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sunyata07
27 October 2010, 10:26 AM
Namaste,

I have been reading more about how to improve mantra recitation, and to make it more effective, and the advice I have taken is that it seems to be a matter of perseverence. One author I have been reading (Easwaran) says that mantra can be recited almost anywhere, whether you are sitting down for a session of meditation or not. I agree with this line of reasoning, and I find that sometimes practical life can get in the way of being given some hours peace and quiet to do this daily. Anybody else know what I'm talking about, or am I that bad a timekeeper?

The main point I wish to raise, however, is that Easwaran talking about becoming established deeply in one's mantra. He says once you've selected your mantra, one which works for you, not to change it again. If you continue reciting the mantra for a long time even a little bit everyday, eventually it becomes a part of your consciousness, each breath reciting the mantra for you, as it were. In one of his books he advises reciting the mantra gently in one's mind before falling asleep. It's much trickier than it sounds, because in japa practice my mind is usually very intent on the sound of the syllables and not being distracted or losing pace. Easwaran says eventually if you have bad dreams, your mantra will be able to come to your rescue and bring back your sense of calm and imperturbability.

Has anyone experienced hearing their mantra or a prayer they use often in their dreams? I still have bad dreams from time to time, but the closest I have gotten to hearing my mantra in sleep was from my seeing a nataraja figure in one of my dreams. It sounds like it takes years of practice to achieve what the writer was talking about.

Om namah Shivaya

yajvan
27 October 2010, 02:38 PM
 
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté sunyata07,

I thought the following may contribute to your post.

regarding the following,


He says once you've selected your mantra, one which works for you, not to change it again
Many of the wise have said we only dig one well. This is the point Easwaran I think is alluding to. We want the sound vibration to become established in us. Even in the ved, we invite agni to become established in us. We wish for the Divine to make its home within our awareness, our heart (hṛdaya = heart = code word for consciusness, the ~center~).

Mantra-s need to be enlivened , brought to life and there are multiple 'features' to this which I choose not to lay out as it can become a bit technical. But that said, the value of receiving a mantra from a proper instructor ( teacher, guru, etc.) is of great value; Given by the guru this enlivening process has been accomplished and the mantra is ready for application.

What is needed is the proper application and puraścaraṇa¹ for siddhi ( sidh = to turn out well i.e. success). This is the value of teacher-student ( guru-śiṣya ) relationship, as the guru brings the knowledge of the paramparā (tradition, lineage) to use in the proper mantra application.

There is a rule of thumb that suggests repetitions depend on the number of akṣara अक्षर (syllables or phonemes) the mantra contains.
Pending the number, 1 lac (lakśa लक्ष; 1 lac =100,000) is counted for each akṣara and the total count = the total repetitions that bring siddhi (sidh= to attain or success).

That is why the proper mantra format is of great value. The correct akṣara is considered from the saṁskṛt akṣara format not an interpretation. This has nothing to do with meaning of the mantra but its saṁskṛt (some like to write sanscrit) akṣara count.

Now are there caveats and different approaches ? Absolutely. This then becomes advanced conversations that may only bring confusion or debate to the conversation. Yet for the advanced aspirant the discussion becomes one of suitability to the native that is doing the jāpa¹ (or ajāpa).

One approach called akathāḥ cakara, considers 4x4 ( or 4²) general categories and is considered a 'test' method for mantra suitability. Here are the 4 components:

siddha सिद्ध- accomplished , fulfilled , effected , gained , acquired
sadhya साध्य- to be subdued or mastered or won or managed , conquerable , amenable
susiddha सुसिद्ध- well cooked; very efficacious ; containing power
ari अरि- hostile, below ( less then desirable) There are several other methods. Now what supersedes all this testing? The competent instructor, guru, etc.

praṇām

words

puraścaraṇa = pura +ścara +ṇa - to come near, approach, the abode of ṇa. This ṇa is a name for śiva , a name for nirvṛti which is emancipation = nir-vāṇa.
jāpa जाप - muttering, wispering; ajāpa this muttering is done internally, no veral movement of the lips; within the mind.

sunyata07
28 October 2010, 07:07 AM
Namaste Yajvan,

Thank you for explaining the technical side of mantra. Easwaran is a good teacher, but he has provided only the practical knowledge for mantra practice. In a sense, I suppose, this is better, because I have become a bit obsessed lately with knowing how many times I have chanted the syllables of my mantra. I don't think this is a good attitude to nurse for too long, because I feel the reciter will become too wrapped up in detail and ironically, have to work harder for the mantra to work properly. If there are any books or literature on this, I would greatly appreciate it if you could recommend them to me.

