Yudhishtira

[yajvan]

Hari Om
~~~~~~
Namaste,

Have you ever considered why Krsna chose Arjuna for his conversation of raj-yoga? ( the Gita). Would Yudhishtira not have been a fit choice?
He is also known as Dharm-raj himself. A most noble being, the first born of the Pandava.

Have you an opinion on this?



pranams,

[satay]

Hari Om
~~~~~~
Namaste,

Have you ever considered why Krsna chose Arjuna for his conversation of raj-yoga? ( the Gita). Would Yudhishtira not have been a fit choice?
He is also known as Dharm-raj himself. A most noble being, the first born of the Pandava.

Have you an opinion on this?



pranams,



namaste,
I have wondered about it. Yudhisthtira was also the eldest brother. One would think that Lord would have given him the special treatment since it is customary for the eldest son to have the first choice in all matters.

[sm78]

Raj Yog or any yog for that matter are not for those who shy away from their duties, justice and pardon the asura (duryodhan) ... one should be free of personal hatred but at the same time have no doubts about defending justice and slaying those who stand against it.

Personal hatred comes from ego, shying away from duty comes from attachment. Both are moha's as per shastras ~ latter is of a worser type ..... moha of being a good, moha of being bad, moha of sticking to a ideology ... all are same.

Arjuna's had much less moha than Yudhishtira ... "Dharma Raj" is just title for following the book ... we have many people carrying good titles for helping to continue the lies in our present societies.

[yajvan]

Hari Om
~~~~~


Arjuna's had much less moha than Yudhishtira ... "Dharma Raj" is just title for following the book ... we have many people carrying good titles for helping to continue the lies in our present societies.

Namaste sm78,
So, let me test my understanding of your point... since Arjuna has less moha then Yudhishtira, ( the son of Dharma), he then is qualified to recieve the song of the Lord. Is my assessment correct , or have I embellished the point?

[satay]

so why Arjuna? is it because he was the perfect devotee? was he perfect?

[yajvan]

Hari Om
~~~~

so why Arjuna? is it because he was the perfect devotee? was he perfect?

Namaste Satay,
before I submit my thoughts on this matter, I would like to hear from sm78,and what he, and others think of this....
My approach and understanding will be directed by Arjuna as Nara, and Sri Krsna as Nararayana....Nara in sanscrit can mean hero, also can mean a person. It is this relationship that holds ( to me) the meaning of this relationship.

I read of Yudishthira's behviours as only exemplary, as one possessed of high ideals, of spiritual resolve and a great mind. I would aspire to become 1/2 as sattvic as Yudishthira-ji.

The answer to the Lords instruction is in their relationship...

Let us hear from others for additional ideas/insights.

[Agnideva]

Namaste All,

Let's take a step back, shall we? Was it Krishna who chose Arjuna, or was it Arjuna who chose Krishna? Just something to think about ...

Regards,
A.

[sm78]

Hari Om
~~~~~


Namaste sm78,
So, let me test my understanding of your point... since Arjuna has less moha then Yudhishtira, ( the son of Dharma), he then is qualified to recieve the song of the Lord. Is my assessment correct , or have I embellished the point?

He is certainly more likely to make better sense of the song of lord than the son of dharma.

The essense of the song of lord is to stand beyond all levels of moha, be it physical, mental or spiritual ~ the final question from the Lord at the end of it all, is whether our (and Arjuna's) moha has been removed by listing to this unparralled song.

As Agnideva says, Yudhishtira (did not) would not have asked for Lord's advice ~ I think his moha for rules of dharma were too much to seek advice at that juncture.

[sm78]

To put my final comment here:- I am not actually sure why Arjuna received the song of lord, and why yudhishtira did not. But that is not a terribly important question for me.

But I am only convinced that Gita's and most mahabharata's teaching is how moha (including spiritual) leads to ruin and how Gita stands beyond all of it. It is indeed the song sung by a Puruhottama ~ one who stands beyond the unmanifest (abyakta), untained by any weaknesses of the manifest.

One cannot be a Krshna, but it should be the only goal of development ~ peace (shiva), love (Vishnu), hate (Asura) or intellect (GaneshA) are not goals of development. They are the powers of the fully evolved one. We can have all, yet not let any become a weakness and attachment.

[Agnideva]

Namaste,

My thoughts are very similar to Singhi's. Yudhishtira is very noble, and as the dharma raja, he doesn't question dharma. He never questioned the ethics of the war or have a dharmic dilemma on the battle field. Arjuna, on the other hand, is a very human personality in the story. He questions dharma, he is not sure what his dharma is at that point. Had Arjuna not questioned his dharma, had he just blown his conch and said let's begin the war, the song of the Lord would not have been.

Even before the war, Arjuna was given a choice. He could have Krishna as a charioteer, or he could have the entire Yadava army. He chose Krishna over the army, and Kauravas got the army.

It was Arjuna who chose Krishna in that sense. It was Arjuna who needed the message, not Yudhishtira. He was the one who had the moha as Singhi says, which needed to be dispelled.

OM Shanti,
A.

[Ganeshprasad]

Pranam

please furgive me for stating the obvious

Why Krishna spoke the Bhagvat Gita to Arjun, the reasons are given in the Gita itself and I quote

karpanya-dosopahata-svabhavah
prcchami tvam dharma-sammudha-cetah
yac chreyah syan niscitam bruhi tan me
sisyas te 'ham sadhi mam tvam prapannam

Now I am confused about my duty and have lost all composure because of weakness. In this condition I am asking You to tell me clearly what is best for me. Now I am Your disciple, and a soul surrendered unto You. Please instruct me. Bg2.7

sa evayam maya te 'dya
yogah proktah puratanah
bhakto 'si me sakha ceti
rahasyam hy etad uttamam

Today I have described the same ancient science to you, because you are my sincere devotee and friend. yoga is a supreme secret indeed. (4.03)
And further in chapter 9 he says because you are not envious.

Youdhister was born amsah of Dharma Raj; he is said to go to haven in his original form.
He was truth personified he had mastered Dharma studying from his gurus while Arjun was expert in the field of fighting and it is Arjun who is deluded and overcome by grief therefor the Gita was spoken to Arjun.
I can not see any other reason

Jai Shree Krishna

[yajvan]

Hari Om
~~~~~

