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realdemigod
22 March 2011, 11:05 AM
Hello all,
I try so hard to stop eating non-veg but I'm unable to give up. Though I have controlled the intake I'm still struggling to give it up entirely. Is there any effective way of slowly giving up?

PARAM
22 March 2011, 11:09 AM
Hello all,
I try so hard to stop eating non-veg but I'm unable to give up. Though I have controlled the intake I'm still struggling to give it up entirely. Is there any effective way of slowly giving up?

What is your devotion all about ? Are you asking so much from ॐ ?

Give up, just like I did.

Pray your deity with pure heart, and you will start hating all kind of Adharmic deeds.

sunyata07
22 March 2011, 01:43 PM
Is there any effective way of slowly giving up?


Namaste,

If you have been living most of your life with a meat-based diet, I can understand why you might be experiencing some difficulty with changing to a wholly veggie diet. Some find it very easy, others will find it exceedingly difficult to stick by because of attachment to baser sense pleasures like the taste of meat. Try to look at it as objectively as possible. It made me quit eating meat and non vegetarian foods a lot faster that way. Ask yourself: Where did this food come from? What exactly is it that I am ingesting? Whose life was snatched away to be placed inside my mouth and stomach? Were they frightened at the time of their death? Did I know this soul in another past life? If you start looking at your diet in this light, it might help to erode the foundation you might have that has been built solely on tastes and perception of meat foods.

Perhaps you could start by cutting out meat a little bit here and there everyday for a week. I don't mean going cold turkey all at once (excuse the pun!), because, like I said before, it might make cravings all the more intense if you have struggled to stay on a vegetarian diet. Start looking at what you eat everyday. What could you cut out? In the morning when you have breakfast, look at your plate and leave out the meat portions. Do this for a week. Then repeat the same course of action and add to that your cutting out meat in your lunch, then dinner, etc. This gradual deprivation of meat might make it a lot easier. I know it helped for me when I changed my diet. You slowly realise that going with meat foods isn't actually all that difficult if you take it one step at a time.

Of course, meditation and prayer will assist with this, so continue with it regularly if you can. May Lord Ganesha remove any obstacles that might impede your spiritual progress.

Om namah Shivaya

charitra
22 March 2011, 02:19 PM
Namaste all. There was a thread here recently, that clearly states that vegetarianism is not a mandatory requirement of hinduism. Non veg eating is NOT unhindu, for clarity. Cow slaughtering IS unhindu.Some Bengali and Kashmiri Brahmins eat nonveg. Majority hindus are nonvegetarians, believe me.
That said, vegetarianism is encouraged and recommended. I hope you all notice the difference and not to remain guilty and bogged down for no serious reason. shanti :)

smaranam
22 March 2011, 02:59 PM
Namaste RealDemiGod,

Congratulations on your first step - icchA. It is indeed daivI (like a RealDemiGod) to be vegetarian. I can point to some discussions we already had:

Try these steps, while adding healthy alternatives (legumes, nuts, flax etc.) as discussed here:
http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showpost.php?p=40041&postcount=9

0. Talk to, pray to the Lord asking for help with the resolution. Without Your Grace, how can i possibly overcome this ? Not a blade of grass can move without Your Will.

1. Give up red meat - very easy ? Outside and at home.
2. After 2 weeks, start giving up poultry, at least at home. Gradually, as you become more knowledgeable of alternatives, outside as well.
3. After 1 or 2 weeks give up fish
4. A few weeks later - your judgement - give up eggs. This last seems hard for some, and we talked about it here: http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showpost.php?p=40466&postcount=8

Wish you all the best, and with BhagvAn's grace you will never want to go back.

Jai Shri KrushNa

praNAm

realdemigod
22 March 2011, 07:41 PM
thanks everyone for your suggestions

Ramakrishna
22 March 2011, 09:14 PM
Namaste Realdemigod,

Considering that I became a vegetarian at age 9 and I was never much of a meat eater to begin with, I can't offer you much advice. It was a pretty easy process for me. But I can definitely understand how this might be a difficult process people who are used to eating a lot of meat or have been eating meat for a long time. Sunyata and Smaranam offer great advice. Something I would reiterate is to at least try to cut out all beef from your diet first and foremost, if you do eat beef. Keep in mind that Mother Cow is highly revered in our religion. Then you can work on cutting out other meat products. Good luck and I pray for your success.

Jai Sri Ram

Ramakrishna
22 March 2011, 09:20 PM
Majority hindus are nonvegetarians, believe me.


Namaste Charitra,

Are you sure about that? I know that probably most of the members of my family eat meat, but none of them eat beef, only chicken and turkey for the most part. But they are not very devout Hindus and some of them are pretty much non-practicing. But I always thought that at least the majority (over 50%) of Hindus are vegetarian. I can imagine something like that would be difficult to determine exactly, but I always thought that the majority are indeed vegetarians. Do you have a source or anything to back that up?

Jai Sri Ram

Adhvagat
22 March 2011, 10:45 PM
Namaste all. There was a thread here recently, that clearly states that vegetarianism is not a mandatory requirement of hinduism. Non veg eating is NOT unhindu, for clarity. Cow slaughtering IS unhindu.Some Bengali and Kashmiri Brahmins eat nonveg. Majority hindus are nonvegetarians, believe me.
That said, vegetarianism is encouraged and recommended. I hope you all notice the difference and not to remain guilty and bogged down for no serious reason. shanti :)

The first thing that I suggest to people is to become vegetarian. Usually they also start becoming more interested in Hinduism after adopting a vegetarian diet. In my opinion it has to do with the gunas, eating dead animals is very tamasic and creates a clutter of heavy energy on people.

If one is having difficulty stop eating meat? Realize meat is a dead animal. Realize there are great rajasic and sattvic foods made of vegetables that taste great! Realize again meat is a dead animal. :)

Last time I researched more than 50% of India is vegetarian. That's an expressive number!

murugan
22 March 2011, 10:47 PM
Hello all,
I try so hard to stop eating non-veg but I'm unable to give up. Though I have controlled the intake I'm still struggling to give it up entirely. Is there any effective way of slowly giving up?

I gave up non-veg at the age of 12. I just prayed to god that "I have made my mind to give up non-veg, god you only have to help me in this."

From that time till now am leaving a vegetarian life.

So its all in your hands realdemigod, just set your mind towards it and keep on practicing vegetarian food. You will surely achieve it.

devotee
22 March 2011, 11:12 PM
I try so hard to stop eating non-veg but I'm unable to give up. Though I have controlled the intake I'm still struggling to give it up entirely. Is there any effective way of slowly giving up?

