Continuation of Abrahamic Religions Subforum

[Sahasranama]

Lately there's a lot of commotion around the interreligious discussions, especially abrahamic religions. I am thinking it might be a better idea to close down the Abrahamic Religions forums for a while. I believe almost all members will agree about the irrelevance of Abrahamic religions on Hindu Dharma. If people are interested about Abrahamic faiths, I don't think they will get a lot from posting here. It only creates a lot of tension between members. It would really be a shame if people got angry and left, because of something that was said about something that's totally unrelated to Hindu Dharma. I propose to close down this subforum. Maybe it's possible to put a lock on this subforum at least for a trial period to see how it goes. I think having this subforum is an invitation to muslims and christians to post here about things we are not interested in as Hindus. They might think that these forums were opened to cater to the needs to promote their religions here on HinduDharmaForums.com. I doubt we will find many Hindu sections on muslim and christian forums. Maybe the abrahamic religions are serving as a common enemy so that Hindus won't fight between each other, but I don't think that this is really necessary. What does the rest think about this idea?

[saidevo]

I second Sahasranama's suggestion of at least having a lock on the AR subforum for sometime. As he says, those religions have absolutely no relevance to Hindus. With the number of westerners joining HDF on the increase, there is a strong possibility that all of them are not Hindus or inclined favourably towards Hindu Dharma and that it could be that these people are behind the commotion.

In addition, I strongly suggest each member to take up something from our scriptures--a shloka, mantra, stotra from the shruti or smRti--and discuss their own experiences in getting exposed to it.

Further, since many members (myself included) may not agree NOT to discuss Hindu dharma rakShaNa, a separate subforum may be created with this name and ALL discussions should be contained within that forum only.

[Sahasranama]

Further, since many members (myself included) may not agree NOT to discuss Hindu dharma rakShaNa, a separate subforum may be created with this name and ALL discussions should be contained within that forum only.
That's really a good idea. Then it will be clear that the subject of interest is Hinduism.



In addition, I strongly suggest each member to take up something from our scriptures--a shloka, mantra, stotra from the shruti or smRti--and discuss their own experiences in getting exposed to it.
That's also a great idea, better to talk about the scriptures than to constantly clash opinions about things that are in the news etc.

[Eastern Mind]

Vannakkam Sahasranama and Saidevo:

I think there needs to be some place where we can counter evangelism, or let others know about it, in the sense of protecting SD. I would be happy if there was a name change to the title ... something like "Preserving Dharma from Abrahamic Influences" . The way it stands now, if someone doesn't read the rules before posting, it just appears to be a place where indeed we can discuss these faiths, but what we actually want is only how they relate to us.

I also don't mind open minded dialogue, but there are interfaith forums on line where one can do that. Perhaps we need a LINKS section for places like that.

It is interesting to note the number of posts on the side of the main index. Certainly there is an inordinate number on the Abrahamic section, which I find rather sad.

But certainly I wouldn't be against closing the door entirely.

Aum Namasivaya

[Sahasranama]

I think there needs to be some place where we can counter evangelism, or let others know about it, in the sense of protecting SD. I would be happy if there was a name change to the title ... something like "Preserving Dharma from Abrahamic Influences" . The way it stands now, if someone doesn't read the rules before posting, it just appears to be a place where indeed we can discuss these faiths, but what we actually want is only how they relate to us. I like Saidevo's name suggestion of Hindu Rakshana, I also like the name Hindutva. I know that name has a lot of bagage, but I think it's a good name to denote to protection of Hindu culture and values.
I also don't mind open minded dialogue, but there are interfaith forums on line where one can do that. Perhaps we need a LINKS section for places like that. It is interesting to note the number of posts on the side of the main index. Certainly there is an inordinate number on the Abrahamic section, which I find rather sad. I also don't mind open minded dialogue, but as you are saying it doesn't have to happen here. In practice these type of discussions may start open minded, but almost always will create more tension between members. As you are saying, there have been an inordinate number of posts on the abrahamic forums. "Energy goes where attention goes."

[Eastern Mind]

Vannakkam Sahasranama:

I just had to look up 'Rakshana' so if that goes we should probably put 'defense' or 'protectionism' or some other word in brackets so the western fools like me know what the forum would be about.

Aum Namasivaya

[Sahasranama]

I didn't think of that, but there's a line for description under the title for the subforum.

[sm78]

I think for Indian Hindus and for Hindus anywhere for that matter "Abrahamic Religions" are one of the most important topic to be aware of from the perspective of geopolictics. It was the ignorance that had landed in the kind of soup we are suffering for a millenium. I also don't think geopolictics is something outside the domain of hindu religious thoughts.

That said, the nature of this forum is somewhat philosophical & spiritual aspects of the religion. Particularly when many Hindus in this forum feel very uncomfortable to take an aggressive stance on anything - it is only counter productive. So a time bound lock on these sub forums may be sensible.

But I think provocations comes in other areas as well.

[sanjaya]

I think EM certainly has a good suggestion about the name change. But I do think that this part of the forum should remain open. Admittedly I don't browse it that often. But I think that Christian missionary activity is a great threat to Hinduism. Those of us who live in the West know that Hindus surrounded by Christians are often targetted for conversion attempts. It's important for us to have a place to talk about this, and to discuss how we might preserve our Dharma and counter these evangelistic threats.

[TatTvamAsi]

This is a good idea however I have a suggestion.

Instead of closing this section outright, why not just allow "New Threads" that are related to PRESERVING Hindu Dharma? Instead of some nincompoop who asks, "Was jeebus an avatar" or some nonsense, we can make posts bringing out the atrocities these vermin, along with their towel-head cousins (muslims), commit on Hindus and India.

