Shrine photos & advice on pujas please [Archive]

Sean

09 February 2011, 10:14 PM

TheOne

10 February 2011, 02:29 PM

Make sure the candles you burn aren't from killed animals(especially cows). Now insence, beeswax, oil, and clarified butter are to my knowledge better than a generic wax candle.

Sean

10 February 2011, 07:59 PM

Hi TheOne

Make sure the candles you burn aren't from killed animals(especially cows). Now insence, beeswax, oil, and clarified butter are to my knowledge better than a generic wax candle.

Thanks. Most candles are made just of parafin wax and no longer with the animal fat tallow for strength; I haven't found any beeswax candles, and vegetable oil ones from Bodyshop are far too expensive.

sm78

11 February 2011, 02:19 AM

Hi, I've kept shrines for a few years with the gods Saraswati, Krishna-Radha, Shiva, Parvati & Ganesh and would be pleased to hear of any improvements I might make. At present my pujas run like this, though I may skip the abhishekam-

Offer food, drink and flowers (usually dried)

Burn candel, incense and oil

Perform abhishekam (with yogurt), namaskara and aarti

Read from the Gita (Maharishi translation & commentary), do TM (20 mins) and take prasad

Sean

Dear Sean,

Nice shrine you have built. I don't have much to improve on the shrine, but probably you can slowly build on the preliminary practices before puja eg:-

1. Sitting on the puja mat
2. vishnu smaran: Remembering vishnu and purifying oneself
3. Achaman: sipping water 3 times to purify self, basically continuation of 2.
4. Guru & Kundalini: Remembering Guru in sahasrara chakra and kundalini in muladhara chakra - the entire goal of sadhana is to unite these 2, hence remembering them in the very begining
5. asan suddhi: Purifying your puja mat (simple procedure: touching your puja mat recite mentally your guru mantra Or your main mantra you do japa with Or simple Om).
6. Pranayama
7. dhyana & manasa puja: A meditation of your deity or guru and offer him/her the same stuff you offer outside, mentally (the main thing is to understand the deity is in you).
8. Ahavana: Simply call these deities now to occupy the murtis/idols you have placed. This can be done ritually or by simply imagining, but not to dwell on imagination too much.

now understanding that deity occupies you and is also in fornt of you, realizing the unity externally also...continue with the external ritual you have outlined. TM or any other personal practice after puja is good.

There should be many resources on the web on these steps with appropriate rituals and mantras, but one needs to build slowly and with real feeling and understanding. Steps should not be mechanical. How much may it be technically correct, mechanical performance leads nowhere - its not worship at all.

Sahasranama

11 February 2011, 04:11 AM

I like your shrine. SM has given you good tips.

If you want to make a dia (butter lamp) instead of using candles, it's very easy, you warm up the ghee and put it in the copper holder, then you take a wad of cotton wool and make a fuse out of it. Ghee is best, but sesame oil is also allowed. I also burn candles next to my shrine, but I don't offer them.

Sean

11 February 2011, 08:24 AM

sm78, many thanks indeed for that.

Nice shrine you have built. I don't have much to improve on the shrine, but probably you can slowly build on the preliminary practices before puja eg:-

1. Sitting on the puja mat
2. vishnu smaran: Remembering vishnu and purifying oneself
3. Achaman: sipping water 3 times to purify self, basically continuation of 2.
4. Guru & Kundalini: Remembering Guru in sahasrara chakra and kundalini in muladhara chakra - the entire goal of sadhana is to unite these 2, hence remembering them in the very begining
5. asan suddhi: Purifying your puja mat (simple procedure: touching your puja mat recite mentally your guru mantra Or your main mantra you do japa with Or simple Om).
6. Pranayama
7. dhyana & manasa puja: A meditation of your deity or guru and offer him/her the same stuff you offer outside, mentally (the main thing is to understand the deity is in you).
8. Ahavana: Simply call these deities now to occupy the murtis/idols you have placed. This can be done ritually or by simply imagining, but not to dwell on imagination too much.

That's a very inspiring list, really useful and interesting. I'll start making use of a mat and begin pranayama, which I used to do before meditation, along with a set of asanas, and sipping hot water. I'll also begin incorporating 5 & 8, thanks.

Philosophically I'm especially interested in the subject to object relationship you touch on, becoming subject to subject, that the puja illuminates: internal potential and individual self becoming external universality and Self.

And indeed the enormous value of Hinduism is that it's not dogmatic or prescriptive, and I'm mindful of not having to fall into a mechanical routine.