It is easy. Just don't take it one time, the next time ! That is all !

Every craving has a set pattern. All cravings are acquired. They are all effects of our conditioning. Anything gives me only as much pleasure as I attach importance to it for my enjoyment.

Actually, you get rid of any craving if you learn how to be with God through meditation, japa, bhajans etc. If that is difficult, you may try this :

a) Don't do it just for once i.e. the next time. Just let the moment of temptation pass. Leave that place where the temptataion is ... eat something else immediately so that the satisfaction of hunger kills the craving for any other thing.

b) Thoughts take us towards our objects of cravings. Thoughts make you restless and make you believe that "you would be more happy when you have it". Reason against that thought : "How temporary that saisfaction is. The taste of the meat doesn't last on your tongue even for a minute when you eat it. Why have a craving for an enjoyment of just a few minutes ? Why should I allow my happiness/enjoyment to be dependent of a few minutes of slavery of my taste buds ? If I can't be happy renouncing a few minutes of dependent enjoyment ... how can I be happy ? A time will come when I won't be able to enjoy ... this temptation will not die out ... but burn me with flames of desires."

If I want to be happy all the time ... then I must reduce the dependence of my happiness on other things external to me.

OM

anirvan
23 March 2011, 02:28 AM
my suggestion is very practical. Replace equally or more that equally better,tasty veggi food.you will start hating non-veg. because the peace you will get with good veggi will be missing in non-veg.

still i am trying it :)

rajputistan
24 March 2011, 09:16 AM
I would have given up non-veg, but I don't recognize that Hindu Dharma advocates veg. Only one sect of Hindu Dharma- 'Jainism' advocate vegetarian diet. Most hindus like that idea.

I have two good proves:
1. It is written in veda- 'Living being eats living beings'. Both plants and animals are included in it.
2. Lord Rama going to hunt deer for Mother Sita. This proves that 7 thousands years ago all do eat meat.

But what Hinduism advocates that we are free to believe what we like(if it isn't bad :P) so both cultures would prevail.

sanjaya
24 March 2011, 10:29 AM
I realize I'm not going to be of much help since I grew up in a Brahmin house and have never eaten meat. But have you tried non-meat substitutes, i.e. veggie burgers and similar things? I have them all the time; can't say if they taste like meat, but I like them. Whenever I go back home and make them, my mom always complains that they stink up her kitchen with the smell of meat. So I imagine that this might be a helpful transition.

yajvan
24 March 2011, 12:27 PM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté

All of the suggestions above are excellent and address the intellect. We can call this the right-hand path.

If this path does not work ( and you will know), then one can choose the left-hand path. What would that be in this case?
Address the emotions.

One could do any of the following:

go to a butcher shop and just observe how meat is prepared
go to a meat processing house and observe what occurs from the time an animal enters to the time it leaves
process and prepare your own meat - from its origin to your tableThe notion is this:
When one goes to McDonalds® they see 'happy meals' being served - this is the farthest from the truth.

We are very far removed from how an animal is treated, processed and prepared. If one observes what occurs, you now know what happens -
you are no longer at the end of the food chain. You get up close and personal. Then the emotions are engaged.

http://www.exploreveg.org/i/outreach-for-animals-week-2008-logo-1/image_preview



praṇām

PARAM
24 March 2011, 12:35 PM
Namaste all. There was a thread here recently, that clearly states that vegetarianism is not a mandatory requirement of hinduism. Non veg eating is NOT unhindu, for clarity. Cow slaughtering IS unhindu.Some Bengali and Kashmiri Brahmins eat nonveg. Majority hindus are nonvegetarians, believe me.
That said, vegetarianism is encouraged and recommended. I hope you all notice the difference and not to remain guilty and bogged down for no serious reason. shanti :)

Not true, you should read Vedas, Upnishads, Shastras all prohibits it

There are three kind of meals-
Satvic - Sweet, Milk and pure food.
Rajas - Salyu, bitter.
Tamas - Toxic, spoiled and Non Veg.

Those 'Majority' you are talking about are not devout. You will not excapt Non Veg served as Prasadam / Prasad even in Kashmir Hindu Temples.



I would have given up non-veg, but I don't recognize that Hindu Dharma advocates veg. Only one sect of Hindu Dharma- 'Jainism' advocate vegetarian diet. Most hindus like that idea.


Thats not true, Jainism took Vegetarianism from Dharma, anti Hindus do not believe it.

I have two good proves:

[QUOTE]1. It is written in veda- 'Living being eats living beings'. Both plants and animals are included in it.
Entire Nature is to be protected, don't you know about agriculture rules provided in Vedas ? Those plants are made by om as the meals, but animals, birds etc are not for meals.



2. Lord Rama going to hunt deer for Mother Sita. This proves that 7 thousands years ago all do eat meat.

Do you have any proof in his entire life, in Forest or n the Kingdom when Ram or others ate non veg ? He went to capture the Deer, not to hunt it.



But what Hinduism advocates that we are free to believe what we like(if it isn't bad :P) so both cultures would prevail.

First read Dharma Granthas, Vedas, Shastras, Upnishads etc then come to saying anything about Dharma.

You have the Username Rajputistan, then you must Remember Vegetarian Rajputs where mostly devotees of Durga then any Jain Tirthankar. Krishna Devotee Mira was also a Rajput, she was daughter in Law of Great Rana Sanga.

smaranam
24 March 2011, 05:35 PM
Namaste

If that helps, here is PETA's MEET YOUR MEAT (http://www.peta.org/tv/videos/celebrities/87206203001.aspx) video - disgusting, i could not watch it, and do not know what it shows. It used to be on Peta's home page, so simply links to peta.org and their Veg Starter Kit , i thought , would suffice.

Like others said here, i only give advice by trying to put myself in people's shoes when they say they find it hard to give up meat. So, the advice may not always work or may be superficial.

I grew up with fish and poultry as a small part of a mostly vegetarian diet. My decision to turn vegetarian came very late, completely from within, and all of a sudden overnight, with practically no input or influence from outside. It was so obviously by KrushNa's grace - the moment He walked into my life - as if the two things were incompatible. I could relate to the plight of the animals - freedom and right snatched away, imprisoned. Interestingly, this never occurred earlier. Just shows how consciousness is covered !

Some time after that KRushNa led me to His devotees on the net ; learned about tea, coffee, soda, chocolate, onion, garlic, mushrooms and tossed them all out immediately.
Onion garlic - i was more than happy and eager to "toss out of the window". A long-term instant-coffee lover, i gave up coffee overnight because it made so much sense. It actually shocked my family that i gave up coffee.