I have one small question - is the letter ḥ used in the likes of the key word namaḥ considered a syallable? I remember you told me the ḥ is not aspirated as the normal letter h.

Om namah Shivaya

yajvan
28 October 2010, 06:37 PM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté sunyata07,



Thank you for explaining the technical side of mantra. Easwaran is a good teacher, but he has provided only the practical knowledge for mantra practice. In a sense, I suppose, this is better, because I have become a bit obsessed lately with knowing how many times I have chanted the syllables of my mantra. I don't think this is a good attitude to nurse for too long, because I feel the reciter will become too wrapped up in detail and ironically, have to work harder for the mantra to work properly. If there are any books or literature on this, I would greatly appreciate it if you could recommend them to me.

I have one small question - is the letter ḥ used in the likes of the key word namaḥ considered a syllable? I remember you told me the ḥ is not aspirated as the normal letter h. Om namah Shivaya

Becoming obsessed with counting - yes I understand this. I have found over the years that counting ( for me) is futile. Why so? It keeps the attention on the surface level of awareness , and we wish to dive into awareness, into caitanya¹.

So, what to do? Here is a simple approach and you can (perhaps) stop counting... calculate how many rounds or repetitions you wish to pursue. See how many times you repeat your mantra in one minute.
Let's for an example say you count 10 ( could be any other number , but for this example , let's use 10) in 1 minute. . In 5 minutes you do 50 rounds/japa. In 10 minutes you are at 100, no?
And lets say you wish to do 108 rounds. That means you would do japa for 11 minutes. This allows you to not worry about counting. Over time you will know when 11 minutes is complete. Your mind will know. If you wish to do more, then you set your time in your mind, I will do japa for 25 minutes, and you are off. Then your mind is 'not minding' ,
not counting and you can go about your sādhana, unhampered.

But then you say, yajvan I want to do 1 lac (lakśa लक्ष; 1 lac =100,000). Okay. We look at it this way. You do 108 repetitions 2X per day = 216 ( or what ever multiple you wish to do).
100,000 divided by 216 = 463 days. But since you wish to insure you did 1 lac, add an additional 2%-5% more , so you know you did a minimum of 100,000. Now you just mark your calendar and you are free from this burden of counting.

Regarding this wonderful visarga (ḥ)
This visarga¹ is written as : in saṃskṛtam. Offically it is not part of the saṃskṛta alphabet but is part of the ~rules~ of saṃdhi¹. It would be like saying is a period (.) that is used in English part of the alphabet? No, it is part of grammar and sentence structure and informs the reader when to stop. We see this in saṃskṛta as a bar (|) at the end of a hymn, a śloka.

But that said, by the rule a sound it produced , and it is an unvoiced breath; it is due to the adjacent sounds before it. It is my opinion (and I look to learn and stand corrected) that this is not a phoneme to count.

So, here is the pickle ... visarga (ḥ) comes after a vowel . It can be other vowels ( not only 'a'), but let's use this example of namaḥ. Here it is the unvoiced breath following the 'a' , air comes from the mouth as long as the mouth is open with the 'a' , there is the emission of breath.

Enter this tradition - some like to 'echo' the vowel 'a' , so now it looks like this, namaḥa. Now ha is in fact a phoneme .
The thirty-third and last consonant of our nāgarī alphabet (in pāṇini's system belonging to the guttural class , and usually pronounced like the English h in hard).

