Just remove the 'human' part

[yajvan]

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté


There is a key idea in sanātana dharma of na-iti . This na = not and iti in the brāhmaṇas is often equivalent to 'as you know'.
Hence na-iti is not as you know, not as you perceive. This comes to be known as neti-neti.

We find this in the bṛhadaraṇyaka upaniṣad ( some write bṛhadaraṇyakopaniṣad ) the mūrta-amūrta brāhmaṇa ( form and formless).
We also find this in the avadhūta¹ gītā 1.25 :

tattvamasyādivākyena svātmā hi pratipāditaḥ |
neti neti śrutirbrūyādanṛtaṁ pāñcabhautikam ||25||

this says,
By such great sayings as that thou art ,our own Self is affirmed.
Of that which is untrue and composed of the five elements - the śruti-s¹ say, not this, not this


Hence many that are familiar with sanātana dharma come know of this saying neti-neti. So, as one looks around they can say neti-neti -
I am not this, a tree, a bush, the auto, the mountain. This may be so initially.

This neti-neti has come to mean renunciation, a moniker for renouncing the world and the sound of the recluse. While this can be applied here,
the words of na-iti is to inform the seeker that brahman is not what you see, not what you conceive.

If one looks outside one's self and goes though the process of identifying what things are not brahman , that is all fine and good and perhaps
can take some amount of time to eliminate all 'things' in the world that is not brahman. But what still remains is the person doing the eliminating!
Hence this post.

If we look at the idea of the human being, if we remove the human part, we have Being. It is this pure Being that is brahman.
If we are to remove the human part, what goes?

ego
fear, angst
likes and dis-likes
desires of all shapes and sizes
smallness of thinking, boundaries
etc.Of all these things that 'go' in part, it is the mind (collectively) that can prove to be most stubborn. Why so? because it protects it self .
It is as if the mind has a mind of its own.

This mind ( some would say ego component of mind) is quite crafty. It wishes to preserve and protect its existence. It will let you play
this game of neti-neti but as you get close to this actual insight, in which the mind-ego-individual has to give itself up, then the mind rebels.

How so? In all different ways... one I have found is the installation of fear. Fear that comes into one's awareness for no apparent reason
what so ever. Fear creates 'clinging' attachment to the known, which brings the illusion of safety. With this safe feeling, one feels again
preserved and balanced. A false sense of security from the mind for the mind to survive!

More to follow...

praṇām
words

iti - is in this manner , 'thus' ; (in its original signification íti refers to something that has been said or thought , or lays stress on
what precedes In the śatapatha-brāhmaṇa ti occurs for íti
avadhūta - one who has shaken-off from himself worldly feeling and obligation; What is shaken off? Duality.
This work is ascribed to dattātreya-jī. http://www.nonduality.com/ag.htm (http://www.nonduality.com/ag.htm)
śruti - that which has been heard or communicated from the beginning , sacred knowledge; the ved - sacred eternal sounds
or words as eternally heard by the ṛṣi-s , and differing from smṛ́ti or what is remembered and handed down in writing over the ages.

[NayaSurya]

I was reading this and mouthed the word "fear". As I approached the word in your post I smiled, as it is such a good topic. Fear is one of the strongest reasons why a being would continue to allow such limitation.

We have a very large amusement park we go to every Summer numerous times. The first times we went many years ago...the place seemed so very very large...and we became lost many times. We got separated from each other, disoriented...it was alarming.

So, because of this fear and disorientation we began to come up with coping mechanisms. We stuck to a small area, and constructed a limited area of exploration. Stuck to the path...never deviating.

Meaning...there were huge places within this amusement park we had never stepped one foot inside. But, over the years....this park has become small to us(As we learn to accept its fullness)...

We are no longer afraid...no longer become lost or disoriented.

As a child who on the first day of school becomes overwhelmed, but by the final day of school has seen and done all....we began to feel more confident. We began to be brave.

And we became brave within this amusement park and have moved through it freely since our acceptance and knowledge of it has blossomed.

We go everywhere now...have seen everything...and we are not afraid.

From my limited experience... This is one of the many ways of progression.

Sometimes it is not the knowledge or some action that is missing...but the fear of progression....and forward movement that impedes the evolution.

Becoming lost in the breadth and width of such expansive concepts, one may begin to cling to the small bits to find comfort.

But, again...with time....I have faith that we become confident enough to step beyond that comfort into the light.

What separates the Beloved Portion whom knows their origin is nothing less than the Beloved Heart of Beloved Himself, from the one who knows their origin is nothing less than the Beloved Heart of Beloved Himself?

