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Spiritualseeker
12 April 2012, 08:11 PM
Namaste,

Interesting article I found http://www.virtualvinodh.com/religion/193-shiva-in-buddhism

Om Namah Shivaya

Spiritualseeker
12 April 2012, 08:44 PM
Namaste,

I do not mean to be challenging the article, but it states

"After emanation of Shiva from his Body, Avalokiteshvara tells Mahesvara that, during the kaliyuga, he will appear in a degenerate realm and will be called the primordial god (ādideva), the creator and author of the world. The beings in this realm at that time will be deprived of the path to awakening and the talk among those foolish common people will be: "It is said that space is his linga and the earth his pedestal. He is the ground of all and is called linga because all beings dissolve into him". [1]


The Shaivaite Doctrine is directly rebuked here, those who worship Shiva as the Creator deity are criticized as "foolish common people" (pṛthagjana)."


This is an attack on the Shaivite doctrine for sure, but this seems like sectarianism of later Buddhist. There is no problem there since we all have our particular views, but I do not think these particular sutras can hold any weight, because these are later writings that we do not even know if the Buddha ever uttered any of them. There is even difficulty in stating that the Buddha preached the Theravada cannon, because there are additions and other such things in them.



The article also says:


"oving further to the narrative end of the Sutra, Shiva appears before the Buddha, prostrated before him and asks for Vyakarana [Prediction of Buddha-hood]. He is directed by the Buddha to Avalokiteshvara. Maheshvara praises Avalokiteshvara and requests Vyakarana from him. On his request Avalokiteshvara bestows the prophecy for Buddhahood.


bhaviṣyasi tvaṁ kulaputra vivṛtāyāṁ lokadhātau bhasmeśvaro nāma tathāgato'rhan samyaksaṁbuddho vidyācaraṇasaṁpannaḥ sugato lokavidanuttaraḥ puruṣadamyasārathiḥ śāstā devānāṁ ca manuṣyāṇāṁ ca buddho bhagavān



Kulaputra ! In the future you will become in the World called Vivrita, a Tathagata named Bhasmeshvara, an Arhat, One who is perfect in knowledge and conduct, a Sugata, Knower of the Word, Unsurpassed-one, Tamer of Men, Teacher of the Gods & Men, Buddha and the Lord."

So from the quote above it seems they see Shiva as not yet enlightened. This is strange since Shiva is himself Enlightenment or Moksha. Shiva is the underlying reality in which all things take place in. I see not how he could not be enlightened. This matted haired, three eyed deity is the Lord of Yoga. The Primordial being from which the Universe appeared. All experience of awakening or non awakening occurs within the great being of Shiva. This again are just Buddhist attacks against Sanatana Dharma. It is just due to competition of ways. I love Mahayana Buddhism and find it to be filled with great wisdom, but I do not think that all of these Sutras are uttered from the mouth of the Buddha.

Just my thoughts that lack scholarly and experiential knowledge.


Om Namah Shivaya

shian
13 April 2012, 04:24 AM
Vanakkam Spiritual Seeker,

very good point !

I will explain first about vyakarana :

In Mahayana Buddhism, Buddha also give vyakarana to Ksitigarbha and Avalokitesvara, and then Manjusri etc
But acctually, they are all is already a Buddha and also the manifestation of Vairocana (The Highest)
But why Buddha become Bodhisattva then get vyakarana again and then become another Buddha ???
well, from India philosophy i think this kind of things is not strange and even not a conflict.
That is only a sport , a lilas of Bhagavan !
Whatever they become, whatever the name they get , they always ONE.
All of this play is only to teach us.

About attack Shaivite teachings,
yes you are right the text is maybe from peoples after Parinirvana of Gautama Buddha.
That is why Tantric Buddhism need a GURU
then se Guru as Buddha, and we follow his guide to understand the scripture etc.

We talk about scripture off course there will be add many political reason etc from many follower of Buddha, i dont know who add that in the scripture, but we must see in whole teachings to understand what the meaning.

For me , the statment maybe is get influence from the conflict between Shaivaism and Buddhism in India
But when we talk about Shaivaism and Buddhism, not all Shaivite is have conflict with Buddhist , not all Buddhist is conflict with Shaivite !
What some person do in the name of Hindu is dont mean all Hindu agree that !