So you see, then you would count 'ha' as a phoneme/sound. Some build mantra's with this 'ha' in it taking advantage of 'ha' sound. But who cares?
The designer of the mantra - 'ha' is a masculine form of śiva or bhairava , and feminine form some say śakti. No matter , it is auspicious and 'ha' means auspicious, heaven, it also means delight, and viṣṇu . Where do we find this 'ha' ? In a+ha + ṁ.

So, you see we need to see the intent of the mantra builder. Does he want you to sound 'ha' or does he wish the visarga (ḥ) with breath?

words

caitanya चैतन्य - consciousness, some too like to call Universal Spirit.
visarga - emission; sending forth , letting go . That is why is is associated with śiva , as he 'sends forth' creation from Himself.
saṃdhi , some write sandhi - In general, containing a conjunction or transition from one to the other .

More specifically according to the Monier-Williams Saṃskṛt Dictionary, saṃdhi is a euphonic junction of final and initial letters in grammar .
Every sentence in saṃskṛt being regarded as a euphonic chain , a break in which occurs at the end of a sentence and is denoted by a virāma or avasāna , " stop ";
this euphonic coalition causing modifications of the final and initial letters of the separate words of a sentence and in the final letters of roots and stems when
combined with terminations to form such words

saidevo
29 October 2010, 12:31 AM
namaste Sunyata, Yajvan and others.

As Yajvan says, the anusvAra (अं--aM) and visarga (अः--aH) were not treated as part of the classical Sanskrit alphabets, but the modern varNamAlA--alphabets list, does include them.

An extended varNamAlA of Sanskrit includes 54 letters (17 vowels and 37 consonants):

vowels--svaraH:
अ आ इ ई उ ऊ ऋ ॠ ऌ ॡ
ऎ ऐ ओ औ अं अः ॐ

consonants--vyanjanam:
क ख ग घ ङ
च छ ज झ ञ
ट ठ ड ढ ण
त थ द ध न
प फ ब भ म
य र ल ळ व
श ष स ह क्ष
त्र ज्ञ

**********

अक्षरम्--akSharam

The actual term that denotes a letter of the alphabet, a syllable and a word is अक्षरम्--akSharam (as per Apte's dictionary).

The term अक्षरः--akSharaH, is a masculine noun that denotes Shiva and ViShNu.

When akSharam refers to a syllable, the syllable could be (*1,2):

• a single vowel;
• a consonant followed by a vowel;
• a consonant cluster followed by a vowel.

The vowel in either case may be nasalized--anusvAra, or aspirated--visarga.
Thus in the term 'akSharam' has three syllables: a + kSha + ram

Important rule in Sanskrit writing

Sanskrit is written syllabically and by words. The common practice is NOT to separate the words written in a sentence or unit of verse unless the word boundary coincides with a syllable boundary. (*2)

In transliterations, the word boundaries are indicated, either separately or with a hyphen.

Examples:

01. तत्त्वमसि
Syllables: ta + ttva + ma + si -- notice how the word and syllable boundaries don't agree.
Transliteration: tat tvam asi
Meaning: That thou art.

02. अग्निरस्म्यहम्
Syllables: a + gni + ra + smya + ham
Transliteration: agnir-asmi-aham
Meaning: I am fire.

03. गामानय
Syllables: gA + mA + na + ya
Transliteration: gAM Anaya
Meaning: Bring a cow.

However, where a word ending in a vowel (with or without visarga or anusvAra) precedes a word beginning with a consonant or in certain cases a vowel, word boundary is indicated, since it coincides with the syllable boundary.

04. मत्स्या इव जना नित्यं भक्षयन्ति परस्परम् ।

Syllables: ma+tsyA i+va ja+nA ni+tyam bha+kSha+ya+nti pa+ra+spa+ram

Transliteration: matsyA iva janA nityam bhakShayanti parasparam |
Meaning: Like fish, men always are devouring one another.

Pronunciation of visarga

Most masculine words in Sanskrit end in a visarga: देवः--devaH for example. Apte's dictionaries clearly indicate this and write devaH, whereas the Monier Williams Dictionary (MWD) always omit the visarga, with sometimes confusing results.

