secular enquirer...

[vel ardoc]

Hi everyone,

I hope you don't mind that I presently have no religious beliefs, but I'm finding out more and more about how Christianity was clearly derived from Hinduism. This necessarily means that when Christians say they experience God (and Jesus) they must be tapping into something from the sources of Hinduism (IMO). It seems to me only Hinduism can be true because it is the oldest living tradition.

The problem is, I've been brought up in a Christian society, dominated by the practice of Christian "testimony" - the experiences people have which make the Biblical God seem very real to them. I think these experiences mask the real truth and I would like to know more about any divine encounters in Hinduism. My search has yielded very few results though, because it seems Hinduism is based much more on humility than Christianity is, and therefore talking about direct mystical encounters is not encouraged.

I'll be looking through the forums here, but in the meantime if anyone can point me to some accounts of Hindu experiences I will be grateful. Is it impolite to ask directly by starting a thread? If not, which sub-forum might I use?


Thanks in advance!

[Shanti]

Welcome Vel,

I don't really know much about what a christian 'testimony' is supposed to be. That you testify to believing in God? Miracles?

The "Hindu experience", IMO, occurs daily. I see the miracle of God everyday, I feel the realness of God everyday.

I would suggest to you to learn more about Hinduism/Sanatana Dharma and learn about it without a constant comparison christianity as that is not the base of this religion, this dharma.

Best of luck to you in your search for the truth.
~S

[kallol]

Hinduism helps human to get integrated into the creation and beyond. It helps to know God and what it means for us.

There is no miracle from POV of highest knower and there are constant miracles for the masses.

Hinduism gives the end to end knowledge of the Cosmos.

Love and best wishes

[Believer]

..... I would like to know more about any divine encounters in Hinduism.

Consider your presence here, you having been sheparded to this forum, a divine happening. Need I say more?

[Sahasranama]

I was once approach by mormon missionaries walking on the street. They asked me if I would pray with them to Jesus and look for some divine encounter to accept Jesus. I didn't do it. They were claiming that their faith was strengthened when they were praying and had experienced a message from Jesus and wanted me to expierence the same. Christians seem to be big on some fantasied divine encounter to strengthen their faith. I don't think this is psychologically healthy. In Hinduism, the mere fact that you are breathing is divine, isn't it? Or the fact that you have taken birth as a human being. Is there anything that is not a divine encounter? All that happens, happens because of His presense and His shakti, the entire universe (vishva) is His form (rupa), therefore he is called vishvarupa. Everything that is beautiful and even everything that is not are his glorious attributes.

[naga]

Hi well worth watching is 'Jesus in India' available in the US its produced by an Evangelist. Here you can see how Jesus studied the Vedas and Buddhism in Lhasa. When Jesus was around, India as today was the spiritual centre of the world. I will not say anymore, worth watching.

[Sahasranama]

Hi well worth watching is 'Jesus in India' available in the US its produced by an Evangelist. Here you can see how Jesus studied the Vedas and Buddhism in Lhasa. When Jesus was around, India as today was the spiritual centre of the world. I will not say anymore, worth watching.

Pure fantasy, there's no evidence for this.

[naga]

Pure fantasy, there's no evidence for this.
Hi have you seen it? This has been a big cover up by the Vatican. If you don't believe it fair enough at least do some research ...www.tombofjesus.com (http://www.tombofjesus.com) is a starter. Jesus was a yogi..

[sanjaya]

Hi everyone,

I hope you don't mind that I presently have no religious beliefs, but I'm finding out more and more about how Christianity was clearly derived from Hinduism. This necessarily means that when Christians say they experience God (and Jesus) they must be tapping into something from the sources of Hinduism (IMO). It seems to me only Hinduism can be true because it is the oldest living tradition.

The problem is, I've been brought up in a Christian society, dominated by the practice of Christian "testimony" - the experiences people have which make the Biblical God seem very real to them. I think these experiences mask the real truth and I would like to know more about any divine encounters in Hinduism. My search has yielded very few results though, because it seems Hinduism is based much more on humility than Christianity is, and therefore talking about direct mystical encounters is not encouraged.