So it was all due to Him. In any case He is the one who works behind the scenes.

So if that MeetYourMeat does not repulse anyone on this path (i don't see how) all the more reason to hand yourself over to the Lord. Another point - do you plan your vegetarian menu ? Because many do not know what to eat (other than "rabbit food" - lettuce tomatoes etc. The key is to have the right balanced meal, beginning with substitutes first, then going off to the mainstream wholesome.

Now, my Kamalnayan MadhusUdan, when O when will You help me give up that late afternoon snacking, if You think i am not sincere about it, please make me sincere, and if that requires will from me, please grace me with that will. Not a blade of grass ... yes i know You know

praNAm

Eastern Mind
24 March 2011, 05:57 PM
Vannakkam Realdemigod: Meat is not an addiction like tobacco or alcohol or a prescription medication. There will be no physical withdrawal symptoms. Those of us who have quit smoking or some other physically addicting substance will vouch for that. So the situation is primarily psychological. I see it all the time in the Hindu community I live in. My carnivorous friends all intellectually understand the health and other arguments for becoming vegetarian but for some odd reason just won't. They are vegetarian only on those days that they wish to go to temple. Its quite the conundrum, and frankly I have difficulty relating as I went cold turkey from a redneck western Canadian steak eating meat loving diet to vegetarianism. It was easy. Far easier than quitting smoking, which I've also done.

There have been many good suggestions put forth. Personally, I don't do the disconnect thing. Meat equals flesh to me. Back in the first days of vegetarianism, I thought of eating flesh ... yuch!

But its far more than giving up meat. For me, white sugar, white bread, too much oil, and white rice are also huge problems in the Indian diet. Although I drink coffee, eat onions and garlic, and other root vegetables, I avoid white rice like the plague. So there are also different dietary views on it.

Best wishes in the transition.

Aum Namasivaya

Sahasranama
24 March 2011, 06:16 PM
I have a similar experience to EM. When I was 12 I gave up eating meat cold turkey (or should I say cold tofu). If you think about it like EM said, eating flesh, there's no way you want to eat that stuff again.

Hinduism encourages vegetarianism in many instances, but hardly stands on a soapbox condemning people who eat meat. This is only the case in Jainism, not Hinduism/Buddhism where the question is left open for the individual to decide. As many already know there are a lot of Buddhist monks who eat meat, but most Hindu monks are vegetarian. It does not help to scare anyone into vegetarianism, when it doesn't come from your heart, you will be eating meat again very soon. I have seen this in other people. Making nutrition decisions out of fear/ guilt may also develop some unhealthy phobias about food.

If you are going vegetarian for health reasons, I have to dissapoint you. There is no scientific evidence that a healthy diet with a moderate amount of animal products is any less healthier than a balanced vegetarian diet. It might even be easier to eat healthy when you are not vegetarian. It can't be said that this is the "western" view of medicine, even ayurveda recommends meat eating in many instances. Vegetarians no doubt will have to put more effort into their diet in order to stay healthy. But the question of vegetarianism is not about health, unless you have some rare disease that requires a vegetarian diet. Vegetarianism is about compassion for animals. Only become a vegetarian if you are willing to make that sacrifice for the wellbeing of other living beings, but don't forget your own wellbeing and remember to eat healthy when you do become a vegetarian.

About brown rice, if you can digest it, it is healthy for you, if not than it can be an irritant in the digestive track. So there's no need to filify white rice, when eaten in moderation it can be a great addition to any diet. Also fats (including saturated fats) need not to be filified either. Healthy fats are very important for proper functioning of the endocrine system, there's no question about that. Yes, the average Indian diet is not that healthy with the large amount of vegetable oil used for frying. Healthier cooking oils include ghee and coconut oil, olive oil should only be eaten raw.

charitra
24 March 2011, 07:29 PM
Namaste all,
Ramakrishna and Pietro, I don’t have any statistics available with me, its more from random sampling if you will, from my observation of classmates living in hostels/dorms throughout my school years and friends etc..
Param, I don’t argue with Vedopanishads, that’s where I draw a line for myself. A steadfast vegan is adopting the hindu tenets of ahinsa and daya to the last letter. Admirable and to be encouraged indeed. Is Veganism a Testament? Not sure.
The One and Rajputistan, please note Rama, on Sita’s request, had tried to ‘capture’ the golden deer alive in the forest, not to ‘kill’ it for food. Sita wanted to raise the trophy animal in her little garden. Lives of both have changed forever! :mad:
Should you decide to go absolute vegan then please do comply with the daily requirements of proteins. ;)
Shanti.

smaranam
24 March 2011, 09:43 PM
Namaste


Namaste all,
[FONT=Calibri][SIZE=3]Should you decide to go absolute vegan then please do comply with the daily requirements of proteins. ;)
Shanti.

To ShantiJi's good advice, i would add B12, calcium and Vitamin D. If you replace milk with fortified Soy Milk, 1 glass a day will give the protein, B12 and calcium, plus, increase leafy greens and legumes for calcium - spinach, kale, chard... Add tofu occasionally but not too much.

*** To absorb the calcium, go out in the Sun and get lots of Vitamin D.

Then add a dash of occasional fortified almond, rice and coconut milks. Coconut helps with Ph balancing (acidity). Also makes milk-based recipes tastier at times: Halwas, Laddoos, Cakes, Cookies (http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showthread.php?t=5636)

Some countries may not have fortified non-dairy easily available. Tofu also takes care of the protein and calcium. Indian markets have Indianized Soy milk - mango and pistA flavors :)

Adharam madhuram Hrudayam madhuram MadhurAdhipater akhilam madhuram

praNAm

smaranam
24 March 2011, 09:53 PM
WARNING: MAke sure the Soy milk does not have isoflavons - too much of it is not good.

Gopa madhura gAvo madhura MadhurAdhipater akhilam madhuram ~

Ganeshprasad
25 March 2011, 10:52 AM
Pranam

many good advice here.
all i can say is if one kill and eat it's own pray perhaps there is no paap in it, there no real good reason to eat meat for those who understand the laws off Karma and the value off food.

it has been suggested that there is no restriction in Hindu dietary requirement, well i would not like to argue that point here because the OP is asking for tips to give up meat, so there is no need to encourage that subject here.

open up a new thread if there is interest to discuss if shastra sanctions meat eating, sure Vedas do say one living entity is food for another but one must also remember ahimsa and make a balance choice. a human can certainly survive and thrive on vegetarian food but a meat eater would not live very long without veg. if we want mercy and i sure do then i have to learn to be merciful.