For example:
shiva -- an adjective meaning auspicious, fortunate;
shivaH -- a masculine noun meaning Shiva, Veda, MokSha, a post for cattle;
shivam -- a neutral noun meaning auspiciousness, happiness, good, water, MokSha.
shivA -- a feminine noun meaning PArvatI, female jackal.

Examples of pronouncing visarga:

word -- pronunciation
devaH -- deva(ha)
devAH -- devA(ha) (not devAhA)
muniH -- muni(hi)
dhIH -- dhI(hi)
viShNuH -- viShNu(hu)
muneH -- mune(he)
devaiH -- devai(hi) (not devaihai)

Generally, visargha after a long vowel is echoled in the sound of its short vowel. When it occurs in the middle of a sentence or unit of verse, it is often slurred, whereas when it occurs at the end, it is fully pronounced. For example,

namaH (pronounced namah) shivAya |
shivAya namaH (pronounced namaha) |

References:
01. 'DevavANipraveshikA' by Robert P.Goldman and Sally J.Sutherland Goldman
02. http://www.experiencefestival.com/a/Akshara/id/418933

sunyata07
29 October 2010, 07:54 AM
Namaste,

Thank you both for the clear and comprehensive responses! It makes a lot more sense now. I had often wondered why some texts had written namah as namah and namaha. I don't think I would have ever understood how it worked, had it not been for these answers. Many thanks.

Now that I am becoming more familiar with the Devanagari script, I am considering learning Sanskrit properly (and not part-time as I have been doing up until now), as soon as I can find some good resources. It looks like a very difficult language to master, one that might take years of practice and continual study.

Om namah Shivaya

saidevo
29 October 2010, 08:26 AM
namaste everyone.

In Hindu tradition, personal chanting of a mantra is considered:

• uttama--topmost/best: chanting in mind, with the akSharas--syllables, clearly articulated with the right pronunciation, with no lip movement.

• madhyama--middle/better: chanting with lip movement, but no voice, with the akSharas--syllables, clearly articulated with the right pronunciation.

• adhama--lowest/just good: chanting with lip movement and voice, with the akSharas--syllables, clearly articulated with the right pronunciation.

However, in performing yajnas, pujas and community chanting, the adhama of personal chanting becomes the uttama, and the other two ways are not allowed.

• Our elders also advise us to keep an accurate count of chanting--without approximating it to time--for small numbers of AvRtti--repetition. This would ensure discipline in chanting.

Personally, I feel my concentration improving when I consciously count each AvRtti of the mantra (gAyatrI for me), feeling the tactile sensation of the japamAlA bead or my finger knuckle.

• However, when the intended AvRtti is a large number, approximation of the mantra to time might be useful and preferable, giving allowance for the inevitable digression of the mind.

• With community japa, however, an accurate count is maintained, whatever the number. Each participant is given a quota, which she/he keeps track of.

For example, in Chennai, Astika groups of women occasionally visit invited homes and perform the 'lalitA sahasranAma' puja, at 2,000 AvRttis per home with a target of one crore AvRttis in a span of six months or less. Similarly, groups of men perform the gAyatrI yajna, with similar individual and overall targets. Both these community chantings are performed for family and community welfare as well as the welfare of all beings in the world: lokA samasta sukino bhavantu--may all the world attain happiness.

Here is some information about the mantra 'AUM namaH shivAya':
http://bawandinesh.name/om-namah-shivaya/

Eastern Mind
29 October 2010, 08:39 AM
It looks like a very difficult language to master, one that might take years of practice and continual study.

Om namah Shivaya

Vannakkam Sunyata: An admiral idea indeed. Now I am wondering why there are regional differences, or is it just the person. As per English, I have heard the mumblers, the speeders, the pacers, the singers, and perhaps more. Frankly, I don't pay a WHOLE lot of attention to it, as I have witnessed livid debates about the importance of it in temple rituals, almost coming to yelling matches. One person openly stated she wouldn't be coming back to a particular temple because the priest's Sanskrit wasn't correct. I do wonder if there is a correct tone and pace some days. But I'd rather be in a temple where the priest demonstrates sincere devotion and knows enough to get by than in a temple where its obvious the priest thinks the knowledge of Sanskrit is higher than Self-realisation. The former just 'feels' better.