Bravery....overcoming this fear.

Bravery is fed by fire tempered Faith.

Faith is a fuel of progress.

You have to be brave to become the one inside...not cling to those old comforts and secure but limited ways of thinking. Even if you begin to look funny to those around you...as you become still...have faith.

Beloved Shiva, dissolve this body...this space of comfort and leave nothing but this portion at Your Beloved Feet.

Hari Om Namah Shivaya

[Adhvagat]

If one looks outside one's self and goes though the process of identifying what things are not brahman, that is all fine and good and perhaps
can take some amount of time to eliminate all 'things' in the world that is not brahman.

Yajvan, sorry for the basic question, but how can anything NOT be Brahman?

[yajvan]

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté PI,


Yajvan, sorry for the basic question, but how can anything NOT be Brahman?

This is a reasonable question. Lets look at the framing of it. Recall I am saying the following - If one looks outside one's self
and goes though the process of identifying what things are not brahman ... Looking outside one's self is key here.

The notion is this - no individual finite thing can be said to be brahman in its fullness, in its identification of It as the all.
It is by this process that the intellect can go from item-to-item and discount it and say that thing is not brahman . Over time after one
looks outside, it finally leads one to the inside , to one's own level of Being. This is where fullness can be found and where one can
experience this fullness of Being.

Now each thing in the universe ( and outside of it, all things and no-thing) is no doubt brahman. Yet it cannot be captured in a single
finite thing, but is no doubt part of the whole.

When one's vision is perfect, then each thing sings the glory of the fullness of brahman, yet prior to this with blemished vision, an item
is an item, a finite thing.

It depends on which viewpoint one has. The muni that bathes in the essence of Reality, only sees this fullness, even in a blade of grass;
yet on the other side , the paśu¹ is lacking this personal and direct experience, even though he/she may be able to articulate this point of view -
it as yet not living the reality of this truth.

praṇām


words
paśu - teathered animal; 5 kinds are enumerated , men , kine , horses , goats and sheep " to which are sometimes mules are added.

[yajvan]

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté



Of all these things that 'go' in part, it is the mind (collectively) that can prove to be most stubborn. Why so? because it protects it self .
It is as if the mind has a mind of its own.
This mind ( some would say ego component of mind) is quite crafty. It wishes to preserve and protect its existence. It will let you play
this game of neti-neti but as you get close to this actual insight, in which the mind-ego-individual has to give itself up, then the mind rebels.

This mind, it continues to flow in thoughts... so many thoughts every day. Many we are not aware of; some we choose to notice, others not. Like a river incessantly flowing.

At times one takes a cup and dips it in the river of thoughts. We ( the intellect) inspects the thoughts. Do I act on these thoughts, ponder them or perhaps just pour them back into the river?

But what is this constant flow? Where does this mind wish to go , to end up? Some say that is what the mind does - it flows. Others say, yes this mind does this, but it has a purpose.

I have talked to many people who say they cannot sit and meditate because of this constant chatter in the mind - it distracts. It is difficult for them to sit and be still. That means one is constantly engaging in the chatter , no? When one comes to know the nature of this thing we call the mind, we begin to understand some of its behaviors.

Does any one have a POV on this purpose? Perhaps you are of the opinion there is none?


http://images.travelpod.com/users/garth_travel/chile_2007.1195315320.nice-flowing-river.jpg





praṇām

[NayaSurya]

I have talked to many people who say they cannot sit and meditate because of this constant chatter in the mind - it distracts. It is difficult for them to sit and be still. That means one is constantly engaging in the chatter , no? When one comes to know the nature of this thing we call the mind, we begin to understand some of its behaviors.

Does any one have a POV on this purpose? Perhaps you are of the opinion there is none?

For me the keyboard has become some form of meditation.

Not in a traditional sense but by some crazy luck...my concentration upon the keys causes something to happen. It's just enough stillness inside to cause something much higher to emerge.

I used to think it was some ghost or spirit trying to speak through me...I couldn't allow myself to even think such wondrous thoughts and songs could come from me. But I finally have begun to understand that by disarming the mind with this simple task...searching out the keys upon the laptop...something wonderful happens. The thing which helps me along is myself...

The me beyond this tangle of experiences and memories of this transient lifetime. It's is the timeless portion which has found a way to seep out despite this decaying vessel full of distractions. For at the keyboard as my eyes close and I begin to type I see the miracle happen over and over again.

