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Tirisilex
30 October 2010, 04:40 PM
"When the yogi, by practice of yoga, disciplines his mental activities and becomes situated in transcendence - devoid of all material desires -he is said to have attained yoga."

Bg 6.18

What are Material Desires?

Ekanta
30 October 2010, 06:09 PM
I can contribute with this:
Noting the parts from your used translation: "situated in trance" & "material desires"...

Compared to Sivanandas translation (I have marked out the words):

yadā viniyataṃ cittam ātmany evāvatiṣṭhate |
nispṛhaḥ sarva-kāmebhyo yukta ity ucyate tadā || BhG 6.18 ||
6.18 When [yadā] the controlled [viniyatam] mind [cittam] rests [avatiṣṭhate] in the Self [ātmani] only [eva], free from longing [nispṛhaḥ] for all objects of desire [sarva-kāmebhyaḥ] then [tadā] it is said : “thus [iti] united [yuktaḥ].”

kāmebhyaḥ = kāma in plural/dative, i.e. "from desires" ... we see that it can mean any kind of desire the mind dwells on (not material only)

ps: note the word "citta" which we talked about the other day!

---

Shankara's comment is like this:
6.18. A yogi, nispṛhaḥ, who has become free from hankering, thirst, sarva-kāmebhyaḥ, for all desirable objects, [U]seen and unseen, is tadā, then, ucyate, said to be, yuktaḥ, Self-absorbed, yadā, when, the viniyatam, controlled, cittam, mind, the mind that has been made fully one-pointed by giving up thought of external objects, avatiṣṭhate, rests, ātmani eva, in the non-dual Self alone, i.e. he gets established in his own Self.

Tirisilex
30 October 2010, 06:27 PM
Citta is memory right?

yajvan
30 October 2010, 06:27 PM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté

Ekanta has given an excellent preview of this śloka and the key that he offers is 'all kinds of desires'... Let me offer the following to advance the conversation if I may.


yadā viniyataṁ cittam ātmany evāvatiṣṭhate
niḥspṛhaḥ sarvakāmebhyo yukta ity ucyate tadā || 6.18



Note that svāmī prabhupāda writes nispṛha . This I believe is where Tirisilex chose the translation.
This nispṛha that svāmī prabhupāda uses = niḥspṛha = 'free from desire , not longing' - some say free from ~craving~.


Yet the key word for this discussion is sarvakāmebhyo. We can look at it this way:
sarva + kāmebhyo


sarva = all, of all sorts , manifold , various , different

kāmebhyo = kāma + ibhya - note when we join two words ( by the rule of saṁdhi) we add a+i we get an 'e'.


kāma = pleasure, enjoyment

ibhya = an enemy, or belonging to one's servants or attendants

The meaning here is then free from (niḥspṛha) all sorts (sarva) pleasures (kāma) that one becomes a servant to (ibhya).


Now some may argue that kāmebhyo could also be kāma + ubh - which is, pleasures (kāma) that bind (ubh) and I am okay with that view, as it is germane to the śloka at hand.


So, I am in concert with Ekanta's fine view of this śloka. That it is not specifically material desires, but free from craving (niḥspṛha) for any pleasure (kāma).


praṇām

Tirisilex
30 October 2010, 06:34 PM
Like being greedy?

Ekanta
30 October 2010, 06:52 PM
Citta is memory right?
Citta is same as antaḥkaraṇa, the total mind-complex (manas/buddhi). Different traditions give different names for the same thing. One has to know or figure out the tradition the text is based on.
(citta can also mean memory only, and is then a part of the manas, but not in the Gita, since the Gita uses the word citta for total mind-complex).

There can be more to the word citta, but I leave that out.
And by all means feel free to correct me!

Ekanta
30 October 2010, 06:56 PM
Between yajvan... if you ever write a book... I think I'll be the first to buy it.

yajvan
30 October 2010, 07:01 PM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté



Like being greedy?
There is no doubt that greed fits into sarvakāmebhyo. Greed is not only the excessive desire for things, it too can be hoarding of feelings, of passions, etc.

What then do we wish to consider? aparigraha - to back-away from and release from this excessive kāma of grasping, binding and seizing. Therefore apaigraha is a most descriptive term for the absence of hoarding. Some people in the West call this avarice or being greedy and covetous.

This hoarding is the accumulation of finite things, of more possessions that bind ones awareness to the objects possessed.
Let me ask you Tirisilex and our fellow HDF reader, Why does one do this? Why is there this grasping and collecting?


praṇām

Tirisilex
30 October 2010, 07:41 PM
Why? I'm not sure.. We think it'll bring us Happiness?

I dont think I'm gonna be able to keep up with the different definitions according to each tradition.

Ekanta
30 October 2010, 07:59 PM
I dont think I'm gonna be able to keep up with the different definitions according to each tradition.

I dont think its absolutely necessary either. The mind is said to be one, but given different names according to its functions.

yajvan
30 October 2010, 08:21 PM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~
namasté



There is no doubt that greed fits into sarvakāmebhyo. Greed is not only the excessive desire for things, it too can be hoarding of feelings, of passions, etc.

In a word, over-indulgence.

praṇām