I did a magazine interviewof a Sanskritologist once. Still there are people who claim it as the mother tongue, and can actually converse in it. I found that interesting. But then he asked me to recite a few of the slokas I had memorised. He was polite and said, "Not bad."

Aum Namasivaya

upsydownyupsy mv ss
29 October 2010, 08:46 AM
:eek: Talk about co-incidence.......
I stick everyday with 'Aum namah Shivaya' many times, this mantra has saved me in my bad dreams, I started to recite this many times, when afraid, esp in nightmares.
I have a question now....
I want to shift now to, 'Om namoh Bhagavate Jwalajwala MahaRudraaya', will that affect his effect?

1 more thing, I'd like to tell.... Akshara has meanings, indestroyable, eternal, sanatana, undestroyed, endless, etc. It refers to god actually.

saidevo
29 October 2010, 08:52 AM
namaste Sunyata.

Glad to note that you plan to devote more time to learning Sanskrit. Of course the language is difficult--even to become fluent in reading, with some ability to glean the meaning; so IMO, our target must be to acquire fluent reading in DevanAgari with a good grasp of meaning of individual phrases. This would be better than pouring over Sanskrit grammar, trying to learn the advanced rules of saMdhi, vibhakti, vachana and kAlam, where just a familiarity with the basics of these grammatical elements would do. Learning the pronunciation, of course, is of utmost importance, and a good way to do this is to listen to the right audio versions of texts and mantras.

In my own case, my Sanskrit literacy so far (in over two years) is just some fluency in reading, with much less grasp of meaning as I read on. Where I need to know the nuances of the meaning, I have to pour over the dictionary or a commentary. I am however confident, that I can find out the meaning of a line of mantra or text, when I need to.

One small advantage we native Hindus have is that our vernacular languages have a large percentage of words derived from Sanskrit, so we can easily build up our Sanskrit vocabulary. There is also a disadvantage because the derived words in our languages have undergone much change in pronunciation (though less change in meaning), so we need to look up the dictionary to know how to write that related word, rather than to know its meaning!

yajvan
29 October 2010, 07:50 PM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~
namasté sunyata07,saidevo, (et.al)



Enter this tradition - some like to 'echo' the vowel 'a' , so now it looks like this, namaḥa. Now ha is in fact a phoneme .
The thirty-third and last consonant of our nāgarī alphabet (in pāṇini's system belonging to the guttural class , and usually pronounced like the English h in hard).

So you see, then you would count 'ha' as a phoneme/sound. Some build mantra's with this 'ha' in it taking advantage of 'ha' sound. But who cares?
The designer of the mantra - 'ha' is a masculine form of śiva or bhairava , and feminine form some say śakti. No matter , it is auspicious and 'ha' means auspicious, heaven, it also
means delight, and viṣṇu . Where do we find this 'ha' ? In a+ha + ṁ.

So, you see we need to see the intent of the mantra builder. Does he want you to sound 'ha' or does he wish the visarga (ḥ) with breath?

This consonant 'ha' is also called ūṣman. That means heat , glow , ardour. We can see why it may be used in a mantra, to add glow, heat, energy.
It is said that this 'ha' is aghoṣa meaning voiceless, or absence of all sound. Yet via tradition it becomes voiced ( ghoṣa). Once again we see how this visarga (ḥ) and ūṣman find its way into grammar, some voiced, some unvoiced.