Once we can begin to separate ourself from the machine/body even a tiny bit...it begins. As one chipping away at a sand castle...it will disentigrate.

It's as if the curtain slipped open upon the stage of this universe and exposed the Hand of the Master...once seen...it begins to unravel everything we once accepted as reality.


Perhaps we are given a mind, a body and location which facilitates the burning of our karma. Perhaps we are given the mind and body which compliments our movement forward?

From the most intelligent being to the disabled. Each one, so perfectly right...as each one is specifically designed to help us move past these lessons to the next.

I see the mind as perhaps three portions. One is the organic machine, two is the interconnected portions which own the experiences of this life time. Such as a car will contain our belongings until we come to remove them.

Then the third is the the True Portion. The thing which will pick up these memories one day and depart from the vehicle with joy.

As you can see, I am a confused portion and I have not gotten this fully put together. So please forgive my feeble attempts to work it out in your presence.<3

I would love to know what you know about this Yajvan, and all the other Beloved Portions residing here.

[Onkara]

But what is this constant flow? Where does this mind wish to go , to end up? Some say that is what the mind does - it flows. Others say, yes this mind does this, but it has a purpose.


Does any one have a POV on this purpose? Perhaps you are of the opinion there is none?



Namast&#233; Yajvan and all
The conundrum is that both the question and the answer (or opinion) is of the mind. So the answer depends on the beholder, in that the mind serves a purpose up until it no longer serves a purpose.

The question may arise: can one operate without thinking, without the mind?

I once heard it said that if we let the mind 'touch' such questions then we are pulled away and back into mind.

[smaranam]

For me the keyboard has become some form of meditation.

Not in a traditional sense but by some crazy luck...my concentration upon the keys causes something to happen. It's just enough stillness inside to cause something much higher to emerge.

I used to think it was some ghost or spirit trying to speak through me...I couldn't allow myself to even think such wondrous thoughts and songs could come from me. But I finally have begun to understand that by disarming the mind with this simple task...searching out the keys upon the laptop...something wonderful happens. The thing which helps me along is myself...

The me beyond this tangle of experiences and memories of this transient lifetime. It's is the timeless portion which has found a way to seep out despite this decaying vessel full of distractions. For at the keyboard as my eyes close and I begin to type I see the miracle happen over and over again.

.....
I would love to know what you know about this Yajvan, and all the other Beloved Portions residing here.

The "thing" which helps me all along is my sarvasva, G O V I N D, PArabrahma Parameshwar, Dearmost Witness, Beloved Companion, Divine Guide. As witness He stands in a corner with folded arms and casts His loving eyes without judgement. As Divine Guide He babysits, is the "culprit" behind all those "where did that poem come from ?" and "how did i know that ?" I believe He also steals in and fixes posts sometimes. As Companion Most Beloved... see the VaishNav forum for more if interested ...

Love,
smaraNam

[Ganeshprasad]

Pranam Yajvan and all


hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté


This mind, it continues to flow in thoughts... so many thoughts every day. Many we are not aware of; some we choose to notice, others not. Like a river incessantly flowing.


But what is this constant flow? Where does this mind wish to go , to end up? Some say that is what the mind does - it flows. Others say, yes this mind does this, but it has a purpose.


http://images.travelpod.com/users/garth_travel/chile_2007.1195315320.nice-flowing-river.jpg





praṇām

I don't know about the mind, what independent authority has this mind got, although it is trublesome and can be a friend, does it have a choice to guide me or force me? i don't think so, where would i wish to go or end up you ask?

yasmin gata na nivartanti bhuyah, Krishna ji advise, from where there in no return.

Jai Shree Krishna

[yajvan]

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namast&#233;

Thank you for your ideas Onkara, Ganeshprasad, Narasurya, smaraNam , some excellent points to consider.

I have a few notions to offer on this mind - see what you think.

The chāndogya upaniṣad gives us an example - the mind is like a bird :
A bird bound to a point by a string; after flying in various directions and finding no place to rest it finally returns to the point
where it is bound. Likewise , the mind having flown in various directions of interest, finding no place to rest, finally comes back to prāṇa,
because my dear mind is bound to prāṇa.

The mind by its nature is drawn here-and-there by the senses. Yet this mind is bent on looking for experiences, one after the other.
Doesn't care much what the experience is, as it is curious nature. Yet that said, what then is it looking for?

It is like a bee going from flower to flower in search of nectar, the mind is in seach of more. It is looking for more. More what?
More anything that that brings expansion. It is looking to alight on something and extract the maximum amount of nectar and move on.

