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wcrow
11 October 2010, 01:10 PM
Hi,

After a long wait I would like to begin to study the Bhagavad Gita again, as I feel an understanding of it will really settle my mind as to how I understand God.
It is my understanding that there are many interpretations - Advaita, Vaishnava, Gaudiya Vaishnava and so on.
I wonder if those here could point me towards a website, book, or even thier own explanations of those different interpretations so that I can make my mind up as to which I feel helps me understand best.

Wilfred.

yajvan
11 October 2010, 03:22 PM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté wcrow


I am happy you have chosen to being the study of the bhāgavad gītā . IMHO reading multiple views/authors will bring the cream to the top, yet this worked for me and perhaps you will have a different a approach.

I myself have been blessed with a new reading and translation this month. This is my 7th or 8th author on this matter. Why so?

This knowledge is too valuable to leave to just one translation or view. As one reads it again , new knowledge always floats to the top. For this we are blessed on how profound this work is. My teacher has said the bhāgavad gītā addresses each school of thought (ṣaḍ-darśana)¹. I can see this and just how profound veda vyāsa-ji's brilliance extends.

If you like I will be happy to list out the books and authors for your consideration. I also recommend a hard copy of the book so you can make notes within it. Yet that said, my most favorite is by
Mahaṛṣi Mahesh Yogī as he reveals an in-depth understanding of the wisdom. He only translated 6 chapters ( this is not uncommon as the gītā is seen as 3 sets of 6 chapters , the knowledge collected together).

praṇām

words

ṣaḍ-darśana one could in general group the 6 into 3 pairs :

yoga & sāṁkhya - very similar views of creation, one's advancement and the like.
mimāṁsā & vedānta as vedānta is also known as uttara mimāṁsā a.k.a. the brahma-sūtra-s
Also some distinguish mimāṁsā as pūrva ( former , prior ) to that of uttara ( later , following , subsequent ) mimāṁsā
One needs to look at this work of jaimini's pūrva mimāṁsā and see if one can find īśvara. I see īśvara
very easily in vedānta as this is = to the upaniṣads, as which is the subject at hand in the brahma-sūtra-s.
nyāya & vaiśeṣika - logic and cosmology - Here we find the 'atom eater' or kaṇāda-muni the author of the vaiśeṣika branch.
And we have akṣapāda-muni (akṣapāda = having his eyes fixed on his feet ) of the nyāya philosophy.

Skull
11 October 2010, 04:06 PM
This site has four traditional commentaries with an emphasis on devotion & dualism. Find a copy of Sri Shankara's non-dualistic commentary and those 5 views should give you plenty to chew on.

http://www.bhagavad-gita.org/index-english.html

This commentary is beautiful, yet long. Sri Jnanadeva gave it - http://www.bvbpune.org/contents1.html

wcrow
12 October 2010, 11:14 AM
Yajvan: I would very much like it if you could list books and authors for me, that would be very helpful.

Skull: That is very helpful - I am glad there is somewhere on line where I can read commentry for now.

kd gupta
13 October 2010, 12:57 AM
Concept of Hindu[sanatan] dharm is as simple as other dharm’s almighty oneness .
Prayaanakaale manasaachalena
Bhaktyaa yukto yogabalena chaiva;
Bhruvormadhye praanamaaveshya samyak
Sa tam param purusham upaiti divyam.
At the time of death, with unshaken mind, endowed with devotion and by the power of
Yoga, fixing the whole life-breath in the middle of the two eyebrows, he reaches that resplendent
Supreme Person , the one Almighty .

Now , hindu dharm tells to achieve this goal either by leaving no chance or by attaining the human body in second time and this human body can be achieved only when human form of the almighty is in mind at the death time , that is idol worship .
Antakaale cha maameva smaran muktwaa kalevaram;
Yah prayaati sa madbhaavam yaati naastyatra samshayah.
And whosoever, leaving the body, goes forth remembering , the almighty form alone at the time of death,
he attains same being; there is no doubt about this.

This is great BHAGWAT GITA GYAN .

Also as per Vedas human form can be achieved , three times only , 1st for knowledge 2nd for duty and 3rd for bhakti or liberation .

wcrow
14 October 2010, 12:36 PM
I currently don't actually have a copy of the Gita myself - I have two that I can readily access, a penguin translation and the Bhagavad Gita "As It Is" by Prabhupada.
I would like to get a copy for myself, do you reckon this one would be good?

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Bhagavad-Gita-Classic-Indian-Spirituality/dp/1586380192/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1287077055&sr=1-1

Unfortunatly not hardback, but there isn't a wide variety of hardback copies on Amazon.

Kd Gupta:

"Also as per Vedas human form can be achieved , three times only , 1st for knowledge 2nd for duty and 3rd for bhakti or liberation"

Are you saying that we reincarnate only three times?

yajvan
14 October 2010, 03:42 PM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté wcrow

Yajvan: I would very much like it if you could list books and authors for me, that would be very helpful.


per your request, these are the books I have found to be most useful (to me) regarding the bhāgavad gītā . I use these as my reference.
There are a few on-line references that are also well done that I refer to. I will edit them into this message once I find the proper URL addresses.

