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Rudy
26 November 2011, 05:13 PM
For those of you who live in India or an other non western nation do you see modernization as the same thing as westenization or different and why (I guess this also goes for those of you who do live in the west actually)?

I'm reading a book by Fareed Zakeria called The Post American World, and it seems like every thing that is modern is western (meaning it was based in, perfected by, or invented by the west). From modern military organization, to blue jeans, to cars, and modern farming.

Do you think becoming modern means giving up what is distinctly non western?

(PS as some who likes to study other cultures and traditions, us all becoming a big similar blob scares me more than a little. Saying that I dont want any one to be cultural museum.)

Eastern Mind
26 November 2011, 07:00 PM
Vannakkam Rudy: An excellent question. Personally I don't see the west as having a monopoly on modernisation, or that modernisation is necessarily better.

An example was rice growing in Bali. I don't know if this is urban myth, the truth, or just partial truth, but here is a story of how modern agriculturalists went to Bali, and tried to increase food production with their 'modern' techniques, only to have the whole experiment become an abysmal failure, and the farmers all went back to the 'old' way.

Cloth was invented in the west? Really now? There are other examples. Personally I think that the whole world needs to slow down on the modernisation wagon. Some more astute thoughts as to long term effects need to be considered. DDT was once a modern concept. Not thinking things through thoroughly has led to a ton of problems, this (pollution) just being one of them.

I'm curious as to what others will have to say.

Aum Namasivaya

devotee
26 November 2011, 08:36 PM
It is true that Modernisation has become a synonym to Westernisation. Basically the Industrial revolution started in the west and many modern things came from it & therefore, to some extent it is correct to say so. However, though it led us towards physical comforts ... it is the cause of our becoming to a slave to our physical needs. You have completely got identified with your body.

OM

NayaSurya
26 November 2011, 08:48 PM
This past week in school my son's class learned about other religions by making small groups and telling the class about the religion the teacher picked randomly so each religion was given to one group.

Many many children became disturbed by this, they got very angry about being Hindu...and said they could burn in hell for such a thing. But, this wonderful teacher persisted and would not let them change.

At one point in their lecture, a professor on the television program begins to explain how abrahamic religions are the oldest religions in the world and that Hinduism came from them not the other way around to which this very brilliant teacher stop the DVD and tell them all. "Folks that's wrong...it's not accurate. Hinduism is oldest."

This causes a very bad uproar, even louder than the first and these children make post it notes and place hundreds all over the school which read "xtianity is the oldest religion in the world".

My son, came up to the teacher before class and asked permission to go around an mark out xtianity and put Hinduism on these notes.

He gave his blessing to change this ignorant, backward thinking.

What can I say...it was the Bumpkins.:p

When asked, these children said..."Hindus didn't write the bible and it's the first and ONLY BOOK written by GOD"

It's funny how much the level of ones own ability to understand and perceive this universe is very much contingent upon how well each of us can use this machine to process information in our mind, digest stimulus we take in and our own ability to learn from experiences...both good and bad.

Just look around at the modern world in every culture.

Each year Sari come out with new colors for the season...new modern manufacturing make silk not bad to use. Every country has a modern and a bumpkin side.

Here it's the same...at the craft show this clash is very evident as some have old orange or pukey green blankets made from old fashioned, coarse yarns. While ones such as myself make hats with recycled satin yarns with blue skies and sunshines....rainbows of yarn...cupcakes in hot pink...definitely not your grandmother's crochet.

So even here in the west we see ones clinging to old ways...I know many people here still not having cell phones, or computers. It takes all kinds.

I suppose to answer this question it would be a big No from me. No, being modern doesn't mean you have to become westernized. I think modern is in every location. It's mixed in the masses with others who are traditional.

Eastern Mind
26 November 2011, 09:07 PM
So even here in the west we see ones clinging to old ways...I know many people here still not having cell phones.

Vannakkam Naya et al: You'd have to pay me to have a cell phone. I never did get the point ... except maybe road side emergencies. Call me old fashioned.
:)

But that's the lesson in this for me. We have to be selective about which modern stuff is dharmic, or just some ode to science. I remember working on my 65 VW with a former German POW in my home town. He was going up and down VW, in poor broken English, every second word a curse word.

"Used to dvop Enjin with 4 bolts ... Idiots... now look what they've done!"

Progress just for progress sake isn't progress at all. I can imagine the day they do pujas with flashlights replacing flames.

Aum Namasivaya

NayaSurya
26 November 2011, 09:18 PM
This past year my family insisted I get a phone. So when my son lost mine just a few weeks later....

Well I was just being frugal when I declined the replacement:p

In the end...my oldest son gave me a new one. But, it does come in handy when the car is on the fritz.:p

I did not have a home computer until 2002.

BryonMorrigan
27 November 2011, 08:25 AM
Naya:

You really need to move. ...[EDITED, since I probably shouldn't speak ill of her in a public forum]...I moved out of that Pennsylvania cesspool into a much better environment back in my hometown of St. Augustine. Now that I'm a single-father to my 3 girls, I am making certain that they are able to be around a much more culturally-diverse group of people.

NayaSurya
27 November 2011, 09:19 AM
I am sorry to hear about your X, but knowing you from your posts here...I would say you are such a wonderful parent...you are 200&#37; more than what normal kids have.<3

This will sound very silly...and perhaps a bit weird. But, we were ushered here to this hill...by higher Beings. It was as if you are trying to reach shore by rowing...and waiting for a large wave. The wave picked us up and placed us here without one once of effort. I feel it was for our safety. Everything lined up as if it were a machine taking us here.

Also, my Mother used to say...if you are having a problem don't run from it...most of the time you will just be running from yourself. In this case I have been cautious to make sure it wasn't some sort of lesson. But, as the years roll on I am feeling as if this isn't our problem as much as it is a chronic situation in rural society here. But, I can not be rude about this safety and shelter...it was a gift.

So when I saw this post and it spoke of "western modernity" there was a lil giggle...as I live in the most backwards of places.

In a rare fluke, our home appraised way higher than our price we pay...and so one day I do plan to leave. I am just waiting for that next strong wave to let me know it's okay. Here or there...I go where they allow me. (But Sanibel Island is a place of my visions, so Florida is a destination of my heart) I don't think I will see the ocean until this Karma has burned off sufficiently. Perhaps this will be soon...I can only hope.