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c.smith
12 January 2007, 07:23 PM
ISKCON chants "Hare Krishna Hare Krishna Krishna Krishna Hare Hare Hare Rama Hare Rama Rama Rama Hare Hare" while a few of the simply "Krishna" (non ISKCON) temples reverse the order, using Rama first, then Krishna. Why (and what is) the difference?

Agnideva
12 January 2007, 11:01 PM
ISKCON chants "Hare Krishna Hare Krishna Krishna Krishna Hare Hare Hare Rama Hare Rama Rama Rama Hare Hare" while a few of the simply "Krishna" (non ISKCON) temples reverse the order, using Rama first, then Krishna. Why (and what is) the difference?
Hmmm... I didn't know that, and never heard it that way before. But I found that Swami Sivananda (http://www.dlshq.org/teachings/japayoga.htm#mantras) also presents it like that (Hare Rama before Hare Krishna). I have heard (not sure if this is true) that in ISKCON, Rama refers to Balarama, and not Ramachandra. Could this have something to do with it?

satay
13 January 2007, 02:17 PM
As far as I know, in India non-iskcon narayana temples/govinda/krishna temples chant:

hare ram hare ram ram ram hare hare,
hare krishna hare krishna krishna krishna hare hare

Ganeshprasad
15 January 2007, 12:55 PM
ISKCON chants "Hare Krishna Hare Krishna Krishna Krishna Hare Hare Hare Rama Hare Rama Rama Rama Hare Hare" while a few of the simply "Krishna" (non ISKCON) temples reverse the order, using Rama first, then Krishna. Why (and what is) the difference?


Jai Ganesh

There is no difference one can chant either way.

This Mantra is from Kali Santarna Upanishad,Some versions of the Upanishad give the mantra with Hare Rama preceding Hare Krishna, and others with Hare Krishna preceding Hare Rama

Most commentators that I have heard says it starts with Hare Rama
What I recall hearing from Bhai Sri Rameshbhai Oza, was that Shree Chetanya Mahaprabhu turned this around for the purpose of Sankirtan, congregation chanting.
There are no restrictions or formal initiation required for this mantra, any one could chant this, it so sublime and simple.

http://cc.1asphost.com/shastras/ebooks/upanishads/kali_santarana_upanishad.htm (http://cc.1asphost.com/shastras/ebooks/upanishads/kali_santarana_upanishad.htm)
Jai Shree Krishna

Krsna Das
29 December 2009, 06:32 AM
Hari Bol !

As far as I know, we chant mahamantra in this order (Hare Krsna hare Krsna....) because it is given in this order only in Sri Kali-Santarana Upanishad.

smaranam
29 December 2009, 07:17 AM
Namaste

I agree with Satayji and Ganeshprasadji, and that exactly has been my observation too. I have seen Kali Santarna Upanishad with Hare RAm first.
It may have versions the other way around too.

It doesn't matter which way it is chanted. Hare Krshna first makes sense when the Kirtan revolves around Krshna. Simple as that.

I was only aware of the Mahamantra as the end of the final Arati to the Supreme. No one had asked me to chant it like a mantra.

For some reason , later as an adult, I started chanting it occasionally, only when I felt like. It made me peaceful.

Once, I was chanting like this - the only way I knew at the time :

Hare RAm Hare RAm RAm RAm Hare Hare
Hare Krushna Hare Krushna Krushna Krushna Hare Hare

in the same aarati tune.

to my surprise in brought dear Krshna and RAm to me. KRshna stayed.

I think different ways are naturally appealing to different people, also depending on what they picked up from their surroundings.

Krsna Das
29 December 2009, 08:43 AM
Dandavat Pranamas !

Mahamantra is the name of God afterall, so one may chant as much as possible for getting the mercy of Nam-Prabhu, in any way one likes.

However, this was the verse I was mentioning from Sri Kali Santaran Upanishad:

Hare Krsna Hare Krsna Krsna Krsna Hare Hare
Hare Ram Hare Ram Ram Ram Hare Hare
iti sodasakam nam-nam kali kalmasanasanam
natah paratoparayah sarva vedesu drisyate

Is anybody who likes chanting Mahamantra on tulsi beads?

All glories to SriSri Radha Krsna.

Vin
29 December 2009, 10:49 AM
Dear All,

I would like to know about some mantras for particular problem. Is this the right thread I can post my question? Or is there any specific thread where I can post my problem and get a mantra for the same?

Seeking your help.

Thanks

smaranam
14 March 2010, 04:01 PM
Namaste

To the question :

ISKCON chants "Hare Krishna Hare Krishna Krishna Krishna Hare Hare Hare Rama Hare Rama Rama Rama Hare Hare" while a few of the simply "Krishna" (non ISKCON) temples reverse the order, using Rama first, then Krishna. Why (and what is) the difference?

I said :

Namaste

I agree with Satayji and Ganeshprasadji, and that exactly has been my observation too. I have seen Kali Santarna Upanishad with Hare RAm first.


Here is one of Kali Santarana Upanishad translations
http://www.celextel.org/108upanishads/kalisantarana.html

It reads with Hare RAm first then Hare Krshna.

The reason we are asked to chant it the other way around is given by someone on this thread - post #7
http://www.indiadivine.org/audarya/vedic-verses/29217-kali-santarana-upanishad.html


Upanishads are held sacred and are regarded as the highest form of Jnana.
The shastras say that the Vedas and Upanishads can be learnt and chanted only by a specific sect of people, because of the rigorous tone and intonnation involved in these.

