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View Full Version : Pastor arrested for conversion bid in Bangalore



wundermonk
19 April 2012, 10:19 PM
Story here (http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city/bangalore/Pastor-arrested-for-conversion-bid/articleshow/12739685.cms).


BANGALORE: Mahadevapura police on Thursday arrested a 31-year-old trainee pastor for allegedly trying to convert 23 children, including 14 girls, during a summer camp here.

[Yes pastor. Catch them young.]

Victor Babu alias Victor, a native of Dharmavaram in Andhra Pradesh, was held following a complaint filed by a few parents. Police recovered prayer books, pamphlets and other material from him and registered a case under Section 295A of the Indian Penal Code.

[How dare the parents complain? Hinduism says "Ekam sad vipra bahuda vadanti...Vasudaiva Kutumbakam" That means Hinduism should be open to all other religions including those that say Hinduism is wrong and Hindus are hell-bound.]

Police said Victor was imparting religious lessons to the 23 children in the Hebron prayer hall in Kundalahalli near Whitefield. According to complainants, Victor told them he would run a month-long free summer camp for their children. The camp opened three days ago. A mini-bus (KA 03 D 8949) would pick up children from Mahadevapura, Kundalahalli and surrounding areas every day.

Victor said: "I taught them prayers and songs but that doesn't mean I was converting them." Parents claimed Victor offered education and other basic facilities to children if they (parents) accepted his conditions. But Victor didn't elaborate what his conditions were, they added.

[Yes pastor. Teach them prayers that teach that Jesus was nailed to a cross and allowed to bleed to death. That will definitely make a great impression on young children. This is exactly what needs to be taught to these children.]

Section 295A

Pertains to deliberate and malicious acts, intended to outrage religious feelings or any class by insulting its religion or religious beliefs and suggests imprisonment for three years, or fine, or both.

yajvan
20 April 2012, 10:33 AM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté

of what value is this information ? It only inflames one's emotions and brings out the negitivity in others to pursue thoughts of ' I told you so', of ill feelings.

We are here to uplift , to inspire - this is the value of HDF.

praṇām

Jainarayan
20 April 2012, 10:48 AM
Namaste yajvan.

You are correct. Moreover, this is misinformation in the extreme; not to mention showing irreverence for scriptures by misusing them, for personal reasons.

Says the o.p.:

Hinduism says "Ekam sad vipra bahuda vadanti...Vasudaiva Kutumbakam" That means Hinduism should be open to all other religions including those that say Hinduism is wrong and Hindus are hell-bound.]

The full verse is:

Indraṃ mitraṃ varuṇamaghnimāhuratho divyaḥ sa suparṇo gharutmān
ekaṃ sad viprā bahudhā vadantyaghniṃ yamaṃ mātariśvānamāhuḥ

"They call him Indra, Mitra, Varuṇa, Agni, and he is heavenly nobly-winged Garutmān.
To what is One, sages give many a title they call it Agni, Yama, Mātariśvan."

It means there is only one God and one Truth. It speaks nothing of one path or the correctness of one religion over another. In fact the phrase Vasudaiva Kutumbakam 'meaning one family of Earth' is not in that verse.

The deliberate dissemination of misinformation is a disservice to the site's reputation.

realdemigod
20 April 2012, 11:22 AM
wundermonk,
Next to my place in blore..there is a summer bible school for kids.. I hope this don't happen here

charitra
20 April 2012, 11:35 AM
wundermonk,
Next to my place in blore..there is a summer bible school for kids.. I hope this don't happen here
the moral and material support come from their western masters, what else would you expect.. If you have time and are serious about protect hinduism better go check it out along with your friends yourself, im positive nothing short of predatory tactics are applied every place associated with those 2 abrahamic faiths. youtube search the following-Jesus Camp divides America. The situation in USA is much worse.

wundermonk
20 April 2012, 11:47 AM
@TbtL:

My bad...I included both the sayings that are repeated by "sab kuch chaltha hai" folks [Hindi for "everything under the sun goes" folks] within the same set of quotations.

wundermonk
20 April 2012, 11:51 AM
of what value is this information ?

