action(kriya, such as dharma or artha) which leads to Karma.

I'm utterly confused now. :doh::headscratch:

Yea, I do agree modern medicine is inadequate. Some Doctors behave like computers. They think there are only two possibilities, 1.)ill-health (0) and 2.)normal health (1). They don't think of a third possibility, that is 3.)positive health or evolution or higher positive healths like Kundalini.

I've read some Western Ideas referring to them as 'Syndromes(:ill:)'. :Roll:

NayaSurya

23 June 2010, 11:30 AM

Without the desire to have sex. Perhaps I should have clarified. Those who do not eat, lose the desire to have food. Those who avoid sex in all forms will lose this desire. I can only comment on these two things. As I have been using them my whole life to clear my body and brain for better things.

devotee

23 June 2010, 11:49 AM

It's all or nothing. You have to avoid triggering that in any way.

You are right, NS ! I also can testify it with my experience. The desire dies out. However, if you even try to be a little "playful", it can spoil everything.

It is all or nothing. Yes, it is true. Thanks. :)

OM

NayaSurya

23 June 2010, 11:56 AM

lol it is.

The other night I was five days into my fast, feeling wonderful. I was passed the place where the body begs...and even preparing meals no longer bothered me.

Then it happened...Father's day.

My husband, wanted a delicious meal at the Chinese place in our small town. It's ran by wonderful Chinese family and has such fresh produce that as I walked past the four lines of buffet...I cracked.

I had a small plate of those chinese long beans with rice.:o

upsydownyupsy mv ss

23 June 2010, 12:01 PM

:confused::doh:I'm still not clarified. Perhaps, devotee, NayaSurya and sambya would like to go thru my previous post in this thread again and then answer me too? :o

devotee

23 June 2010, 07:44 PM

:confused::doh:I'm still not clarified. Perhaps, devotee, NayaSurya and sambya would like to go thru my previous post in this thread again and then answer me too? :o

Dear SS,

Your question is not clear. What do you want to know ? I or no one can comment on your experience.

However, your doubts over this :

No desire (not even for libration) :

This actually is an example of stretching any idea to limit and getting stuck there. First of all, you sacrifice all desires for the only desire for liberation and see what happens ! Why bother about it now ? What would happen when I reach the peak of the mountain .... reach there first and see for yourself. If you keep only contemplating like this, you won't reach anywhere.

OM

amith vikram

24 June 2010, 05:52 AM

thank you for your responses.

upsydownyupsy mv ss

24 June 2010, 05:57 AM

@ devotee: Right.....

Onkara

24 June 2010, 07:46 AM

:confused: Without any desire? Not even the desire to reach god or desire that everything must be happy? Not even the desire to reach 'Nirbana'(leaving the arrow called {subtlest of} body)? Maybe its true.
Not having desires- This is a Tedious statement. It is to be noted that this world has been born out of the desire of Prakriti half of Consciousness.
Desire is the cause of action(kriya, such as dharma or artha) which leads to Karma.

I'm utterly confused now. :doh::headscratch:

Hi SS
You are right, desire is natural, it is a guna and so part of Prakriti. My personal impression is that desire itself does not stop, it will continue regardless of my mortal existance, it continues around you and me, but also has the ability to make us act. When we take ourselves to be the body/mind we attract desire, in other words we take ourselves to that which has desires and so we act upon them, saying “I desire to do”.

Desire shows itself as thought at the conscious level. We desire wealth and comfort and so we look into how we (the body being) can get wealth, this takes us into action. We go to the shop to buy a suit. And so the conception that we are the doer is enforced. We remember and witnessed our selves in action, propelled by desire.

It is no coincidence that the strongest desires related to our bodies survival and reproduction of genes, for that is what prakriti wills for continuation.

The point, in my personal experience is not to try rid myself of desire, as trying itself enforces the sense of being a doer, compelled by desire. Rather I become that which witnesses. That which witnesses is my truth Self or Atman. It does not mean that I become immune to desire, for I am still prakriti whilst I know myself as man, but this is no longer so at the state of ultimate realisation as Atman. We shift from the bird which acts to the bird which looks on:

Like two birds of golden plumage, inseparable companions, the individual self and the immortal Self are perched on the branches of the selfsame tree. The former tastes of the sweet and bitter fruits of the tree; the latter, tasting of neither, calmly observes. Mun Upanishad 3.1 (http://www.atmajyoti.org/up_mundaka_upanishad_text.asp)

upsydownyupsy mv ss

24 June 2010, 08:07 AM

@ snip: AMEN!

devotee

24 June 2010, 07:57 PM

How many Yama - Niyama ?

It may create confusion in a few minds. I have mentioned in this thread that there are Five Yamas and Five Niyamas. However, Eastern Mind ji in his series of threads have already reached the 9th Yama. Where these more and more Yamas coming from ? How can Devotee have a different set of Yamas from Eastern Mind ?

Actually, Patanjali talks of only five Yamas and five Niyamas which are listed in this thread. But Vedanta talks of 10 Yamas and 10 Niyamas. Shandilya Upanishad tells us about these ten Yamas and 10 Niyamas.

Maharishi Atharvan tells us :

1. Under Yama (forbearance) are ten: Ahimsa, Satya, Asteya, Brahmacharya, Daya, Arjava,Kshama, Dhriti, Mitahara and Saucha.

i) Of these, Ahimsa is the not causing of any pain to any living being at any time through the actions of one’s mind, speech, or body.
ii) Satya is the speaking of the truth that conduces to the well-being of creatures, through the actions of one’s mind, speech, or body.
iii) Asteya is not coveting of another’s property through the actions of one’s mind, speech, or body.
iv) Brahmacharya is the refraining from sexual inter-course in all places and in all states in mind, speech or body.
v) Daya is kindliness towards all creatures in all places.
vi) Arjava is the preserving of equanimity of mind, speech, or body in the performance or non-performance of the actions ordained or forbidden to be done.
Vii) Kshama is the bearing patiently of all pleasant or unpleasant things, such as praise or blow.
viii) Dhriti is the preserving of firmness of mind during the period of gain or loss of wealth or relatives.
ix)Mitahara is the taking of "snigdha" (which is not rough, milk products and made in milk) and "madhur" (which is appetising, sweet) food, leaving one-fourth of the stomach empty.
x) Saucha is of two kinds, external and internal. Of these, the external is the cleansing of the body by earth and water; the internal is the cleansing of the mind. This (the latter) is to be obtained by means of the Adhyatma-Vidya (Science of Self).