You look some text of Hindu and Buddhist, some text also look like see other sect as wrong view, and even foolish (even they are same Hindu or same Buddhist in different sect)

If we learn India philosophy (even i not expert) we will know what is the meaning of this sentence (the sentence who talk about their superiority between other sect)

Even in Buddhist text (maybe also Hindu text ) there is many sentence who said This mantra is the king of all mantra, other mantra cant compare etc.
Or this Istadevata is the highest etc.
This is very ordinary things in India philosophy

but is depend on how your Guru understand this,

for my own, my GURU, he have initiated us with the Sadhana of Buddha Mahesvara,
He teach us Shiva is Buddha (like the proof from Sutra about 12 Deva in Buddhism), then Shiva is mara , but that is His wonderful way to guide us recognize our inner mara !
That is why i am Buddhist but very respect and even says :
SHIVA and GANESH is my Lord
is Buddha
is Lord of Universe
and i even dont have problem with Hindu scripture, i dont see Hindu scripture as foolish or cant touch etc
Even i have no problem when read Shiva Purana explain about Asura from Tripura is deluded by Buddha.
I have post the thread about that, but only to know how the others view that text, than i offer my own view.

So, im back, when i say this, not all Buddhist will agree what i say
and not all Buddhist will reject what i say

When i say this, not all Hindu will accept me
but also, not all Hindu will reject me

That is depend on individual understanding and the spiritual wisdom

shian
13 April 2012, 04:31 AM
about vyakarana again,
we all know story when Krsna and Balaram
or
Rama and Laksmana
have Guru then get the guide from Their Guru etc
then Hanuman help Rama
then Rahvana, the devotee of Shiva have ben killed
or Shiva burn Kama Deva
or Shiva subjugated the pride of Vishnu and Brahma

why ?
why we not feel confused with this ?
new comer will confused read that story and think why God do such things ? why , why and why.

But we all understand what the teachings behind what Krsna, Rama, Rahvana, Shiva, Hanuman etc do

This is same
why Buddha become Bodhisattva, why born again, why become another Buddha
why Buddha become mara and let His self be subjugated by His another form
why Buddha become Vinayaka
why Buddha become Sidharta Gautama and search the TRUTH of life
and search the end of birth and death

new comer will confused see this :)

shian
13 April 2012, 04:37 AM
Then in i say :
This is India Philosophy,
according how we get it
how we understand it

About the harted or conflict between all sect in India
that is product of human beings
i learn India Philosophy
but i choose to dont follow that way (harted and conflict)
that is very common in this material world, even i , i cant stop it happened in this world
i choose to get whatever will improve my spirituality and inner peace

shian
13 April 2012, 06:32 AM
I also hear some people said Hindu get Buddha as one avatar of Vishnu to get back people who already become Buddhist

I also hear some people said Buddhist Mantra Om Mani Padme Hum is to make a rival for Om Namah Shivaya

Also so many political view

But when i see sincere people chant Om Mani Padme Hum, they get good spiritual effect and even know the dead time and dead in wonderful way.
See this fact, am i must believe that political side of view ?

I see sincere people with devotion praised Buddha in Hindu temple as one of avatar of Vishnu
See this fact of devotion, am i must believe that Buddha praised by Hindu is for political purpose ??

When i ask some devotee of Krsna, is Shiva created this Universe ? Is Shiva is primordial God ?

When i ask some devotee of Shiva , is Brahma the primordial God ?

What they say ? If i hear the answer said the believe of Shiva as primordial God is WRONG. When i hear the answer said the believe that Brahma is primordial God is WRONG. When i see Tantric form of Kali Maa who hold corpses of Shiva. I must follow them to choose one and hate another ?

But in fact i see SOME devotee of Shiva gain wonderful wisdom, they gain peace, they live with wisdom way and beautiful and sweet life.
I see SOME devotee of Shakti also life in peace and wisdom.
I see SOME devotee of Buddha also life in peace and wisdom.

See all of this, I must follow the political argument to hate other sect and Deitys ??? But the hater cant find peace in their life, there is chaos in their aura.

What i must do ?

Bhagavan have many way to teach different peoples, but different people also will confused with this sport of Bhagavan.