But herein lies the pickle. As sanatkumāra is instructing nārada, he says, nālpe sukham asti or finite (alpa) things do not (na)
contain happiness (suka). So, the mind wishing to find more nectar , perhaps for a fleeting moment ( a minite, a day, a week , perhaps a month)
will not satisfy the mind because it is looking in the finite realm. It continues it search and we experience a restless/waivering mind.
Yet the taming of manas ( mind) is facilitated via prāṇa.
Now this prāṇa is also known as vital breath. Yet it is also interesting to note that life force (prāṇa) is also found in food. So, it is via the
breath and food intake that we influence the mind.

In yoga & in kaśmir śaivism the movement of the breath is looked at ( identifed) in 3 different ways.

prāṇa śakti
ātma śakti
prabhu śaktiWith prāṇa śakti, the movement of breath takes place automatically - part of the autonomic nervous system. We are breathing
but do not pay much attention to it. An example would be our breath in sleep - all going on automatically. Or during a conversation
no one notices the breath, or when being entertained, this prāṇa śakti is on auto pilot.

With ātma śakti we are managing the breath coming in and going out. We decide how deep, how long to hold the breath, all that.
Some call this conscious breathing. This method is the basis for many upāyae-s or techniques , found in the āṇavopāya&#185; approach.

With prabhu śakti the movement is by the grace of the Supreme. The prāṇa enters the madhyā-nādī some call the suṣumnā, the central
or principle nerve (nādī ).

praṇām

words


āṇavopāya
āṇu अणु = fine , minute , atomic is known as 'atom' - which is another name for the individual jiva.
This upāya is the means whereby the āṇu or the individual jiva uses his own kāraṇa-s or instruments i.e. senses, prana and manas for self-realization.
It includes disciplines concerning the regulation
of prana, japa, concentration, meditation, etc.

[anirvan]

neti-neti...thats not..thats not , its practice is like butter wants to come out of milk and separating gradually from rest parts of milk.

atman practices that he is not universe,not country,not human,not body,not mind,not intellect,not sense ete.. tilll it is nothing but omnipresent,omnipotent atman.

In jnana marga the sadhna is avyasa and bairagya......which ultimately developes VIVEK. there are 6 types of vivek avyas.

neti-neti is part of NITYANITYA VIVEKA. atma discriminate anitya from nitya part, that is self.
Just by sheer will power and very strong thought they are able to realize the self different from maya.

Mind is the essence of prana.it is the active tool of our 10 pranas,10 sense and intellect. just imagine electricity is mind. when it pass into fan...fan moves.when it pass into heater,it warms.

same is the case of mind which is always changing form. that is converting into sensual energy,work,into every active aspects of us.when somebody burt us,we become angry.that time mind is anger,fully converted into anger.there is no other thought.

when mind becomes still......then it is intellect(buddhi). thats why it is told that take a decision. when mind is still.that time most part of energy are inactive and converts into intellect.

if prana is milk,mind is butter. if we can controll prana,mind is easily controlled.the god of prana is Hanuman.thats why to worship Sriram,we first worship Hanuman.
prana is the life force energy in every thing - in air,water,food,in everything. so whatever we take into inside of us makes our mind. thats why its important what we eat,drink,where we live,with whom we befriended.
again pranayam is strong way to control prana.

jayaguru

[Ganeshprasad]

Pranam Yajvan and all
　
　

hariḥ oṁ
　
　
Yet the taming of manas ( mind) is facilitated via prāṇa.
Now this prāṇa is also known as vital breath. Yet it is also interesting to note that life force (prāṇa) is also found in food. So, it is via the
breath and food intake that we influence the mind.
　
　
In yoga & in kaśmir śaivism the movement of the breath is looked at ( identifed) in 3 different ways.
prāṇa śakti
ātma śakti
prabhu śakti
With prāṇa śakti, the movement of breath takes place automatically - part of the autonomic nervous system. We are breathing
but do not pay much attention to it. An example would be our breath in sleep - all going on automatically. Or during a conversation
no one notices the breath, or when being entertained, this prāṇa śakti is on auto pilot.
　
　
With ātma śakti we are managing the breath coming in and going out. We decide how deep, how long to hold the breath, all that.
Some call this conscious breathing. This method is the basis for many upāyae-s or techniques , found in the āṇavopāya¹ approach.
　
　
With prabhu śakti the movement is by the grace of the Supreme. The prāṇa enters the madhyā-nādī some call the suṣumnā, the central
or principle nerve (nādī ).
　
　
praṇam
　
　
words
　
āṇavopāya
āṇu अणु = fine , minute , atomic is known as 'atom' - which is another name for the individual jiva.
This upāya is the means whereby the āṇu or the individual jiva uses his own kāraṇa-s or instruments i.e. senses, prana and manas for self-realization.
It includes disciplines concerning the regulation
of prana, japa, concentration, meditation, etc.
　