Yeah, I know what you mean about growing up in a Christian society. I, being born and raised in the United States, have basically the same experience (though I grew up in a Hindu home). The problem is that Christianity is basically lent additional credence by virtue of being the majority religion. It's assumed knowledge for most of the population, even the less religious Americans. If you were living in India, it would likely be the same thing with HInduism.


I'll be looking through the forums here, but in the meantime if anyone can point me to some accounts of Hindu experiences I will be grateful. Is it impolite to ask directly by starting a thread? If not, which sub-forum might I use?


Thanks in advance!

Ah, you want to know about Hindu experiences? There are many that people could share! I'm sure that any of the regular forums like "God in Hindu Dharma," or "New to SD" would be a good place to post a thread.

Personally I've never had any substantial religious experiences. But then, I've never been the most religious (it's something I've been working on recently). Both my parents have had such experiences though. My father quite regularly has dreams in which he talks to God. One book that I have found very helpful is the Sri Sai Satcharitra. There are places you could buy it, but it's also available online. Sai Baba is a Hindu avatar who lived in the village of Shirdi in India, and one of his devotees records in this book many of the miracles that he performed, as well as other divine experiences that various individuals had with him. But this is not some mythological tale from thousands of years ago. The book was written by this devotee at the beginning of the twentieth century. I would strongly encourage you to read it, and learn about just a few of the divine encounters that Hindus have had with God.

[Sahasranama]

Sai Baba was not a Hindu saint, he was a sufi saint. Sufism has always had an hidden agenda to infiltrate Hinduism. On the surface they are peace loving, but they are believers in Islam and in the Sharia. Sufis have murdered countless of Hindus. The first Shridhi Sai Baba temple was originally going to become a Krishna temple. According to legend Shridhi Sai Baba died on the spot where the Krishna Mandiram was going to be build. Therefore it was decided that the temple was going to be dedicated to Shridhi Sai Baba instead of Sri Krishna Bhagavan.

Hindus have to be very careful not to let people +1 us with their mleccha Gods. It's a mere tactic to infiltrate Hinduism. Sanatana Dharma is most easily destroyed from the inside, not by missionaries from the outside, but by gurus pretending to be Hindu who actually serve the agenda of Islam, Christianity or New Age, who appropiate our cultural and religious Hindu heritage and distort the Hindu teachings to serve their own agenda. A Christian who yells that we are superstitious pagans is not really our problem. Let him do so, good for him. The real problems are the inside jobs, the wolves in sheep's clothing who have become immume for criticism, because of their status as guru or even avatara. I am very sceptical about the claims people make about gurus who have had or helped people to experience divine encounters. This is not a hair better than the Christians who make up stories that Jesus talked to them when they prayed to him. Even if a divine encounter occurs to a person, it's for his personal sadhana only. It's not necessary to write books about it in order to convert people to your new founded religion.

[Onkara]

.... I don't think this is psychologically healthy. In Hinduism, the mere fact that you are breathing is divine, isn't it? Or the fact that you have taken birth as a human being. Is there anything that is not a divine encounter? All that happens, happens because of His presense and His shakti, the entire universe (vishva) is His form (rupa), therefore he is called vishvarupa. Everything that is beautiful and even everything that is not are his glorious attributes.

Hello Sahasranama and all
I agree with this. It seems to me that some people following Abrahmic faiths seem to report that they continue to feel separate and isolated from God. (I don't address the OP or any specific person here, it is an observation) Their only way to come close to God, other than through worship, is some mind-blowing experience of some sort. This, as you say, cannot be good, as it becomes a hungry desire which can distract from the gift of life itself.

What the Upanishads (and Sananta Dharma in whole) do is remove that doubt that one is not already divine and that life is not already a divine and uplifting experience. Even when things don't seem to be going our way, they are still a part of the summum bonum. It is that recognition on the daily mundane level which is the most uplifting divine experience.

[sanjaya]

Sai Baba was not a Hindu saint, he was a sufi saint. Sufism has always had an hidden agenda to infiltrate Hinduism. On the surface they are peace loving, but they are believers in Islam and in the Sharia. Sufis have murdered countless of Hindus. The first Shridhi Sai Baba temple was originally going to become a Krishna temple. According to legend Shridhi Sai Baba died on the spot where the Krishna Mandiram was going to be build. Therefore it was decided that the temple was going to be dedicated to Shridhi Sai Baba instead of Sri Krishna Bhagavan.