Some people follow the philosophy of Mother Bharat without any problem and get the peace , get many benefit in this life

But some people follow the philosophy of Mother Bharat with many problem, how to win, how to subjugate, how to destroy the wrong view, how to push other , how to convert, how to show my superior, how to make my ideal look like number one, how to make entire world worship same istadevata with me, how to do this, how to do that, so hurt me, so hate them, so fool, this is not right, that is right, etc...

Which one should i walk
I only know and remember that Mother Bharat give me that is want me find peace, want me get the true benefit for my life, want me to get happiness

Back to the sport of Bhagavan,
I have find from Buddhist Tripitaka in one Sutra , there is said 8 names of Vinayaka (Lord Ganesh), and who meditate on them will destroy the sin.
One name of 8 Vinayaka is King of Mara.
Mara is the hindrance on path of Buddha Hood, how come the name of King of Mara will vanished my sin ?

Well, this kind is common in philosophy and wisdom of Mother Bharat.

Even i also find my Buddhist friend or many Buddhist will confused with this stuff. They also confused with the philosophy between Buddha and Mara, Buddha Shiva and Mara.

Some Hindu also confused how to choose one istadevata and perpare them self to go to see other as demigods.

This is normal, this is spiritual journey, we life with many people with many different way of thinking.

This is samsara.

PARAM
13 April 2012, 12:10 PM
about vyakarana again,
we all know story when Krsna and Balaram
or
Rama and Laksmana
have Guru then get the guide from Their Guru etc
then Hanuman help Rama
then Rahvana, the devotee of Shiva have ben killed
or Shiva burn Kama Deva
or Shiva subjugated the pride of Vishnu and Brahma

why ?
why we not feel confused with this ?
new comer will confused read that story and think why God do such things ? why , why and why.

But we all understand what the teachings behind what Krsna, Rama, Rahvana, Shiva, Hanuman etc do

This is same
why Buddha become Bodhisattva, why born again, why become another Buddha
why Buddha become mara and let His self be subjugated by His another form
why Buddha become Vinayaka
why Buddha become Sidharta Gautama and search the TRUTH of life
and search the end of birth and death

new comer will confused see this :)

Ravan was devotee of Shiva and got blessings of Shiva, but this gave him no green signal to rule like aDHaRmi. Hanuman was incarnation of Shiva and he become devotee of Ram. The Parshuram form of Vishnu was friend of Ravana, but Ram form of Vishnu killed the same Ravana. It's all depends on Karma and nobody is pardoned.


I also hear some people said Hindu get Buddha as one avatar of Vishnu to get back people who already become Buddhist

--------------------------------------------------

This is misquoting made by Modern Buddhists who hardly have any knowledge about Buddhism. In fact Buddhist themselves played the misquote card to make Buddha popular with Vishnuism, because Jainism was popular only using the name of Rishabhdev who was one of the forefathers of Bhagwan Sri Ram.

shian
13 April 2012, 07:37 PM
@Param, so i said that is political view and i will ignore it because not my bussiness and i am personaly not do that and not interesting with that. Whatever you said about Buddhist, acctually i dont understand that because i am personally not like what you say.

I still view on : this is fact there is some Shiva devotee who have sincere heart then they get the bliss and happiness. This fact that there is some Buddha devotee who have sincere heart, then they get bliss and happiness. So , see this fact, why i view the philosophy of Mother Bharat from political side ? I am not politican, i only ordinary person who worship Shiva, Ganesh, Devi and Buddha. Thats it. You can talk politic with other person who have interseted in it and have the desire to fight on it.

Thank you

shian
13 April 2012, 07:44 PM
In this world,

There is some Hindu who hate Buddhist
There is some Buddhist who hate Hindu
There is some Hindu sect who hate another Hindu sect
There is some Buddhist sect who hate another Buddhist sect

And i dont care about that because that is not my goal in this life
I only person who love India philosophy, but why some people guide me to joined their hatred and fight ? I dont understand their purpose, is they want to kick me off and not let me know more and get more bliss from many rich philosophy of India ?
Is they want me stop learned India philosophy and go search other philosophy ? What the purpose of fighting for such things ?
What they want ? They want to tell me the beautiful rich philosophy of India, or want to show me that India philosophy is full of harted ? Why and what ? Because this is never ending

That is normal, this is world

shian
13 April 2012, 07:56 PM
You fight each other, this your way to show the beautiful of Mother Bharat to others ?
I tell you, even you try to hitt me or kick me with fighting theory, you also still need to face other sect with fighting desire, and this is will never end until you are vanished each other. This is what you want show to your own Mother Bharat ?