Namaste Unmesaki ( one who has the eyes opened a.k.a open to the truth).

Here is my opinion as I see it:
Arjuna is Nara - means Hero, Leader ( as is Arjuna) and it also means the ordinary person.
We also know Arjuna's name Arjuna: a—"no," rajju—"rope," the symbol of bondage, and na—"no." Although he is free, he thinks he is in bondage.

And we know Narayanya as the Supreme - nara + ayana. Nara as we said can mean person or humanity + ayana is path. So it can mean the path of man or humanity - the path of all of us to the Supreme, is one view. Another view is nara for ~ water , and ayana moving or path for He you lies upon the water ( the symbol for consciousness) .
So know this Narayana as Visnu , and then Krsna , the fountainhead of all.
So Nara and Narayana are quire close… like Arjuna and Sri Krsna. We have that established.

But why did Hrishikesha ( Krsna, the Lord of the senses) give this knowledge to Gudakesha ( Arjuna, or the conqueror of sleep) ? Here's an idea to consider:
Arjuna represents the highly elevated, yet ordinary man ( Nara)… this suggests to me that the song of the Lord can be comprehended by one and all. It is Arjuna that asks the most practical questions of life ( and strife) that one encounters. Our duty, family, our social dharma and personal dharma. Arjuna represents Nara, humanity, with his questions a.k.a - you and me. Krsna is able to deliver the wisdom of life to the world through Arjuna, our Nara, the representative of humanity.

Another salient point is the response of Krsna as the Supreme, as Vishva (Vaishvanara). The response of the universe to ones need is done in a timely manner. This is a subtle yet interesting lesson. The universe is highly intelligent, it is the expression, if not the representation of pure intelligence. With Krshna's response , He is responding to the need of the time. That is, Arjuna's request for knowledge, both practical as a kasatriya, and as a sishya, the student of the Jagadguru , Krsna. This is quite interesting, as Krsna is able to uplift Arjuna from a personal, social and spiritual standpoint, so is the wisdom of the Supreme.


Now, the question remains, why was this wisdom not imparted to Arjuna's brother and King, Yudhishtira? Its my humble opinion, Yudhishtira's needs are of a different order. How so? Lets compare the questions of Yudhishtira (from yudhi, "in the battle", and sthira, "calm, undisturbed" some say 'fixed' or he that is calm in battle).
Yudhishtira asks Bhishma six questions, as he, Bhishma awaits the proper time to drop the body. He had the boon of Ichchamrtyu, the power to die whenever he wished. Yet who suggests that Yudhishtira should visit Bhishma? It was Krsna. What was the intent? Aruna brings out one level of knowledge for Nara ( humanity) and Yudhishtira will bring out another level of knowledge, Narayana bhakti…. He asks the following questions:
1. Who is the supreme deity?
2. Which is the supreme goal?
3.& 4. Praising whom and worshipping whom men attain happiness?
5. What is, in your opinion , the best dharma of all?
6.Meditation on whom leads one to salvation?
These questions are of a high nature… Yudhishtira is an evoloved soul, the son or Dharma. From these question's Bhishma is Able to impart Vishnu sahasranama, or the 1000 names of the Lord or Jagatprabhu, as He is the one who ordains salvation by His Grace as well as upligting and supporting Dharma (as represented by Yudhishtira).

Let me know of your thoughts and comments...


Pranams,

[mirabai]

Namaste,

In my very unscholarly opinion, Arjun's struggle with moral issues of going to war with his kin, and his confusion about duty and the nature of life and death are the very traits that made him the perfect choice. The doubts and uncertainty that paralyzed Arjuna are symbolic of the doubts and uncertainty that plague humanity. When Krishna convinced His friend of the truth and revealed him His true nature, He also revealed it to humanity, who have the doubts dispelled the moment we understand what took place on that field. Humanity must come to the same epiphany that Arjun realized; that Krishna is lord of discipline and we, knowing that, are simply to perform our duty without hesitation or fear.

Hari Hari