2. Under Niyama (religious observances), are ten, viz., Tapas, Santosha Astikya, Dana, Ishvarapujana, Siddhanta-Sravana, Hrih, Mati, Japa and Vrata.

i) Of these Tapas, is the emancipation of the body through the observances of such penances as Krichchhra, Chandrayana, etc., according to rules.
ii) Santosha is being satisfied with whatever comes to us of its own accord.
iii) Astikya is the belief in the merits or demerits of actions as stated in the Vedas.
iv) Dana is the giving with faith to deserving persons, money, grains, etc., earned lawfully.
v) Ishvarapujana is the worshipping of Vishnu, Rudra, etc., with pure mind according to one’s power.
vi) Siddhanta-Sravana is the inquiry into the significance of Vedanta.
vii) Hrih is the shame felt in the performance of things contrary to the rules of the Vedas and of Society.
viii) Mati is the faith in the paths laid down by the Vedas.
ix) Japa is the practising of the Mantras into which one is duly initiated by his spiritual instructor and which is not against (the rules of) the Vedas. It is of two kinds – the spoken and the mental. The mental is associated with contemplation by the mind. The spoken is of two kinds – the loud and the low. The loud pronunciation gives the reward as stated (in the Vedas): (while) the low one (gives) a reward thousand times (that). The mental (gives) a reward a Crore (of times that).
x) Vrata is the regular observance of or the refraining from the actions enjoined or prohibited by the Vedas.

OM

Eastern Mind

24 June 2010, 08:33 PM

Vannakkam Devotee:

I knew this would come up eventually. The only reason I went for the ten was i thought it would increase the chances of more discussion. But I didn't even know why there was a difference or where they came from. So thanks for the information. Learn somethin' new every day.

Aum namasivaya

upsydownyupsy mv ss

28 June 2010, 06:19 AM

devotee

28 June 2010, 11:15 AM

I'm still not clarified, but a 'Yes' or 'No' or 'other' question will solve this confusion. We know that there is Karmateeta Karma, those deeds done by god. Similarly, is there any desire-less desire of such kind? I know this sounds confusing, but I hope I'm accurate.

Relax SS, this question is not necessary to answer. You can express yourself using simpler terms. One of my friends tried to explain Brahman :

It is not existence. It is not even non-existence. Is it neither ? Nope ! It is neither the neither of neither !! :)

OM

upsydownyupsy mv ss

28 June 2010, 11:48 AM

devotee, got it in the sense I didn't get it, yet I got it, but I don't understand how. Remarkable! You seem to amaze me every time. You've reminded me what I spoke in some other thread. You are simply remarkable! A beautiful answer!

devotee

03 July 2010, 08:52 AM

The Third Step towards Raaj Yoga – Aasanam

“Aasan” – literally means sitting posture. This appears quite surprising to see that Patanjali stresses importance of this by giving it a status of a separate step which looks so easy. Is it really so important ? In fact, Patanjali lists it after Yama & Niyama … so some schools of Yoga say that unless you master Yama & Niyama you can’t have command on a correct sitting posture. Let’s see what Patanjali & others say on this :

Patanjali gives two sutras for Aasanam :

Sthirsukham Aasanam :

Very crisp prescription ! It says, “The sitting posture should be “sthir” i.e. motionless and “sukham” i.e. painless”. “sukham” gives us a little jolt ! But what about the complicated painful yoga postures like standing on head etc. ? Patanjali doesn’t recommend those postures for “yoga”. Those postures may be beneficial as physical exercises for the body but certainly not recommended for Yoga. Patanjali clearly insists on Aasans which are painless and motionless.

Prayatnashaithilyaanantsamaapattibhyaam :

Posture becomes firm and relaxed through control of natural tendencies of the body and through meditation on the infinite.

What are the natural tendencies of the body ? Here the term body includes mind too, in fact more of mind than body. The body has some natural tendencies for movement …. Mind has natural tendency to wander about & be restless over this or that thought. These tendencies must be curbed with careful training. The Yoga Guru tells us how to master these tendencies.

Patanjali further says that it can be achieved through meditation on the infinite ! The meditation has yet to start & Patanjali prescribe that correct posture will come through meditation on the Infinite ! What does it mean ? That simply means that instead of waiting for getting complete mastery over our sitting posture we should start the other steps which will in turn slowly bring mastery over the former steps. This is very important to understand. You cannot wait till you master Yama & Niyama to start mastering sitting posture or meditation. The Yoga must be taken as a complete course & slowly it would have positive effect on all steps including the preliminary ones.

But how to sit and where ?

Patanjali is silent on this. He has nothing more to say than those two verses I mentioned above. This leaves us with a number of questions. What aasan, how and where ? Let’s see what Lord Krishna advises on sitting posture :

Yogi yunjeet satatamaatmaanam rahasi sthitah |
Ekaaki yatchittaatmaa niraasheerparigrahah || BG 6.10
Shuchau deshe pratishthaaya sthiramaasanamaamanah |
Naatyuchhtritam naatineecham chailaajinkushottaram || BG 6.11
Tataikagram manah kritva yatchittendriyakriyah |
Upvishyaasane yunjyaadyogmaatmavishudddhye || BG 6.12
Samam kaayashirogrivam dhaaryannachalam sthirah |
Samprekshya naasikaagram svam dishaashchaanvalokayan || BG 6.13
Prashaantaatmaa vigatbhihbrahmachaarivratesthitah |
Manah sanyamya machchitto yukta aaseet matparah || BG 6.14

Yogi should having control on his mind and sense organs, without having any (worldly) expectations and not desiring to accumulate worldly things for body comfort, should stay in a secluded place and practise continuous flow of thoughts towards the Self.

