Conversation about those who haven't posted in a while

[devotee]

Namaste All,

It is heartening to see this. I am sure, Yajvan ji would certainly contribute constructively towards maintaining the quality of posts on this forum & also keep this forum cleaner.

I think it would have been better to have our old friends Atanu and GaneshPrasad ji (who have chosen to keep silent off late) around here at this important juncture on this forum to make this place a little more noisier!

My best wishes to you, Yajvan ji ! :)

OM

[saidevo]

namate Devotee.

Welcome back! I hope Atanu and GP will also be back soon and help contribute to the knowledge base of HDF.

[Ekanta]

Come on Devotee, we miss you, post now and then!

[yajvan]

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté devotee,





I think it would have been better to have our old friends Atanu and GaneshPrasad ji (who have chosen to keep silent off late) :)
OM

I hope your visits are regular - and we can see once again your posts, along with atanu's and ganeshprasad.

praṇām

[satay]

namaste devotee,


I think it would have been better to have our old friends Atanu and GaneshPrasad ji (who have chosen to keep silent off late) around here at this important juncture on this forum to make this place a little more noisier!

OM

No doubt. To reiterate their accounts including of other members like sambya, sarabhanga etc. remain in good standing.

We cannot force people to post and must respect their wishes if they choose not to post.

For me, lamenting about that is disrespecting them and their choices. At some point we have to realize that people have other things to keep them occupied. :Cool:

[devotee]

Namaste Saidevo ji, Ekanta, Yajvan and Satay,

It is nice to be back among you all again. :)



At some point we have to realize that people have other things to keep them occupied. :Cool:

Yeah, that is right ! I too had extremely busy schedule in office during last three-four months. Now the pressure is mostly off but it may continue till the end of this month. However, I hope I may be able to be regular here.

Satay, I find pm facility on my account disabled. Can you please check up what the problem is ?

OM

[devotee]

Dear Satay,

Another thing apart from pm difficulty ... do all posts these days pass through moderation before being visible ? It is happening to my posts.

OM

[Eastern Mind]

For me, lamenting about that is disrespecting them and their choices. At some point we have to realize that people have other things to keep them occupied. :Cool:

Satay, I couldn't agree more. Lamenting indicates attachment. Attachment to what? We don't even really know each other. I personally have not met a single other individual on here. We don't know each other very well at all. Perhaps someone has personal issues to deal with. Perhaps this place just got boring, or too argumentative. Perhaps a computer was no longer available.

When its over, its over. Just move on. When I retired I went back to my former workplace of 28 years just once, and that was for an 'in the now' purpose. Wise people like Atanu, Sarabhanga, and Devotee to mention but a few have left us with their words. As I just said somewhere else, most of the people of HDF are readers, not members. (Perhaps they are members who just don't sign on, sure) "Please come back' sounds like some kind of baby talk when Mom is going out the door to run an errand. What causes that? Attachment. Aren't we all supposed to be working on getting rid of emotional attachment. Isn't that part of Hinduism? When the day comes that I walk away, there will be no goodbyes. It'll just be 'poof'. Let's get to the 'Now' that so many sages talk about.

Sorry for the rant.

Aum Namasivaya

[satay]

Namaskar Devotee,


Dear Satay,

Another thing apart from pm difficulty ... do all posts these days pass through moderation before being visible ? It is happening to my posts.

OM

Yes, your account was moved to a different group for security reasons. If you are going to be posting regularly I will be happy to move it back to the regular members group.

[satay]

This thread is for conversation about members who haven't posted in a while.

[Believer]

Aren't we all supposed to be working on getting rid of emotional attachment. Isn't that part of Hinduism? Let's get to the 'Now' that so many sages talk about.

+1

My deep, deep respects to you EM.
It is in these unguarded moments of idle talk that we reveal our true spiritual identity.
When humans - talking heads - are deified, the Lord takes a backseat!

[satay]

Namaskar Devotee,


However, I hope I may be able to be regular here.

OM

Your account has been moved to regular group. Your posts will now go straight to the forum.

[Adhvagat]

Sudarshan was one of the members that motivated me to join this forum...

Any news about him?

[Eastern Mind]

Vannakkam Pietro: If you go to the member's list tab, you can look at any member's info and it shows the last time they came on. It does not show if they were just visiting. You can also search on 'find all posts by ____' Turns out Sudarshan posted on Nov. 13 so he's still around. Hope this helps in future.

Aum Namasivaya

[satay]

namaskar,


Sudarshan was one of the members that motivated me to join this forum...

Any news about him?

The last time I talked to Sudarshan he was busy with translations of puranas and was having some health problems. He is a busy guy.

[yajvan]

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté EM (et.al)


Satay, I couldn't agree more. Lamenting indicates attachment. Attachment to what? We don't even really know each other. I personally have not met a single other individual on here. We don't know each other very well at all.

I see your point ( and agree moving on is a good thing), but allow me to offer a different POV on the said quote I have extracted above.


Perhaps we may know the people on HDF better then one thinks. We are able to read and listen to one's views day-in-and-day-out. We may even perhaps be seeing a new side, different side of a person via HDF. They can be more open , without feeling threatened.

We are viewing people via their ideas and knowledge - leaving the body behind. With physical personal contact , different biases arise, no? Oh he's short, tall, skinny. I do not like his/her shoes. I do not like her dress. All this takes place within ~ 2 minutes~ of physically meeting a person.


I submit to you that if HDF members met commonality has been established. Interests have been established. The foundation is there to build a structure ( friendship). This is what I believe.

Yet, that said, the mahābhārata tells of people meeting on this earth. They are like two logs floating down a river. Some times they bump into each other and 'sail' down the river together, then they depart. The departures are various and many.

It is my belief that we meet others to learn or teach. That is how I view HDF - some times I am the student, other times I may assist with an idea to two.

For this, we are blessed being human¹ - to miss this point is to sell at diamond at the price of spinach


praṇām

1. On being human - a different view : http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showthread.php?t=3912&highlight=human

[Adhvagat]

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté EM (et.al)



I see your point ( and agree moving on is a good thing), but allow me to offer a different POV on the said quote I have extracted above.


Perhaps we may know the people on HDF better then one thinks. We are able to read and listen to one's views day-in-and-day-out. We may even perhaps be seeing a new side, different side of a person via HDF. They can be more open , without feeling threatened.

We are viewing people via their ideas and knowledge - leaving the body behind. With physical personal contact , different biases arise, no? Oh he's short, tall, skinny. I do not like his/her shoes. I do not like her dress. All this takes place within ~ 2 minutes~ of physically meeting a person.


I submit to you that if HDF members met commonality has been established. Interests have been established. The foundation is there to build a structure ( friendship). This is what I believe.

Yet, that said, the mahābhārata tells of people meeting on this earth. They are like two logs floating down a river. Some times they bump into each other and 'sail' down the river together, then they depart. The departures are various and many.

It is my belief that we meet others to learn or teach. That is how I view HDF - some times I am the student, other times I may assist with an idea to two.