Eastern Mind

11 February 2011, 08:28 AM

Vannakkam Sean: If you go to some Indian shops in your area, or in London, you will quite likely find many accessories such as standing oil lamps (candles aren't really in the Indian way) achamaniyam cups, and the like. But really it is the vibration you put into it, not the shrine itself. Of course it helps to have an awesome physical shrine because it motivates you more. I presume you've been through the thread of other's shrines on here.

Aum Namasivaya

Sean

11 February 2011, 09:35 AM

Sahasranama & Eastern mind, I understand there are better oil lamps than my candle contraption, and I will try to give it some though in the future. Actually I'm doing some teaching in China right now, which of course is a spiritual wasteland and I haven't seen much of the right equipment around, though there's plenty of incense.

Indeed a shrine's vibration is important, and I think it makes an impression on people when they visit my place, particularly as I moved the television set previously in the room into the junk cupboard. They don't understand of course and most never ask many questions, but I expect it percolates through their minds.

PARAM

11 February 2011, 10:46 AM

I like your Mandir

Pure Ghee is the right choice instead of candle. We always use Ghee Diya to make light, but mostly on Dharmic Days. However if the candle is from pure form, then there is no harm, but using Ghee is still better during Dharmic Days

Ramakrishna

11 February 2011, 10:18 PM

Namaste Sean,

A puja can be as simple as saying a few prayers and offering some fruit or it can be a long and extended ritual hours long ritual. What you are currently doing sounds good, and sm78 has great suggestions.

I have also found the time immediately after puja to great for meditation. The shakti at that time is very powerful, and it becomes much easier to feel the presence of the deity that you have just done puja to. Beautiful shrine, BTW.

Jai Sri Ram

Sean

11 February 2011, 10:36 PM

Ramakrishna, yes indeed. I understand that TM uses Shakti mantras, and meditating with the god is a similar intense experience as meditating with other meditators, all finding the common ground, seething within it.

sm78

12 February 2011, 01:37 AM

Philosophically I'm especially interested in the subject to object relationship you touch on, becoming subject to subject, that the puja illuminates: internal potential and individual self becoming external universality and Self.

Right to the point you have got, the steps I described are based on Shakta siddhanta, although roughly same steps are followed by everyone - difference "may be" in the understanding.

Fundamentally, shakta siddhanta says that this universe, internal and external are just contracted form of the fundamental shakti. When she contracts, the universe and the deities (both beings and stages of consciousnes) emerge, and when she expands into the nothingness everything merges into her in the process of dissolution. The full process of emergence (or dissolution) of all the deities and the universe is done in avarana puja which is mostly done externally for simplicity and concreteness. Buddhist do this internally/meditation in the Generation stage.

So in Puja first shakti occupies the worshipper and they become one. Then she occupies an external object and she, worshipper become one externally also. In the ultimate analysis there is no difference between external and internal. When one fully comprehends this the so called left handed rituals also fall into place. More than performing left handed rituals technically, I feel really comprehending (not just in intellectual analysis, which is also very important, but also in actual experience) this internal and external unity is the key.

Hence external ritual is as important as manas puja or internal worship, but in practical terms, good mental worship guarantees a good external worship.

Sahasranama

12 February 2011, 04:32 AM

Is there any difference between this shakta nothingness and Buddhist shunyata?

Sean

12 February 2011, 04:54 AM

Good stuff sm78, you have a detailed understanding of advaita on the level of the puja and the deities; moreover Shakti is the feminine that masculinity seeks unity with.

Western philosophy is deeply concerned with the structure of the subject to object relationship and the core discipline of epistemology and how it can be known that the world exists beyond the mind, etc was seriously undermined in the mid-20th century.

Subject cannot be theoretically linked to object for the reason that truth doesn�t consist in the intellect and instead of dual realms of consciousness and materiality there is ultimately only consciousness- our relationship with the world is really subject-subject and there are no epistemological gaps to bridge. (I�m also going to start a thread soon with notes I put together for talks I did last year covering this stuff...)

The darshan is the fundamental puja experience, giving one�s divine self back to oneself to enliven it.

sm78

12 February 2011, 05:01 AM

@sahasranama: I am not intimately familiar with Buddhist philosophical concept of Shunyata or emptyness. I used nothingness only as an adjective to imply the situation when creation is no more.

Shakta siddhanta does not pose any radical new concept as ultimate reality (buddhist shunyata is a different philosophical speculation on the ultimate, may be or may not be same as what we refer as brahma) - what its does however is that it changes the relationship between what we deem as ultimate and what we percieve as ordinary.