So, for a future post, and just to round out the conversation we should spend just a few minutes on 1/2 visarga's. This gives us a clue
to some of the total numbers we find in saṃskṛtā :

saidevo offers : An extended varNamAlA of Sanskrit includes 54 letters (17 vowels and 37 consonants);
There is 50 akṣara found in mātṛkā and mālini view
Pāniṇi-muni suggests there are 9 core vowels + 33 consonents ; The 9 vowels can be extended to 14 by dīrga or their long version (ā , ṝ, ī, ū, etc.) giving a total of 47. So, it seems one needs to better understand some of the ideas and principles to make sense of all this. Perhaps we can unravel some of these in future posts.

praṇām

yajvan
30 October 2010, 11:50 AM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté




saidevo offers : An extended varNamAlA of Sanskrit includes 54 letters (17 vowels and 37 consonants);
There is 50 akṣara found in mātṛkā and mālini view
Pāniṇi-muni suggests there are 9 core vowels + 33 consonents ; The 9 vowels can be extended to 14 by dīrga or their long version (ā , ṝ, ī, ū, etc.) giving a total of 47. Via pāniṇi-muni we have 9 vowels extended to 14 by dīrga and then extended by 2 more by visarga (ḥ) and the nasal sound anusvāra (nasalization of the preceding vowel) now gives us 16 vowels or svara.

So let me offer so additional ideas for one's consideration.

The diacritic ं is how anusvāra is depicted . Some times you will see it like this ṃ or like this ṁ. It is used both to indicate the nasalization (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nasalization) of the vowel and represent the letter m or n. It will look like this in saṃskṛtā. पं
The diacritic ः is visarga and looks like this in saṃskṛtā पः We sometimes call it the 'after sound' or a distinct audible aspiration.
Lets add one more to our discussion The diacritic ँ called chandrabindu, and is usually not included in saṃskṛtā charts . It is used interchangeably with the anusvāra to indicate nasalization of the vowel, primarily in vedic notation and looks like this पँThat may be mildly interesting... Consider the following:


This consonant 'ha' is also called ūṣman. That means heat , glow , ardour. We can see why it may be used in a mantra, to add glow, heat, energy.
It is said that this 'ha' is aghoṣa meaning voiceless, or absence of all sound. Yet via tradition it becomes voiced ( ghoṣa). Once again we see how this visarga (ḥ) and ūṣman find its way into grammar, some voiced, some unvoiced.

Do you not find it curious that this 'ha' and ḥ are similar? As one studies more of this, knowledge is revealed and we are given a glimpse to its meaning and workings. This is what abhinavagupti-ji ( one of the luminaries found in kaśmir śaivism) offers. He says that 1/2 of 'ha' is known as full visarga (ḥ) and 1/2 of visarga is anusvāra or bindu (.)
So we go from ha ह to visarga (ḥ) which in saṃskṛtā is depected as : to anusvāra or bindu which is depicted as .

If you recall I said this 'ha' is aghoṣa meaning voiceless. Why so ? It is my assessment it is fullness itself, and cannot be voiced. Just as we cannot voice infinity in a word, but we say 'infinity', like that , this is the greatness of 'ha'. Then we take 1/2 of 'ha' and we end up with :

In kaśmir śaivism it is the very nature of the Supreme. The two dots are the depiction of śiva and śakti. And from them the emanation of all of creation. That is why we find it as the unvoiced breath, an emanation from us, clear, perfect, unbounded by a sound yet it is the emanation, expansion.

What is my point ? When we begin to understand saṃskṛtā in a deeper manner we come to the appreciation that we are dealing with energy, with śakti and how it chooses to manifest, express itself within us and within creation itself. And this begins the study of mātṛkā+cakra; mātṛka coming from or belonging to Mother + cakra or wheel, which should be put in the uttara folder.

praṇām

sunyata07
31 October 2010, 02:02 PM
Namaste everyone,

Yajvan, I have never looked at Sanskrit in that light - never considered Ultimate Reality in the form of language. I had much respect for its age and liturgical significance, not to mention the clear influence it had on later Indo-European languages, but I had not considered just how complex and rich a language it really is to encompass these things (never would have given a second thought to the visarga 'colon'). The syllables don't seem as random as they might to somebody looking at a foreign language. It makes me wonder if it will be enough that I am learning it by myself on a surface level, but thank you for explaining in depth about the little things most of us might overlook!