For this, we are blessed being human¹ - to miss this point is to sell at diamond at the price of spinach


praṇām

1. On being human - a different view : http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showthread.php?t=3912&highlight=human

I pretty much agree with you...

HDF makes me very happy, it's such a great way to discuss such highly beneficial topics.

So I tend to come here when I'm with my mind quiet and clean, it's almost like the beginning of a spiritual sadhana to me.

I remember reading a post where someone was saying that perhaps we have more in common in past lives than we may realize.

We are all here discussing the vedas... That alone is amazing! But many here contribute to take it to the next level and mantain a peaceful envinronment and bring rich topics and insights.

I present my respect to this whole community!

Hari Om Tat Sat

[devotee]

Satay, I couldn't agree more. Lamenting indicates attachment. Attachment to what? We don't even really know each other. I personally have not met a single other individual on here. We don't know each other very well at all.

I have a different view-point, EM. First, there is no lamenting but a sense of missing the company of our spiritual friends. There is a fine difference between the two things. What are we missing when people like Atanu, GP, or Sambya are not around ?? ... their ideas and that is a loss.

You say that you don't know me because we have never "met" in person. Now think over it. Even if you meet me & see my face & my attire and my body expressions ... will you be sure that you "know" me ? My dear friend, I agree with Yajvan ... the ideas are what we really are. Why do we visit this forum at all ? We are here to share ideas ... clearance of our doubts and reinforcement of some bright ideas held by us & helping others wherever we can.


"Please come back' sounds like some kind of baby talk when Mom is going out the door to run an errand. What causes that? Attachment. Aren't we all supposed to be working on getting rid of emotional attachment. Isn't that part of Hinduism? When the day comes that I walk away, there will be no goodbyes. It'll just be 'poof'. Let's get to the 'Now' that so many sages talk about.

Ah, that topic interests me much. You have not got it right, EM. "Could not care less" ... "Why should I bother what you think or feel" ... "Whether anyone is in pain or suffering ... it is not my concern" .... Why ?? Because I am on the path towards "non-attachment" and nothing affects me at all ! ------ Sorry, this type of thinking can lead us only towards our ego-centric world (i.e. hell) ... this is not the correct path leading towards non-attachment which Bhagwad Gita says. The Correct path is :

Sva (ego-self) ===> Par (others) ===> Param (the Ultimate ... the Self)

If someone is getting beaten & I am not feeling any pain ... this not non-attachment .... this is heartlessness and selfishness (this is because of our intense attachment to this body-mind entity somehere deeper within) .... If I am getting beaten and I am immune to the pains inflicted on my body-mind ... that is non-attachment. Yes, eventually there would come a point when nothing affects the yogi ... he remains even in all circumstances but we have a long way to go before that state comes.

I will tell you one story on this :

There was a famine in Bengal in 1897 & once when Swami Vivekanada heard the sufferings of people dying of hunger he wept in compassion for the poor people. At this one of his disciple commented " "Why sir ? Why do you weep being a Sannyaasi & a yogi when everything in this world is just Maya ?" At this Swamiji took a stick & started beating him. The disciple cried in pain & then Swamiji smiled and said, "Now why do you cry when your body is Maya, this stick is Maya & your sufferings are too Maya ? When it concerns you, you feel the pain because you think it is real & when it affects others then it is Maya ?? First reach the point where you don't feel the pains inflicted on your own body-mind & then you will have correct understanding of Maya and the Truth & not before that."

It is paradoxical but true that the path of attachment goes through extremely intense attachment to the Ultimate Truth. The point beyond the ladder is through ladder alone.

OM

[sunyata07]

Namaste,

Welcome back to the forum, Devotee! I have missed reading the gentle insight and wisdom that comes with your posts.

I agree with you and Yajvan. I do not think the regret one feels in not seeing the posts or activity of long-time members necessarily means attachment. It's not something that would ever really shake or bother me, but I do feel a sense of vague disappointment (closest emotion I can come to describing) that you might never hear from them again. There is always the possibility that any post you might read here from member X will be his last. There is no way of knowing if some members that no longer post here have died and moved onto the next life. It reminds you that someone can be here in this life one minute and then gone the next.

EM, it's true that we might not be personally acquainted with each other in real life, but think about how much of our lives, personal thoughts and experiences we share with each on HDF - sometimes I feel like the people on this forum would know me better than some of my real-life friends with whom I'd never discuss the vedas, God, the meaning behind our existence and greater reality.

Om namah Shivaya

[Believer]

I will tell you one story on this :

There was a famine in Bengal in 1897 & once when Swami Vivekanada heard the sufferings of people dying of hunger he wept in compassion for the poor people. At this one of his disciple commented " "Why sir ? Why do you weep being a Sannyaasi & a yogi when everything in this world is just Maya ?" At this Swamiji took a stick & started beating him. The disciple cried in pain & then Swamiji smiled and said, "Now why do you cry when your body is Maya, this stick is Maya & your sufferings are too Maya ? When it concerns you, you feel the pain because you think it is real & when it affects others then it is Maya ?? First reach the point where you don't feel the pains inflicted on your own body-mind & then you will have correct understanding of Maya and the Truth & not before that." Moral of the story: EM, until you reach the level of spirituality as defined by Swamiji, don't utter a word. :)
-

[Eastern Mind]

Vannakkam everyone: Please don't get me wrong. I do like this place. There is a ton of wisdom here, and the fact I keep coming back over and over demonstrates it. I don't know about others, but I know I have had several 'off the forum' interactions with people here as well, via email, gifts sent to real addresses, help with travel plans, etc.

My comments were more in line with respecting a personal choice, as some others have also mentioned. So I apologise for projecting my beliefs onto others. I came to be this way from a deep reflection on relationships and how they end one day a long time back, and it has stuck with me.

I was hitchhiking across Canada, and often when the ride was over, the other and perhaps me as well would end it with "See you later." Then waiting for the next ride, one day I started thinking how very odd that was. It was simple highly highly unlikely, and yet we had both expressed it as if we were brothers, and it was indeed very likely.

I must also confess that I'm biased somewhat this way from some previous experiences on line. One was from a 'confession' in a PM to me where the individual clearly demonstrated his words on line were different than his actions in life. Another time I agreed to meet someone for coffee here in my city, and she turned out to be someone completely different than my impressions. For starters she was a he. So perhaps I'm warped by that.

Then there is the old ingrained adage (in me anyway) "actions speak louder than words".

But hey this is all just my personal take. Even in real life, I faced these differences when I asked not to have the standard 'retirement' or 'going away' parties. Then the 'social convener' went ahead despite my objections. So I apologise if I have offended anyone, but in reality I respect all of your views, as they are your views. Hopefully I can get the same in return. It's like a lot of things. If you don't tell me how to think, I won't tell you how to think.

Aum Namasivaya

[Believer]

I don't know about others, but I know I have had several 'off the forum' interactions with people here as well, ....gifts sent to real addresses, ..... etc.


EM, you have been bribing the Administrators? ;)
No wonder they are "soft" on you.