Sean

12 February 2011, 09:16 AM

sm78

By the way I carried out a Radha puja tonight including Asan suddhi, Achaman and Ahavana, very purifying indeed.

yajvan

13 February 2011, 10:54 AM

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté sean,

Hi, I've kept shrines for a few years with the gods Saraswati, Krishna-Radha, Shiva, Parvati & Ganesh and would be pleased to hear of any improvements I might make. At present my pujas run like this, though I may skip the abhishekam-

Offer food, drink and flowers (usually dried)

Burn candel, incense and oil

Perform abhishekam (with yogurt), namaskara and aarti

Read from the Gita (Maharishi translation & commentary), do TM (20 mins) and take prasad

I am happy that you are performing pūjā-s (some call yajña). When performing pūjā it is all about wholeness, fullness of Being. I see you have a good understanding of this as I read your posts in this string.

If you are open to suggestions and since we're talking of wholeness, it is recommended we use fresh flowers and avoid dry flowers. You will also find with some looking around that a pūjā consists of 16 items. This 16 is consistent with wholeness, fullness - pūrṇam adaḥ pūrṇam idaṃ - That is full (whole) this is full (whole) - īśāvāsyaupaniṣad.

Another subtle point , it would be in good practice to keep mahaṛṣi mahesh yogī's photo off of the floor, the place where feet have been. I see you have the book on the floor yet is on cloth and this is fine.

I hope you receive the recommendations in the spirit they were offered, of good intent and not finding fault.

praṇām

Sean

13 February 2011, 08:20 PM

yajvan, my thanks. About the photo, actually it's not on the floor, it's on a small glass base.

My puja is up to 12 items at the moment, but I'm always finding out more.

By the way I'm leaving town in July and the shrine is all staying where it is. I wonder if I can pass it on to my successor in the apartment here...

yajvan

13 February 2011, 10:23 PM

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namast� sean

yajvan, my thanks. About the photo, actually it's not on the floor, it's on a small glass base.

My puja is up to 12 items at the moment, but I'm always finding out more.

By the way I'm leaving town in July and the shrine is all staying where it is. I wonder if I can pass it on to my successor in the apartment here...

Please consider the following....
the śāstra-s teach us that guru is brahmā, guru is viṣṇu , guru is maheśvarāya. For this reason we do not look down ... I see mahaṛṣi-ji is not on the floor directly, yet it is best to have him on par with the other devatā. Yet do as you see fit.

Regarding the offer of 16 items or steps. This is called ṣoḍaśa upacāra pūjā

ṣoḍaśa = 6+10 or 16
upacāra = ceremony; approach , service , attendance
pūjā = worshipPerhaps you may wish to research this , and it will give you the items and the significance of each. Each offering has an inner and outer meaning.

Passing on the shrine - that is up to you, yet it would be wise to see who the next attendant will be, no?

praṇām

Sean

14 February 2011, 12:08 AM

Thanks, very kind.

Sahasranama

14 February 2011, 04:26 AM

sm78

By the way I carried out a Radha puja tonight including Asan suddhi, Achaman and Ahavana, very purifying indeed.

Very nice, if you are interested I have encoded some Radha stotras at the Sanskrit documents site: http://sanskritdocuments.org/doc_deities_misc/doc_deities_misc.html

Sean

14 February 2011, 05:28 AM

Wow, you're a scholar to be sure. Is there a particular link you'd recommend?!

Sahasranama

14 February 2011, 05:34 AM

I am no scholar, it's a volunteer based site, I have just contributed some stotras for Radha and Durga and a few puja texts for Tulasi and panchadeva.

What kind a link are you looking for?

You can find more puja texts here: http://satsangh.tripod.com/pujatexts/index.html (http://sanskritdocuments.org/mirrors/puja/deities/Default.htm)

Sean

14 February 2011, 05:42 AM

Thanks; I'm not familiar with stotra hymns but I'll try and find out more about them.

Sahasranama

14 February 2011, 05:48 AM

Sean

14 February 2011, 06:46 AM

The best way to get familiar to stotras is to listen to them. There are many audio files of stotras at www.raaga.com (http://www.raaga.com/channels/sanskrit/albums.asp)

Also, on youtube you can find a lot of stotra chanting, for example a very beautiful stotra is the Shiva Mahimna (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DOhZ-ozzXmg) Stotra. This is one is maybe too difficult to chant at first, a simpler stotra for Shiva is the Shiva Panchakshara Stotra (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UjeOYznUFlU)

You can chant these after you have offered the upacharas to the deities.

Good, that's great & I'll look them up forthwith.