Jai Shree Krishna

Eastern Mind
25 March 2011, 11:06 AM
a human can certainly survive and thrive on vegetarian food but a meat eater would not live very long without veg. if we want mercy and i sure do then i have to learn to be merciful.

Jai Shree Krishna

Vannakkam Ganeshprasad: I agree with moving the shastric arguments for or against meat eating to another thread, or continuing over where one already exists. But I just wanted to tell you an interesting diversion. The native indigenous peoples of Canada (and I assume elsewhere) made sure to eat the stomach contents of animals such as deer and caribou that they killed. This is where they got much of the dietary balance (vitamins) from. I'm not sure whether the stomach contents would be considered vegetarian or meat. Meat is just mostly muscle, whereas the contents of an animal stomach would be partially digested grasses and mosses, and I can see how one could argue that it was vegetable.

Aum Namasivaya

PARAM
25 March 2011, 11:20 AM
A steadfast vegan is adopting the hindu tenets of ahinsa and daya to the last letter. Admirable and to be encouraged indeed. Is Veganism a Testament? Not sure.


Dharma is clear calf is first child so claf should be allowed to drink milk first, after it reast of the milk is Mother's gift for the world.
Vegan depends on the situation, if milk industries use adharmik tactics, and you have no other source of Milk, then better be Vegan, or you are drinking robbed milk which belongs to calf. If Dharmic rules are supported, like in Hindu Goshala, then drink Milk, it is Mother's gift from Om.



all i can say is if one kill and eat it's own pray perhaps there is no paap in it, there no real good reason to eat meat for those who understand the laws off Karma and the value off food.


it has been suggested that there is no restriction in Hindu dietary requirement, well i would not like to argue that point here because the OP is asking for tips to give up meat, so there is no need to encourage that subject here.

Of course it is pap, You where arguing with me last time if animals can attain moksha, where is your knowledge about Ramayan now ? Valmiki himself accept it is adharm, and animals also have rights.



open up a new thread if there is interest to discuss if shastra sanctions meat eating, sure Vedas do say one living entity is food for another but one must also remember ahimsa and make a balance choice. a human can certainly survive and thrive on vegetarian food but a meat eater would not live very long without veg. if we want mercy and i sure do then i have to learn to be merciful.
Provide those verses, are those for human too ? A Lion can eat a bear, a bear can eat a goat, and goat is vegetarian but Human cannot eat any of them.

Jai Shree Krishna[/quote]

yajvan
25 March 2011, 11:27 AM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté EM


whereas the contents of an animal stomach would be partially digested grasses and mosses, and I can see how one could argue that it was vegetable.
Aum Namasivaya

I see this from a different vantage point. To do this the animal must be killed. This same argument could be used for killing an elephant for it's tusks.
The elephant was not eaten so no harm , no foul ?

These arguments, while mildly academic, the animal remains dead.

The point (for me) is not how healthy I become from the consumption of other beings, but the level of grief, hiṃsā¹, that is left behind.

praṇām

words

hiṃsā हिंसा - injury or harm said to be of three kinds :
mental as bearing malice
verbal as abusive language
personal as acts of violence

kd gupta
25 March 2011, 11:32 AM
Veda prohibits meat eating...17/1 ch yajurveda
Bold art thou. Cast away the Corpse-consumer. Drive off
the fire that eats raw flesh, O Agni.
That which makes offerings to the Gods bring hither.
Firm art thou. Make earth firm. For the foe's slaughter I
set thee on, devoted to the priesthood, devoted to the
nobles and the kinsmen.

Eastern Mind
25 March 2011, 11:35 AM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté EM



I see this from a different vantage point. To do this the animal must be killed. This same argument could be used for killing an elephant for it's tusks.
The elephant was not eaten so no harm , no foul ?

These arguments, while mildly academic, the animal remains dead.

The point (for me) is not how healthy I become from the consumption of other beings, but the level of greif, hiṃsā¹, that is left behind.

praṇām

words
hiṃsā हिंसा - injury or harm said to be of three kinds :
mental as bearing malice
verbal as abusive language
personal as acts of violence

Vannakkam Yajvan: I agree with you totally. I was just saying, 'the argument could be made' not that I was making it.

Still I have more empathy for the hunting and gathering carnivorous nomads of the past who really didn't know any better than those now who do, or should - from the knowledge so readily available about many different pros of vegetarianism, including ahimsa as the foremost one.

Aum Namasivaya

PARAM
25 March 2011, 11:38 AM
Veda prohibits meat eating...17/1 ch yajurveda
Bold art thou. Cast away the Corpse-consumer. Drive off
the fire that eats raw flesh, O Agni.
That which makes offerings to the Gods bring hither.
Firm art thou. Make earth firm. For the foe's slaughter I
set thee on, devoted to the priesthood, devoted to the
nobles and the kinsmen.

Thanks, you already know Vedic rules
I was wondering, when somebody ask for becoming vegetarian, why other come in to oppose it in the name of Dharma Granthas ? Lying about Dharma Granthas is totally unacceptable.

Ganeshprasad
25 March 2011, 11:40 AM
Pranam EM


But I just wanted to tell you an interesting diversion. The native indigenous peoples of Canada (and I assume elsewhere) made sure to eat the stomach contents of animals such as deer and caribou that they killed. This is where they got much of the dietary balance (vitamins) from. I'm not sure whether the stomach contents would be considered vegetarian or meat. Meat is just mostly muscle, whereas the contents of an animal stomach would be partially digested grasses and mosses, and I can see how one could argue that it was vegetable.

Aum Namasivaya

Yes i did consider Eskimos and such people thus i said in my opening line "all i can say is if one kill and eat it's own pray perhaps there is no paap in it" i do not know what other diet they would have excess to.
but we are not taking off them are we?
today five fruit and veg is what the general advise is to have a healthy life at least that is what they are pushing here in UK.

Jai Shree Krishna

PARAM
25 March 2011, 11:50 AM
"all i can say is if one kill and eat it's own pray perhaps there is no paap in it"


perhaps ?

So you are not sure about it yourself, in this case do not ask others it is like to kill and eat themselves.

Sahasranama
25 March 2011, 11:51 AM
Veda prohibits meat eating...17/1 ch yajurveda
Bold art thou. Cast away the Corpse-consumer. Drive off
the fire that eats raw flesh, O Agni.
That which makes offerings to the Gods bring hither.
Firm art thou. Make earth firm. For the foe's slaughter I
set thee on, devoted to the priesthood, devoted to the
nobles and the kinsmen.

This verse is for casting off the fire that cooks raw food in the kitchen (laukagni) and the fire that burns corpses at cremation (chitagni) in order to invite the ritual fire to worship the gods (devagni). It's not a prohibition against eating meat. I am all for people becomming vegetarian, I am one myself, but it's not mandatory according to the veda samhitas. It is recommended elsewhere though.

Eastern Mind
25 March 2011, 12:18 PM
Pranam EM

today five fruit and veg is what the general advise is to have a healthy life at least that is what they are pushing here in UK.

Jai Shree Krishna

Vannakkam: That's interesting too. In Canada (Canada Food Guide) its 8-9 servings per day compared to 2 of 'meat and alternates' . So the countries cannot agree, but that's pretty normal I would say. Doctors certainly can't agree. My daughter had one doctor advise her to give up the vegetarianism. About two months ago she was diagnosed with Celiac's (gluten allergy basically) and has since modified her diet accordingly. Now she looks incredibly healthy.

I do hope Realdemigod gets to read all this.

Aum Namasivaya

yajvan
25 March 2011, 12:19 PM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté EM


Vannakkam Yajvan: I agree with you totally. I was just saying, 'the argument could be made' not that I was making it.

Still I have more empathy for the hunting and gathering carnivorous nomads of the past who really didn't know any better than those now who do, or should - from the knowledge so readily available about many different pros of vegetarianism, including ahimsa as the foremost one.
Aum Namasivaya

Yes, I see your point that the argument ' could be made'... and I know you are not making it. To me, it seems benthic.

Now that said, and with all of my noble words offered ,what if I were in the same condition of the hunters and gatherers. What would I do?

Would my will to perpetuate the body's existence thrive more then my beliefs of proper action (ahiṃsā) ? It is very easy for one to make choices inside a home that is at 72º and with a kitchen supplied with food.

praṇām

Eastern Mind
25 March 2011, 12:31 PM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

Now that said, and with all of my noble words offered ,what if I were in the same condition of the hunters and gatherers. What would I do?

Would my will to perpetuate the body's existence thrive more then my beliefs of proper action (ahiṃsā) ?



Vannakkam: I'm just grateful to Siva that I am no longer put in hypothetical situations such as this. :)

Its a bit like the mystical experiences we speak of. You'd have to be there in order to truly realise what your actions would be. I have no idea what I'd do and I don't want to find out.

Aum Namasivaya

smaranam
25 March 2011, 12:48 PM
Would my will to perpetuate the body's existence thrive more then my beliefs of proper action (ahiṃsā) ? It is very easy for one to make choices inside a home that is at 72º and with a kitchen supplied with food.

praṇām

Namaste YajvanJi

I always think of this and hence, Thank You Lord, for bringing humanity to this point where agriculture is so advanced as everything else, and Thank You for this comfortable air-conditioned cave.

We simply "think" this and this product "should be there" and lo and behold food is available in the market - we think "organic" and the prices are slowly closing up on the regular. We want to say no to milk and the nicely flavored alternatives spring up in the neighboring isle as the same price.

Yet there are downsides to advancement like factory farming and genetic engineering,

Precisely why, Parameshwar has given so much, wake up humanity, do not dwell in factory farming!!

---

On another note, is being a vegan complete ahimsa ? It will never be as we always destroy living organisms while tilling soil, planting, ploughing, cooking, grinding cutting (5 aparadhs),

So ONLY PRASADAM - Naivedya offered to the Lord is free of ahimsa. This does not necessarily mean a ritualistic offering, but simply gratitude from the heart is enough.

In BG Chapter 3 - KRushNa says one who cooks for himself ... implying gratitude.

praNAm

kd gupta
25 March 2011, 12:56 PM
This verse is for casting off the fire that cooks raw food in the kitchen (laukagni) and the fire that burns corpses at cremation (chitagni) in order to invite the ritual fire to worship the gods (devagni). It's not a prohibition against eating meat. I am all for people becomming vegetarian, I am one myself, but it's not mandatory according to the veda samhitas. It is recommended elsewhere though.
ok. How is it ?
mā kasya yaksha sadam id dhuro .....13/3/rigveda 4......Go never to the feast of one who cooks non veg .

Sahasranama
25 March 2011, 01:20 PM
That's a prayer for agni not to go to the yajna of the person who is a himsaka according to the translations of Pandit Srirama Sharma. I think it was Swami Dayananda who translated yaksa as meat eater, but yaksas were actually spirits who were occasionally benign and occasionally evil, according the puranas there are different kind of spirits: gandharvas, apsaras, charanas, kinnaras, yakshas, rakshasas, daityas and danavas etc. There are also pauranik/agamic rituals for moving away yakshas, rakshasas, bhutas and pretas before puja similar to this vedic one, for this purpose the bell (ghanta) and conch (shankha) are used. I have been to many pujas, but the meat eaters didn't leave after hearing the sound of the bell and conch.

yajvan
25 March 2011, 01:27 PM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté smaranam



Namaste YajvanJi
On another note, is being a vegan complete ahimsa ? It will never be as we always destroy living organisms while tilling soil, planting, ploughing, cooking, grinding cutting (5 aparadhs),
Yes, I concur. As much as we wish to cause no harm it is here , part of life itself.
We live on a stable planet. It is blue, with plenty of water, we are graced by its calmness. So, here and there there is a earthquake, some big rains, all that. Compared to the Universe our planet it tame.
In the deeps of space galaxies collide, there are suns that explode daily, there are black holes swallowing billions of ton's of matter per second, yet on this isle of earth we move along unperturbed. A meteor crashes now and then, or a solar flare erupts and one cannot use their cell phone. We are blessed and some forget this. Just this little blue ball falling in space.


http://www.gitma.org/earth2-browse.jpg

Ganeshprasad
25 March 2011, 01:30 PM
Pranam


perhaps ?

So you are not sure about it yourself, in this case do not ask others it is like to kill and eat themselves.

This what happens when the context is lost one jump to erroneous conclusion. anyone who knows me on HDF would know, how passionate i feel about vegetarian.

As i said before this thread is not about vegetarian its about how to give up for those who are used to eating meat in that context it would be reasonable for me to suggest killing their own pray see how many those who eat non veg would be able to do that?

i do not know what paap would be incurred to those who have no other choice. why they are born in those condition and where would their Karma take them.