[Eastern Mind]

EM, you have been bribing the Administrators? ;)
No wonder they are "soft" on you.

Vannakkam: And how much would it cost just for your silence?
http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Aum Namasivaya

[Sahasranama]

If you don't tell me how to think, I won't tell you how to think.
I once listened to a talk and the lecturer said, people don't like to be told how to think. Children only have to make up their mind, but adults have to change their mind. As we get older, we become more resistent to people telling us how to think. Not saying it's a bad thing, but it's interesting to think about.

[Eastern Mind]

Vannakkam Sahasranama:

Projecting our thoughts, ways of Practice, and impressions into the minds of others is a common folly. Personally, I need to guard against doing it. When you observe someone in a temple telling another devotee how to do something (besides the serious things like not entering sanctums of course) such as how to hold your hands, put on vibhuthi, etc. then the folly becomes quite apparent. If everyone thought like me, then Toyota would be the only automobile on the planet. How sad that would be because then I couldn't laugh at all the poor guys standing beside their broken down Fords and Chevies on the shoulder of the highway.

Aum Namasivaya

[yajvan]

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté EM (et.al)

You have spoken your mind, and here on HDF that is fine and welcomed. Many have offered reflection on what you said.
Now the question is was there any value in what was offered? If so, a learning experience, if not , well alls well with the world and others had the opportunity to express their POV's.

For me , it is of the highest importance that a person can speak their mind ( less being condescending , yet welcomed in the jalpa folder :) )
in a calm and reflecting way and know it is safe and okay to do it here. As I see observe your posts you do this in fine fashion.
You are sincere & no faults arise from the sincerity.

The benefit comes to the person, the community and HDF when a person says or thinks, I did not think that way before, this is a new
perspective for me. That is the value of HDF ( as I see it) - growth.

They say if you wish to learn something new, drop an old habit. This can only occur with new ideas as 'fuel'. HDF is the fuel source.

Overall I am reminded again and again ( regarding relationships to any person, place or thing): In the final analysis all love is
directed to the Self¹ .


praṇām

1. bṛhadaraṇyaka upaniṣad - puruṣavidha-brāhmaṇa, 2nd śloka
If one cares to read the bṛhadaraṇyaka upaniṣad ( some write bṛhadaraṇyakopaniṣad ), maitreyi brāhmaṇa (section 4) confirms this.
Yajñavalkya muni speaks to his wife maitreya ( as he is about to depart to the forest and take to saṃyas-āśrama).

He says, It is not for the love of the husband my dear that the husband dear to his wife, but for the love of the Self (ātman).
Yajñavalkya-ji points this out for the love of sons, wealth, worlds, gods, etc. as he expounds on 9 subjects. All love is directed towards the Self (ātman)

[Eastern Mind]

Now the question is was there any value in what was offered?

Vannakkam Yajvan: Well at least I feel I learned something, so in that sense for me it was valuable.

Aum Namasivaya

[Believer]

How sad that would be because then I couldn't laugh at all the poor guys standing beside their broken down Fords and Chevies on the shoulder of the highway.
That is a direct frontal attack on the intelligence, work ethic and integrity of American workers. Our unmanned drones are hovering over Edmonton as we speak, and you will feel them soon. Ha Ha!

[Eastern Mind]

Vannakkam Believer: Hopefully, said drones have reputable cameras that can distinguish automotive brands from above. There are several that have died along major routes. Mostly __________s , ___________ s, and ______s.

But hey I once owned a decent '86 Chevy Nova.

Aum Namasivaya

[satay]

namaskar devotee,


their ideas and that is a loss.
OM

What do you propose we do? How do we force people to post here when they do not post?

Incidentally, this topic seems very important to you, however, please post on other topics if your time allows.

[Adhvagat]

Everyone is digressing a lot lately...

Perhaps something in the skies?

:)

[Ganeshprasad]

Pranam all


Namaste All,

I think it would have been better to have our old friends Atanu and GaneshPrasad ji (who have chosen to keep silent off late) around here at this important juncture on this forum to make this place a little more noisier!

OM

Pranam devotee ji
Nice to see you posting again, let me reiterate I have no problem with anyone here, I was saddened to see our dear friend Atanu ji leaving HDF that was hard for me to bear, I had known him over along period of time, long before HD.



Welcome back! I hope Atanu and GP will also be back soon and help contribute to the knowledge base of HDF.

Pranam saidevo ji
thanks, I do hope Atanu change his mind and come back, HDF is poorer without his contribution



I hope your visits are regular - and we can see once again your posts, along with atanu's and ganeshprasad.



Pranam Yajvan ji
belated congratulations, may be too late, I realised you are having issues or conflict off interest .

I do hope one day Atanu start posting again



No doubt. To reiterate their accounts including of other members like sambya, sarabhanga etc. remain in good standing.

We cannot force people to post and must respect their wishes if they choose not to post.

For me, lamenting about that is disrespecting them and their choices. At some point we have to realize that people have other things to keep them occupied.

Pranam Satay ji
I have to disagree with you , how can missing someone be construed as disrespecting them? Atanu found his position to continue posting on HDF untenable, he loved posting here but he could not do so at the expense off his Guru, he always argued on the strength of Shastra, if anyone had problem with his universal approach then they should have done so with logic and Shastra.

Sambya’s case is even more unique, he was banned here again defending his Guru, so it would be nice to encourage them to come back, by respecting their choices we are simply saying goodbye. I have no idea why Sarabhanga is not posting, I also wish Mahaharda start posting again, even if don’t agree with him on many things.

Jai Shree Krishna

[satay]

namaskar!
It is nice to see your post here on HDF after a period of rest.


Pranam Satay ji
I have to disagree with you ,
Jai Shree Krishna


I will ask you the same question I asked Devotee.

What do you propose we do? There are 2086 members on HDF. How do we force them to post? How do we force people to post here when they choose not post?

Any ideas?

[Ganeshprasad]

Pranam Satay


namaskar!
It is nice to see your post here on HDF after a period of rest.
I will ask you the same question I asked Devotee.

What do you propose we do? There are 2086 members on HDF. How do we force them to post? How do we force people to post here when they choose not post?

Any ideas?

Thanks
off course there is no question of force, many members come and go off their own choice, but when members feel their continued presence is not welcome or questioned, then the choice is forced upon them. Atanu is an esteem member of this forum, his contribution and knowledge is immense, likewise Sambya who was banned for the reasons known to you, was another intelligent contributer. best we can do is encourage them to come back, i let you work that out, i do my bit with Atanu, Sambya i have no contact.
Jai Shree Krishna

[devotee]

Namaste GaneshPrasad ji,

It is so nice to see you here again ! :) I don't mind EM rebuking me for having such worldly attachments !! :) :)

I don't understand why we should allow ill speaking against any Guru of any tradition. It may not matter to those for whom spirituality is simply a time-pass .... and a game of war of words .... but it is a entirely different matter for those who are seriously into it. I don't think a true Hindu worth his name is not aware of seriousness of this issue. It is ok to disagree with views of saints but why use abusive language against them ?