There seems to be an audacious stance by many members, especially westerners, that jeebus was a realized man, while Indian saints are somehow "fake". I can't believe such blatant prevarications are allowed on HDF.

The least we can do is defend our Dharma, our country, and our saints from these wolves in sheep's clothing.

[sanjaya]

This is a good idea however I have a suggestion.

Instead of closing this section outright, why not just allow "New Threads" that are related to PRESERVING Hindu Dharma? Instead of some nincompoop who asks, "Was jeebus an avatar" or some nonsense, we can make posts bringing out the atrocities these vermin, along with their towel-head cousins (muslims), commit on Hindus and India.

There seems to be an audacious stance by many members, especially westerners, that jeebus was a realized man, while Indian saints are somehow "fake". I can't believe such blatant prevarications are allowed on HDF.

The least we can do is defend our Dharma, our country, and our saints from these wolves in sheep's clothing.

I'd definitely agree with such a measure. I think conversations about the nature Jesus, theology of Christianity, etc. are fine, if you happen to be a Christian. To us though, none of it is relevant. Christians have plenty of online forums for themselves, no need to clutter this one with their threads. Same goes for Muslims.

Perhaps we could simply change the description of the Abrahamic Religions forum to indicate that this is where we can discuss how to protect ourselves from missionary work by Christians, as well as from Muslim culture.

I don't think Jews are any sort of threat though, so I'm not sure what should be done with that forums.

[yajvan]

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté sanjaya


Perhaps we could simply change the description of the Abrahamic Religions forum

Perhaps what is missing is the notion of how this relates to sanātana dharma ? Maybe that is where there is a blemish?

As you mention ( and I concur) there are more then enough places on the Internet one can attend if they wish a ~pure~ Christian or Muslim conversation.


I will talk to satay on this matter and see how we can better describe this folder.

praṇām

[satay]

Namaskar,

The original purpose of the subforums was two fold: 1. to discuss the abrhamic religions from the point of view of dharma and, 2. to collect thoughts, ideas etc. so that missionary activity going on elsewhere on internet by these groups could be effectively countered. These subforums are not for the promotion of those religions i.e. if a member joins solely for the purpose of promoting any religion other than Hinduism, that is not allowed and they get redirected out of HDF quickly.

Now, what's been happening lately is that some people are hiding behind multiple ids, pretending to be hindus and they start their nonsense slowly. Harder to detect but still detectable and as soon as they get detected they are redirected out.

That all being said, I am not willing to close these forums because though we haven't made much progress in this area, I think we can still achieve the initial goals that were intended for these subforums.

Edit:
One more thing I wanted to add. I am a little bit surprised to see that in the past four years since hDF's inception, I have mainly seen two kinds of hindus 1. pacifist hindus who are hell bent on accepting all nonsense of anti hindus as dharma or 2. the other extreme i.e. the angry hindu calling any non-hindu names etc. Why can't there be more of us that are of middle ground?

I fimly believe that the non hindu religions can be countered with logic thus there is no need to get angry and name calling, but I have yet to see a such a person on HDF. Actually the only persons that put their money where their mouth is when it comes to this, is our own Sanjaya and Saidevo! Kudos to them for so nicely crafting their responses to missionaries of other religions.

[Sahasranama]

I am just saying a lot of attention goes towards Islam and Christianity. Shankaracharya even said that Buddhism is too ridiculous to comment about, then what about Christianity and Islam? I agree that the missonaries form a treat to Hinduism, but that treat is mainly to Hindus living in India, because of the poor circumstances they can take advantage of. Another treat to the Hindus in India are the fake avatars. Also a lot of saints from India who have inspired westerners to call Jesus an avatar, but that topic is too sensitive to talk about here. The missionaries here in the west are a joke, there's no need to be paranoid about them. What greater treat is there than for these missionaries to occupy our mind?

[sm78]

What greater treat is there than for these missionaries to occupy our mind?

I agree, ignoring is the one of the best way to difuse ignorance. But can we not just attempt to do so without closing down the forum...

[sm78]

One more thing I wanted to add. I am a little bit surprised to see that in the past four years since hDF's inception, I have mainly seen two kinds of hindus 1. pacifist hindus who are hell bent on accepting all nonsense of anti hindus as dharma or 2. the other extreme i.e. the angry hindu calling any non-hindu names etc. Why can't there be more of us that are of middle ground?

Polarity breeds more polarity. If only the die hard pacifists were more realistic, the others would would be less extremists. If there were less irrational and false posts of the order that "all religions ultimately lead to the same goal" from esteemed hindus...extremists would not feel so outraged and backstabbed to start the name calling...thus being less extreme and angry.

I believe the same works other way round as well, and few gentle souls unable to bear the anger and hate in the posts feel repulsed and take the soft and easy stance of religious oneness.

We need less sentiment and more logic.

[Believer]

Polarity breeds more polarity. If only the die hard pacifists were more realistic, the others would would be less extremists. If there were less irrational and false posts of the order that "all religions ultimately lead to the same goal" from esteemed hindus...extremists would not feel so outraged and backstabbed to start the name calling...thus being less extreme and angry.

I believe the same works other way round as well, and few gentle souls unable to bear the anger and hate in the posts feel repulsed and take the soft and easy stance of religious oneness.

We need less sentiment and more logic.

Hear ye! Hear ye!!
Wise, wise words indeed.
I could not have said it any better.
Being a die hard scriptural pacifist and badmouthing those who may occasionally get frustrated because of their extreme pacifism and cross the line is hardly a just verdict.
Thank you sm78. << Bowing to the sage who understands human psychology so well and is not stuck on a set of rules. <<