Please see post by realdemigod who stays in Bangalore. Incidents like these are not something that happens in some place in Africa or Antartica. They are close to the home, heart and hearth of posters here on HDF itself.


It only inflames one's emotions and brings out the negitivity in others to pursue thoughts of ' I told you so', of ill feelings.

Not at all. Not all religions are benign. Some ARE more virulent than others. How does one deal with a virulent religion?


We are here to uplift , to inspire - this is the value of HDF.

Sure...and there are many such posts on HDF, no doubt. At the same time, whether Hindus accept it or not, the Abrahamics are on a war footing against us - as this story illustrates.

Jainarayan
20 April 2012, 12:05 PM
the moral and material support come from their western masters, what else would you expect.. If you have time and are serious about protect hinduism better go check it out along with your friends yourself, im positive nothing short of predatory tactics are applied every place associated with those 2 abrahamic faiths. youtube search the following-Jesus Camp divides America. The situation in USA is much worse.

The situation in the US is indeed pretty bad, as I've been trying to point out for the longest time. While the US is not a Christian nation, it is a nation of Christians. The roots for this sort of nonsense are already planted.

Here are typical "Christian" worship services, aka "worshiptainment":

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=70d3bU6vn5o
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=db-D1G1EGKA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6m512HSACxc

Unquestionably these people are bonafide kooks.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jesus_Camp
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Becky_Fischer
http://www.christiantoday.com/article/jesus.camp.shuts.down.due.to.negative.response/8539.htm

There is one camp that one teenager "escaped" from, and was dragged back kicking and screaming. I'm trying to find the real story. It was one of the camps in North Carolina.

No honor among thieves:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qUeoqEbgY9I&feature=related

realdemigod
20 April 2012, 09:44 PM
charitra and wundermonk,
I despise christianity and hate even entering churches for the damage it has done to the world for eons. But I'll see what I can do...besides just pouring water on head and saying you are christian doesn't make one christian right...or is it.. I don't know their rituals.

Also ISKCON is doing her job of fighting against christianity for decades that's the only resort.

Regarding USA, the country gives freedom more than that it should give to its citizens and people are exploiting. And people who hold power and greedy capitalists every one of them is christian (some jew) so there people are doomed.

Jainarayan
21 April 2012, 06:26 AM
Namaste.


charitra and wundermonk,
I despise christianity and hate even entering churches for the damage it has done to the world for eons.


Unfortunately when you are the "odd man out" in a family of Roman Catholics (in-laws too), there is always the obligatory funeral or wedding. I had to attend my mother-in-law's Spanish-flavored RC funeral last October. I just withdrew into myself, recited the Mahamrityunjaya Mantra (after all, she is a jiva also ;)) and was there for the support. But I felt nothing otherwise.



besides just pouring water on head and saying you are christian doesn't make one christian right...or is it.. I don't know their rituals.


Yes, to some that's all it is. My family is Roman Catholic-As-Convenient. That is, weddings are held in a RC church, babies are baptized in a RC church, dead persons are buried from a RC church. But they may as well be atheists for the rest of the time; yet they live their own lives: live and let live.


Regarding USA, the country gives freedom more than that it should give to its citizens and people are exploiting.

That pesky First Amendment. I love the US Constitution, but its vagueries (perhaps deliberately done by the founders) necessitate the US Supreme Court stepping in.

realdemigod
21 April 2012, 06:42 AM
I pity you TouchedbytheLord but appreciate your patience and courage. :)

sanjaya
21 April 2012, 08:54 AM
Wundermonk, I for one am glad you posted these (no offense to those of differing opinion). Yes, it's a form of negativity. But ignorance of the plague of Christianity is precisely the means by which we allow this horrible and evil religion to erode our culture. Ignoring the problem will not make it go away. It is encouraging too see Indians taking advantage of the law and complaining about conversion attempts, rather than touting this tired old line that "all religions are equally valid." All religions are not equally valid. Any religion which condemns a billion Hindus to hell for failing to give up our culture and become de facto Europeans is evil, and should be recognized as such.

yajvan
21 April 2012, 10:15 AM
hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté

While I respect others views, I look at the issue from a different light. One does not deal with a problem on the level of the problem. If I am in the dark do I try and push out the dark ? I bring light. If I am hungry how do I eliminate the hunger ? I bring food.