I fully endorse your views and would say that if we are able to resolve this issue, things would improve for better on this forum & our long time knowledgeable friends namely Atanu and Sambya may like to come back.

I was asked by Satay not to be too interested in this topic but if the question is asked with all seriousness (what shall we do ? ...) ... the answer is given above.

OM

[Ganeshprasad]

Pranam Devotee ji


Namaste GaneshPrasad ji,

It is so nice to see you here again ! :) I don't mind EM rebuking me for having such worldly attachments !! :) :)

I don't understand why we should allow ill speaking against any Guru of any tradition-----


OM

Thanks for your kind words.
As for worldly attachment, name me one person who is completely detached from worldly affairs.
May be EMji is working toward detachment so much that he could not even address you in person.

Jai Shree Krishna

[kd gupta]

This is a regular festive season in india these days and in hdf as gprasadji and devoteeji are back , Atanuji must be joining soon , I am confident .
Welcome all .

[Eastern Mind]

Vannakkam Devotee and Ganeshprasad:http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

My Guru termed it 'affectionate detachment'. Please note the word 'affectionate'. When monks or ascetics renounce the world, it is not a 'running away from' but rather a loving from a distance. Sages and acharyas practice it, and I keep it in mind just as we keep moksha in mind, yet we have not experienced it. So I am really not that detached from duties, etc., yet I keep renunciation there in the back of my head somewhere as a goal. Maybe next life time, for instance.

For me, its a question of not being sticky and emotional about it. After all, we're not this sack of bones and emotions. We're all something deeper than that.

Take my friend in Chidambaram for example. We're dropping by for coffee. It'll be a pleasant break to renew an old acquaintance. But I'm going to India to see the temples, not the people.

If my plans were slightly different, Devotee and I would be meeting up so I would have a great guide in a particular city, and we could share in the camaraderie of worship.

Odic (sticky, emotional, lovey-dovey) forces can be a hindrance. That's all. Nothing more.

I come to HDF for the knowledge, not the people. But I am with Satay. There is no way we can force someone to return.

For Satay, there is also the issue of confidence. I mean confidence as the root to confidential. We don't need to know why someone is banned. But here is a possibility of the way it could come about. Someone starts sending harassing PMs to Satay or to another HDF member, clearly violating the rules of HDF. Or sometimes a person sends a PM that is 'private' . Do you really think any of us should then cut and paste and post that PM in the public forums. Clearly not. So because of this, we have to put our trust in Satay. Similarly if someone complains about another member, I don't think Satay should release the name of the complainer either.

So I'm aware of this aspect.

Also as stated before to one of the previously banned members some time back, there is always the option of starting a new forum on your own for anyone who feels this one doesn't quite suit them. I am unaware if this has ever happened. I do believe, however, that that was the way HDF itself got started. Out of another forum that had poorer moderation.

FYI, this city was the third coldest place on the planet about 4 days ago. A brutal -40C or so. So take heart. UK and India can't match that. No Hindu in their right mind should have to endure that. I go to temple from my house in veshti, but throw some denim jeans into the car in case the wretched machine breaks down on the way. But just walking from the parking lot into the temple is kavadi enough for me.

Blessings to you both.

Aum Namasivaya

[Believer]

I have restrained myself for some time to not enter this discussion, but let us examine the banter....


off course there is no question of force, many members come and go off their own choice, but when members feel their continued presence is not welcome or questioned, then the choice is forced upon them.When members don't follow the guidelines set forth by the Administrator to ensure the peace and neutrality of the forum, THEY make a willful choice of not being welcome; choice is NOT made for them. This is a self-serving, indirect negative comment on the Administrator's performance. Why?



I don't understand why we should allow ill speaking against any Guru of any tradition. It may not matter to those for whom spirituality is simply a time-pass .... and a game of war of words .... but it is a entirely different matter for those who are seriously into it. I don't think a true Hindu worth his name is not aware of seriousness of this issue. It is ok to disagree with views of saints but why use abusive language against them ? Any Hindu worth his salt would not speak ill against any Guru or Tradition. The problem comes when a member or a group of members gang up and try to shove THEIR sampradaye down everyone else's throat.

When discussing something with me, if the other person were to make a direct argument, I could counter it, if I disagree. But when someone throws the weight of his sampradaye/Guru behind his position, what choice do I have but to go against that sampradaye/Guru. And that my friend would be considered speaking ill of the sampradaye/Guru. When people get tricky and the aim becomes not to seek the right solution but to win the debate, they invite this disrespect to their sampradaye/Guru, which the other person really has no intention of doing.


I was asked by Satay not to be too interested in this topic but if the question is asked with all seriousness (what shall we do ? ...) ... the answer is given above. Is this a PM being mentioned in the public forum to question the Administrator's steller performance? Is anything new divulged in this 'serious' post? Should he get on his knees and beg people to come back on THEIR terms?


As for worldly attachment, name me one person who is completely detached from worldly affairs.A tacit admission that there are no high priests and commoners in this forum?


May be EMji is working toward detachment so much that he could not even address you in person.
???


My Guru termed it 'affectionate detachment'. Please note the word 'affectionate'. When monks or ascetics renounce the world, it is not a 'running away from' but rather a loving from a distance. Sages and acharyas practice it, and I keep it in mind just as we keep moksha in mind, yet we have not experienced it. So I am really not that detached from duties, etc., yet I keep renunciation there in the back of my head somewhere as a goal. Maybe next life time, for instance.

For me, its a question of not being sticky and emotional about it. After all, we're not this sack of bones and emotions. We're all something deeper than that.

Take my friend in Chidambaram for example. We're dropping by for coffee. It'll be a pleasant break to renew an old acquaintance. But I'm going to India to see the temples, not the people.

If my plans were slightly different, Devotee and I would be meeting up so I would have a great guide in a particular city, and we could share in the camaraderie of worship.

Odic (sticky, emotional, lovey-dovey) forces can be a hindrance. That's all. Nothing more.

I come to HDF for the knowledge, not the people. But I am with Satay. There is no way we can force someone to return.

For Satay, there is also the issue of confidence. I mean confidence as the root to confidential. We don't need to know why someone is banned. But here is a possibility of the way it could come about. Someone starts sending harassing PMs to Satay or to another HDF member, clearly violating the rules of HDF. Or sometimes a person sends a PM that is 'private' . Do you really think any of us should then cut and paste and post that PM in the public forums. Clearly not. So because of this, we have to put our trust in Satay. Similarly if someone complains about another member, I don't think Satay should release the name of the complainer either.

So I'm aware of this aspect.

Also as stated before to one of the previously banned members some time back, there is always the option of starting a new forum on your own for anyone who feels this one doesn't quite suit them. I am unaware if this has ever happened. I do believe, however, that that was the way HDF itself got started. Out of another forum that had poorer moderation.

FYI, this city was the third coldest place on the planet about 4 days ago. A brutal -40C or so. So take heart. UK and India can't match that. No Hindu in their right mind should have to endure that. I go to temple from my house in veshti, but throw some denim jeans into the car in case the wretched machine breaks down on the way. But just walking from the parking lot into the temple is kavadi enough for me.