PARAM
14 April 2012, 11:39 AM
@Param, so i said that is political view and i will ignore it because not my bussiness and i am personaly not do that and not interesting with that. Whatever you said about Buddhist, acctually i dont understand that because i am personally not like what you say.

I still view on : this is fact there is some Shiva devotee who have sincere heart then they get the bliss and happiness. This fact that there is some Buddha devotee who have sincere heart, then they get bliss and happiness. So , see this fact, why i view the philosophy of Mother Bharat from political side ? I am not politican, i only ordinary person who worship Shiva, Ganesh, Devi and Buddha. Thats it. You can talk politic with other person who have interseted in it and have the desire to fight on it.

Thank you

I am not talking politics, where you find politics in my post there?

Later Buddhists themselves played misquotes, maybe this is politics but your comment say all this itself.

Hindus accepted Buddha as he was a Hindu himself, his forefathers were Hindus themselves.

shian
15 April 2012, 10:32 AM
@Param
Im not mean you post politic,
I mean i wrote about the example of political view, and that is only take a example and not my argument .

I personaly dont care about is Buddha an avatar of Vishnu or Vishnu is avatar of Buddha .
Or Vishnu is personal Godhead and Shiva is demigods .
This kind of personal believe
Believe what you want to believe.
I only know, in my heart they are one and i cant make them separate.
What my heart says is already not outer things , but originaly nature from my mind.
Whatever text i read and maybe the text (both Hindu and Buddha ) said this deity is get help from that deity or this deity is number one etc, i not catch it as a reason to see other deity is low or other is high. Absolutely not.
Because for me, these kind of story is only a tool to guide us in meditation state, know and recognize many aspect of our mind.
But if some people see thesse story as a reason to hate each other, what i can do ?

If some people choosee to see theese story as a reason to hate other sect as NON DHARMA , and to say them self as follower of true DHARMA (for both Hindu and Buddhist in any sect), what i can do ?
If they want to fighting until they destroyed each other as offering to Mother Bharat,
What i can do ?

I only doing my part, to tell what i feel toward the teaching of India ancestor and how i use it in my spiritual life
And i only hope, they are stop to attack each other, this is only my wish,

shian
15 April 2012, 09:54 PM
About is Siddharta Gautama is Hindu
i must explain my own opinion here
i have initiated on Buddhist lineage
but i have no problem to say Siddharta Gautama is Hindu
very easy
Buddhist has chant OM kara
they also chant many sacred syllable from Veda
these stuff is from Veda we are know it.

My own lineage Guru, absolutely no problem if we pay homage on Hindu temple
or if we read Hindu sacred text
He also have ever go to Hindu temple and He also respect and Homage

He worship Lord Shiva, Sarasvati Maa etc as He worship Buddha (see them as Highest)
in His explanation and teachings about these Deity , He also explain these Deity is from Hindu
so for my personal , i am is Buddhist, but i am dont have any problem with Hindu, i also no problem to say i am proud to be Hindu, or to be Buddhist
This kind , all is outer aspect
The most important, no matter what sampradaya we are, is how we can put and realize the blessing of Bhagavan on our daily life and share it to another sentient beings , let them also receive the blessing.

Is true that every sect have their own view
even in every sect, every student have their own personal view
but this step of inner spiritual is not a reason to fight each other
The text about the lilas of Bhagavan is beyond our ordinary imagination, and that is not for fight, if you see that as a tool to fight each other
no matter we is Hindu or Buddha, we will destroy each other , not only towards other religion (Hindu vs Buddhist), but also towards other sect in same religion ( some sect of Hindu vs other sect of Hindu, or some sect of Buddhist vs other sect of Buddhist )

When one family want to promote their family life philosophy, what can they say if their own family is fight each other ???

i said this because i still care . . .
because my past life is India,
if i dont care, i will choose to ignore it and forget it all

shian
16 April 2012, 09:34 PM
Anyway,

In Buddhism, all of outer worship is called heretical path (include outer worship of Buddha)
all of method (include method of Buddhism) is called heretical view
include method of Buddhism is not all will suitable for all beings
include method of Buddhism , a practicioner or sadhaka cant attached on method

In Mahayan Tripitaka, there is a Sutra on 4 chapter who is spoken by Vajrasattva, the Sutra is all about the worship of Ganesh !
Many tantric ways, like for different purpose we must made the sclupture of Ganesh with deifferent materials, and offer puja in deifferent ways, and give abhisekam with different liquid , and another difficult puja.