He was a Sufi? I'll have to take your word for it. It's true that Sai Baba was raised by Muslims, but I don't know much about Sufism, and certainly nothing from my devotion to Baba. If you wish to adhere only to older avatars then that of course if your right. In fact I commend you for standing up for Sri Krishna and against mleccha Gods. I too am against polluting our devotion with Western religions. Worshiping Baba doesn't have this effect on me. But if you feel that it smells of Western religion, then more power to you. I'm not offended, and we can pleasantly agree to disagree.

[sm78]

Sai Baba was not a Hindu saint, he was a sufi saint. Sufism has always had an hidden agenda to infiltrate Hinduism. On the surface they are peace loving, but they are believers in Islam and in the Sharia. Sufis have murdered countless of Hindus. The first Shridhi Sai Baba temple was originally going to become a Krishna temple. According to legend Shridhi Sai Baba died on the spot where the Krishna Mandiram was going to be build. Therefore it was decided that the temple was going to be dedicated to Shridhi Sai Baba instead of Sri Krishna Bhagavan.

This is interesting. Can you share from where we can get more info about shai baba? People in Sai circle are always claiming to encounter his divine interventions - to the point its almost freaky.

As far as divine encounters are consider, if one has a seriously impared reasoning faculty, one will see anything in everything.

But to an extent there might be some truth in the encounters particularly w.r.t dead saints of mleccha faiths. Without any rituals to help them settle in pitri loka, there is a good chance the pirs will hover around their own graves which are regularly worshipped by the followers with strange insense. And they might wield some level of power and presence.

[vel ardoc]

Wow - thanks everyone for your informative answers! There's obviously a lot to learn about Hindu philosphies. It's already very interesting in this thread alone!

I'll be checking back in later and following up on any new info, so thanks again!

[Sahasranama]

This is interesting. Can you share from where we can get more info about shai baba? People in Sai circle are always claiming to encounter his divine interventions - to the point its almost freaky.


This is from a Hindi movie on Shridhi Sai Baba's life.

[PARAM]

Sahasranama, but I thought it was Ram temple were Sai Temple was build, and thus he was promoted as ॐ Sai Ram, not 100% sure

[Sahasranama]

I am no expert on Sai Baba's live, I have seen a Hindi movie on his life when I was a child where he died on the spot where a Krishna Mandir was going to be build. I don't know how accurate this information is.

[Eastern Mind]

I don't know how accurate this information is.

Vannakkam: For some reason this made me laugh, as it applies to so many situations. "Accuracy" can be in the eyes of the beholder alone. The biographies of many a famed personality of history can and have been 'adjusted' to suit the needs of the modern day interpreter. All within the dance of maya. :)

Aum Namasivaya

[saidevo]

namaste vel.

If you are really serious about coming out of the Christian paradigm of experiencing the divine, RamaNa MaharShi's simply profound suggestion of the line of inquiry "Who am I?" should help you.

You may start initially at a purely rational, intellectual level:

• Who or what is this always assertive feeling of I-ness in me?

• Do I feel it at all times of my existence, in deep sleep for example? If not, why not?

• Since every human must die, will death be the end of this I-ness?

• If that be so, as science says it is, what is the purpose of our being born and living?

• If that be so, as the western religions say, since no departed soul these days can be without some sort of sin, what is the guarantee--even justification--of an eternal heaven? Even if a soul has sinned through all its human life, is the prospect of eternal hell justified for it?

• Is this sense of I-ness is past beyond the mind? and the buddhi--wisdom/intellect? If so, in what way?

• Is this sense of I-ness of mine and another person the same or different?

The more independently one can find answers, even at the intellectual level, to such questions as these, the more personally convincing could be whatever one arrives at, which in turn would create a thirst to seek and experience its ultimate divinity.

All the texts one reads and all the rituals one performs will start revealing their esoteric meanings, only after a person is basically decided (at least intellectually) about the sense of I-ness in him/her.

[PARAM]

ॐ Sai Ram is a Hindu Bhakti word, and Idol worship of Sai Baba was also adopted, there is no Sai Baba Dargah either. That was Hindu Temple.