A sensible post indeed by EM!


Here is a summary of how some of us conduct ourselves in the forum:

http://hindudharmaforums.com/showthread.php?t=6417

-

[devotee]

Believer, it is better to keep silent when you don't know the background of some serious issue.

You have no clue what & why it is all being discussed in this thread. And for your kind information, there is no private PM being discussed here. I don't think I & Satay need your help for sorting out issues between us two. We two know each other better than you know anyone on this forum. Your assumption is really wild & I can only admire your quality of jumping to give sermons to others without bothering to understand the context fully.

OM

[Believer]

Why not do it via PM's then? Please get used to members making posts in a 'public forum'.
Why should 'spiritual' people raise their voices like this?
True, I don't know anyone in the forum, because I don't come here for social reasons, to be surrounded by 'friends', or for a popularity contest!
Why do acrimonious/condescending posts also end with the Lord's name - "Om Namo Bhagvate Vaasudevaye"??

-

[sm78]

Dear Believer,
Here is a it of back ground for you. There may have been other incidents, and I was not the only culprit. My harsh tounge did some unwanted damage perhaves.

http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showpost.php?p=47069&postcount=89

http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showthread.php?p=47069#post47069

[satay]

namaste Ganesh,

I wasn't going to continue on this thread but I can't bite my tounge (must be genetics).

If I understand you correctly you want me to 'encourage' the members who have chosen not to post. And you have devotee's support on this.

I know that you and devotee are older than me. You are more experienced in life, in knowledge of sastra and just in general you are wiser. I respect that.

However, I think you are both wrong. Let me try to explain.

The members who have chosen not to post even when their accounts are in good standing have made a personal choice for whatever reason (let's put the reason on the side for a minute). Their choice is 'I am not posting or visiting HDF any longer.' In corporate circles we call it 'making your bed' as in if you make your bed you lie on it. In other words, they have made their bed and chosen to lie on it.

Now, sulking about their choice, lamenting about thier choice, questioning their choice, moping about their choice is disrespecting them.

Asking me to 'encourage' them is even worse. It is like asking me to treat them like children. Do you think they are children? Do you think they are five year olds that I need to storke their ego and give them encouragement so that they can post? All rhetorical questions mind you.

Please, I realize that I am younger and less experienced in the politics of all this but I request you all to not treat the other members like children. They don't need encouragement to do anything let alone encouragement from me. Who am I to encourage them? I am just an electron on this internet community. Why so much attachment?

Now on the issue of guru pramapara and disrespecting gurus. Before accusing others of disrespecting gurus let me ask what the esteemed members would say about this guru. I will give you an example and I ask in advance forgiveness from the devotees of this guru because I am about to take his name in vain. Acharya prabupada of ISKCON calls lord shiva a naukar of lord vishnu. What do you think of this guru sirla prabupada? It is okay to question this guru and point out that he is wrong in calling shiva and other devta vishun's naukar because he is not from our sampradaya and start sulking and complaining when someone questions your guru? Isn't that hypocritical?

There are many gurus and many sampradayas and like believer pointed out why force one member to insult your guru and why shove your sampradaya's view point down others' throat?

Lastly because one of you touched on it, this forum is not about a specific sampradaya be it universalism, advaita, dvaita or whatever others that exist out there. It is a generic hindu forum for hindus. There are different sections on the forum to accomodate not only hindu sampradayas but to accomodate dharmic devotees of other faiths too. So if one is hell bent on being a pacifist and on radical universalism then they can simply post in that specific section, there is no reason to shove that down other people's throat.

If one doesn't agree with the rules of the forum or moderation why mop around and keep sulking, why not create your own forum or go elsewhere better suited for your needs?

I hate playing politics and I am sorry to say that by moping around for some members who have made a personal choice not to post, you are making this into a political issue. I am sorry but I do not play that game. I refuse to treat adults like little children.

I know that you do not agree with what I just said and I am perfectly okay with that. Are you okay with me not accepting your view point? I will leave that to you to deal with. The fact that you don't agree with my view and some members have chosen not to post for their own reasons doesn't keep me up at night.

Thanks and be well.

With respect,


Pranam Satay

Atanu is an esteem member of this forum, his contribution and knowledge is immense, likewise Sambya who was banned for the reasons known to you, was another intelligent contributer. best we can do is encourage them to come back, i let you work that out, i do my bit with Atanu, Sambya i have no contact.
Jai Shree Krishna

[Believer]

Believer, it is better to keep silent when you don't know the background of some serious issue.

You have no clue what & why it is all being discussed in this thread. And for your kind information, there is no private PM being discussed here. I don't think I & Satay need your help for sorting out issues between us two. We two know each other better than you know anyone on this forum. Your assumption is really wild & I can only admire your quality of jumping to give sermons to others without bothering to understand the context fully.

OM

Was I that much off the mark in my assumptions?
Was my 'sermon' an exercise in futility?
Do older people in the forum need to be ridiculed by 'kids', contrary to the Hindu code of conduct?
dete hain bhagwan ko dokhaa, insaan ko kayaa chhodegen....
-

[kd gupta]

Was I that much off the mark in my assumptions?
Was my 'sermon' an exercise in futility?
Do older people in the forum need to be ridiculed by 'kids', contrary to the Hindu code of conduct?
dete hain bhagwan ko dokhaa, insaan ko kayaa chhodegen....
-
Pitch is wet.....pl dont jump .:o

[devotee]

Namaste Satay,

I have to nothing more to offer further. My only submission is that there is lot of difference between objecting to a Guru's views and abusing a Guru, calling names of a Guru. My objection is to the latter. Let me remind you that Ramkrishna was called epileptic, villain and stupid in one of the threads. You will agree with me that this can certainly be stopped without compromising on the rights of a forum member to disagree.

OM

[sm78]

My only submission is that there is lot of difference between objecting to a Guru's views and abusing a Guru, calling names of a Guru.

Well how can one dislike the taste of a food and yet like the food? How can one be neutral to a personality and yet be critical even dismissive of his teachings or the propadanda sorrounding him? So I don't see how realistically possible to be able to dismiss a person's teaching and not dismiss the person?...except by being tremendously pseudo-articulate with language. Many of us lack that ability.

What is abusive or name calling is also a tremendously subjective question.

Finally and most importantly, Guru as a preceptor is an extremely personal affair. He/she is no different from God and one's own mother. But this personal relationship is well beyond the scope of any public discussion.

However, the original proposition and debate was not around any guru. Ramakrishna may be several person's guru, but when he is critisized it is purely for his public role as a modern religious and spiritual leader. It is an extremely socially relevant topic for all hindus and any hindu has the right to support or criticize his teachings (and in the process him, particularly when he was being quoted as if his words and deeds are sabda pramana for all hindus).

The personal sentiments of him being someone's guru should not at all come into the picture - since the original objection had nothing to do with him being a guru. That role of ramakrishna had no relevance (and as I said well beyond the scope) in that discussion...yet it seems to be the main problem!