Jai Shree Krishna

charitra
25 March 2011, 02:27 PM
@ GANESHpRASAD,
" Yes i did consider Eskimos and such people thus i said in my opening line "all i can say is if one kill and eat it's own pray perhaps there is no paap in it" i do not know what other diet they ..”[/font]

Namaste. Agree. For Polar cap dwellers non veg remains the only food choice available for them, unless we with our daya guna (compassion) air drop those much prescribed vegetables year long. Paap (sin) is a strong word and cannot be handed down loosely, individual’s situation need to be given its due consideration. A guy/gal who was raised a vegetarian is not in the same situation of one who was raised a non vegetarian.
That’s where one ought to exercise caution and scrutinize the shastras for many exceptions to this ‘veg only’ rule, after all Kshama (foegivenness) is also an indispensable hindu tenet. Vithanda vaada would have to yield path to Tarkha (logic) and one should keep away from Vitarkha .
Read the 70s book or see the 90s movie ‘Alive’, a stunning true story that shook me to the core, I was disturbed for a longtime, and at the end I forgave the young Uruguayan players wholeheartedly. Life is different and cruel from what an ideal itihasa depicts it to be. I would be careful to downsize the thread owner and instead urge him take his own course at his own pace. Vegetarianism is kind but non veg are equally hindu. I have that much belief in Vedas. Om Shanti.

Ganeshprasad
25 March 2011, 05:34 PM
Pranam




Namaste. Agree. For Polar cap dwellers non veg remains the only food choice available for them, unless we with our daya guna (compassion) air drop those much prescribed vegetables year long. Paap (sin) is a strong word and cannot be handed down loosely, individual’s situation need to be given its due consideration. A guy/gal who was raised a vegetarian is not in the same situation of one who was raised a non vegetarian.

paap sure is a strong word but if you notice i did not prescribe it to anyone, use of the word 'perhaps' which incidentally got me in to trouble with Param differently, such is the power of vak.

agree everyones position or journey is at different level and thus karma has different affect yet it spares no one.
as we say the day begins when we wake up.



That’s where one ought to exercise caution and scrutinize the shastras for many exceptions to this ‘veg only’ rule, after all Kshama (foegivenness) is also an indispensable hindu tenet. Vithanda vaada would have to yield path to Tarkha (logic) and one should keep away from Vitarkha .

trouble is exceptions becomes a rule then we loose site of Dharma.
i am at a lost as to whom and why we need this Kshama, i am not disputing it is a great quality.



Read the 70s book or see the 90s movie ‘Alive’, a stunning true story that shook me to the core, I was disturbed for a longtime, and at the end I forgave the young Uruguayan players wholeheartedly. Life is different and cruel from what an ideal itihasa depicts it to be.

Yes i remember this incidence, desperate situation required desperate action, Jiva jivasya jivanam: that is what came to mind. i was asked what would i have done? i remember saying i prefer to die. life sure is cruel and we have to make very difficult choices.



Vegetarianism is kind but non veg are equally hindu. I have that much belief in Vedas. Om Shanti.

Being vegetarian is not enough, Vedas teaches different people at different level its not my job to decide who is a Hindu,all i know is Lord Krishna says;
Bhagavad-gita (9.26) Krishna (God) says: "If someone offers Me with love and devotion a leaf, a flower, a fruit, or a little water, I will accept it."

it is quite clear for me, what Lord Krishna desires off his devotees.

Jai Shree Krishna

kd gupta
25 March 2011, 09:46 PM
That's a prayer for agni not to go to the yajna of the person who is a himsaka according to the translations of Pandit Srirama Sharma. I think it was Swami Dayananda who translated yaksa as meat eater, but yaksas were actually spirits who were occasionally benign and occasionally evil, according the puranas there are different kind of spirits: gandharvas, apsaras, charanas, kinnaras, yakshas, rakshasas, daityas and danavas etc. There are also pauranik/agamic rituals for moving away yakshas, rakshasas, bhutas and pretas before puja similar to this vedic one, for this purpose the bell (ghanta) and conch (shankha) are used. I have been to many pujas, but the meat eaters didn't leave after hearing the sound of the bell and conch.
बुज्ह्हे की काम अगिनि तुलसी कन्हु विषय भोग बहु घी ते .
We should think in affirmative , one may say that 1 kg ghee shall extinguish the candle flame..no , not like that .
दुर्लभ देह पाय हरि पद भज करम वचन अरु ही ते .
मन पछितैहै अवसर बीते ....विनय पत्रिका

Sahasranama
25 March 2011, 09:54 PM
It is not my purpose to dissuade the topic starter from becomming a vegetarian, as GP has said these posts are probably a little off topic, but I can't help myself, the veda samhitas do not prescribe vegetarianism. Actually animal and even human sacrifice is part of the vedas. Other shastras do speak of vegetarianism though. Swami Dayananda blindly stared at a limited subset of vedic samhita text for the answer to all questions, this made him see things that have never been there in the first place, like vegetarianism. To make up for posting so much off topic, I'll give some on topic advice. It might be easier to give up eating meat if you do it together with a friend or relative.

PARAM
30 March 2011, 11:33 AM
This what happens when the context is lost one jump to erroneous conclusion. anyone who knows me on HDF would know, how passionate i feel about vegetarian.

As i said before this thread is not about vegetarian its about how to give up for those who are used to eating meat in that context it would be reasonable for me to suggest killing their own pray see how many those who eat non veg would be able to do that?

I agree with this, but Dharma Granthas do not allows it.



i do not know what paap would be incurred to those who have no other choice. why they are born in those condition and where would their Karma take them.

Of course there is

Even Valmiki agrees it is Pap to kill for food. His own Ramayan is proof, you where the one who who supported Animal rights through Ramayan, even they can attain Moksha, now you should know


-----------

It was you who made Radhakumud blog in support of Hindu vegetarianism?

Don't blame Dharma Granths for your personal thinking; it is Bible that support non Veg

The term sacrifice has been loosely used in the English language to express the term Yajna and Bali.

KD Gupta has gives you true knowledge, accept it or reject it but I will not go into your words again.

In Hinduism offering even a leaf is enough, but Christianity does not resist non Veg - This I learnt from you... But

Vedas never accept killing animals in Yajna, or Non veg (even egg) as meal - This you will learn from me.

achintya
09 October 2011, 02:23 PM
Hello all,
I try so hard to stop eating non-veg but I'm unable to give up. Though I have controlled the intake I'm still struggling to give it up entirely. Is there any effective way of slowly giving up?


Why do you try to give up? There is nothing in Hinduism that forces you to give up meat.

If you have to, you will lose the taste naturally. My father does not take meat now but used to eat in his youth.