What you offer is off great value,
Taming of mind, you speak three different sakti which we can expand on it later, what is the position off mind vis the body and the individual self.

Why do mind have such a sway after all it is Jada.
　
　
Katha Upanishad gives example off a chariot, and the charioteer and how the mind is controlled.

Katha UP
9. 'But he who has understanding for his charioteer, and who holds the reins of the mind, he reaches the end of his journey, and that is the highest place of Vishnu.'
10. 'Beyond the senses there are the objects, beyond the objects there is the mind, beyond the mind there is the intellect, the Great Self is beyond the intellect.'

Bhagvat Gita 3.42 offers the similar as above, so it is quite clear the mind although very strong, taming it, is done via budhi holding the rains.
　
　
How important is the taming of mind?

from Bhagvat Gita6.6
　
　
bandhur atmatmanas tasya
yenatmaivatmana jitah
anatmanas tu satrutve
vartetatmaiva satru-vat
　
For him who has conquered the mind, the mind is the best of friends; but for one who has failed to do so, his very mind will be the greatest enemy.
　
　
Jai Shree Krishna

[yajvan]

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namast&#233; Ganeshprasad,



How important is the taming of mind?

I think it is worthy of merit. It is by the mind that distractions come-and-go. It is the mind the pulls one here and there via desires.
It is the mind that thinks, I will pursue more, perhaps with more I will feel full, I will find the Supreme in the acquisition of more.
The mind will argue with you and not care about a conclusion - this allows it to keep on going. It does not care much if you chase your
tail and go over the same idea, the same condition again and again, it does not care.

Yet this is the issue - no matter what the mind acquires there is not enough to satisfy its thirst. Finding one's Being is not by adding
but by subtracting what one is not, hence na-iti is not as you know, not as you perceive.

What are you not? Big, small, likes, dislikes , fear, anger, etc. - all these things reside in the mind say the wise. So it is removing,
not adding , is the approach. Just as sculptor takes away all the stone that is not the final statue, one can pursue their true Being.

Now, some see this mind as the ~enemy~. I do not. I see it as a tool to assist me ( the best I can). There is no benefit in beating-up
the mind as it will only revolt again and again. So , one needs a technique, an approach to use the mind to one's benefit - and as I
have found so often it takes time, skill, patience and persistence . The wise call earnestness - my teacher called it one-pointedness.


It is the wise person that learns how to go beyond the mind. To leave the mind - thus enters spiritual practices or upāya-s.
This includes the breath as we discussed ( briefly) in post 10 above. Are there other ways? No doubt, yes.

This is the recent insight I am wishing to truly absorb:

the clearer you understand that on the level of the mind you can be described in negative terms only ( e.g.neti-neti), the quicker will
you come to the end of your search and realize you are the limitless Being... śrī nisargadatta maharāj



praṇām

[Ganeshprasad]

Pranam Yajvan

We should here take the Katha UP example you say mind pulls one here and there in fact you know it is the senses that pulls one here and there. Senses if not checked would cause havoc, mind with the help of budhi puts the charioteer on course.

But you are right it is the mind that convince the jiva despite budhis better judgment impels us to act.

In my opinion mind is nothing but minefield of information, once one desires the mind comes in to play, it gives us from simplest to more complex solution. Sometimes it is not possible or practical to fulfil that desire at that moment so it stay as a backburner , it is with experience over a long period of time one will pursue a desire or not with or without, the consideration of consequence.

Why desire what is desire? It is a state everyone seeks, is to be happy this is the mad rush everyone off us are seeking here and there, the mind has only the temporary solution but the soul seeks that which does not perish with time. Chewing the chewed that is all that we do there is no real happiness.


As galib writes
hazaaron Khvaahishen aisii ki har Khvaaish pe dam nikale
bahut nikale mere armaaN lekin phir bhii kam nikale
Roughly translated,
thousand of desires are so that each one exhausts one,
A lot off them comes to fruition yet does not satiate.


So what Upaya or solution are there, there is no need to go against the tide but with constant meditation remembering that we have been there done it so it is time to give faith to budhi control that mind, give it a rest so to speak, engage that mind in real happiness, seek the good and not the pleasant.