[devotee]

Well how can one dislike the taste of a food and yet like the food? How can one be neutral to a personality and yet be critical even dismissive of his teachings or the propadanda sorrounding him? So I don't see how realistically possible to be able to dismiss a person's teaching and not dismiss the person?...except by being tremendously pseudo-articulate with language. Many of us lack that ability.
What is abusive or name calling is also a tremendously subjective question.

You were objective in calling him "epileptic" and saying that he "brain-damaged" his disciples ? Are you a doctor who examined him and his disciples ??

You are much younger to me but yet you are old enough to understand how to express your disagreement without using unparliamentary language that too against a revered saint who never harmed anyone even with his words. If you defend your manners this way, I have nothing to say. You know better whether you are cheating or telling the truth.

As your comments have not attracted moderation, I have simply started avoiding your posts by keeping you on "ignore" list. Please excuse me, I am not used to either hear or use such words in my conversation with anyone ... let alone against any saint. I was not taught this way.

OM

[satay]

namaste Devotee,

I agree with you. Even when we disagree with our others we can and should maintain civility. That said often members lash out at others personally when the guru is questioned. I don't understand why that is.

I will go through that thread and edit anyone's posts that called any saint stupid etc.

Thanks for pointing that out.


Namaste Satay,

I have to nothing more to offer further. My only submission is that there is lot of difference between objecting to a Guru's views and abusing a Guru, calling names of a Guru. My objection is to the latter. Let me remind you that Ramkrishna was called epileptic, villain and stupid in one of the threads. You will agree with me that this can certainly be stopped without compromising on the rights of a forum member to disagree.

OM

[Sahasranama]

I am glad to see Ganesh Prasad back. I would also like to see sambya, isavasya and mahahrada back. I have tried to send all three of them a PM/email, unfortunately, sambya had disabled PM/email option. I have not recieved a response from the other two. But I agree with satay that they are adults and if they have chosen not to post, it's their decision. Who knows what they are dealing with. I do pity their absence, but ce la vie.

I am reading here that we should argue based on shastra and logic. But the simple fact is that when shastra and logic contradict someone, they will ignore it, or even worse, belittle you for being a westerner, a youngster, morally deprived etc or very cunningly distract you from the arguments. People have their own beliefs or gurus to protect, neither logic nor shastra will change that. Supplying references from shastra in this case is similar to putting a mirror in front of a blind man. People only use Shastra to support their own agenda these days, not to understand the real meaning of the Shastra in it's proper context. I have learned to ignore requests to quote from the shastras in heated debates. The times that I have done it, I can only regret to have placed Narayana in the form of the vedas in the middle of a discussion where people are only interesting in cherry picking evidence.

[Ganeshprasad]

Pranam satay


namaste Ganesh,

I wasn't going to continue on this thread but I can't bite my tounge (must be genetics).



Please don’t do that on my account, I am sorry to put you in this situation, if you ask I am willing to call it a day and stop this topic but it is dear to me so I will continue with your permission.




If I understand you correctly you want me to 'encourage' the members who have chosen not to post. And you have devotee's support on this.

Not directly but at least in the case off Sambya some effort can be accommodated since his banning was, if I can recall his posts, debating with Mahaharda he brought out some startling revelation about Aghori practice. My concern for Atanu is not so much as any direct plea from you but a reason to understand why he feels compel to leave or not post, at least not discourage him to come back, I am afraid many off you if my perception is correct slamming the door in his face.



The members who have chosen not to post even when their accounts are in good standing have made a personal choice for whatever reason (let's put the reason on the side for a minute). Their choice is 'I am not posting or visiting HDF any longer.' In corporate circles we call it 'making your bed' as in if you make your bed you lie on it. In other words, they have made their bed and chosen to lie on it.

In a corporate environment you will know there would be a lot off backstabbing, and if the board valued that individual then there certainly would be some consultation and not this attitude that if you want to go we can’t force you to stay.



Now, sulking about their choice, lamenting about thier choice, questioning their choice, moping about their choice is disrespecting them.

Asking me to 'encourage' them is even worse. It is like asking me to treat them like children. Do you think they are children? Do you think they are five year olds that I need to storke their ego and give them encouragement so that they can post? All rhetorical questions mind you.

I think we are approaching this from two different angle while I may be sentimental and want to encourage them to be back you are seeing them from pragmatic way and I view that as actual discouragement.



Please, I realize that I am younger and less experienced in the politics of all this but I request you all to not treat the other members like children. They don't need encouragement to do anything let alone encouragement from me. Who am I to encourage them? I am just an electron on this internet community. Why so much attachment?

Atanu has never accused me as treating him like a child, attachment is a very personal thing.




Now on the issue of guru pramapara and disrespecting gurus. Before accusing others of disrespecting gurus let me ask what the esteemed members would say about this guru. I will give you an example and I ask in advance forgiveness from the devotees of this guru because I am about to take his name in vain. Acharya prabupada of ISKCON calls lord shiva a naukar of lord vishnu. What do you think of this guru sirla prabupada? It is okay to question this guru and point out that he is wrong in calling shiva and other devta vishun's naukar because he is not from our sampradaya and start sulking and complaining when someone questions your guru? Isn't that hypocritical?

Ah my Achilles, not really, I do not agree about the servant bit and only way I can counter that is with Shastra and would not call him names. despite that I still go to Iskcon temple because I love the Kirtan and deities. Does this make me hypocrit?




There are many gurus and many sampradayas and like believer pointed out why force one member to insult your guru and why shove your sampradaya's view point down others' throat?
Why take a bait?
Let me get this right, are you inferring that it is ok to insult a guru?
Off course one must not shove their viewpoint down someone’s throat




Lastly because one of you touched on it, this forum is not about a specific sampradaya be it universalism, advaita, dvaita or whatever others that exist out there. It is a generic hindu forum for hindus. There are different sections on the forum to accomodate not only hindu sampradayas but to accomodate dharmic devotees of other faiths too. So if one is hell bent on being a pacifist and on radical universalism then they can simply post in that specific section, there is no reason to shove that down other people's throat.

I don’t get it, please be specific am I missing something?




If one doesn't agree with the rules of the forum or moderation why mop around and keep sulking, why not create your own forum or go elsewhere better suited for your needs?

Now that is below the belt!




I know that you do not agree with what I just said and I am perfectly okay with that. Are you okay with me not accepting your view point? I will leave that to you to deal with. The fact that you don't agree with my view and some members have chosen not to post for their own reasons doesn't keep me up at night.

I don’t expect anyone to agree with my viewpoint does that mean I should not express them?

Jai Shree Krishna

[Ganeshprasad]

Pranam EM


My Guru termed it 'affectionate detachment'. Please note the word 'affectionate'. Aum Namasivaya

Nice words 'affectionate detachment'



When monks or ascetics renounce the world, it is not a 'running away from' but rather a loving from a distance. Sages and acharyas practice it, and I keep it in mind just as we keep moksha in mind, yet we have not experienced it. So I am really not that detached from duties, etc., yet I keep renunciation there in the back of my head somewhere as a goal. Maybe next life time, for instance.