In a clean (& sacred) place which is neither very high nor very low & where kushaa ( a mat of special grass), deerskin & clothes are spread one over the other, the yogi should sit in a motionless state & keeping control over his mind-waves and sense organs activities , should practise yoga for purifying his self (heart/antahkaran).

He should keep his bust, head and neck in a line and staying motionless, keeping his eyes fixed on the tip of his nose & not seeing sideways, staying in Brahmacharya vratam with a peaceful mind, stopping wandering nature of his mind should constantly meditate on Me.

In the above verses, use of deerskin, kushaa can discourage us. First thing we may not get it easily and second having a deerskin today is unlawful. So, what shall we do ? The Yoga Gurus say that this requirement is to insulate us from earthly currents. So, any comfortable aasan which can insulate us from such earthly currents is ok. So, we can use a blanket for our aasan purpose.

Here we are told some key points for the aasanam.

1. We should keep our chest, head and neck in a vertical line. This is important and is greatly emphasized in Raaj Yoga. The reason is that the spinal chord carrying the Naadis (nerve currents) must be in a vertical line. There are three types of nerves currents going through our spinal chord. These are : Idaa on the left, Pingalaa on the right and the Sushummanaa in the middle. In non-spiritual persons Sushummana remains closed. The spiritual energy lying dormant in Kundalini can travel through Sushummana on spiritual advancement of the yogi and for that it is very important to keep the spine straight during Yoga.

2. The eyes should be fixed on the tip of the nose. Now this position of eyes can vary from one type of posture to different depending on what your Guru recommends. Some schools say that the eyes should be closed. Some say that closed eyes would take you towards sleep & hallucinations, so eyes should not be closed. Some say that the eyes should be half-closed. Some say that whether the eyes are closed or open … the gaze must necessarily fixed towards the point between the eyebrows. In some Buddhists meditation I also found a practice of eyes keeping fully open & fixed at a distance of a few feet. The important point to remember is that the position of the gaze should be such that we should not go to sleep or should not go to our sub-conscious mind having hallucinations. This aspect is also very important in Yoga & must be learned carefully from one’s Guru.

3. What about place ? The verses say that the place should be secluded. We must be insulated from all worldly noises and disturbances and for that a secluded place is required. So, shall we go the caves ? It is not necessary. A secluded place can be also found in our own home by shutting the door and closing all sounds. The place should not be dirty & preferably sacred. This has to do the spiritual vibrations in the place. That is why it beneficial to meditate in sacred places & sacred temples which are abound in good spiritual vibrations.

4. The Sandliya Upanishad talks of 8 different Aasanas which are recommended for Yoga : Svastika, Gomukha, Padma, Vira, Simha, Bhadra, Mukta and Mayura.

Let us note here that a good posture is a matter of consistent effort both physically and mentally & is a very important requirement in Yoga. The reason is that one must be slowly ready to sit for long hours in meditation motionless in erect position comfortably & that is not easy.

OM

devotee

04 July 2010, 06:02 AM

Continued from last post ...

Svetaasvatara Upanishad on Sitting Posture and Suitable places for Meditation

Svetaasvatara Upanishad gives two shlokas to guide us on sitting posture and choice of place to meditate :

Trirunnatam sthaapya samam shareeram
Hrideendriyaani manasaa sanniveshya |
Brahmodupena pratareta vidwaan
Srotaansi sarvaaNi bhayaavahaani || S.U. 2.8||

Yogi should have three parts of the body i.e. Chest, Neck and Head held high and in a straight line. With the help of mind, he should focus all his senses in his heart & then use Brahman as his raft to cross the frightful currents of the river of life.

Samau shuchau sharkaraavahnivaalukaa
Vivarjite shabdajalaashrayaadibhih |
Manonukoole na tu chakshupeedane
guhaanivaataashrayaNe prayojayet || S.U.2.10||

The place should be even, holy, without pebbles, fire, and sand without noise, such as coming from a crowd and not close to lakes and other sources of water. It should be pleasing to mind and not repulsive to sight. It should be a place such as a cave where there are no strong winds. Practise Yoga in such a place.

So what is the advice of Rishi Svetaasvatar ? Chest out, neck and head high �. all these kept in a straight line (vertical). Now in choice of place there arises some confusion : What is the harm in meditating near fire, source of water or where there are strong winds ? In meditative posture on attaining certain degree of concentration, the yogi loses awareness of the world around himself. If anything goes wrong, his life may be in trouble & by the time he knows it, it may be too late. So, these things are prescribed keeping that in view. The fire nearby can spread by some accident & can be hazardous � so any fire nearby should be avoided. The water-body nearby can attract carnivorous animals or harmful insects when practicing in a forest (which was usually chosen by the Yogis in ancient times) � so such places should be avoided. Strong winds can disturb the calmness of mind � so the place should be free from strong winds.

What to do if I cannot sit in sitting posture for long on ground ?

Sitting on ground in Lotus posture, half lotus posture, Sukhaasan etc. is easy for those who practise these aasnaas (sitting postures) since their childhood when their body is flexible. However, when the practitioner starts at an advanced age, the limbs become stiff and it is difficult to sit in such postures for long on ground. Yoga Gurus advise such practitioners to sit on an armless chair. The chair should be well covered by a blanket which should go below the feet as the feet too should be insulated from earth currents. However, there is a caution in using a chair for practicing yoga. As I said earlier, Yoga Gurus advise that after gaining some control on mind-waves, the yogi attains some level of concentration & can forget where he is sitting. There are chances that he falls down from the chair & injures himself if the chair is too high. So, one should always practise towards making himself fit for sitting postures on ground.