If one is invincible, how can a pebble, or bullet bother him ?

If sanātana dharma is strong from where can any erosion come from ?
The issue is not in the other religions but in some weakness within one's own practice or collective practice.


If some one comes to your door and knocks... you can open the door or just not mind it. No one need become a victim.

praṇām

charitra
21 April 2012, 11:44 AM
If sanātana dharma is strong from where can any erosion come from ?The issue is not in the other religions but in some weakness within one's own practice or collective practice praṇām
The strength that is inherent is not complemented by the much desirable vigor and commitment of its adherents. They simply lack any will to educate their coreligionists nor do they want to erase the divisive elements that have crept into the culture (iam sure you all understand what iam talking about).

On a constructive note I suggest that the mandirs can introduce some brief interludes of hindu doctrinal teachings between or at the end of every puja, arati etc. It is doable. Mere recitation of slokas in sanskrit which no one understands, though should be left as it is for obvious reasons, must be followed by a brief talk of , say 2 minutes, in local language explaining the hindu philosophy in broader terms (not about sampradayas). Lets campaign for this, shall we? Even after the kid makes a visit to mandir he/she walks out with only physical images in mind and nothing more! No lasting words are uttered that make an impact on the child. The abrahamic faiths on the otherhand grind their doctrines into the minds of kids and thats all they do, no pujas or rituals of import. Namaste.

Jainarayan
21 April 2012, 02:38 PM
Namaste.


If sanātana dharma is strong from where can any erosion come from ?
The issue is not in the other religions but in some weakness within one's own practice or collective practice.



On a constructive note I suggest that the mandirs can introduce some brief interludes of hindu doctrinal teachings between or at the end of every puja, arati etc. It is doable.

Fight fire with fire. What do I mean? Rabbis, imams, ministers, preachers and priests of the RC, EO and Anglican Churches all give sermons! It has not occurred to me whether this is done in mandir or not.

If one has ever been to one of the above mentioned services, even a wedding or funeral! one hears the clergyperson deliver a sermon extolling the virtues of the respective religion.

Why shouldn't a pujari or a guest speaker, if not the pujari, give a "sermon", a teaching, stories, anything to light the fire of Hindu pride in the congregants who don't know anything other than the order of the puja?

as a westerner who attended Christian churches for half of my life, I know the efforts clergypersons put into their semons. RC, EO and Anglican priests don't just get up to the pulpit and start yapping. They actually compose their sermons, and work on them for days. With the corpus of Hindu scripture and literature, couldn't a pujari or prominent member of the temple do at least the same, probably better?

It's said that a fish begins to rot from the head; if the parents know little of their Hindu faith other than mindlessly following customs, how can they teach their children to appreciate Hinduism? How can they teach their children to avoid falling prey to unscrupulous evangelists (I know that's redundant).

Maybe I am talking out of turn, and if so I apologize. However, I've said in the past, and been rebuffed, that if Hindus are strong enough in their faith, they will rebuff the advances of evangelists, proselytizers and missionaries.

Years ago there was a tactic in the cities in the US called "block busting". One neighborhood resident who had some particular agenda, usually to change the demographic of the neighborhood, would go around telling the other neighbors that one of the neighbors was selling his house for $x.

For Sale signs started popping up all over the neighborhoods. There was no real reason to sell, but people followed the herd. If each person said "No, we are staying put and not selling the house", the neighborhood could not change. "No" means "no". If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem.