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satay
10 November 2006, 10:18 PM
According to christianity, man is in 'fallen' state ever since Adam disobeyed GOD. If that is so, why doesn't the christian god just stop making new souls. Stopping the production of new souls corrects the problem right away. Why keep creating new souls if you know they have a 'dis-ease'?

A normal human being with a bit of common sense will not produce kids if e.g. they knew that one of the partners has a disease that will be transferred to the new born child.

Does christian god not even have common sense or intelligence of a normal human being?

Sudarshan
17 November 2006, 09:30 AM
According to christianity, man is in 'fallen' state ever since Adam disobeyed GOD. If that is so, why doesn't the christian god just stop making new souls. Stopping the production of new souls corrects the problem right away. Why keep creating new souls if you know they have a 'dis-ease'?

A normal human being with a bit of common sense will not produce kids if e.g. they knew that one of the partners has a disease that will be transferred to the new born child.

Does christian god not even have common sense or intelligence of a normal human being?

There is nothing wrong with this theory - but the theory is in the "wrong hands" and soiled. Who can deny the 'fallen' state regardless of the cause? Christian GOD is certainly intelligent but not his (most) followers.

satay
17 November 2006, 09:49 AM
Christian GOD is certainly intelligent but not his (most) followers.

namaste,
On this forum I am only interested in a response from 'christians'. What is their perspective?
Does God of bible have intelligence compared to man? I gave the example above in which it seems that God is less intelligent than men. Most men will not bear children if they even had a hint of knowledge that a disease will be transferred to their children. Why bear children and thus pass the disease but then tell them to follow your commands if they want to get better and if they want you to take them to the doctor. What kind of grace would that be???

A simple logical example.

anyone ?

jaggin
05 March 2007, 05:52 PM
According to christianity, man is in 'fallen' state ever since Adam disobeyed GOD. If that is so, why doesn't the christian god just stop making new souls. Stopping the production of new souls corrects the problem right away. Why keep creating new souls if you know they have a 'dis-ease'?

A normal human being with a bit of common sense will not produce kids if e.g. they knew that one of the partners has a disease that will be transferred to the new born child.

Does christian god not even have common sense or intelligence of a normal human being?

God's intelligence is greater than any human's intelligence. For your information there is no such thing as a Christian God. There is one God.

Znanna
05 March 2007, 06:23 PM
God's intelligence is greater than any human's intelligence. For your information there is no such thing as a Christian God. There is one God.



Yeah.


"Christian God" seems somewhat an oxymoron (contradiction in terms), to me.

Too bad most so-called "Christians" don't get that.




ZN

atanu
06 March 2007, 02:34 AM
Yeah.


"Christian God" seems somewhat an oxymoron (contradiction in terms), to me.

Too bad most so-called "Christians" don't get that.
ZN

In my opinion, since they feel that only Christ (who is in imagination now) and the preacher are the only two beings near to God and who know about God. They believe that others are all fallen and need recovery operation, like reclaiming Iron from its ore. Some boundary christians have added Lord Krishna to the list of noble metals.

This is my view alone, which however, is getting stronger day by day.

Om

atanu
14 March 2007, 09:56 AM
In my opinion, since they feel that only Christ (who is in imagination now) and the preacher are the only two beings near to God and who know about God. They believe that others are all fallen and need recovery operation, like reclaiming Iron from its ore. Some boundary christians have added Lord Krishna to the list of noble metals.

This is my view alone, which however, is getting stronger day by day.

Om


Though Christ himself taught "Be ye perfect as father in heaven is" and "The kingdom of heaven is within".

It seems that Jesus has to come again to give up his body once more.

Om

Znanna
14 March 2007, 09:06 PM
Though Christ himself taught "Be ye perfect as father in heaven is" and "The kingdom of heaven is within".

It seems that Jesus has to come again to give up his body once more.

Om

To me, it is the Christ Jesus, not Jesus The Christ :)

Ah, the problems of translation, hehe.




The notion of there being a difference of inside and outside is resolved by residing in the breath, which is everywhere!



ZN
/inspired :D

atanu
15 March 2007, 02:06 AM
To me, it is the Christ Jesus, not Jesus The Christ :)

Ah, the problems of translation, hehe.

ZN
/inspired :D

Not translation. Just carelessness.

Om

jaggin
07 April 2007, 08:50 AM
Yeah.