OM

yajvan

04 July 2010, 11:34 AM

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~~

namasté devotee (et.al)

Patanjali further says that it can be achieved through meditation on the infinite ! The meditation has yet to start & Patanjali prescribe that correct posture will come through meditation on the Infinite ! What does it mean ? That simply means that instead of waiting for getting complete mastery over our sitting posture we should start the other steps which will in turn slowly bring mastery over the former steps. This is very important to understand. You cannot wait till you master Yama & Niyama to start mastering sitting posture or meditation. The Yoga must be taken as a complete course & slowly it would have positive effect on all steps including the preliminary ones.
These are very insightful words of instruction... Through one's meditation proper posture will prevail AND so will yama and niyama come to be.

My teacher has said many times that yama and niyama when fully bloomed is the fruit of one's meditation and sādhana. So it is a complementary practice , yes? We do the best we can with yama and niyama, yet it is the meditative approach that is doing the 'heavy lifting'.

praṇām

yajvan

04 July 2010, 03:44 PM

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~~

namasté devotee (et.al)

“Aasan” – literally means sitting posture. This appears quite surprising to see that Patanjali stresses importance of this by giving it a status of a separate step which looks so easy.
Patanjali gives two sutras for Aasanam :

Sthirsukham Aasanam :
Very crisp prescription ! It says, “The sitting posture should be “sthir” i.e. motionless and “sukham” i.e. painless”. “sukham” gives us a little jolt ! But what about the complicated painful yoga postures like standing on head etc. ? Patanjali doesn’t recommend those postures for “yoga”. Those postures may be beneficial as physical exercises for the body but certainly not recommended for Yoga. Patanjali clearly insists on Aasans which are painless and motionless.

Prayatnashaithilyaanantsamaapattibhyaam :

Posture becomes firm and relaxed through control of natural tendencies of the body and through meditation on the infinite.
I thought to offer this as I am reminded of the 16th śloka ( 3rd chapter) in the śiva-sūtra-s. I offer it to give another dimension to the knowledge; this is not a correction of any postings, just a greater appreciation of the wisdom that can be extented on this subject.

The 16th śloka says the following:

āsanasthaḥ sukaṁ hrade nimajjati ||

āsana+ sthaḥ - we know this āsana as sitting, a posture. This is what we see on the physical level with our eyes. Yet the feminine gender of this word āsana also means staying, abiding.
this sthaḥ means occupied with , engaged in , devoted to performing , practising
So āsana+ sthaḥ = practicing and occupied with staying and abiding.
sukaṁ is ease , easiness , comfort . The notion with just these first two words:
(āsana+ sthaḥ) the practice of staying and abiding easily , (sukaṁ) without effort.

hrade or hrada is a large or deep body of water , lake , pool
nimajjati is ni + majj+ati ; ni = into + majj = dive , plunge + ati = passing , going , beyond

The next two words gives us:
(nimajjati) to plunge or dive into (hrade) a pool or ocean . But of what ? Sukaṁ or delight is implied as I see it.

Hence with these 4 words we have the aspirant that is easily setting steadlity winthin his own Being and he/she dives within his/her own delight of awareness.

Svāmī lakṣman-jū translates this sūtra in the following way,
seated in that real posture , he effortlessly dives in the ocean of nectar.

praṇām

devotee

16 October 2011, 05:05 AM

Namaste,

This thread was left due to some my very busy schedule at that time. We can't start from the point where we left it.

The PrANAyAm - 01 :

In this thread, till now, we have discussed, Yama, Niyama and Asana i.e. the first three steps towards Raj-yoga. Now we shall discuss the PrANAyAm, the fourth step :

Meaning of PrANAyAm : PrANA means breath (actually it means vital force & breath is its gross form). Therefore, the methodology of controlling one’s breath is called PrANAyAm. PrANa also means Life-force AyAm means extension/expansion/increase ... so PrANAyAm also means breathing exercises which increase the life-force of the practitioner.

There are various types of PrANyAms. Before we take a step towards understanding PrANAyAm, we would like to know “why to control one’s breath at all” ?

Let’s look at the problem that we suffer from : The supreme Self within us is hidden by the vibration of mind. The intensity of this vibration/restlessness is a measure of how much we are away from God/Self-realisation. The mind is never free from thoughts. There are times when we consciously engage in thoughts, like when we are thinking to solve certain problem etc. ... however, most of the times the thoughts arising in our minds has no constructive value .... it is unguided “automatically” generated thoughts ... because of our samskaars (the impressions of our karmas). This is drifting in current of aimless thoughts. This is what we have to get rid of. Normally an average person on an average goes through approximately 38 thoughts per minute i.e. 1 thought in less than every 2 seconds !!

For self-examination, anyone can watch is thought for 4-5 minutes and see how much the thoughts are in his/her control. It is very difficult to control these thoughts. The Yoga is the art of controlling one’s thoughts. Let’s remember Patanjali’s 2nd Sutra : “Yogaschittavritti nirodhah” ==> Yoga is controlling of mind-waves. The mind-waves are the disturbance that keep us under delusion and we are unable to see the reality. This becomes our habit to constantly think something ... we feel bored when there is no stimulation to the mind-waves. More the uncontrolled mind-waves, more is our misery as more we are away from our True Nature which is blissful & peaceful.

To control these mind-waves alone, Patanjali first prescribes Yama & Niyama. The observance of these Yama and Niyama help us in avoiding unnecessary worldly stimulation to our restlessness. After that we reach a state where the thoughts are controlled through controlled breathing. Yama & Niyama help us to unload the unnecessary baggage we keep carrying for the long journey towards Self-realisation. So, where we have mastered the Yama-Niyama or not let’s see if we are carrying any unnecessary baggage which can be unloaded. Let’s examine through this check-list :

a) Have we forgiven each and every being for whatever wrong they did to us ? If no, let’s forgive him or her honestly without keeping any thought of enmity towards that being. If it is you yourself who is the culprit in your eyes, please forgive yourself.