There is also a sutra about Art Goddess who born from Usnisa hair of Shiva, when He dance with all Goddess.
Then this hair manifestation Goddess have a mantra , if we chant it etc, we can get salvation and highest wisdom,
Think it ! She only a manifestation of Hair of Lord Shiva ! but can give us salvation.

So, i think, we cant understand a teaching only from a piece of text
we must looking by the whole teachings
because there is many method for different person

i affraid if missunderstanding will make a chaos between all school of India religion !

shian
17 April 2012, 03:17 AM
Learn from history,

what is the easiest way to defeat some country ?
is make them fight each other with their own brothers.

Why peoples from other country have same feeling and love our land ?
is spread ancestor philosophy to other country.

why i am , who born in Indonesia, not have India ancestor (maybe have),
but i can feel love toward India ? why ?

Crane-Foot King
28 January 2013, 02:11 AM
Shiva is revered as Mahakala in Vajrayana (Tantric) Buddhism, and as a god of wealth in Japan.
Mahakala in Tantric Buddhism is a powerful figure. He is depicted as a wrathful deity, an emanation of Avalokiteshvara, the Lord of Compassion.
http://www.mimagallery.com/bmz_cache/e/ec3541b02c2ea3d60f230a392b3cc4ff.image.251x350.jpg

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Necromancer
30 January 2013, 03:42 AM
Shiva is revered as Mahakala in Vajrayana (Tantric) Buddhism, and as a god of wealth in Japan.
Mahakala in Tantric Buddhism is a powerful figure. He is depicted as a wrathful deity, an emanation of Avalokiteshvara, the Lord of Compassion.
http://www.mimagallery.com/bmz_cache/e/ec3541b02c2ea3d60f230a392b3cc4ff.image.251x350.jpg

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Namaste.

You have just reached the very heart of my core beliefs right there and the exact reason as to why I worship Lord Siva in the form of Maha Kala Bhairava/Avilokiteshvara. Nail has been hit firmly and squarely on the head.

Shaivism and Tantric Buddhism are almost inseperable at the core.

Reputation points coming your way.

Aum Batuk Bhairavaye Namah
Aum Namah Shivaya

Crane-Foot King
30 January 2013, 04:01 AM
Namaste.

You have just reached the very heart of my core beliefs right there and the exact reason as to why I worship Lord Siva in the form of Maha Kala Bhairava/Avilokiteshvara. Nail has been hit firmly and squarely on the head.

Shaivism and Tantric Buddhism are almost inseperable at the core.

Reputation points coming your way.

Aum Batuk Bhairavaye Namah
Aum Namah Shivaya

Thank you. I have a great deal of respect for Lord Shiva. It is without a doubt that he is an enlightened being.

shian
01 February 2013, 05:39 AM
But not all Buddhist agree that Shiva is perfect being.

This is same with internal of Hindu, not all Hindu sect agree that Shiva is perfect being.

But that is just their , you, or me, or our opinion

Shiva is Shiva

Crane-Foot King
01 February 2013, 09:58 AM
But not all Buddhist agree that Shiva is perfect being.

This is same with internal of Hindu, not all Hindu sect agree that Shiva is perfect being.

But that is just their , you, or me, or our opinion

Shiva is Shiva

No, not all. In some myths, Vajrapani kills Maheshvara who is reborn and becomes the Soundless Lord of Ahes Buddha, but I tend to view that as a sectarian myth.

shian
05 February 2013, 01:07 AM
No, not all. In some myths, Vajrapani kills Maheshvara who is reborn and becomes the Soundless Lord of Ahes Buddha, but I tend to view that as a sectarian myth.

The story is have meaning, not just a simple like Vajrapani killing some deities.

I find one about Trailokavijaya , in some Sutra, Trailokavijaya subjugated Uma and Shiva. But Buddhist also believe that Trailokavijaya is Shiva Himself. Just like Goddess Kali who stand on Shiva. etc

Then in Sutra about 12 Devas we find about Shiva is ancient Buddha.
Also in one Sutra is say that Mahakala who praised by Sangha, is emanation of Vairocana, Shiva, Prthivi etc.