Well that is a nice sentiment.



For me, its a question of not being sticky and emotional about it. After all, we're not this sack of bones and emotions. We're all something deeper than that.

Sure but then why such emotional attachment to vesti?



Take my friend in Chidambaram for example. We're dropping by for coffee. It'll be a pleasant break to renew an old acquaintance. But I'm going to India to see the temples, not the people.
　
If my plans were slightly different, Devotee and I would be meeting up so I would have a great guide in a particular city, and we could share in the camaraderie of worship.
Odic (sticky, emotional, lovey-dovey) forces can be a hindrance. That's all. Nothing more.

I would love to hook up with devotee if I was near by or practicle same as if I was ever to visit Canada (unlikely) I would love to see you or Satay but that’s me.




I come to HDF for the knowledge, not the people.

We might as well surf the net gogle cerch engin and get all the answers we need but without the personal touch it is all boring, for me people are as much important as knowledge



But I am with Satay. There is no way we can force someone to return.

Who is forcing what?



For Satay, there is also the issue of confidence. I mean confidence as the root to confidential. We don't need to know why someone is banned. But here is a possibility of the way it could come about. Someone starts sending harassing PMs to Satay or to another HDF member, clearly violating the rules of HDF. Or sometimes a person sends a PM that is 'private' .

Why speculate? No ones asking satay to breach the confidence.



Do you really think any of us should then cut and paste and post that PM in the public forums. Clearly not. So because of this, we have to put our trust in Satay. Similarly if someone complains about another member, I don't think Satay should release the name of the complainer either.

And do you think I am insinuating that?
　


Also as stated before to one of the previously banned members some time back, there is always the option of starting a new forum on your own for anyone who feels this one doesn't quite suit them. I am unaware if this has ever happened. I do believe, however, that that was the way HDF itself got started. Out of another forum that had poorer moderation.

Surprise surprise Satay said some thing similar!



FYI, this city was the third coldest place on the planet about 4 days ago. A brutal -40C or so. So take heart. UK and India can't match that. No Hindu in their right mind should have to endure that. I go to temple from my house in veshti, but throw some denim jeans into the car in case the wretched machine breaks down on the way. But just walking from the parking lot into the temple is kavadi enough for me.

Thanks for the weather forecast.
Who said this world is bed of roses?

Jai Shree Krishna
　

[Eastern Mind]

Vannakkam GP:

Hmmm, I never thought of my veshti wearing as attachment, but it could be. I'll think about it. I thought it was just a matter of personal choice when going to temples, as puts me in a religious mood. But you could be right. I have been to temples dressed as the average devotee, but I don't own a leather belt so I can't do that part. I do find immodest clothing, leather, cell phones ringing, hats, etc to be disrespectful. And I think it is sort of like a cancer in how things slowly get 'looser' over time, like certain ruder words have slowly gotten into our language. So yes I do make it a point.

With the banning bit, I wasn't personally insinuating anything. I was just giving one example of why Satay may have to ban someone without letting the rest of us know the reasons why, but yes it is part conjecture.

Weather is just a off topic thing I threw in there to lighten things up a bit in this discussion. Nothing more, nothing less. It has warmed up.

Not sure where you are, but if I ever have to do a long stopover in Heathrow, maybe we can meet for coffee or tea, but since I will be your guest, you have to buy.

Aum Namasivaya

[satay]

Namaste Ganesh,

As far as I am concerned the topic is closed as I have nothing more to say than I have already in my previous posts on this thread.

Thanks,

[sm78]

I
I am reading here that we should argue based on shastra and logic. But the simple fact is that when shastra and logic contradict someone, they will ignore it, or even worse, belittle you for being a westerner, a youngster, morally deprived etc or very cunningly distract you from the arguments. People have their own beliefs or gurus to protect, neither logic nor shastra will change that. Supplying references from shastra in this case is similar to putting a mirror in front of a blind man. People only use Shastra to support their own agenda these days, not to understand the real meaning of the Shastra in it's proper context. I have learned to ignore requests to quote from the shastras in heated debates. The times that I have done it, I can only regret to have placed Narayana in the form of the vedas in the middle of a discussion where people are only interesting in cherry picking evidence.

You have taken the words from my mouth and posted them in a kind fashion ;). Shastra make sense in a guru-shishya set up when we are trying to learn something. The way Yajvan quotes shastra would be close to that set up.

But quoting shastras for debates and put up an agenda is extremely tiresome...and as you have said, even when counter statements from shastras are put up they are ignored or digressed to different points.

The problem is compounded by simple fact that shastra is sampradaya specific, as its interpretation. Also a modern approach calls for complete holistic study of a book, not 2 lines quoted from here and 3 lines from there.

But coming back to my abuse of ramakrishna, as I said, I am not always in control of my harsh tone - but those 2 words don't change the proposition, nor the objection thereof (which is one cannot criticize ramakrishna, a guru cannot be criticized etc). I should apologize for those words, but it won't matter now. But to be very clear, the word 'epleptic' was not used as a pure name calling, but as a hypothesis for his frequent samadhis at the drop of a hat. That hypothesis has been around as well and not created by me. However, as I said, I now believe that point my post would not have changed without those adjectives and hypothesis...and would still be ignored and frowned upon. But those words should surely be removed from my posts. I am not married to my posts and no problem in admitting a wrong doing.

[Ganeshprasad]

Namaste Ganesh,

As far as I am concerned the topic is closed as I have nothing more to say than I have already in my previous posts on this thread.

Thanks,

Pranam Satay


Thank you for your time and trouble.

Jai Shree Krishna

[Ganeshprasad]

Pranam EM


Vannakkam GP:

Hmmm, I never thought of my veshti wearing as attachment, but it could be. I'll think about it. I thought it was just a matter of personal choice when going to temples, as puts me in a religious mood.


Don't get me wrong I commend you for wearing a vesti or Dhoti as commonly know, yes it does add respectability and authenticity but the point was that those outwardly dress would have no meaning without this bag off bones.




Not sure where you are, but if I ever have to do a long stopover in Heathrow, maybe we can meet for coffee or tea, but since I will be your guest, you have to buy.

Aum Namasivaya

You are welcome, i will also throw in biscuits and cakes if you do. I am only about 15 miles away depending on traffic half an hour to two hours only.

Jai Shree Krishna

[Ganeshprasad]

Pranam


I have restrained myself for some time to not enter this discussion, but let us examine the banter....

Do enlighten us.



When members don't follow the guidelines set forth by the Administrator to ensure the peace and neutrality of the forum, THEY make a willful choice of not being welcome; choice is NOT made for them. This is a self-serving, indirect negative comment on the Administrator's performance. Why?

Be specific what guidlines were violated?

your observation is noted re Satay but i do no agree with you.



The problem comes when a member or a group of members gang up and try to shove THEIR sampradaye down everyone else's throat.

yes i can see that as well on this thread.