Note : Forgiving people who have wronged us in the past is the best choice. Why ? The person who has done wrong is already marked by Nature for deserved punishment ... however, your anger towards will accrue unnecessary bad karma for you. So, it is only you who is going to be harmed by that anger. So, let’s drop it here once for all. We can do better without this baggage.

b) Are we afraid of anything ? Let’s leave our fear here in the feet of God/Guru. We needn’t carry it ourself ... let God/Guru handle it. Surrender yourself to the will of God/Guru. Take a jump ... let it happen whatever has to happen. Fear is one of the most difficult baggage to drop.

c) Does any desire of any worldly thing is disturbing us ? This thought of desire is our greatest enemy. Let’s surrender to the will of God/Guru. This baggage is too heavy to carry. We must drop it here itself in the feet of God and Guru before going ahead.

d) Is there any past incidence which we like to bring into memory again and again to keep relishing that happy moment again and again ? This is one of the strongest bondage. Let’s drop it like hot coal on our hand ! Similarly, we must get rid of all thoughts related with anything bad that happened in the past and ... we are bringing that painful moment again and again to memory. Let's stop carrying our wounds.

I think if we take care of the above we can be very well free from unnecessary baggage we were carrying due to our habit ... and be ready to tread ahead on the path of Self-realisation.

OM

devotee

16 October 2011, 05:09 AM

Namaste,

Continuing the PraNAyAm from the earlier post :

The PrANAyAm-02 :

Our thoughts are linked with our breath. Howsoever we are disturbed with automatically arising thoughts ... these thoughts can be easily brought under control by stopping breath/regulating the breath. However, this art must be learnt through some Yoga-teacher and we must be very very patient while trying to have control over breath ... as being impatient can kill the practitioner.

All PrAnAyAm involve three steps in breathing :
a) Poorak : This involves inhaling the breath. It can be slow or fast and shallow or deep. It depends upon the type of PrANyAma.
b) Kumbhak : This is holding the breath inside the lungs. The duration of this part depends on type of PrANyAm being performed.
c) Rechak : This is breathing out the air. This can be slow or fast ... it depends upon type of PrANyAma being performed.

There are various types of PrANAyAms. The most common ones are :

a) Bhastrika
b) KapAl BhAti
c) Anulom Vilom
d) NAdi-sodhan
e) SheetalI
f) UjjAyI
g) BhrAmarI

These PrANAyAms help us free from many diseases if done regularly under the guidance of a good teacher. The PrANAyAm also makes us ready for Self-realisation by helping in controlling our thought-waves.

The interested forum members can visit this link for details on these PrANAyAms :

http://knowyoga.org/tiki-index.php?page=Pranayama

OM

devotee

16 October 2011, 08:45 PM

Namaste,

Bhagwad Gita on PrANAyAm :

Bhagwan Sri Krishna tells in Bhagwad Gita that one should perform Yajna (Yagyan) and one should enjoy (eat, drink or whatever) Only what is available after performing Yajna. Anyone who eats without performing Yajna eats only the sin and for him there is no peace even on this earth (in this life) and it is also not in the heavens (after death). (Ref : BG 3.13 and 4.31)

Bhagwan Krishna further tells us : Yajnas are of various types prescribed in the Vedas. Some of the types are stated in BG :

a) Material related : Offering for the devas, helping the poor and downtrodden etc.
b) Tapa or austerity : Worshiping in any form, gaining control over the sense organs & controlling the desires, Keeping away from words (speaking, listening), Ahimsa, Yoga, etc.
c) PrANAyAm : PrANAyAm has been listed as one of the Yajnas by Bhagwan Krishna in verses 4.29-30 :

ApAne juhwati PrANam PrANeapANam tathApare |
PrANApAngati ruddhwa PrANAyAmparAyNah || (BG 4.29)

Apare niyatAhArAh PrANAnprANeshu juhwati |
Sarvepyete yajnavido yajnakshapitkalmashAh || (BG 4.30)

==> Some sacrifice the exhaled breath into inhaled breath, some inhaled into the exhaled and some stop the motion of both the inhaled and the exhaled breaths & perform PrANAyAm. Others who take regulated food sacrifice the inhaled breath into inhaled breath (or life-force into life force) ... these practitioners are the knowers of all the Yajna and the destroyers of sins by performing Yajna.

Thus PrANAyAm has been recognised not just a limb of Yoga but has been considered a complete exercise which can rid the Yogis from sins. Yoga ChudamaNi Upanishad says :

The JeevAtma (the soul of the individual) is under the control of prAnA which goes up and down as well as apAna. ApAna pulls PrANa. PrANa pulls ApAna. He who knows and realizes this mutual pull which is pulling to the top and bottom, understands yoga.

OM

Drifter

17 October 2011, 03:53 PM

Antahkarana:
seeking guidance?

Drifter

17 October 2011, 03:55 PM

antahkarana;
seeking any information or links?

kind regards
d.

devotee

17 October 2011, 11:12 PM

Antahkarana:
seeking guidance?

The inner-self or the heart (not physical one) is called AntahkaraNa.

OM

devotee

19 October 2011, 09:36 AM

Namaste,

Just a little about Kundalini and Bandhas :

Though Raaj Yoga / Kriya Yoga which we are focussing on here, don�t emphasise on awakening of Kunadlini but the talk on PrANAyAm will remain incomplete without talking a little about Kundalini. It is stated that Kunadlini is the intense power which resides in MoolAdhAr chakra (near anus) along the spine. Its structure is like the stem of a lotus plant which also resembles a snake. It sleeps keeping its tail inside its mouth closing the Brahmarandhra�s mouth in an average person.