In my own case, my Sanskrit literacy so far (in over two years) is just some fluency in reading, with much less grasp of meaning as I read on. Where I need to know the nuances of the meaning, I have to pour over the dictionary or a commentary. I am however confident, that I can find out the meaning of a line of mantra or text, when I need to.

One small advantage we native Hindus have is that our vernacular languages have a large percentage of words derived from Sanskrit, so we can easily build up our Sanskrit vocabulary. There is also a disadvantage because the derived words in our languages have undergone much change in pronunciation (though less change in meaning), so we need to look up the dictionary to know how to write that related word, rather than to know its meaning!

Yes, Saidevo, it definitely would be an advantage to be a native or even fluent in another Indian language. I had been hoping I could learn two languages at a time when I take on Sanskrit as a sort of "two birds one stone" situation (I've been considering Hindi or maybe even Tamil), and that it would be very easy to make a connection between the two, but somehow I'm starting to doubt that. In my prior ignorance I had thought that moving from Sanskrit to a contemporary language would be as easy as moving from Latin to Italian or some other romance language, where you can guess the meaning of a word from a stem word. Certainly, with Tamil or some other Dravidian language I'd need to learn a whole other script. But I understand what you say - I won't say I can "hear" Sanskrit just yet, but I notice that whenever I hear/read new slokas or stotrams with certain formulaic phrases, I can get a very vague gist of what is being discussed, which is better than nothing. Maybe it's better to get a general grasp of Sanskrit. I looked up an overview of the language recently and was dismayed at how many verb cases there are, not to mention the three classes of gender and the dreaded declensions.

EM, I think you brought this up before. I keep having it in my mind that priests who conduct pujas and ceremonies will always be fluent in Sanskrit - a bad habit I carry from my old religion in thinking that all priests are fully consecrated in their roles as officiators. To leave a temple on those grounds alone seem a bit extremist to me, and yet I can see why it would matter to traditionalists; aren't some mantras far more effective when pronounced "correctly"? But I agree with you on the devotion part. That's all you really need at the end of the day. And I'm not just saying that because I can't speak Sanskrit. :)

yajvan
31 October 2010, 02:22 PM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~
namasté sunyata07


Namaste everyone,

Yajvan, I have never looked at Sanskrit in that light - never considered Ultimate Reality in the form of language. I had much respect for its age and liturgical significance, not to mention the clear influence it had on later Indo-European languages, but I had not considered just how complex and rich a language it really is to encompass these things (never would have given a second thought to the visarga 'colon'). The syllables don't seem as random as they might to somebody looking at a foreign language. It makes me wonder if it will be enough that I am learning it by myself on a surface level, but thank you for explaining in depth about the little things most of us might overlook!


It is a very pleasent experince when another piece of the puzzle is added to one's understanding. This is His grace.

The study of mātrikācakra or the study/theory of akṣarāṇām mentioned , the saṃskṛtā alphabet is part of the richness of this knowledge.
Mālini or śrī devī wears a garland of 50 letters (the saṃskṛtā alphabet). The difference between Mātrikācakra and Mālini is the arrangement letters i.e. vowels then consonents, etc.
5 śakti-s found in the alphabet:

cit śakti - that śakti of consciousness
ānanda śakti - of bliss
icchā śakti - of will
jnāna śakti - of knowledge
kriyā śakti - of action What may be worthy of time is the reivew of the various akṣarāṇām (sounds/phonemes)of saṃskṛtā for one's consideration. Again this should appear in the uttara folder.
I do not wish to start it (as it is not a cut 'n paste effort) unless there is interest. Let's see if others have interest in the matter.

praṇām

brahman
09 November 2010, 03:24 AM
Namaste,

I have been reading more about how to improve mantra recitation, and to make it more effective, and the advice I have taken is that it seems to be a matter of perseverence. One author I have been reading (Easwaran) says that mantra can be recited almost anywhere, whether you are sitting down for a session of meditation or not. I agree with this line of reasoning, and I find that sometimes practical life can get in the way of being given some hours peace and quiet to do this daily. Anybody else know what I'm talking about, or am I that bad a timekeeper?