I don't know from where you have got this idea that taking meat is some sort of sin in Hinduism.

If it is, then the last tens of thousands of generations of my ancestors were never Hindus and also those of all the Kshatriya and Shudra communities of India.

ohhcuppycakee
20 October 2011, 01:41 PM
I wish to become a vegetarian as well. It is pretty easy for me as of now though since according to my religion I can only eat halal meat anyways and there aren't very many halal restaurants or stores here. I eat meat on occasion, but I am trying not to. It would be a lot easier if I just knew how to cook.

Eastern Mind
20 October 2011, 05:04 PM
Vannakkam cupcake: Is that a pet name? I am still hoping you can change your font color to a more readable one.

Not to pry, but why is it that you don't know how to cook? My guess is you are in a situation where someone else does all the cooking. Learning to cook is easier these days with the internet, and its something you're going have toi do some day anyway, so maybe now is a time to start. Vegetarian coking is downright fun if you have the attitude and curiousity conducive to it.

Best wishes.

Aum namasivaya

ohhcuppycakee
20 October 2011, 06:08 PM
Vannakkam cupcake: Is that a pet name? I am still hoping you can change your font color to a more readable one.

Not to pry, but why is it that you don't know how to cook? My guess is you are in a situation where someone else does all the cooking. Learning to cook is easier these days with the internet, and its something you're going have toi do some day anyway, so maybe now is a time to start. Vegetarian coking is downright fun if you have the attitude and curiousity conducive to it.

Best wishes.

Aum namasivaya

I changed it, I changed it, lol. Hmm. I guess, kind of...?

Well, I just never learned. My mother never taught me and she's not exactly the best cook anyways. I want to learn how to cook things I actually want to eat, mainly South Asian and Mediterranean food, actually. Hmm. Well, my fiance actually went to CIA and works as a cook, so he does most of the cooking...And I tend to eat out a lot.

Ramakrishna
20 October 2011, 07:54 PM
Namaste cupcake,


I wish to become a vegetarian as well. It is pretty easy for me as of now though since according to my religion I can only eat halal meat anyways and there aren't very many halal restaurants or stores here. I eat meat on occasion, but I am trying not to. It would be a lot easier if I just knew how to cook.

One of my roommates was a Muslim from Kuwait, and when he was in the United States he was a vegetarian since it was too hard to find halal meat. I suppose if things are going well for you like this, then it shouldn't be hard to give up meat altogether, regardless of how the animals are slaughtered. Also, a lot of restaurants nowadays have at least one vegetarian/vegan option available, although it would definitely be better if they were more widely available and more choices.

Jai Sri Ram

Eastern Mind
20 October 2011, 09:21 PM
Vannakkam: Ramakrishna, I believe the vegetarianism thing really depends on a couple of factors: where you live and market demand. For example, most, if not all of the MacDonalds, Burger Kings, etc., in Canada offer veggie burgers. However, I didn't find the same in the US especially in the great plains areas like Montana or the Dakotas. Perhaps in urban areas it's different. So I make it a point to complain a bit when and if the opportunity arises. Make it known to the manager that if there was a veggie burger option, you'd buy it. Or even write to the corporate offices. All I can say when travelling is 'Thank goodness for Subway". On the other hand, a direct talk to many restaurant owners, especially small private owners, and they are often more than willing to come up with a veggie 'sumthin or uther' right on the spot, even if its not on the menu. So this slowly changes the subconscious. Or even say, "I'm sorry, but since you don't have any vegetarian options, I guess I'll have to eat elsewhere."

Aum Namasivaya

anisha_astrologer
20 October 2011, 11:28 PM
it can be easy if u try to feel the pain a chicken or a goat or a pig or any livestock may feel when you kill them and cut them into pieces. i have known people who stopped eating meat after they saw how these creatures were killed and cut into pieces.

Jainarayan
21 October 2011, 08:48 AM
Namaste all.


Bhagavad-gita (9.26) Krishna (God) says: "If someone offers Me with love and devotion a leaf, a flower, a fruit, or a little water, I will accept it."

it is quite clear for me, what Lord Krishna desires off his devotees.

Jai Shree Krishna

I know that verse is used to underscore and encourage adoption of vegetarianism, but I don't interpret it as being for or against vegetarianism or any dietary injunction. I take it to mean only that Lord Krishna will accept even the smallest thing as a gift if it's done with love and devotion.

Jainarayan
21 October 2011, 08:58 AM
Here's an irony for me in becoming vegetarian.

I have no problem giving up meat, fish or eggs. Rather, it's the wheat products, even whole wheat, I am having a problem with. To make matters worse, I am insulin resistant and very likely gluten-intolerant. Yet, I crave them.

I use the rice cooker to make combinations of rice (btw, brown rice has no more nutrients than white rice, just more fiber) or quinoa, legumes and vegetables. I am also using whey protein again.

I'm not supposed to because of hypothyroidism for which I take medication, but I've begun using soy products... veggie burgers, veggie chili, etc. (I kind of dislike the word "veggie", it sounds so cutesy :p ). I'm going to have to see what effect this has on my thyroid blood tests.

I don't think it's dificult to eliminate meat, fish or eggs as long as you plan and think outside the box.

Ramakrishna
21 October 2011, 11:22 AM
Namaste TBTL,



(btw, brown rice has no more nutrients than white rice, just more fiber)

Interesting, I've actually heard differently. White rice is created by removing the bran and germ portions of brown rice, and that process not only results in loss of fiber, but also vitamins, magnesium, and other minerals, as well as compounds that protect against diabetes. With these things removed, consumption of white rice can lead to increased blood sucrose levels which can lead to diabetes.

Really, the main reason that manufacturers put the rice through this process and created white rice is because it can be stored longer. But brown rice is more natural and better for the body. It is also a whole grain, which is very healthy and the consumption of which is greatly lacking throughout the world.

http://diabetes.webmd.com/news/20100614/brown-rice-vs-white-rice-which-is-better

Jai Sri Ram

Jainarayan
21 October 2011, 11:37 AM
Namaste Jai Sri Ram.


Namaste TBTL,



Interesting, I've actually heard differently. White rice is created by removing the bran and germ portions of brown rice, and that process not only results in loss of fiber, but also vitamins, magnesium, and other minerals, as well as compounds that protect against diabetes. With these things removed, consumption of white rice can lead to increased blood sucrose levels which can lead to diabetes.