The awakening of Kundalini i.e. Kundalini getting straightened & rising along the spine through ShushumNa naDi can happen by various means. And one of the ways indicated is through PrANAyAm & Bandhas. The regular practice of correct posture and PrANAyAm opens the ShushumNa naDi. The regular performance of PrANAyAm harbouring always Sattvic-thoughts makes the Consciousness focussed in ShushumNa & thus makes the PrANa run in ShushumNa. When with regular practice, impurities are burnt by PraNa running in ShushumNa then aPAna is made to rise vertically up along the spine. Here the apAna interacts with Agni (fire) & travels upwards where it meets the PrANa in the PraNa-point & meet the sleeping Kundalini. On getting the heat from PrAna mixed with aPana, Kundalini gets heated and gets straightened and rises into the mouth of ShushumNa and travels through the spine towards the various chakras.

There are three Bandhas which the Yogis perform who are interested in awakening of the Kundalini. They are Moolbandha, UddiyAn bandha and Jaalandhar bandha.

One should not try to practise awakening of Kundalini without a proper Guru. It can be dangerous to do so. It is also important to know that for Kriya Yoga/Raaj Yoga nothing special is required to be done for the awakening of Kundalini.

OM

devotee

23 October 2011, 07:59 AM

Namaste friends,

We have discussed the four limbs or steps of Yoga in the preceding posts. Now here we shall discuss PratyAhAr.

PratyAhAr, the Fifth Step to Yoga :

The next step in Yoga is PratyAhAr. What does PratyAhAr mean ? :

Maharshi Patjanli says :

2.54 “Svavishayasamprayoge chittswaroopAnukAr evendriyANAm PratyAhArah”

==> When the (mental) organs of senses and actions (indriyas) cease to be engaged with their corresponding objects in their mental realm, and become one with consciousness (mind) from which they arose, this is called pratyahara.

2.55 “Tatah parmA vashyatendriyANAm”

==> Through that turning inward of the organs of senses and actions (indriyas) also comes a supreme ability, controllability, or mastery over those senses inclining to go outward towards their objects.

Let’s understand one of the most difficult part of the Yoga-SAdhnA that is PratyAhAr. Patanjali lays unambiguous emphasis on not allowing the sense organs coming into the contact of objects of those senses. This contact is not of the physical organs. Every sense organ has its centre in mind-field i.e. there are mental sense organs which have to be kept separated from their sense objects. Which further means that no thought of the contact of objects of sense organs with the sense organs has to be permitted. By constantly depriving their union with each other, slowly the mental sense organs merge into and become one with the consciousness from which they arise. It is like when all source of disturbance of water surface is withdrawn, the waves arising on the surface of the water go back into water and become one with that.

Maharshi Patanjali further says that the PratyAhAr leads to achieving ultimate control over the sense organs.

Bhagwad Gita :

What does Lord Krishna says in Bhagwad Gita on PratyAhAr ? :

Completely renouncing all desires arising from worldly thoughts (sankalpa ) and completely restraining all senses from all sides by the mind he (Yogi) should through gradual practice attain tranquillity and fixing the mind on the Self through reason controlled by steadfastness he should not think of anything else. (BG 6.24-25)

Drawing back the fidgety and restless mind from all those objects after which it runs he should repeatedly fix it on the Self. (BG 6.26)

For to the Yogi whose mind is perfectly serene, who is sinless, whose passion is subdued and who is identified with Brahman supreme happiness comes to him as a matter of course. (BG 6.27)

Now everyone of us knows that our senses are the most difficult things to be brought under control. How can we do it ? Maharishi Patanjali advises that the mental sense organs and the objects of senses should not be allowed to come into contact with each other ... but the bigger question is the “Is it going to be easy for a common practitioner like us who are suffering from deep past samskAars (impressions) of the contacts of these organs with their objects ?”. It is not. That is what Arjuna says :

"O Krishna, the mind is very unsteady, turbulent, tenacious and powerful & therefore I consider it as difficult to control as controlling the wind". (BG 6.34)

Now Lord Krishna answers to this query which is the most important thing to remember for practising PratyAhAr :

“The mind is restless no doubt and difficult to control but it can be brought under control by repeated practice and by the exercise of dispassion, O’ son of Kunti.” (BG 6.35)

... and he also says this without mincing words :

“Yoga is difficult to be achieved by one whose mind is not under control but it is easy for one who has brought it under control by incessant practice”. (BG 6.36)

This above verse underlines the importance of PratyAhAr for Yoga.

A clear understanding of the importance of PratyAhAr can help us in :

a) saving us from any delusion that there is any yogic path without controlling the sense organs. Therefore, we should avoid Gurus who either advocate indulging into sexual acts or themselves indulge into such acts. In all probability, such a self-proclaimed Guru is fake.
b) Understanding it clearly that keeping all thoughts of sense-objects away and incessant practice is the only way to PratyAhAr.

The real spiritual journey towards Self-realisation starts with PratyAhAr. It can also be achieved by pure devotion and love to God ... when love for God occupies all space in the heart, there is no space left for the desires to indulge into sensual gratification.

OM

devotee

07 November 2011, 04:26 AM

Namaste,

PratyAhAr is a very important step in Yoga. PratyAhAr leads us to peaceful state of mind undisturbed by the waves of desires. JabAldarshna Upanishad, Yoga Yajnavalkya and Gherunda Samhita talk about PratyAhAr.

PratyAhAr and PrANAyAm are related closely to each other. The practice of PrANAyAm leads to PratyAhAr. PratyAhAr has also been described in some scriptures as control of PraNa.

Yajnyavalkya says in Yoga-Yajnavalkya :

===> Having drawn the prana from one point to another, holding in the 18 marmasthanas is spoken of as pratyahara. The Ashwini Kumaras who are the best among physicians of the devas have spoken thus of the vital points in the body, for the attainment of liberation through yoga.� (Yoga-yajnavalkya, VII. 2-7)

Yajnavalkya explains these MarmasthAns (vital points in the body) to Gargi :

The big toes, the ankles, and in the mid-shanks, the root of the calves, the knees, middle of the thighs, the root of the anus, then the center of the body (Dehamadya), the generative organ, the navel, the heart (hrdaya) and neck pit, Gargi. Then, the root of the palate, the root of the nose, circular orb of the eyes, the point between the eyebrows, the forehead, and the crown of the head, best among sages (Gargi), these are the vital points.