With constant practice what ever the spiritual practice one follows will help one find that goal from where there is no return. Be that Japa meditation, doing service to humanity, going to temples, observing fast on auspicious day like Shivaratri will all help eventually to give up those desires that bind us in this sansar.

Jai Shree Krishna

[yajvan]

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namast&#233;




Of all these things that 'go' in part, it is the mind (collectively) that can prove to be most stubborn. Why so? because it protects it self .
It is as if the mind has a mind of its own.
śrī nisargadatta maharāj:
Restlessness takes you nowhere. Something prevents you from seeing that there is nothing you need... Its like swallowing some poision
and suffering from an unquenchable craving for water. Instad of drinking beyond all measure, why not eliminate the poison and free from this burning thirst.

In this example the ~poision~ is the time-bound, limited view of being human. If we remove the 'human' part, then all that remains is
Being. So, one may say I will renounce, I will relinquish all. I will approach this condition via vairāgya&#185;. This no doubt is a noble cause,
but if done on the level of the ~mind~ without the direct personal experience of Being, of becoming established in Being (rūpātitā&#185;),
we still remain tied up in being human. We still are the limited, we have not moved out of the constraining condition.

praṇām


words

vairāgya - we know means the removal or indifference to worldly objects and to life; it also means change or loss of color , growing pale
rūpātitā = rūpā+ati+tā : rūpā = having the form + ati = beyond, surpassing + tā = crossing

[yajvan]

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namast&#233;

The mind, motion, movement

So, here is the pickle as I see it. We are born into nature. This nature by its own nature is movement, motion, creation. Our body-mind complex
is part of that.
Even if we look at the saṃskṛt word for nature, it tells much:
prakṛti - nature , character , constitution ; 'making or placing before or at first'; the original or natural form or condition
pra + kṛti

pra = filling , fulfilling - as it is rooted in pṝ , defined as 'to grant abundantly'
kṛti = the act of doing , making , performing , manufacturing , composing This prakṛti is abundantly doing and composing. It enjoys creating, multiplying, unfolding, expanding abundantly.

Hence we as human beings should not shrink from this condition. The whole universe is subjected to this expansion and creation -
we experience it on the level of the mind with streams of thoughts, ideas, and the like.

It is said, na hi kaṣcit svnadmin ātmani muhūrtam avatiṣṭhate or, there is nothing that exists in its own form even for a moment .
This is the behavior of prakṛti.

Yet there is a part of us that is beyond the incessant movement and that is the Being part of us.

Now, some of the wise would take issue with what I have said e.g. 'we are born into nature'. They would propose your body is born
into nature, you are not the body. Hence begins the conversation on who ( some say the what) we really are.
To be anchored to the body , one will be whirled around by nature, taken here and there as we experience this via our minds and
the multiple thoughts we encounter every day. Become anchored to Being, and we reside in stillness, in silence.

The wise say, you can have both... you can be within the world of change, yet be anchored to your true nature of (sattā) Being.
This then becomes the notion of Unity. One has united diversity with the silence of Being. One then experiences the unity of all
things in the mist of diversity - the essence of a spiritual / balanced life.

praṇām

[yajvan]

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namast&#233;

Mind, breath, food



Now this prāṇa is also known as vital breath. Yet it is also interesting to note that life force (prāṇa) is also found in food. So, it is via the
breath and food intake that we influence the mind.
If we go a bit deeper into this idea, we can gain insight from the chāndogya upaniṣad , 6th chapter (prapāṭhaka - a lecture ; also a chapter).

The food we eat gets separated out as three

Food: the coarsest part becomes waste, the middling part becomes flesh and the subtlest part becomes mind.
What we eat is composed of the tattva-s, yes? In turn we are composed of these tattva...
Water : (āpaḥ) also separates into 3 , waste, blood, and prāṇa. There are other elements ( tattva) we can refer to but these
two are part of the next story.

In the chāndogya upaniṣad an aspirant of truth śvetaketu ( a śiṣya or student) is instructed to fast for 15 days, but drink water as he pleases.
After the 15 days he approaches his father (as his teacher) as says what whould you like my to say? His father, āruṇi-ji , says you may recite
the verses of the ṛk, yajur and sāma ved. Śvetaketu responds and says, I cannot recall them .

And Why so? It is the nourishment of food that feeds the mind. Without it we are left without a vigorous mind/memory.
We are are brought down to one amber of a big bonfire, says āruṇi-ji.

Śvetaketu's life force , prāṇa, remained because he drank water for the 15 days, yet it was not fueled by food so one would be
bright as the bon-fire. Hence how fasting/food is connected to knowledge, mind and memory... without a strong mind learning is difficult to achieve.

Prāṇa & anna in the praśna upaniṣad -

The guru here is pippalāda-ji&#185; talking to his śiṣya-s or students and says the following:

He (puruṣa) ~created~ ; The word used in the śloka is asṛjata. This sṛj is to to emit , let go, pour forth , shed , cause to flow ;
jāta is born , brought into existence ( as ja is birth, produced or caused by ) . He then discusses prāṇa and anna (food).

From prāṇa came :

śrāddha defined as faith or true, loyal
kha or vacuity , empty space , air , ether , sky ; another name for ākāśa
vāyu or air, gas, wind - some say vital air
jyotis or fire, some perfer light as the specific name
āpas or water; some say āpa - this is from āp to occupy, pervade as does water it spreads and pervades
pṛthvī - we know as earth, solid
indriya - the sense organs; this could include both the organs of perception and the organs of action
manas - mind . It is my assessment this means mind, intellect and ego facilities
and anna - foodFrom food came:

vīrya - vigour , virility , vitality
mantra - hymns in the broadest sense; sacrificial formula; that portion of the ved which contains the texts called ṛc
(some prefer ṛk or ṛig), yajus or sāman ved.
karma - actions
loka - can be defined as divisions, levels of existence. Let's go a little wider:
3 lokas are commonly called out - heaven , earth , and the atmosphere or lower regions.
loka also has another meaning here as it is defined as the faculty of seeing , sight . So, all that can be seen.
We can used ~seen~ as comprehended. So, loka takes on a huge vista of ideas.
lokeṣa is loka +eṣa - it is considered seeking within the worlds or planes of existence . I am not clear on this notion and continue
to look for a more comprehensive description on this.
nāma - names. Why names? It is every thing that can be seen and unseen, can be given a name. Knowledge and mantra are
transmitted by names. Hence the robustness of nāma.
praṇām

references

Pippalāda-ji's lecture is found in the 4th sloka of the 6th chapter of the praśna upaniṣad as he calls out the 16 kalā-s offered to his 6 students .

[yajvan]

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté


Mind -'this' and 'that'
We have gone quite a ways without saying what mind is. Perhaps it would would be good to define mind, before the idea of this and that is offered.

Mind = manas = in its widest sense can be considered intellect , intelligence , understanding , perception , sense , conscience or the faculty or instrument through which thoughts. It is not unusual to separate out the instrument of thought from intellect (buddhi), as well as memory , from the definition of the mind. It is always good to start with some definition. The point is we can define it and refer to the definitions as needed.

So, I wished to call some attention to the notion of 'this' and 'that' as the arena where the mind is most attracted to. What do I mean? When we have thoughts ( and the ones we pay attention to) they're of this notion:


this place, this time, this moment, this house,car, place, family, job, friends, wife, husband, boss, bike, sky, ocean, etc.
that house, that idea, that old neighborhood, car, pants, shirt, shoes, dog, cat, hole, rail, wind, rain, etc.Its the notion of identifying this or that in the mind in time and space. But note what is absent ? The notion of 'now'. Now never ceases yet the mind gravitates to a condition of past or future. Even if I say 'this moment' it becomes in a millisecond 'that moment' and is now in the past.
This is where the mind lives... in 'this' and 'that'. It is as if consciousness is fragmented into slices. In Reality full consciousness ( citi meaning a heap, collection) is not fragmented. Yet when we experience it as human beings it takes on the nature of apohana śakti :

apoha = to strip off , push away , to remove
na = the dental nasal sound found after certain consonants
śakti = we know as energy; some wish to know this by personalities - śrī devī as indrāṇī , vaiṣṇavī, brahmāṇī , kaumārī , nārasiṃhī , vārāhī , māheśvarī , cāmuṇḍā, caṇḍikā, etc.Hence this apohana śakti is the energy that 'strips off' or makes things appear as different between objects - 'this' and 'that'. But strips off from what ? From the whole, from the one-ness. That is, the distinction between things i.e. 'this' and 'that', we perceive or experience. This
distinction is done by śiva as part of the unfoldment in creation.

This is what I wish to talk about in the next post or two, but wanted to start here with the framework. The notion is there is an underlying unity, but we constantly dabble in the differences, and it is where the mind is attracted to.


praṇām

[Onkara]

Thanks for continuing this topic, Yajvan-ji. :)
I don't wish to 'jump the gun' but I wonder if it is 'ego' (ahaṃkāra) specifically which does the slicing into this and that which you refer to above?