"Christian God" seems somewhat an oxymoron (contradiction in terms), to me.

Too bad most so-called "Christians" don't get that.




ZN

It seems to me that it is impossible to "get" something that isn't true unless we had some wish to fantasize. It would be interesting to see if you could back up your statement with facts without having to resort to convoluted logic.

jaggin
07 April 2007, 08:56 AM
Though Christ himself taught "Be ye perfect as father in heaven is" and "The kingdom of heaven is within".

It seems that Jesus has to come again to give up his body once more.

Om

Since you haven't any logic leading up to this conclusion, it is hard to see why you think this is seemly. There is nothing in the Bible to support such a statement.

Znanna
07 April 2007, 09:44 AM
It seems to me that it is impossible to "get" something that isn't true unless we had some wish to fantasize. It would be interesting to see if you could back up your statement with facts without having to resort to convoluted logic.


Heh.

If God is ALL, God is not limited as a specific "man", such as Jesus the Christ for example.

I'm not saying that Jesus and the Christ were not one and the same, but moreso in a shamanistic or avataristic sense as opposed to the myth of "immaculate conception" which, to me, seems suprisingly similar to shaktipata as I understand it (from a girl's point of view).

Thus, the commonly held notion of many so-called Christian that "Jesus" = "God" I find to be a contradiction in terms, an oxymoron, as it is antithetical to the Christian notion of Christ. I find this ironically perverse.

YMMV :)


ZN

Hope that helps.

saidevo
04 May 2007, 12:13 AM
Gods of Christianity

Here is a satire written by Raja Ram Mohun Roy on the concept of Gods in Christianity!

Ram Mohun studied the entire set of Christian scriptures in Greek and Hebrew and pinpointed the fourth gospel of the New Testament of an unknown author as the 'culprit' that offended the concept of monotheism in Christianity by its presentation of the Trinity, though it is this gospel that forms the pulpit that showcases the Christian/Churchian dogma.



Ram Mohun replied by writing a satire in Bengali, PAdarI Sisya SambAd, published in 1823, in order to ridicule the doctrine of Trinity. It was an imaginary dialogue between a European missionary and his three Chinese students. After having taught the dogma, the missionary asked his students whether God was one or many. “The first disciple replied that there were three Gods, the second that there were two and the third that there was no God. The teacher rebuked them and demanded an explanation of their answers. The first one said, ‘You said that there are God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Ghost. According to my counting that is one plus one plus one, making three.’ The second one said, ‘You told us that there were three Gods and that one of them died long ago in a village in a Western country. So I concluded that there are two Gods, now living.’ The third one said, ‘You have said again and again that God was one and that there is no other God and Christ is the real God. But about 1800 years have passed since the Jews, living near the Arabian Sea, crucified him. What else, do you think I can say, Sir, except that there is no God.’”

(http://voi.org/books/hhce/index.htm)

pkmandir
13 May 2007, 10:26 PM
According to christianity, man is in 'fallen' state ever since Adam disobeyed GOD. If that is so, why doesn't the christian god just stop making new souls. Stopping the production of new souls corrects the problem right away. Why keep creating new souls if you know they have a 'dis-ease'?



A normal human being with a bit of common sense will not produce kids if e.g.

First and foremost, God is a God of love, and love must be demonstrated by showering it upon the object of that love. His grace comes only to those who deserve punishment, and the demonstration of His love and grace and mercy stands without parallel among humans.
But in His love He desired reciprocal love, so He created man in His own image. Man was given the ability to respond to God's love or reject it. In the beginning man enjoyed full fellowship with God, but soon rejected Him, bringing the ruination of all creation. This wasn't God's intention, so He implemented His plan for creation to fulfill its intended purpose.


one of the partners has a disease that will be transferred to the new born child.

Yes, what are the odds of having a perfect child, not very good. Yet, Satay Ji, the world i(ncluding you and I) keeps reproducing children, who are disobedient, arrogant, adamant and list goes on. Why do people reproduce children? Inspite, of knowing the fact that every child that will be born will be no less rebellious than one was. Baap numbri to beta dus numbri. The numbers get's bigger and brighter. When a child is born, the parents have a desire to make them better than the parents, but, it ends up that kids are not getting better.


Does christian god not even have common sense or intelligence of a normal human being?

Again that question is also geared towards to the brahmin in you. You know that you are sinful and yet do procreate.


