PDA

View Full Version : Personal Self Points



MarkMe
25 January 2011, 05:40 PM
Hi,
This appears to be part introduction, but also a list of points I would want to raise on this topic, which goes into the topic of the dharma. I noticed my spellchecker thinks dharma is misspelled, but it got misspelled right.

Four points that I have organized in my mind since March of last year...

1) I would like to thank the Hindu Dharma schools for staying alive all of these years, dating back to the ancient writings of the Vedas and the Upanishads. This has made the dharma available to me. I would like to thank my teacher and a student of Swami Shyam, Zebulon (Gregory St. Onge), for putting me on the path back in 1989.

I encountered my dharma teacher as a neighbor in Stowe, Vermont in 1989. At first, I recall wanting to give this man the voice of reason in his day, but after a few weeks the things he had been saying began making sense. I took my place as his student. After a few months of this relationship passed, Zeb and I parted ways (for others of life’s callings), I continued to pursue the dharma, independently, from then until March of 2010. In looking back, I would say that contributions to this end have come primarily in philosophy (critical thinking), with major contributions from comedy, neurosis, work, the right attitude and desire, and with a little help from an unsolvable puzzle I made as a kid (Boardwalk).

2) Speaking to science… Stated in Sanskrit as chit jada granthi, the “personal self” has been available to readers as a general concept for many years, but have scientific parties considered it more specifically as a function of the human brain? Both my philosophy and my experience tell me that chit jada granthi is supported within the physical brain, as where rules and concepts are bundled into an internal, first-person thinker and point of perspective, secondary to the awareness-self. This internalized thinker is more specific than mind altogether. This bundle can become untied, after which the personal self function will no longer occur.

We could call this a “governor (function)” for the physical organism. I would hypothesize, as I have read hypothesized by others before me, that this function provides a need for its own satisfaction, or drive at all times, as well as feelings distinctly sourced by the interaction of concepts within itself. These mechanisms are hypothesized to provide stimuli to the governor for the survival of the physical organism, during its period of development after birth - a matter of which the awareness-self and an undeveloped anatomy would too easily miss, doing so with earthly intelligence. (Note: Anatomy herein is body and mind)

When the governor is satisfied, it ends itself, after which the awareness-self steps in. All other function continues without a governor function. I think scientific discovery of this function would benefit everyone, and I offer my body as one who has no personal self for agreeable assistance to that end.

3) As a seeker, I once read “don’t take the path of the philosopher”, but it didn’t say why. For years I would revolve around that question. I would like to add to that: Thinking doesn’t address the anatomy. Without personal self is without its need or inclination. Where I would call awareness-self “A-sided” and manifest existence “E-sided”, I would say that since I solved the puzzle but didn’t well address my anatomy, I find myself very E-sided. I would recommend to anyone a worthy address of the anatomy and a more A-sided habit and experience (with their inclinations).

4) As a student, I had not heard of ordinary enlightened beings; just teachers, what they taught and their schools. On the heels of my own development, I found myself not intending to be a teacher, or to have a school. I have dedicated my anatomy to the work of my predecessor – my personal self, on civil infrastructure. I’m glad, after looking up on the ‘Net, to see that regular enlightened folks appear to be recognized in India. I hadn’t heard of that and I’m glad to say it’s true. In fact, I didn’t well recognize matters outside of solving the puzzle. Now I have the opportunity to separate the large role played by one’s anatomy, as well as a good sight how important it is to purify, such as with mental and physical disciplines, a.k.a. good habits, and to develop as an exemplary being. Meditation also makes more sense now than it did before.

I am enjoying the great bounty of actuality in day-to-day living, which makes life seem wonderful, albeit less A-sided, where one might be blissing awareness most of the time. I’ll probably have some spin and be in E. I’ll be doing work, and maybe I’ll be the right person for the job. That usage of “person” is a departure from above, where I have no personal self, so I am going to refer to myself as a person anyways. We’ve all got body, mind and spirit, so that will mean I can rub off on you as a person, or in those ways.