[yajvan]

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namast&#233; Onkara ( oṁkāra अूंकार )


Thanks for continuing this topic, Yajvan-ji. :)
I don't wish to 'jump the gun' but I wonder if it is 'ego' (ahaṃkāra) specifically which does the slicing into this and that which you refer to above?

We will see and let you decide if ahaṃkāra ( I doer , ego) is part of the mischief. By its name (ahaṃ+kāra) it suggests it takes 'I' , in this case the Universal (citi from the last post) and makes it think it is doing.

More in the next few posts...

praṇām

[yajvan]

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namast&#233;

In between 'this' and 'that' (see post 18 above)
During 'this ' and 'that' there is vikalpa or mental occupation, variety, thinking. Nothing new here, yet here is the idea I wish to offer.
When there is a cognition of perception occuring of an object or event, there are two components:

The object of attention;
That of which attention is made of - consciousness or awareness.Now what I find interesting is the notion vikalpa. One on hand viklapa is considered thinking, mental occupation. Yet on the other
hand vikalpa is defined as an intermediate kalpa&#185; , the interval between two kalpa-s. That is, between a measurement of time.

Here is the point to consider. As the mind alights from one object and then begins to pursue another yet does not yet land on the other object
( or thought, or idea) there is this vikalpa period in between. Here there is no mind only awareness itself. Hence one can arrive at nirvikalpa.
And what is that ? Nirvikalpa निर्विकल्प = not wavering , free from change or differences , not admitting an alternative. The mind is no more
for that slight period. It is a thought-free state of knowing.

It's said in the īśvara pratyabhija&#241;ā kārakā-s That awareness is present even in an instant of perception. When the name and form are
taken out from the experience what shines through is that of pure awareness (some like to call pure consciousness) or prakāśa (light, splendor).

So, why does this interest me? It is though stabilizing nirvikalpa that one becomes stable in the Self. In this slight vikalpa period, there
for a short time, tells me it can be there for a long time. It is this notion that many techniques (upāya-s) are built upon. To extend this period
of nirvikalpa so one can see it is not foreign to the experiencer, that is is part of our basic constitution is the intent.

http://www.joeydevilla.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/bright-light.jpg


praṇām

words

kalpa = a period of time ; a day of brahmā or one thousand yugas; a month of brahmā is supposed to contain thirty kalpas.
According to the mahābhārata twelve months of brahmā constitute his year , and one hundred such years his lifetime ;
fifty years of brahmā's are supposed to have elapsed and we reside in the śvetavārāha-kalpa of the fifty-first year.

[yajvan]

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namast&#233;

Continuity between 'this' and 'that'


That is, between a measurement of time. Here is the point to consider. As the mind alights from one object and then begins to pursue another yet does not yet land on the other object ( or thought, or idea) there is this vikalpa period in between. Here there is no mind only awareness itself. Hence one can arrive at nirvikalpa.
And what is that ? Nirvikalpa निर्विकल्प = not wavering , free from change or differences , not admitting an alternative The mind is no more for that slight period. It is a thought-free state of knowing.


Now for me this is quite interesting. This awareness provides continuity of being, of perception for us. What do I mean - continuity ?
Let me explain by an example.

Say we're viewing a movie . The 'frames' that pass by the light go by one at a time. But since it is done in a smooth succession, we do not see the transition from one frame to another. In between frame 5 and 6 ( and any other frame) there is no picture, just the frame or border of the picture, but the light from the projector continues to shine for that moment. This light is prakāśa (light, splendor) or consciousness that continues. It continues all the time, wake, dream, sleep. It is the fundamental part of one's being, of life, some say awareness itself.

So think if each frame did not have this continuity behind it. Each frame as it passed by would be interrupted, choppy. Like the old movies from the
1920's - flickering on the screen. Think of it. For each time a perception occurred ( going say looking at a tree, then looking at an auto) there was no continuity. One would see a tree , then the nervous system would halt perceiving from the eyes and then start again once the auto was in view.
Or listening. One listens to music, the music ends, and the next shound does not occur until it arrives at the ears
( say the sound of an airplane overhead) What a choppy life we would have , no?

It is this prakāśa that affords us the smooth-ness of perception. Yet if we are acutely silent & aware of this 'gap' one can come to appreciate
this prakāśa found in-between of 'this' and 'that' .


http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c106/karebearfreak772/filmthing.jpg


praṇām