Mahaṛṣi mahesh yogī - Bhāgavad gītā , A New Translation and Commentary - Chapt. 1 to 6
Śrī Jñānadeva's Bhāvārṭa Dīpikā some call Jñāeśvarī ( his commentary on the Bhāgavad gītā)
Svāmī paramahaṃsa yogānaṃda - the Bhāgavad gītā , Royal Science of God Realization; God Talks With Arjuna
Abhinavgupti's Commentary On the Bhāgavad gītā - its called gitārtha saṁgraha .
This is the view from kaśmir śaivism . Abhinavagupa's work was translated from saṃskṛt to English by Boris Marjanovic
Svāmī prabhupāda - Bhāgavad gītā As It Is
S.Rādhākṛṣṇan - Bhāgavad gītā has a different view on this matter but worth a look
Mahābhārata - Bhāgavad gītā as the sub chapters of this book - this translation is by kisari mohan gangulipraṇām

Sahasranama
14 October 2010, 04:00 PM
Thanks for posting the list yajvan, I am planning to buy the commentaries of Abhinavagupta and Jnaneshvara sometime in the future, maybe the others also.

There are a few commentaries that can be read online:

Swami Chinmayananda, English commentary:
http://www.chinmayauk.org/Resources/Downloads.htm

Jnaneshvari, translated to English,
http://www.bvbpune.org/contents1.html

Swami Ramsukhdas, Hindi commentary:
http://www.gitapress.org/Download_Hin_pdf.htm

Swami Krishnananda, English commentary:
http://www.swami-krishnananda.org/bgita.html

Collection of various translations and commentaries:
http://www.gitasupersite.iitk.ac.in/

wcrow
14 October 2010, 04:29 PM
Yajvan: Thanks a lot!
I wonder, if you wouldn't mind recommending a translation of the Upanishads as well - if that is not too much to ask. Unfortunatly I did not check - but my copy has been abridged so there are parts missing. Obvsiously some bits are not seen to be useful by the translator :rolleyes:.

yajvan
14 October 2010, 08:51 PM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté wcrow


Yajvan: Thanks a lot!
I wonder, if you wouldn't mind recommending a translation of the Upanishads as well - if that is not too much to ask. Unfortunatly I did not check - but my copy has been abridged so there are parts missing. Obvsiously some bits are not seen to be useful by the translator :rolleyes:.

I will be happy to do this. I would first start here:
http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showthread.php?t=4617 (http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showthread.php?t=4617)

Start with the 10 shown on this list... but choose 1 to begin. This is the 'studying' vs. 'window shopping' approach.

That is, there are some books that will offer 108 upaniṣad-s. That is like boiling the ocean. Choose 1 upaniṣad would be my approach. I will suggest an author if you like.

Yet I would still start with the bhāgavad gītā as it is called the cream of the veda-s. You are getting all of the knowledge in condensed form. This is a blessing.

You read it once then say - that was good. Then you read it again some time later and say, wow, how'd I miss that! I still read it again and again . I keep the date in my first copy; an Airline boarding pass of 1974 to remind my of my journey of this most wonderful śāstra .


praṇām

wcrow
15 October 2010, 12:56 PM
Yajvan: If you could recommend an author that would be great - I would like to start with the Katha upanishad.

"You read it once then say - that was good. Then you read it again some time later and say, wow, how'd I miss that! I still read it again and again ."

I know what you mean. First time I read the Gita it was incredible, it opened up a whole new world for me. And I haven't studied it in detail yet!

sunyata07
15 October 2010, 01:09 PM
Yet I would still start with the bhāgavad gītā as it is called the cream of the veda-s. You are getting all of the knowledge in condensed form. This is a blessing.


Well said, Yajvan. I'm just going to start reading my newest copy of BG myself (translated and commented by Eknath Easwaran) and he has pretty neat analogies of the Upanishads and the Bhagavad Gita. He likens the writings of the Upanishads to a big collection of postcards, photos and letters from around the world without regard to source or circumstance - "snapshots of consciousness" he calls it, which is an apt description. But he describes BG as a map and a guidebook into the realm of the Self, with no details held back. All is there for the reader: overview of the territory, different approaches you can try on reaching the summit of Realisation, tips on avoiding pitfalls, telling you what to pack in your backpack and what to leave behind as useless baggage. :)

yajvan
15 October 2010, 02:24 PM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté wcrow ( et.al)


You can never be disapointed by the writings of svāmī kṛṣṇānanda svāmi śivānaṇda:

svāmī kṛṣṇānaṇda on various upaniṣad-s: http://www.swami-krishnananda.org/books_3a.html
Various works from svāmi śivānaṇda : http://www.sivanandaonline.org/ (http://www.sivanandaonline.org/)
I have read their works throughout the years and am a better person for doing so.


Now there is also another beacon of light that I have been blessed to read and that is svāmī muni nārāyaṇa prāsad; His translation of the kaṭha upaniṣad is most notable and worth the pursuit.
It is from D.K.Printworld (P) Ltd. , yet any good Indian book store will carry this ( including Amazon.com http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=Katha+upanisad (http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=Katha+upanisad) )
He is one of the authors I gravitate to for upaniṣadic writings.

On closing , note the brilliance of this word kaṭha.

kaṭha is a pupil ; it is also a sage , a pupil of vaiśampāyana and founder of a branch of the yajur-veda , called after him
If we spell kaṭha as kathā , this is defined as a conversation , speech , talking together , 'a story' .Hence the kaṭha upaniṣad is a conversation, a story of the pupil naciketas, talking with the teacher, yama. This naciketas is naciketa 'of a man'; Yet his name is that of 'na' + 'keta' ; 'na' = not or no + 'keta' = desire.

Hence this 'man' naciketas is without desire. All this comes to surface in this upaniṣad as his non-desire for worldly things he finds of no use.

praṇām

yajvan
17 October 2010, 07:55 PM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté sunyata07


I'm just going to start reading my newest copy of BG myself (translated and commented by Eknath Easwaran) and he has pretty neat analogies of the Upanishads and the Bhagavad Gita. He likens the writings of the Upanishads to a big collection of postcards, photos and letters from around the world without regard to source or circumstance - "snapshots of consciousness" he calls it, which is an apt description.


I was thinking about what you said above and it fits a 'vyāsa' perfectly. Vyāsa means arranger, or compiler. We think of veda vyāsa¹ , the one that arranged the veda-s (assigning various duties/sections/books to his śiṣya-s).

As we find out, the veda's were not chanted in order , nor did the 400+ ṛṣi-s of the ṛg ved have a convention and say ' you take this section, I will do this one, etc. etc. '.

The seers of truth ( including vyāsa-ji's father, sage parāśara) cognized the truth. Some perhaps wrote their words down, yet all passed them on to their śiṣya-s and they sooner or later wrote them down over time.

It is the brilliance of vyāsa-ji to organize this wisdom in such a manner that is sequential, intelligible and orderly. Hence he organized the pictures and postcards in your example to paint a mosaic of the truth, based in Being , and done from those kavi (poets, seers) that lived and breathed the truth in their lives.

praṇām

Veda vyāsa is the one who compiled the veda-s and is also known as Kṛṣṇa Dvaipāyana ;
Kṛṣṇa= dark in complexion and Dvaipāyana suggests where Vyāsa was born:
dvi द्वि is 2 ; pāya पाय is water dvipa द्विप is drinking twice and dvīpa द्वीप an island , peninsula , sandbank.
Hence born on an island where two rivers join or meet
Other names of veda vyāsa is vādarāyaṇa or bādarāyaṇa

NormalName
19 October 2010, 12:53 PM
I wanted to clarify one thing: I asked if Moshka was possible, I meant AFTER one passes away.

Meaning, what if we are able to end our cycle of rebirths, but that the amount of "work" it takes to be one with (God, the universe, etc) is essentially impossible or unbearable or "exhausting."

Being one with the entire universe, every single particle and string and quantum uncertainty and multiverse and pocket universe might become a burden that dwarfs what it takes to achieve Moshka.

What if such "beings" eventually beg for a body again because while life is suffering it may be in essence "easier" than Moshka.

Am I making any sense?!? Probably not!

kd gupta
20 October 2010, 12:03 AM
I currently don't actually have a copy of the Gita myself - I have two that I can readily access, a penguin translation and the Bhagavad Gita "As It Is" by Prabhupada.
I would like to get a copy for myself, do you reckon this one would be good?

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Bhagavad-Gita-Classic-Indian-Spirituality/dp/1586380192/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1287077055&sr=1-1

Unfortunatly not hardback, but there isn't a wide variety of hardback copies on Amazon.

Kd Gupta:

"Also as per Vedas human form can be achieved , three times only , 1st for knowledge 2nd for duty and 3rd for bhakti or liberation"

Are you saying that we reincarnate only three times?
Well mr wcrow
As believerji has mentioned in one post for the members not to mention their age , I agree , because it becomes much confusing to engage you students in spirituality .
Any way read ch 6/41,6/42 for three incarnations of bg .
For three births , first gyan comes…
Rasavarjam raso’pyasya param drishtwaa nivartate.
The objects of the senses turn away from the abstinent man, leaving the longing
(behind); but his longing also turns away on seeing the Supreme.

Then comes the duty…..
Jijnaasurapi yogasya shabdabrahmaativartate.
By that very former practice he is borne on in spite of himself. Even he who merely
wishes to know Yoga transcends the Brahmic word.

Then at last liberation is achieved……
Kimaachaarah katham chaitaam streen gunaan ativartate.

What are the marks of him who has crossed over the three qualities, O Lord? What is his
conduct and how does he go beyond these three qualities?

Eastern Mind
20 October 2010, 07:10 AM
I wanted to clarify one thing: I asked if Moshka was possible, I meant AFTER one passes away.

Meaning, what if we are able to end our cycle of rebirths, but that the amount of "work" it takes to be one with (God, the universe, etc) is essentially impossible or unbearable or "exhausting."

Being one with the entire universe, every single particle and string and quantum uncertainty and multiverse and pocket universe might become a burden that dwarfs what it takes to achieve Moshka.

What if such "beings" eventually beg for a body again because while life is suffering it may be in essence "easier" than Moshka.

Am I making any sense?!? Probably not!

Vannakkam NN: My understanding is that after the Self has been realised many times over, it is difficult to come out to normal consciousness, not the other way around. The Self is described as the natural state of your being. So once moksha is attained, it would be easier to stay there. Then depending on which sect you follow, the end is even further, in absolute merger and loss of personal identity completely. In that case, what you talk about is obviously impossible. Frankly, I'm not sure why you are following this whole line of questioning/reasoning.

Aum Namasivaya

NormalName
20 October 2010, 08:13 AM
Vannakkam NN: My understanding is that after the Self has been realised many times over, it is difficult to come out to normal consciousness, not the other way around. The Self is described as the natural state of your being. So once moksha is attained, it would be easier to stay there. Then depending on which sect you follow, the end is even further, in absolute merger and loss of personal identity completely. In that case, what you talk about is obviously impossible. Frankly, I'm not sure why you are following this whole line of questioning/reasoning.

Aum Namasivaya

First, either I posted this in an incorrect thread or the moderator did (I don't have direct post privileges yet). This was intended for a thread I started.

But thank you for your response. Here is why I asked my question about Moksha. I am reading Gandhi's commentaries on the Gita, and he stresses the importance of "work". Work unattached to its fruits, its results, but work nonetheless. He says that even God must in a sense "work" to maintain the universe (though obviously this is a very different type of "work" than ours.

So, if maintaining the universe is work, and we do attain Moksha, and we are part of this universe, part of God, witnessing-being-experiencing all this at once, constantly, every instant, eternally, never being reborn, could Moksha ITSELF be a condition that still requires work-effort-focus-meditation?

And in turn, might not those who have attained Moksha be unable to remain in that condition for all eternity>

In short, could Moksha itself not be the end of rebirth?

yajvan
20 October 2010, 02:08 PM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté normalname,


I wanted to clarify one thing: I asked if Moshka was possible, I meant AFTER one passes away.


I think you are mixing this conversation in with the one you started here perhaps? http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showthread.php?t=6509 (http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showthread.php?t=6509)

May I recommend re-posting your question in the original area then there will be some continuity, and we can address it there.

... just an idea that would go under housekeeping.

praṇām

c.smith
15 February 2011, 05:10 PM
Anybody else have some favorites in terms of the Bhagavad Gita to suggest? More study oriented as the thread starter asks. It's my turn to get deeply into the scriptures and although I'm not exactly sure where to start, the Gita has provided comfort in the storm. Being a Saivite, I'd be open to other works too.

Om Namah Sivaya!

Eastern Mind
15 February 2011, 06:26 PM
Vannakkam C. Smith: Here is the Amazon link to the most ancient and complete Tamil Saiva scripture, the Tirumantiram. Its pretty heavy reading, I think. Perhaps Saidevo has links to other editions of the same book.

http://www.amazon.com/Tirumantiram-Tamil-Scriptural-Classic-Tirumular/dp/8171203833

Best wishes as always.

Aum Namasivaya

yajvan
15 February 2011, 09:18 PM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté

I have read through the posts above, as they are most rewarding to revisit. Like that,
I am now re-visiting one of my favorite books by nisarga-datta maharāj¹ called I am That.

He lived the essence of the bhāgavad gītā. I never get tired of reading this book . He talks in simple terms.
It is rare that any śāstra-s are even quoted, as he is the embodiment of them.
This book changes one's view of one's practice and the ability to remain simple.
If there were just a few books I could take to a desert island, this would be one of them.

praṇām

words


nisarga-datta maharāj
nisarga = natural state or form or condition; also means void or to evauate;
niṣarga is for ni-sarga - same as mentioned
datta - can be honored, protected; also 'a gift'
maharāj can be seen as great + radiance, illumination

kd gupta
15 February 2011, 11:26 PM
Well said, Yajvan. I'm just going to start reading my newest copy of BG myself (translated and commented by Eknath Easwaran) and he has pretty neat analogies of the Upanishads and the Bhagavad Gita. He likens the writings of the Upanishads to a big collection of postcards, photos and letters from around the world without regard to source or circumstance - "snapshots of consciousness" he calls it, which is an apt description. But he describes BG as a map and a guidebook into the realm of the Self, with no details held back. All is there for the reader: overview of the territory, different approaches you can try on reaching the summit of Realisation, tips on avoiding pitfalls, telling you what to pack in your backpack and what to leave behind as useless baggage. :)
Yes I agree , that's very right .

c.smith
16 February 2011, 01:58 PM
Pranams yajvan ,

I was especially elated to see your suggestions on the gita and have made a purchase based on your suggestions. I also have the book "I am That" and may use it for future studies. Your wisdom is limitless - thanks for your contributions.

Hari Om Eastern Mind ,

Have made a purchased based on your suggestion as well. Rereading through the post before I posted seemed the right thing to do as I have many of the items that have already been mentioned, but yours stood out for obvious reasons. Thanks for the idea!

Thanks to all for the contributions in this post and please do keep adding as you may. Your efforts are greatly appreciated.

Om Namah Shivaya!

kd gupta
16 February 2011, 10:38 PM
There is a core idea for gita readers . In the whole universe the supreme soul is one for everybody , and it is practised by the way of devotion to him only , otherwise a parrot also speaks rama..rama...krsn...krsn .
Shraddhayaa parayaa taptam tapastattrividham naraih;
Aphalaakaangkshibhiryuktaih saattwikam parichakshate.
This threefold austerity practised by steadfast men with the utmost faith, desiring
reward as god fixes, they call Sattwic and is a real devotion...17/17 gita

pineblossom
08 March 2011, 06:21 AM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté

I have read through the posts above, as they are most rewarding to revisit. Like that,
I am now re-visiting one of my favorite books by nisarga-datta maharāj¹ called I am That.

He lived the essence of the bhāgavad gītā. I never get tired of reading this book . He talks in simple terms.
It is rare that any śāstra-s are even quoted, as he is the embodiment of them.
This book changes one's view of one's practice and the ability to remain simple.
If there were just a few books I could take to a desert island, this would be one of them.

praṇām

words


nisarga-datta maharāj
nisarga = natural state or form or condition; also means void or to evauate;
niṣarga is for ni-sarga - same as mentioned
datta - can be honored, protected; also 'a gift'
maharāj can be seen as great + radiance, illumination


Namaste

I have been following this thread with interest.

The reason I am looking into hindu teachings is that I came across I am That which sent me on a chase through the net which laded me in HDF.

I was interested in your earlier recommendations and I am a little more confident in my path having read your assessment of Sri Nisargadatta Maharaj's text.

Given my neophyte status I would be interested in what other suggestion you might direct at me for further consideration.

yajvan
17 April 2011, 07:12 PM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté




Mahaṛṣi mahesh yogī - Bhāgavad gītā , A New Translation and Commentary - Chapt. 1 to 6
Śrī Jñānadeva's Bhāvārṭa Dīpikā some call Jñāeśvarī ( his commentary on the Bhāgavad gītā)
Svāmī paramahaṃsa yogānaṃda - the Bhāgavad gītā , Royal Science of God Realization; God Talks With Arjuna
Abhinavgupti's Commentary On the Bhāgavad gītā - its called gitārtha saṁgraha .
This is the view from kaśmir śaivism . Abhinavagupa's work was translated from saṃskṛt to English by Boris Marjanovic
Svāmī prabhupāda - Bhāgavad gītā As It Is
S.Rādhākṛṣṇan - Bhāgavad gītā has a different view on this matter but worth a look
Mahābhārata - Bhāgavad gītā as the sub chapters of this book - this translation is by kisari mohan ganguli

I am adding an additional author to the list above, it is by svāmī paramahaṃsa yogānaṃda-ji . The book title is written thusly:

The Bhagavad Gita - Royal Science of God Realization
by Paramahansa Yogananda

This is a two book set, offered by the Self Realization Fellowship
ISBN number 087612-031-1 ( paperback) ; 087612-030-3 ( hardcover )

praṇām

Sahasranama
18 April 2011, 02:18 AM
I differ with yajvan on this recommendations. Although I haven't read yogananda's commentary, after reading a few chapters of Autobiography of a Yogi and Yukteshwara's "The Holy Science," I try to stay away from anything that comes from this tradition. There were too many references to Jesus, the Bible and the avatarhood of these persons, that I felt disgusted reading these works.

I also avoid any work by S. Radhakrishnan. He is sucking up too much to western indologists.

I am not a big fan of Srila Prabhupada and Maharshi Mahesh Yogi either, but they are not so bad as the above teachers.

I am learning Sanskrit, so maybe one day I will be able to read the classical commentaries on the Gita which are found here: http://www.archive.org/details/Gita-SgsSadhaleWith11MajorAnd3MinorCommentaries

There are also translations on some of these on the internet:
http://www.gitasupersite.iitk.ac.in/

karna
18 April 2011, 03:04 AM
I differ with yajvan on this recommendations. Although I haven't read yogananda's commentary, after reading a few chapters of Autobiography of a Yogi and Yukteshwara's "The Holy Science," I try to stay away from anything that comes from this tradition. There were too many references to Jesus, the Bible and the avatarhood of these persons, that I felt disgusted reading these works.

I also avoid any work by S. Radhakrishnan. He is sucking up too much to western indologists.

I am not a big fan of Srila Prabhupada and Maharshi Mahesh Yogi either, but they are not so bad as the above teachers.

I am learning Sanskrit, so maybe one day I will be able to read the classical commentaries on the Gita which are found here: http://www.archive.org/details/Gita-SgsSadhaleWith11MajorAnd3MinorCommentaries

There are also translations on some of these on the internet.

Why don't you give dvaita vedanta a chance? If you're interested, I can give you a link to Nyaya Sudha, one of the most important works in Dvaita literature. It'll remove all misconceptions about dvaita.

Sahasranama
18 April 2011, 03:07 AM
You can post that link, I will happily learn more about the dvaita school of thought. Although I am not looking to become a dvaitin. I just try to avoid this colonial interpretation of Hinduism that is prevelant among many modern teachers. The classic commentators on the Hindu scriptures knew how to write consice works where even one sentence was filled with a ton of meaning. Just look at the vyasa bhashya on the sutras of Patanjali. Unlike the modern teachers like Yoganananda/ Vivekananda who can write entire books or give week long lectures without saying anything.

sm78
18 April 2011, 05:55 AM
I differ with yajvan on this recommendations. Although I haven't read yogananda's commentary, after reading a few chapters of Autobiography of a Yogi and Yukteshwara's "The Holy Science," I try to stay away from anything that comes from this tradition. There were too many references to Jesus, the Bible and the avatarhood of these persons, that I felt disgusted reading these works.

I also avoid any work by S. Radhakrishnan. He is sucking up too much to western indologists.

I am not a big fan of Srila Prabhupada and Maharshi Mahesh Yogi either, but they are not so bad as the above teachers.

I am learning Sanskrit, so maybe one day I will be able to read the classical commentaries on the Gita which are found here: http://www.archive.org/details/Gita-SgsSadhaleWith11MajorAnd3MinorCommentaries

There are also translations on some of these on the internet:
http://www.gitasupersite.iitk.ac.in/

I agree with you on the modern authors specially Yogananda. A huge fraction of the spiritual crowd seems to have been motivated into spirituality after reading Yogananda's book - and this makes me wonder if I should really call myself spiritual.

However I doubt if older commentries are necessarily always better, particularly the vedantic era - advaita, dvaita and all that. I find all the polemics too tiring and lot of pages are wasted just to counter or prove a position ~ which most of the time is useless for a seeker (like this dvaita-advaita business).

yajvan
18 April 2011, 10:51 AM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté


I differ with yajvan on this recommendations. Although I haven't read yogananda's commentary, after reading a few chapters of Autobiography of a Yogi and Yukteshwara's "The Holy Science," I try to stay away from anything that comes from this tradition. There were too many references to Jesus, the Bible and the avatarhood of these persons, that I felt disgusted reading these works.

I also avoid any work by S. Radhakrishnan. He is sucking up too much to western indologists.

I am not a big fan of Srila Prabhupada and Maharshi Mahesh Yogi either, but they are not so bad as the above teachers.

I respect your views and in some instances see what you say, yet I look at svāmī paramahaṃsa yogānaṃda-ji's offer a bit differently. For me the overall approach for reading the bhāgavad gītā remains the same - comparing and contrasting different ideas from various people to get to a deeper meaning.


This has worked for me, to form a point of view from multiple sources AND from the actual saṃskṛtam that is offered. I find myself often asking , how did this author come to this translation of this word or phrase? By having several references + that actual saṃskṛt word and defintion, then one can probe & appreciate or reject an idea or phase - for me this is learning...yet I have never rejected an author, but put the book back on the shelve for a different time.
So, if I have just one book, one view then there are limits to doing this.

Yet one will say if you can read saṃskṛt alone, and not rely on others , is this not the best approach?
This no doubt is a favorable way of doing it, yet there is still one thing that is missing - the ability to comprehend saṁketa. That is the hint, the symbol, the inference that is offered. This is where I see the mis-direction and mis-representation happen often. Not just in the bhāgavad gītā but throughout the upaniṣad-s and the āgama-s.

I can give multiple examples if requested. Having a insightful author that can offer these insights that are generally missed
by the average reader is of value.

praṇām

Sahasranama
18 April 2011, 01:39 PM
I can understand your approach, but for me it also comes down to whether I can trust the person. There are millions of books on hinduism and related subjects, for me to start actually reading something the author has to fit certain standards, otherwise I am better of spending my time doing something else. When I study a Hindu text, I do not want to hear about Jesus and the Bible or about how superhumanly enlightened some guru is. The less someone cares about the actual message of a religious work, the more insights they can come up with. We have a member on board who is locked up in a mental asylum, he has a lot of insights too.