One question I'll run by you: once when I was in Pushkar and once on a train in India I heard this rapid hypnotic chant whose genre I'd like to identify. It's a rapidly changing, ceaseless and virtuosic melodic line sung in unison by girls- really great stuff...

NayaSurya

14 February 2011, 07:13 AM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MwMyiDbQrjY

Shiva Tandava Stotram?

<3

Sahasranama

14 February 2011, 07:35 AM

If it was one line then it was probably some form of kirtana, but I can't say. Do you remember some of the words?

Sean

14 February 2011, 07:57 AM

No, indeed not: I suspect it was Sanskrit but may have been Hindi. I know a bit about music and this is quite unique, seemingly endlessly varied and ongoing without pause, at a steady rate. I'd take a great deal of practice I'm sure, and the girls sound like they really enjoy it- it's manic stuff.

It's the sort of thing influencing the development of musical minimalism in America and Britain from the 1960s on, and also has similar possessed onward character of the popular music.

Sean

15 February 2011, 08:50 AM

I'm wondering if there are any thoughts on me offering an alcoholic drink at my shrine. I've been doing this for a few months and quite pleased with it even if it's considered by some as impure (it's a rather pure Chinese white spirit). I guess I'd rather like to set up a Varuni shrine, the Vedic goddess who rides of course in an endless sea of inebriation, counterpart to Varuna a god of order.

Sahasranama

15 February 2011, 08:52 AM

Don't do that, there may be tantrik people who offer alcohol, but you have no business doing that without the proper guidance of tantrik guru. If you want you can offer dhatura to Shiva.

Sean

15 February 2011, 08:59 AM

Okay, sure thing.

yajvan

15 February 2011, 12:56 PM

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté

Varuna a god of order.
Yes I see how we can get to this definition... yet let me expand the idea just a bit if I may.

varuṇá means All enveloping sky and becomes the Lord of the sky and the oceans - of vastness. The sound-syllable va in and of itself means strong, powerful. Yet in the mascline genfer va is air, wind and we can then see the connection with sky. Va is also asupiciousness, and can mean dwelling.
But where does the ocean come in? With ṇa - a water house or water shed.

He is considered the Lord of infinity and hence He too must own time (kāla). He knows 'all sides'. He dwells in the vast. He is considered uru उरु -
wide , broad , spacious , extended , great , large , much , excessive , excellent. We find him early on in the ṛg ved ( 1.24 & 1.25) -
He is known as the one with wide-vision (uru chajṣasam).

It is he ( says the ṛg ved verse 1.24.8) that prepares the pathway for spiritual energy to flow into the aspirant. He is viewed as rāja varuṇa -
hence His importance to the seers (ṛṣi's ) of the ved is well established.

praṇām

Arjuni

15 February 2011, 01:33 PM

Namast�,

Sean, I had read about Varuṇa but not his consort, so thank you for pushing me towards more learning. It occurred to me, while reading, that any beverage you prepare and serve with care and joy could be considered the wine of spiritual bliss. :)

Yajvan, this ṇa as a water-house or water-shed (i.e. ocean) - without wishing to derail the purpose of Sean's post, may I ask if this is the same ṇa found in the beautiful name of Nārāyaṇa?

Indraneela
===
Oṁ Indrāya Namaḥ.
Oṁ Namaḥ Śivāya.

yajvan

15 February 2011, 03:07 PM

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté indraneela

Yajvan, this ṇa as a water-house or water-shed (i.e. ocean) - without wishing to derail the purpose of Sean's post, may I ask if this is the same ṇa found in the beautiful name of Nārāyaṇa?
When it comes to knowledge there is no derailment. This ṇa is quite profound ( to me). We talked of ṇa a bit in post 33 above and its connection to varuṇá. As you point out it is appropriately found in nārāyaṇa. Where else?

This ṇa = nirvṛti = complete satisfaction or happiness , bliss , pleasure , delight. It also appropriately means emancipation or rest, and hence we find it in nirvāṇa. And we find it in the etymology of kriṣṇa ; also ṇa is considered another name for śiva .

Yet some say ṇa = nirvṛti = nirvṛtti - and with this we arrive at a the defintion of originating , development , growth , completion & termination . Now we have the triad of brahmā + viṣṇu + śiva as the originating, development and termination agents of this grand universe.
Some say this is all contained in the idea of nārāyaṇa.
Such is the greatness of this sound-form ṇa.

http://www.dollsofindia.com/dollsofindiaimages/vishnu-pictures/narayana-with-sheshnag-QB95_l.jpg

praṇām