But offcourse one scripture have many explanation according to different peoples. This is also happened in Hindu, and even all of religions.

I think this similarity is the characteristic of India philosophy
Maybe the scripture talk about the war of Deities, but actually that is the way from the Deities to teach us about mind.

But when peoples with asuric or rakshsha quality read the scripture, they will hate each other and interpret the scripture as a reason to hate.

Necromancer
26 July 2013, 11:11 PM
Namaste.

How I see this, is that if there's one constant in this universe, that constant is time.

Each religion embodies this aspect in one form or another.

In Buddhism and Hinduism, that constant is represented by MahaKala.

MahaKala is translated as 'The Great Black' and goes to show how the 'blackness' of the universe and that which is the substratum of all (physicists call this 'Dark Matter') is Maha Kala's ethereal form.

Lord Shiva is also called 'Digambaram' or 'sky-clad'. He is naked and black, just like MahaKala.

If we compare MahaKala and Kala Bhairava, there's absolutely no difference at all...they are one and the same.

I do not know if Lord Shiva was incorporated into Buddhism in the same way as Lord Buddha was incorporated into Hinduism - to convert the masses and whatnot.

All I know is the Divine Image that oversees the Tandavam Dance of Lord Nataraja (praise be unto Him). The 'Grandfather Time' to which all must eventually fall...and rise up again.

I don't see it as supplanting...more than two separate philosophies that have converged at this one point...like a 'common ground'.

Aum Namah Shivaya

Necromancer
27 July 2013, 12:54 AM
As an addendum to the above - I was still trying to work out how Time = Dark Matter for a long while.

I had my own theories about it by way of inverting that famous Einstein equation - I had ideas which I began to research...then I found this. It explains it all...how I conceive God to be (ignore the music). lol

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M5BDWagywAo

Now, compare that back to MahaKala and Bhairava.


Also, there's an interesting observation to make here...

One of my 'addictions' in this life, is a trading card game called Yugioh!

Some cards have Indian/Sanskrit names, so I started researching them. I already knew 'Garuda The Wind Spirit', 'Dragunity Knight Vajrayana' and other things, but I was stuck on this one particular card....it was called 'Maha Vailo'.

I knew that 'Maha' meant 'Great'...but Vailo? What was a Vailo?

For a few weeks I wondered, then I put it out of my mind for years.

Then, a few months ago, I was dueling against a Buddhist scholar (I lost btw).

I don't know how the topic came up, but it did. He was quick to point out the various interchangeable letters and accents from Indian Sanskrit into Tibetan Sanskrit.

Thus, 'Vailo' became 'Bhairo'. A light immediately went off in my head...I understood it all now.

Vairochana = Bhairava.

It was all interconnected.

Aum Namah Shivaya

Crane-Foot King
27 July 2013, 01:56 PM
As an addendum to the above - I was still trying to work out how Time = Dark Matter for a long while.

I had my own theories about it by way of inverting that famous Einstein equation - I had ideas which I began to research...then I found this. It explains it all...how I conceive God to be (ignore the music). lol

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M5BDWagywAo

Now, compare that back to MahaKala and Bhairava.


Also, there's an interesting observation to make here...

One of my 'addictions' in this life, is a trading card game called Yugioh!

Some cards have Indian/Sanskrit names, so I started researching them. I already knew 'Garuda The Wind Spirit', 'Dragunity Knight Vajrayana' and other things, but I was stuck on this one particular card....it was called 'Maha Vailo'.

I knew that 'Maha' meant 'Great'...but Vailo? What was a Vailo?

For a few weeks I wondered, then I put it out of my mind for years.

Then, a few months ago, I was dueling against a Buddhist scholar (I lost btw).

I don't know how the topic came up, but it did. He was quick to point out the various interchangeable letters and accents from Indian Sanskrit into Tibetan Sanskrit.

Thus, 'Vailo' became 'Bhairo'. A light immediately went off in my head...I understood it all now.

Vairochana = Bhairava.

It was all interconnected.

Aum Namah Shivaya

I've held the view that Samantabhadra Buddha is Lord Shiva in another form. There's also Samantabhadra Bodhisattva and Vajrapani, who is a wrathful form of Samantabhadra.