Shishya Dave

P.S.: I need some instructions on putting quotes in the proper format. I would appreciate your advise in this connection.

satay
14 May 2007, 01:42 AM
namaste Shishya Dave,


Again that question is also geared towards to the brahmin in you.

huh? Not sure what you meant...I am not a Brahmin...



You know that you are sinful and yet do procreate.


Not sure what you are talking about. Your personal belief doesn't apply to me. The divine in me rejects the asuriac scripture and beliefs that you susbscribe to.



Shishya Dave

P.S.: I need some instructions on putting quotes in the proper format. I would appreciate your advise in this connection.

I explained this to you in a PM. I will resend.

Now, can you answer the OP.

satay
14 May 2007, 10:40 AM
P.S.: I need some instructions on putting quotes in the proper format. I would appreciate your advise in this connection.

Namaskar Shisya Dave,

Here is a link that will help you with the quotes etc. tags.

http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/misc.php?do=bbcode#quote

satay
14 May 2007, 11:14 AM
According to christianity, man is in 'fallen' state ever since Adam disobeyed GOD. If that is so, why doesn't the christian god just stop making new souls. Stopping the production of new souls corrects the problem right away. Why keep creating new souls if you know they have a 'dis-ease'?

A normal human being with a bit of common sense will not produce kids if e.g.




First and foremost, God is a God of love, and love must be demonstrated by showering it upon the object of that love. His grace comes only to those who deserve punishment, and the demonstration of His love and grace and mercy stands without parallel among humans.
But in His love He desired reciprocal love, so He created man in His own image. Man was given the ability to respond to God's love or reject it. In the beginning man enjoyed full fellowship with God, but soon rejected Him, bringing the ruination of all creation. This wasn't God's intention, so He implemented His plan for creation to fulfill its intended purpose.


Huh? Please read the OP again. I don’t know which question are you answering and from which forum but all I am asking is the following:

Why does the Christian God keep creating new souls if he knows that man is in ‘fallen’ state ever since Adam disobeyed him? Why doesn’t he stop making new souls?

It is illogical to keep creating defective product (or objects as you put it) and then offer corrective measure later to resolve the defects. Why not tackle the problem at its source and either a) shut down the soul making factory or b) produce better product one without defects.




one of the partners has a disease that will be transferred to the new born child




Yes, what are the odds of having a perfect child, not very good.


Huh? Not sure what you are talking about again. First, you ask the question then you answer it yourself. Are you trying to convince yourself of your wrong statement?

First of all, Define 'pefect'.

Secondly, Nowhere I mentioned the need to have a perfect child. I only said that a normal human being would not procreate if they knew that there is a possibility of passing of their disease to the child.

Are you saying that you will still procreate if you were affected with Aids? I would not.



Yet, Satay Ji, the world i(ncluding you and I) keeps reproducing children, who are disobedient, arrogant, adamant and list goes on.


Disobedience and arrogance are bad how exactly?

Oh wait…yes, you believe in a God that got so angry at his first son’s disobedience that he cursed the whole mankind even the ones that are not born yet.

Disobedience is beautiful…it is natural.

What was Adam’s fault really? Disobedience. He was being child like. That’s a stage each child goes through. Instead of recognizing that stage and rewarding Adam God like some sort of tyrant curses him and all of his future generations. Then sends his second son, gets him murdered and then makes a story about sacrificing him for the sins of the first son. This kind of logic (illogic) works for the peasants perhaps.

Also, Shisya Dave, Disobedience is ‘implied’ in free will. Try to understand it…

Just because in your opinion God gets angry and mad at disobedience...doesn't mean that disobedience is bad. What does the reaction to disobedience makes your God look like?




Why do people reproduce children? Inspite, of knowing the fact that every child that will be born will be no less rebellious than one was.


A father should be proud that his child is ‘rebelling’ it shows that the child has self-confidence, he has a sense of self, and he is not a follower. Rebelling is beautiful. Try to understand the beauty of it when the next time your child is not listening your command.

If I wanted my child to obey me, I would have got a dog or better yet a robot.



Baap numbri to beta dus numbri. The numbers get's bigger and brighter.


In some adharmic religions aka asuriac religions, it is all a numbers a game.



When a child is born, the parents have a desire to make them better than the parents, but, it ends up that kids are not getting better.


You are saying that you are not better than your parents are. Okay with me. No one is perfect. ;)