Cheers –
Mark

MarkMe
26 January 2011, 02:13 PM
Namaste,
#2 above - re: the scientific pursuit of the personal self - I would like to make a list of things to look for. I enjoyed this from another thread here...


Saidevo Wrote (http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showpost.php?p=47761&postcount=2):
Two terms, pratyak and parAk, hold the key to the view of the Self.

• The term pratyak is a comparative form of pratyancha which has the meanings 'turning inwards, being or coming from behind, inwardly, within'. Thus 'prayak' suggests the meaning 'private'--compare 'pratyeka--each one, one at a time, singly'.

Therefore, pratyaktva indicates the perception of 'I-sense' in/of the Self. Let us note that the Self by itself does not have the 'I-sense', but when it manifests as the many it arrogates an antaH-karaNa--manas--mind and buddhi--intellect, and chitta--individual consciousness, to each manifestation, which in turn creates this feeling of 'I-ness' in each manifestation.

• The term parAk literally means 'directed towards the outer world, proximity'. It is a very common term in many Indian languages.
What I like is the line between the two. I root things in transcendent awareness as A (purusha), and manifest existence as E (prakriti). I find the simultaneity of the two as sufficient for giving rise to a third (Aham). Look at the aham rising in between, and there is also this imaginary, reflective aspect. The field of view for the rising I within is smaller - not transcendent. It governs the organism.

I listed a couple of personal self mechanisms to look for...
1) constant need
2) conflict orientation: integrity/conflict of concepts within the personal self

Do you have things to say about what to look for in a personal self - in this metaphysical system? I'm wondering what would be useful to an MD to look for.

I think of it as bundled - wrapped up, and needing to be emptied, and in the end, untied. So, when I read what is quoted above, it sounded like a circle, and as I see it, it is the circle that if you (empty it and) untie it, then the personal self within that circle doesn't happen anymore.

And then, anyone who wants to vote on something. Do you think the personal self (function) can be found in the human brain?

Cheers -
Mark

MarkMe
26 January 2011, 11:47 PM
Re: Boardwalk mentioned above...
With a deck of cards I've made these games, played them quite a bit, showed a few people how to play, and I've seen them enjoying doing so. If you like puzzles and games, I think these are good ones - they can last a long time, so they are worth trying. I think they are also dharma games as they are - for a couple of reasons, I think they can be (eternally) humbling. Maybe not. That's the part I don't know. (get it? you don't know if you can beat these games)

I've just completed a new game program for Windows, Mac and Linux. Instructions and the download are freely available at:
http://bwsgames.org (http://bwsgames.org/index.html)

Cheers,
Mark

MarkMe
27 January 2011, 10:39 AM
Re: The Brain
In another discussion, someone thought I was going to be a brain surgeon, but I have no plans for that. I have a simple thought - that there has to be something in the brain corresponding to personal self.

This is for science and medical professionals to work on. At this point, I'm just looking for interest. If there is interest in the dharma school community, then maybe that interest can be seen by the medical community. That was the thinking there. (I know I wasn't prepared to find it myself!)

Namaste,
Mark

MarkMe
27 January 2011, 02:58 PM
Ok, I found a very interesting page by (not sure who). When it gets to the point of talking about the 5 Buddhist Skandhas, I can see these as being various physical abilities. That translates as a set of abilities collectively making up the ego - the personal self. And the writer of the page breaks brain function down in a unique way.
http://crash.ihug.co.nz/~greg.c/psych.html (http://crash.ihug.co.nz/%7Egreg.c/psych.html)

(5 Skandhas at Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skandha)

The Hindu equivalent of the 5 Skandhas, or what constitute the personal self (various levels), would be I think the thing I'm looking for. Of course, there is that sticky wicket... How many different schools or ways of putting this are there?

Namaste,
Mark