Mahaprabhu, agreat mahan that he was, did want to liberate the masses from this ocean of samsara through the Mahamantra, and at the same time not violate the Shastras. Hence he preached it as

Hare Krishna Hare Krishna Krishna Krishna Hare Hare
Hare Rama Hare Rama Rama Rama Hare Hare

When repeated continuously, this indeed reads the same way as stated by the Upanishads.
Did not Valmiki chant the Holy Taraka Mantra as 'mara' 'mara' and was able to give to the world the great Itihasa called Ramayana?

Sri Prabhupada and his movement followed Mahaprabhu's footsteps.

There are other Saints and Mahans, like Swami Abhedananda of Tiruvananthapuram and innumerable saints of Brindavan who have, out of their sheer mercy and compassion given the Mahamantra as is from the Upanishads, as in this Kali Yuga where none of the rules laid out in the Shastras can be practically followed in spirit.


Though powerful by itself, the Mahamantra, if initiated by a Guru, creates multifold effect and helps us reach our ultimate destination quicker.


Radhe Radhe!


Very nice, and makes sense completely. Now we know why Mahaprabhu turned it around. So that it can be accessible to one and all without Ved-mantra rules. Mercy. That doesn't mean it is not available the other way around. I was chanting it as "hare rAm..."

Hare Krshna Hare KRshna Krshna Krshna Hare Hare
Hare rAm hare rAm rAm rAm hare hare

Krsna Das
15 March 2010, 02:45 AM
Hari Bol...

This way or that way, whatever works for you...the main thing is this:

How many of you are chanting a specific number of rounds of Mahamantra daily?

ScottMalaysia
15 March 2010, 03:47 AM
Mahaprabhu, agreat mahan that he was, did want to liberate the masses from this ocean of samsara through the Mahamantra, and at the same time not violate the Shastras. Hence he preached it as

How does preaching it as Hare Rama first violate the Shastras?

Krsna Das
15 March 2010, 05:02 AM
How does preaching it as Hare Rama first violate the Shastras?

Don't worry about it.

How many rounds have you started?

Yogkriya
25 July 2010, 02:32 PM
How does preaching it as Hare Rama first violate the Shastras?

It does not violate any shastras. In fact the Upanishad original mantra starts with RAMA first. More so RAMA came first.
Sri Chaitanya turned Krishna first. He was attached to Krishna not Rama.
So he changed the mantra as Krishna first and gave it for sankirtana.
Simple.
Its original shastra mantra with change.
Still either way you chant, you get the benefit. This is not a strict mantric sadhana with strict rules as in mantra anushthan that has a set of rules.
The rules here are that you can sing out this mantra and dance too while chanting. Vedic sadhnas done for siddhis do not entertain such rules. Though chanting and singing bhajans have always been part of Vedic culture.
Shri Chaitanya took this as the main sadhana since its simpler for people who are not capable to engaging in serious sadhnas.
And the music engrosses the senses. Purpose here is to develop bhakti and love for Lord Krishna. This can be done.

Regards,
YK.

ScottMalaysia
27 July 2010, 08:58 PM
I asked an ISKCON devotee about this, and they told me that some of the Brahmanas objected to Chaitanya giving the Maha-mantra (in its original form, with Hare Rama first) to the lower caste people. So Chaitanya simply reversed the order of the mantra.

I prefer to chant it with Hare Rama first, because that is how it appears in the Kali Santarana Upanishad. I am not a Gaudiya Vaishnava, so I don't chant it the Gaudiya way.

Rasa1976
27 July 2010, 09:51 PM
Krishna says in Gita that He is the gambling of cheats, so He tricks people to chant nama backwards to make them wind up chanting forwards. He was way ahead of John Lennon and the Beatles.

One day Hanuman appeared before a thief and asked him a very simple question. “Why do you steal?” The thief, who was actually a poor man, said he stole from others and with that money he looked after his family. “But when you are caught and punished, will your family also take the blame and share your punishment too?” asked Hanuman. The thief thought about it and went home and asked his wife and children. And you know what their answer was? They said that though they would take the money from stealing or eat the food he brought, nobody agreed to share his punishment. The thief was heartbroken and told this to Hanuman.

“So you see when you steal you alone will be punished for your actions. When you are punished, no one in your family will remember that you have stolen for them. So why steal at all?” said Hanuman. The thief at last understood his fault. He then begged Hanuman to help him and show him the right path. “How can I make God forgive me?” the thief asked Hanuman.

Hanuman then gave him holy beads called rosary and asked him to chant “Rama Rama”. But you know, it becomes very difficult for people who do wrong things like stealing or telling lies or cheating, to say the right things, like saying God’s name. No matter how hard he tried, the thief could not chant the Lord’s mantra. Okay then chant “Mara Mara”, said Hanuman and the thief was able to repeat this with ease! Now, Mara means death, but the theif went on chanting it. The thief chanted “Mara, mara,ma-ra, ma-Ra-ma, Rama.......” ( start it slowly and then increase the speed so that Mara becomes Rama) which you know is ..... yes the ulta of........”Rama Rama”. So all the while that the thief was actually saying ”Mara Mara“ he was really chanting the Lord’s name “Rama Rama”. In course of time he become a good man, gave up stealing and lived like a sadhu in the forest for the rest of his life. In this way, by teaching him to chant God’s name, Hanuman helped the thief become a good man.