No one can or should shove a sampradaya in anyones face, i did not notice Atanu doing that, he alway qulified what he said with Shastra, anyone with any salt should counter that with shastra instead off sulking.



A tacit admission that there are no high priests and commoners in this forum?

???

and your point is?




Here is a summary of how some of us conduct ourselves in the forum:

http://hindudharmaforums.com/showthread.php?t=6417

-

thankfully these are opinions while you are at it why not add sarcasem. If you had your way Quating shastra would be banned, so furgive me if i reject your observation which are just personal to you.

Jai Shree Krishna

[sm78]

No one can or should shove a sampradaya in anyones face, i did not notice Atanu doing that, he alway qulified what he said with Shastra, anyone with any salt should counter that with shastra instead off sulking.

Since you are bringing this up multiple times, I am obliged to point this out. If you had read that thread impartially, this was done multiple times in clearest terms (and with that "crusial" shastra pramana) by Mahahrada and Isavasya. Yet in the end it was turned into a circular argumention, digressing from the original objection raised on Ramakrishna's view, coming back to the same false allegations again and again, until the tread was closed. The same sentence of Mahahrada was quoted 100 times inspite of he clarifying what he meant, and it became just a full blown ego war - with some persons unable to concede that they had no point.

Everybody has their beliefs and point of views which may not be correct in another persons worldview. But since you are time and again wrongly protraying that atanu was the only person who gives some sort of proof to what he says while others are always just talking plain rubbish, I am obliged to oppose such one sided biased protrayal.

One may have personal comradery with someone, but posts are not to be made with the person in mind. Yet you are bringing up the name of Atanu so many times who left on his own terms and indirectly undermining the other posters thus making it personal.

Lets not bring persons into the picture and their merits or de-merits. The anonymous reputation button is enough for that.

And lest this thread also turns into ego banter, I request Satay toconsider closing this thread also, and moderate my posts if required. We have discussed enough about those who have decided to leave the forum on their own terms.

[Ganeshprasad]

Pranam

I see no merit in discussing this any further with you.

If i gave you the impression that Atanu is the only one who qualified his statements with Shastra pramana then i apologize.
By speaking positive about someone i had no idea that everyone else were negative by default. you learn something new every time.

You have no idea why he left, and please do not lecture me how i should conduct my self, if you don't like it there is an ignore button

Jai Shree Krishna

[Believer]

Oh my!
Mr. Perfect is admitting that he has something left to learn?
After raising a person to the level of God incarnate, they are withdrawing his praises?
And they claim to be on a 'spiritual path?'

[sm78]

Pranam

I see no merit in discussing this any further with you.

If i gave you the impression that Atanu is the only one who qualified his statements with Shastra pramana then i apologize.
By speaking positive about someone i had no idea that everyone else were negative by default. you learn something new every time.

You have no idea why he left

Jai Shree Krishna

Here we go again :)



No one can or should shove a sampradaya in anyones face, i did not notice Atanu doing that, he alway qulified what he said with Shastra, anyone with any salt should counter that with shastra instead off sulking.

Sorry of I misunderstood you, but given the context, above looked a clear way of saying what I just said above. If not, then sorry.

[Ganeshprasad]

Pranam


Oh my!
Mr. Perfect is admitting that he has something left to learn?
After raising a person to the level of God incarnate, they are withdrawing his praises?
And they claim to be on a 'spiritual path?'

Sarcasms will get you everywhere, pity you ignore that on your list.

what is that spiritual path!

Jai Shree Krishna

[Ganeshprasad]

Pranam





Sorry of I misunderstood you, but given the context, above looked a clear way of saying what I just said above. If not, then sorry.

What looked so clear and i admit it can be confusing if the context of the message is missed, it was directly addressed to Believer and his number one sticky.

Jai Shree Krishna

[Believer]

Atanu is an esteem member of this forum, his contribution and knowledge is immense,
I fully endorse your views and would say that if we are able to resolve this issue, things would improve for better on this forum & our long time knowledgeable friends namely Atanu and Sambya may like to come back. The chorus to beg certain members to come back to the forum became deafening on this thread. I thought we were trying to get Lord Ram and Lord Laxman Themselves to come back to Ayodhya from Their Vanvaas, since everybody else here is worthless!


It may not matter to those for whom spirituality is simply a time-pass .... and a game of war of words .... but it is a entirely different matter for those who are seriously into it. Let me have a show of hands....how many members come here simply to pass time?
......And which ones of you are here to play the game of war of words?
No one? ...... I guess all of you are seriously into it then!
-

[Ganeshprasad]

pranam

Someone really needs to get a life so much hate is not very healthy.
put an ear plug if you can't handle the noise, there is an ignore button for that purpose.

Jai Shree Krishna

[yajvan]

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté

I raise my hand but have forgotten the question....

http://th1097.photobucket.com/albums/g360/dhikaeliazar/th_boy_raising_hand_desk_school_lg_nwm.gif (http://media.photobucket.com/image/raising%20hand/dhikaeliazar/boy_raising_hand_desk_school_lg_nwm.gif?o=17)

I do not recall begging any one to return - so that is not why I am raising my hand. Me thinks I am raising my hand to say I am here to share ideas...
does that count or am I mistaken?

I am here to offer what I know and to perhaps advance my views from others on sanātana dharma, yep I raise my hand for that one.

I am here to meet people from different walks of life - yep , raise my and for that one too.

praṇām

[Believer]

Someone really needs to get a life so much hate is not very healthy.
You got that right doctor.
Do you have a mirror to locate that 'someone', or should I FedEx one?

[Believer]

Yajvanji (and Saidevoji).

You don't need to raise hands or ask for anyone's permission to enter a thread. Most welcome to interject at any time to share ideas and dispense some wisdom......

-

[satay]

Admin Note

Namaskar,
Now that the thread has outlived its purpose and conversation mostly becoming personal attacks, I will close it.

If someone has a need to continue talking about this topic, please let me know and I can keep it open.

Thanks,

[satay]

Admin Note

Opening thread again so people can continue if they so choose.

[PARAM]

ॐ

When are you going to open Harjas Kaur's thread anyway, she haven't posted in a while

[satay]

namaskar,


ॐ

When are you going to open Harjas Kaur's thread anyway, she haven't posted in a while

Which thread? Can you send me the thread link?

[satay]

Namaste Singhi,

Can you send me the thread link to the one you are referring to re ramakrishna? It's been so long that I can't even remember what the original thread was about and where it is.

[sm78]

Namaste Singhi,

Can you send me the thread link to the one you are referring to re ramakrishna? It's been so long that I can't even remember what the original thread was about and where it is.

No wonder, its 6 months old (I think atanu left not directly because of this thread)...anyways here goes:- http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showthread.php?t=6049

My abusive post in particular:-
http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showpost.php?p=47206&postcount=90

I have dug all this out in last 2 days...and the original thread was about brahmins eating meat :p

[PARAM]

namaskar,



Which thread? Can you send me the thread link?

This one
http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showthread.php?p=54283#post54283