Sahasranama
18 April 2011, 04:39 PM
I agree with you on the modern authors specially Yogananda. A huge fraction of the spiritual crowd seems to have been motivated into spirituality after reading Yogananda's book - and this makes me wonder if I should really call myself spiritual.

However I doubt if older commentries are necessarily always better, particularly the vedantic era - advaita, dvaita and all that. I find all the polemics too tiring and lot of pages are wasted just to counter or prove a position ~ which most of the time is useless for a seeker (like this dvaita-advaita business).

I agree that dvaita and advaita polemics is often overemphasized. But the acharyas who were proponents of these philosophies were not dry academians like we find in the indology department of a University. I am not skilled at nyaya or tarka, but I have a lot of respect for it. The acharyas used these tools to discern the truth. Even though ultimate truth is not discerned through logical debate, critical thinking has its own value. For example, a lot of Hindus love the theories of P.N. Oak, but hardly any enthusiast of his theories critically examines his outrageous claims. No pramana (pratyaksha, anumana or shastra) is required, but any guy from a village is declared avatar and is accepted as jagadguru. What the medieval acharyas did was also necessary to create an identity when Buddhism was on the rise. In this time we need the same critical thinking to remain our identity as Hindus from the abrahamic faiths and perennialism. Some critics have compared the medieval polemics of darshanik Hinduism with the polemics of the medieval Christians who literally debated about how many angels can sit on the pin of a needle. I think this criticism is unfair, medieval polemics in India did have a lot of value in preserving our ancient traditions.

yajvan
19 April 2011, 05:59 AM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté


People are welcomed to their opinions. Just as I welcome the opinions of the wise.
Regarding svāmī paramahaṃsa yogānaṃda-ji , I read the following:

As a bright light shining in the midst of darkness so was Yogananda's presence in the world. Such a great soul comes
on this earth only rarely, when there is a real need amoung men... Śrī Chandraresekharendra Sarasvatī, Śaṅkarācārya
of Kanchipuram

Am I a follower of svāmī paramahaṃsa yogānaṃda ? No I am not. I am a follower of the truth in myself and look to all
that wish to contribute.

I have found as I grow that holding back on judgement is a reasonable course of action. I may hear about a banana,
see it on a bill board, read it in the paper, but until I come to know this banana myself, I cannot really say I understand its
taste. I use the same approach with people ( and authors). I cannot really say I know of their POV till I give them the chance
& read some of their work and evalute. Then I am evaluating their writing and thinking, their ability to look into Reality and
how they see it. To this , I have found a wonderful group of people that have shared their insights. There have been a few
that I do not agree with but do not fault them based upon the words in a book.

You see, I am of the opinion nothing is put in front of you in error. It is there for you to extract some level of learning.
If you miss the learning who can you fault?

praṇām

Sahasranama
19 April 2011, 06:48 AM
I may hear about a banana,
see it on a bill board, read it in the paper, but until I come to know this banana myself, It comes down to having certain standards. I could go to a scientology meeting to learn hidden teachings of their belief, but I don't because I know there are better places to look for. We can not eat all the bananas that are delivered, that's why a sample taken at random will give a good indication. I have had a few samples of bananas from the yogananda batch and I did not like them. Some were not ripe, some were invested with bugs while others were smashed or rotten. I will not open another batch of bananas from Yogananda Inc. I am better of finding a better banana supplier.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3096/2291145631_cbe152a489.jpg

yajvan
19 April 2011, 10:16 AM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté



People are welcomed to their opinions.

http://www.clippergirl.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/10/banana_split.gif

praṇām

Ganeshprasad
19 April 2011, 11:32 AM
Pranam


hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté



http://www.clippergirl.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/10/banana_split.gif

praṇām

I believe there is a message in their somewhere,

A pig does not see a rotten banana just nectar, cherry picking only hans (swan) know how, what looks like to me a dog only barks, Kutch to log kahege.

It is good to remember where the diamond is found, only those who dwell deeper finds the jewel.

Jai Shree Krishna

Sahasranama
19 April 2011, 01:03 PM
Selecting or rejecting an author to study is just the first step of this process as I see it. Yajvan ji says he has never rejected an author. I have a different experience, once I was reading a book on vedic astrology and after finding a lot of misinformation in the book I threw it in the garbage bin. That doesn't mean I look at everything black and white, good or bad, but sometimes an author just loses his credibility as someone who is knowledgable about what he is writing about and then I don't want to spend time studying his/her work.

I do not consider myself to be capable of separating every single information from misinformation when I am reading a book. If I was all-knowing I would not have to read any book. That's why I try to rely on credible sources of information. All science is learned like this, at least initially. When we go to school to learn properties of molecules we can not directly verify this information for ourselves, but we put our trust in the fact that the chemistry book was written by someone who is knowledge about the subject. Sure it may contain a few mistakes here and there that is picked up by the teacher or a clever student, but generally the book is considered a credible work written by a credible author.