Really, the main reason that manufacturers put the rice through this process and created white rice is because it can be stored longer. But brown rice is more natural and better for the body. It is also a whole grain, which is very healthy and the consumption of which is greatly lacking throughout the world.

http://diabetes.webmd.com/news/20100614/brown-rice-vs-white-rice-which-is-better

Jai Sri Ram

I like WebMd, good article. I guess it depends on who you talk to, or read, and what the agenda of the writer(s) is. Personally I like them both, as well as barley. I know bran and fiber slow down conversion and absorption of the glucose and other sugars.

As I said up above, I add things to rice. I guess it's to compensate for what's taken out. Like fortified breakfast cereals and bread. :rolleyes: I like wild rice too, which isn't actually rice, but a grass. I think I'll get some brown and wild rice this weekend. :)

Ramakrishna
21 October 2011, 11:43 AM
Namaste Eastern Mindji,

I agree. I've found that more sit-down style restaurants offer vegetarian options rather than fast food places. I don't even really eat fast food anyway, but I do enjoy Taco Bell, just ask them to substitute the meat with beans (which are vegetarian). But aside from that and Burger King, which had a veggie burger last time I went, I don't think many fast food places in the US offer real vegetarian options, aside from little side things such as french fries and whatnot.

On the other hand, especially over the past couple of years, with vegetarianism rising in the US and throughout the world, I've found that most sit-down restaurants I've been to have actually had real vegetarian options. Real as in an actual entree, and some even have a section of the menu just for vegetarian options.


On the other hand, a direct talk to many restaurant owners, especially small private owners, and they are often more than willing to come up with a veggie 'sumthin or uther' right on the spot, even if its not on the menu.

Yeah, one time I was at a restaurant with a friend and they didn't have any real vegetarian options on the menu aside from small side dishes. I talked to the waitress and then the chef came out and I spoke with him and he cooked up a nice veggie pasta dish. It was a very nice gesture, although of course it would have been better if they had real vegetarian options available in the menu. But maybe they do now, I haven't been back since then.

Jai Sri Ram

Jainarayan
21 October 2011, 12:01 PM
Namaste to all.

Indeed it's unfortunate that eating establishments don't have a separate, even if it's small, side menu for vegs. My favorite place is a family-owned local diner/restaurant. Just about the only thing I can now get veg. is a green salad; veggie burger; maybe eggplant parm and pasta if the eggplant isn't dipped in egg; cottage cheese and fruit salad; oatmeal (with raisins, walnuts, and brown sugar or honey :) ); and maybe one of the vegetable & pasta dinners. Not that those are bad; but I have to remember I can't just sit down at the counter and order any old thing like pancakes or French toast or Florentine omelette with feta cheese.

Ganeshprasad
21 October 2011, 12:30 PM
Pranam


Namaste all.



I know that verse is used to underscore and encourage adoption of vegetarianism, but I don't interpret it as being for or against vegetarianism or any dietary injunction. I take it to mean only that Lord Krishna will accept even the smallest thing as a gift if it's done with love and devotion.

It is interesting how people interpret the verse as they like, who is to say one is more right then other, having said that, i don't consider those thing that he ask for as small, these are essential food in our diet, even the modern scientist have cotton on and they insist 5 a day, and water is the most important ingredient of them all as far as food intake is considered.
Lord Krishna knows what is best and that is why he mentions those items, although simple but very important. Those who worship Vishnu would know that he controls Satva Guna all offering to him are in the mode of Satva, therefor the next verse is also important when he says;
yat karosi yad asnasi
yaj juhosi dadasi yat
yat tapasyasi kaunteya
tat kurusva mad-arpanam

What ever you eat do it as an offering on to me. Having already mentioned the important foods in the previous verse i would conclude, for me at least, what he would like as offering. you will not find any Vishnu temple that offers other then vegetarian ingredient as Prasad.

Jai Shree Krishna

Jainarayan
21 October 2011, 01:14 PM
Namaste.


Pranam



It is interesting how people interpret the verse as they like, who is to say one is more right then other

That's very true. Hence the volumes and volumes of commentaries by sages and gurus. They all saw and interpreted differently. It's not a matter of interpreting how one likes (or it shouldn't be, anyway), but rather what one gets out of it, or sees. To do otherwise is cherry-picking.


What ever you eat do it as an offering on to me. Having already mentioned the important foods in the previous verse i would conclude, for me at least, what he would like as offering. you will not find any Vishnu temple that offers other then vegetarian ingredient as Prasad.

Jai Shree Krishna

He says in 3.13

"The devotees of the Lord are released from all kinds of sins because they eat food which is offered first for sacrifice. Others, who prepare food for personal sense enjoyment, verily eat only sin."

And of course everything offered to Krishna must be vegetarian. I'm not suggesting otherwise, or that the verse (9.26) suggests otherwise.

In 9.30 He says

"Even if one commits the most abominable action, if he is engaged in devotional service he is to be considered saintly because he is properly situated in his determination."

Of course this doesn't give free license to commit murder and say "oh but I love Lord Krishna, and I pray to Him every day". No, there are rules and regulations.

But 9.26 and 9.30 point out and underscore to me how merciful, loving and easy to please Sri Krishna is.

Ganeshprasad
21 October 2011, 04:02 PM
Pranam


Namaste.

In 9.30 He says

"Even if one commits the most abominable action, if he is engaged in devotional service he is to be considered saintly because he is properly situated in his determination."

Of course this doesn't give free license to commit murder and say "oh but I love Lord Krishna, and I pray to Him every day". No, there are rules and regulations.

But 9.26 and 9.30 point out and underscore to me how merciful, loving and easy to please Sri Krishna is.

Not wishing to derail this thread so i be brief and do not expect an answer because i think we are on same page here.

There is no doubt Krishna is loving and merciful, easy to please? perhaps we would have a different take here.

coming back to 9.30 my take is on the operating word here is;
api cet su-duracaro
bhajate mam ananya-bhak
sadhur eva sa mantavyah
samyag vyavasito hi sah

without deviation

It is not as if one who is a sinner and remains a sinner can be considered a sadhu, again the next verse is important to understand because that person would soon become DharmAtma following the code of Dharma.
ksipram bhavati dharmatma
sasvac-chantim nigacchati
kaunteya pratijanihi
na me bhaktah pranasyati

Jai Shree Krishna

Jainarayan
21 October 2011, 05:34 PM
Namaste.


Pranam



Not wishing to derail this thread so i be brief and do not expect an answer because i think we are on same page here.

I wanted to answer to not let you think I ignored you...

Yes, I think we're on the same page and saying the same thing, just saying it differently. In person it's so much easier to get messages and meanings across. ;)