Retain the prana, by the mind, in these vital points. For one who does pratyahara, drawing the prana from one point to another, all diseases are destroyed. For him yoga attains fruition.� (Yoga-yajnavalkya, VII. 20-21)

In Gherunda Samhita, Gherunda talks about PratyAhAr :

==> Gherunda said: Now I shall tell you about the great pratyahara. By such knowledge will all passions like lust, etc. be destroyed. (4.1)
Whenever the chitta (thinking principle) wanders away, attracted by various objects of sight, bring it back under the control of the Self. (4.2)
When faced with praise or censure, good or bad speech, withdraw your mind from these and place it under the control of the Self. (4.3)
From sweet smells or bad smells or from whatever odour, withdraw your mind and place under the control of the Self. (4.4)
From honey-sweet or sour tastes, from bitter or any other by which the mind may be attracted, withdraw it and place it under control of the Self. (4.5)

Jabaldarshanopanishad talks about PratyAhAr :

Now I shall explain PratyAhAr. The forcibly bringing back the sense organs from their natural fields of attachments (Vishayas, subjects) into which these keep dwelling is called PratyAhAr. �Whatever is perceived by man is Brahman alone� ... having this understanding focussing one�s mind to Brahman alone is PratyAhAr. Upto one�s time of death whatever good or bad karmas one performs ... offering all those karmas to God is also called PratyAhAr. Doing everything for the sake of God alone is also called PratyAhAr.

One should take the Vayu from the root of the teeth to the throat, from throat to heart, from heart to navel, from navel to Kundalini and take from Kundalini and establish it to MooladhAr. From MoolAdhAr one should take it to both the hips and from hips to middle of the thighs. From the middle of the thighs to knees and from knees to calf muscles and from calf muscles to big toe and keep it there. This is called PratyAhAr by the Saints who have been engaged in PratyAhAr from the ancient times.

Further this Upanjishad says that those who perform PratyAhAr regularly become free from all sins and diseases & there is nothing which is difficult to achieve for them in this world.

OM

devotee

26 February 2012, 12:24 AM

Namaste,

This PratyAhAr is a subject which needs some more insights. So, let's pay it its due :

Should We Forcibly Do PratyAhAr or ... ?

a) What are the organs ? Are they the outer organs or are they in our mind ?

All our organs derive their power and instructions from mind. Without an active participation of mind with an organ, the organs is just a lump of bones and flesh. When one gets paralysis, even if his hand is otherwise OK, he is unable to do anything with the paralysed hand. So, in such a case, the hand doesn't remain a hand at all. An organ devoid of its capability to function, is no organ at all.

On the other hand, even if one loses the physical part of the organ, he can enjoy/suffer the actions of the non-existent organ through his mind, if there are recorded impressions of the past actions of that organ. If one loses his eyes later in his life ... he can still dream, imagine any scene he likes and enjoy the scene without having eyes.

So, what is exactly the location of the organs ? Mind is the place where these organs really reside ... in other words, the organs are non-different from mind. Therefore, if the mind is controlled all the organs can be controlled.

b) Now the question arises : shall we try to bring our mind into discipline by force or there is an easy way out ?

The organs/mind can be brought into control by force or by switching off the mental power flowing to those organs. Technically speaking, both the options are available to us and both are PratyAhAr. You can choose either way.

Switching off the power going to organs and stop them from creating noise within is an art of Yoga. It has be learnt from an accomplished Guru. One of the way that I know is KriyA. By practising Kriya, the power can be diverted and contained within the spine which produces highly blissful experience to the practitioner. This blissful experience is so magnetic that no power flows to the organs and they are brought into control almost effortlessly. The Yogis have described it in this way :

A person living in a room where high-volume music is being played and a big-screen TV is on can forcibly keep a leash on his/her mind and try to meditate in that environment. It is possible but the effort required here will be too much and sometimes, the practitioner might not succeed. However, it would make the task much easier if the power being given to Music System and the TV is switched off ! The wise person would choose the second option. And that what the KriyA Yogis do.

c) PratyAhAr can also be attained through blessings of Guru/God.

OM

devotee

29 February 2012, 01:09 AM

Namaste,

DhAraNA, DhyAn and SamAdhi

These three stages are the most important stages in Yoga. In fact, in words of Shankara, �Yoga can be effected even without going through the earlier five limbs of yoga�by the mere accomplishment of the triad of dhAraNa, dhyAna, and samAdhi. But without that triad yoga is not possible for anyone, because yoga is essentially associated with the operation of dharana and the other two, for the nature of yoga is perfection of the chitta. Mastery of asana or other instructions of yoga are not, in the case of distracted [i.e., restless or mentally uncontrolled] people, productive of [the state of] yoga. But getting rid of the [mental] defects and samadhi�these two will certainly produce it [yoga], and nothing else will".

The importance of these three stages can be judged from the fact that Maharishi Patanjali didn't club these limbs with the other five. These three have been kept in Vibhuti Pada of the Patanjali Yogasutra. So, let's clarify our all doubts on these three limbs of yoga.

DhAraNA :

What is DhAraNA ? Maharishi Patanjali offers :

"deśa bandhaḥ cittasya dhāraṇā " ===> Binding of mind into a restricted location is DhAraNA.

DhAraNA means holding � what ? Mind � into a restricted location of object of meditation. Normally, the mind keeps moving very fast from one object to another even when tried to fix it on one object. Mind moves because of its attachment to bodily discomfort, attachment to senses and past impressions. It needs great effort and practice for DhAraNA.