The main point I wish to raise, however, is that Easwaran talking about becoming established deeply in one's mantra. He says once you've selected your mantra, one which works for you, not to change it again. If you continue reciting the mantra for a long time even a little bit everyday, eventually it becomes a part of your consciousness, each breath reciting the mantra for you, as it were. In one of his books he advises reciting the mantra gently in one's mind before falling asleep. It's much trickier than it sounds, because in japa practice my mind is usually very intent on the sound of the syllables and not being distracted or losing pace. Easwaran says eventually if you have bad dreams, your mantra will be able to come to your rescue and bring back your sense of calm and imperturbability.

Has anyone experienced hearing their mantra or a prayer they use often in their dreams? I still have bad dreams from time to time, but the closest I have gotten to hearing my mantra in sleep was from my seeing a nataraja figure in one of my dreams. It sounds like it takes years of practice to achieve what the writer was talking about.

Om namah Shivaya







Dear Sunyata07 and all other seekers,

Let’s briefly elucidate ‘Mananath Thrayathe ithi MANTRA(HA)’

Mananath = Recitation of;
Thrayathe = Gives protection, Defend, cherish, preserve, protect, rescue from, Save, rescue

Mantra - protects by being recited or cherishes by being recited.

So understood, Sri. Easwaran says "eventually if you have bad dreams, your mantra will be able to come to your rescue and bring back your sense of calm and imperturbability."

It demands us to recall that Sri. Easwaran is a good teacher.

Hridaya or the anahata is where our bad dreams are recorded.

When we engage in the rigorous practice of sadhana, especially while being in satwa guna(satwa guna to predominate the other two gunas), it is only probable that we encounter intense weird experiences of bad dreams ,
leaving in a state of panic,
with heaviness of heart,
increased sweating,
fear of death,
shortness of breath,
unusual images of colored snakes and bizarre.
Finally, the supernatural being worshipped as a controlling force comes to help and shrugs off the worries.

This is the visualization of our deity. (Which normally happens between 1.00 am- 2.00 am).

This represents the preliminary awakening of the anahata. Before the awakening of kundalini, praana makes its way through sushumna and making the channel clear for the kundalini to pass through.
At anahata, sadhka also gets engulfed in the soaring sounds (be it the mantra, a divine chanting, aum syllable, beautiful sounds of birds, flute, trumpets, drum beats, etc..)

As Manipura lies lower to anahata, the Manipura awakes first, which governs sushupti, eventually leading the sadhaka to sleep ( ourselves remaining unaware of this during the initial days of our practice).

But as the teacher said “If you continue reciting the mantra for a long time even a little bit everyday, eventually it becomes a part of your consciousness, each breath reciting the mantra for you, as it were.”

If we agree to that, even when we are asleep(deep sleep-the above mentioned sushupti), the mantra keeps working for us, awakening extends to anahta and experiences the symptoms described above as bad dreams (also the sounds etc.).

These irregular happenings unknowingly take place (during satva guna), to be accomplished as a regular experience through incessant rigorous practice, takes its own time, which leads to the positive qualities(unconditional love, healing, poetic-artistic talents etc...) governed these chakras

As noted above, this alludes to the promise that bad dreams (temporarily obstacles in the path of successes) are indeed a good sign to progress

The following forms the general implication of mantra yoga down the ages. Though not mandatory as in mantra yoga, knowledge of nadis and chakras while practicing mantra yoga can only aid us. The importance always lies on the Sage (Rishi) to whom it was revealed, the name of the God/dess (Devata) to whom it was addressed, its germ(Bija), its potency (Sakti), its color(Varna), its locality (Sthaana), its accent (Chandas), its dedication (Nyasa) and the correct Interpretation (Viniyoga),

or on the Sage (Rishi), accent (Chandas), God/dess (Devata), and the correct application / Interpretation (Viniyoga) on a less significant way. Lots of love :) .