Now if some nutjob from a mental asylum came up with his own theory that molecules are evil little creatures that are kept in controll by secret agencies of the government, but also adding some valid scientific knowledge to the mix, that book would be rejected by the scientific community. I don't see why this should be different in Hinduism when someone decides to write complete nonsense about Jesus and miracles and pseudo-avatars, added with some authentic information of Hinduism. Any self respecting Hindu should reject such a work on the spot. There is no shortage of authentic information on Hinduism, old shastras are rotting in obscure libraries, ancient traditions are dying, but people would rather read "the miracles of yogananda."

धिक्कार है धिक्कार है

yajvan
19 April 2011, 06:18 PM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté Sahasranama,



Selecting or rejecting an author to study is just the first step of this process as I see it. Yajvan ji says he has never rejected an author. I have a different experience...

Here is how we differ... it is your prerogative to reject the author , I reject the idea. That is our difference. I have an author in mind that
many ( ~ 30%) of his ideas and concepts do not resonate with me. Yet there are many ideas that do make sense. So, I choose the information that works and leave the rest.


I look at a beautiful rose. The rose's stem has thorns . I continue to view the rose and its beauty and avoid the thorns.

praṇām

proudhindu
24 April 2011, 03:51 PM
Selecting or rejecting an author to study is just the first step of this process as I see it. Yajvan ji says he has never rejected an author. I have a different experience, once I was reading a book on vedic astrology and after finding a lot of misinformation in the book I threw it in the garbage bin. That doesn't mean I look at everything black and white, good or bad, but sometimes an author just loses his credibility as someone who is knowledgable about what he is writing about and then I don't want to spend time studying his/her work.

I do not consider myself to be capable of separating every single information from misinformation when I am reading a book. If I was all-knowing I would not have to read any book. That's why I try to rely on credible sources of information. All science is learned like this, at least initially. When we go to school to learn properties of molecules we can not directly verify this information for ourselves, but we put our trust in the fact that the chemistry book was written by someone who is knowledge about the subject. Sure it may contain a few mistakes here and there that is picked up by the teacher or a clever student, but generally the book is considered a credible work written by a credible author.

Now if some nutjob from a mental asylum came up with his own theory that molecules are evil little creatures that are kept in controll by secret agencies of the government, but also adding some valid scientific knowledge to the mix, that book would be rejected by the scientific community. I don't see why this should be different in Hinduism when someone decides to write complete nonsense about Jesus and miracles and pseudo-avatars, added with some authentic information of Hinduism. Any self respecting Hindu should reject such a work on the spot. There is no shortage of authentic information on Hinduism, old shastras are rotting in obscure libraries, ancient traditions are dying, but people would rather read "the miracles of yogananda."

धिक्कार है धिक्कार है

Good One , sir.

Somebody like Yogananada needed western audience(And Their Money) mixed some Bible quotes in to Gita translation.If i had nothing else to do I may be inclined to read such works.

Sahasranama
24 April 2011, 04:28 PM
Universalism is a great business model.

iksvakave
22 May 2011, 04:20 AM
I waited a long time too to understand my religion and god. I asked god --- where is my god? I don't know or understand diety worship (I still have bhakti though) :) Anyway, that was 10 years ago. I had gita by my side and read it hear and there and the english interpretation never made sense to me. MY DEEPEST DESIRE IS TO LEARN SANSKRIT. I listen to a lOT OF VEDIC CHANTS but don't know a word of any of it means. It sucks being from a small town --- no proper resources! :(
So I understand where you are coming from. If you think god is complicated, hinduism is even more complicated.

Iksvakave

iksvakave
22 May 2011, 04:21 AM
What does the swasthika symbolize?

iksvakave
22 May 2011, 04:23 AM
Good One , sir.

Somebody like Yogananada needed western audience(And Their Money) mixed some Bible quotes in to Gita translation.If i had nothing else to do I may be inclined to read such works.


The more I understand my religion the proud I feel. The more pride I feel the more I remember my "dharma." I don't feel so proud anymore.

Iksvakave

twista88
26 June 2011, 05:35 AM
Hi,

After a long wait I would like to begin to study the Bhagavad Gita again, as I feel an understanding of it will really settle my mind as to how I understand God.
It is my understanding that there are many interpretations - Advaita, Vaishnava, Gaudiya Vaishnava and so on.
I wonder if those here could point me towards a website, book, or even thier own explanations of those different interpretations so that I can make my mind up as to which I feel helps me understand best.

Wilfred.

Hi Wilfred,

This post may reach you later than expected. Its wonderful to know you're interested in the Bhagavad Gita, I am sure by now you probably have acquired substantial spiritual wisdom. If you prefer to enhance your knowledge, I would highly recommend you to purchase the Srimad Bhagavatam by Acharya Srila Prabhupada founder of Krishna Consciousness. The Bhagavad Gita is the sweet nectar of Vaishnava knowledge and the latter is the full text with very deep spiritual knowledge and wisdom.

Feel free to contact me for further queries!:)

Jai Shree Ram