Lord Krishna says in Bhagwad Gita : "This mind is very difficult to control and is difficult to be fixed on one object of concentration. However, by practice and non-attachment it can be brought under control". He further says, "By whatever vishayAs (subjects of senses) e.g. sound etc. this mind moves from the object of meditation, the Yogi should keep bringing ad binding it again and again to Self (i.e. the object of meditation)."

A practitioner can learn technique of concentration from anyone and may not find it so difficult. However, the daunting task is to keep the mind bound to the specific location of object of concentration for increasingly longer time. Initially, it may be difficult to hold it even for a few seconds � later on it increase to a few minutes � the slowly to hours and some yogis can do it even for days together.

DhAraNA is the first stage where the practitioner keeps bringing the mind to its object of meditation � i.e. the flow of thoughts to the object is broken � it is not unbroken continuous flow.

DhyAn :

Maharishi Patanjali says :

"tatra pratyaya ekatānatā dhyānam"===> To that place i.e. where the mind is bound into a restricted location in DhAraNA, one continuous threadlike effortless flow of awareness is DhyAna.

So, whereas DhAraNA is continual flow of attention to the object of meditation where effort is required again and again, DhyAna occurs when this effort starts building a continuous thread of effortless flow of attention to the object of meditation. The difference should be clearly understood here. DhAraNA and DhyAna can be better understood with an example of pouring oil from a vessel on a tip of needle fixed on the ground. When you start pouring oil to the tip of the needle, the hands are not immediately steady and when you pour the oil it falls on the tip of needle most of the time but also sometimes goes out and again brought back by conscious effort. This is DhAraNA. After some practice & attaining desired concentration, the oil can be made to flow on the tip of the needle without breaks � in a steady current. This is DhyAna.

SamAdhi

SamAdhi occurs when the DhyAna results in illumination where the mind and the object of concentration become one and the "I" vanishes. Swami Shivananda describes this state : "Here the mind becomes identified with the object of meditation; the meditator and the meditated, thinker and thought become one in perfect absorption of the mind".

Maharishi Patanjali says :

"tadeva arthamātranirbhāsaṁ svarūpaśūnyam iva samādhiḥ"

The state where the practitioner experiences only the object of meditation devoid of himself is SamAdhi.

Shankara says on SamAdhi, "Self is actionless and is always in SamAdhi". During SamAdhi, breathlessness may occur, even the heartbeat may stop � but these states are not essential requirements of SamAdhi. SamAdhi is essentially, the state where the mind dissolves into the object of meditation and other physiological effects are just side-effects.

SamAdhi are broadly classified into two types :

a) Samprajnyata SamAdhi b) ASamprajnata SamAdhi

We shall discuss these two types in the next post.

OM

yajvan

29 February 2012, 10:56 AM

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté

b) Now the question arises : shall we try to bring our mind into discipline by force or there is an easy way out ?

The organs/mind can be brought into control by force or by switching off the mental power flowing to those organs. Technically speaking, both the options are available to us and both are PratyAhAr. You can choose either way.

Switching off the power going to organs and stop them from creating noise within is an art of Yoga.
Thank you for your posts, as these points are quite rewarding.

If I may, I'd like to offer another way one might consider the discipline of the mind. It is the path of the child.

If we disipline the child, what does s/he do ? Pout and push back, I will not comply to your insistence, the child says.
I will not take my medicine, I will spit it out. What does the mother do ? She offers the medicine with some honey, with some sweet that the child finds attractive.

Like that, the mind has this same capacity of revolt. The path to discipline of the mind ( to limit the revolt) is to offer it someting sweet, something it finds attractive. Now what can that be ?
For the mind it is the notion of expansion. The mind ( like a bee) enjoys going from thought to thought, idea to idea. For no reason other then seeking more. The bee goes from flower-to-flower in the same hunt for more.

So it is by the knowledge of the teacher that this 'more' can be set in motion within the mind of the aspirant. This is what the teacher brings to the student. Once this is 'tasted' by the mind, the path and the proper direction begins.

praṇām

devotee

02 March 2012, 11:35 PM

Namaste Yajvan ji,

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté

Thank you for your posts, as these points are quite rewarding.

If I may, I'd like to offer another way one might consider the discipline of the mind. It is the path of the child.

If we disipline the child, what does s/he do ? Pout and push back, I will not comply to your insistence, the child says.
I will not take my medicine, I will spit it out. What does the mother do ? She offers the medicine with some honey, with some sweet that the child finds attractive.

Like that, the mind has this same capacity of revolt. The path to discipline of the mind ( to limit the revolt) is to offer it someting sweet, something it finds attractive. Now what can that be ?
For the mind it is the notion of expansion. The mind ( like a bee) enjoys going from thought to thought, idea to idea. For no reason other then seeking more. The bee goes from flower-to-flower in the same hunt for more.

So it is by the knowledge of the teacher that this 'more' can be set in motion within the mind of the aspirant. This is what the teacher brings to the student. Once this is 'tasted' by the mind, the path and the proper direction begins.

praṇām

You are right. Fighting with the mind doesn't succeed. It has to be cajoled to come to the point of concentration again and again just we cajole a child to act in discipline. However, the specific thing I wanted to share here was the value of yogic way in confining the life-force into spinal centres and not allowing it to flow to the organs. My experience is that even if you are soft and insistent, the mind still wavers and a lot of effort and time is needed to acquire the desired results. In fact, some people keep doing it for decades and don't go beyond DhAraNa at all because of their past SamskArs which cause the mind to waver. Here, the grace of Guru and the special yogic exercise comes to help.

I would like to point out here that the effort required to achieve success in Yoga is different for different people as everyone's samkskArs are different. In fact, some people don't need Yoga at all to attain the Absolute. They can achieve it only through VichArA (Contemplation) on the Upanishadic teachings. The Yoga is prescribed for the weak aspirants who are not so much advanced in spirituality.

OM