Daily Chanting

[TruthSeeker]

The effect of all these is that nowadays Srivaishnavas think that medittaion and Yoga are all alien to their tradition, while it is the core of this religion. Very few people will take all these seriously. In all his kindness for the degenerating humanity, Sri Ramanuja sacrificed many core tenets of the faith, so that religion could be practised easier. That does not, however mean, that you should not try to become a mystic like Sri Ramanuja or Alwars by the practice of Yoga. All Alwars and the early Vaishnava Acharyas were only Yogis and mystics though the very talk of it taken with scepticism and opposed these days.

Hinduism prior to the advent of Sri Shankara must have been unusually secular in nature, and also deeply spiritual in nature. Every person indulged in a type of religion he liked and there was hardly any proselytizing within the whole of Hinduism - there were Shankyas, Naiyyayikas, Yogis, Bhagavatas, Tantrics and there was no real anymosity between them.

In the 8th century, Adi Shankara came down, and composed the prastAna thrayI and established that vedantic philosophy alone was Hinduism, and preached it far and wide all over India. There were a number of people who resented it, but they could not do anything due to his prowess. But we also know why Shankara had to do it - adharmic religions had begun to take over Hinduism and somebody had to do something to unify the vedic religion.

Thus, Hinduism now came to be associated only with vedanta with advaita flavour in it. Since this had clashed with the beleifs of many others, many other groups came soon after, with each group vying for each other and trying to outwit each other.

While the emphasis should have been on sAdhana, in medieval India the emphasis was on logic and argumentation and trying to show who was superior. In this process, the mystic Yoga was totally lost and became completely replaced with bhajans. This may not be anything inferior spiritually in the long run, but such lack of emphasis on Jnana Yoga ensured that people had only bookish knowledge to quarrel with - and NO SPIRITUAL WISDOM.

What is the point with religion if it is just bookish? Religion is there for realization alone, and as long as religions dont emphasis this even a bit, there will always be dualism and divisiveness - the infighting will never cease. Knowledge of the Self alone puts an end to all these quarrels and the never ending questions - so seek that alone. Bookish knowledge however good serves no purpose whatsoever, unless it is used fully for the above purpose.


So start with meditation today, even if it appears difficult to practice. You are bound to find the answers in due course. We can find out which philosopher was correct when these truths are realized in practice.

[TruthSeeker]

I would warn many Vaishnavites to also give importance to this part of Hinduism, namely the core spiritual part - silent intense meditation, which adds many dimensions to the Bhakti movement.

The combination is actually science and not fancy imagination. A small opinion I am giving.

The Atman cannot be percieved by the senses. It is to be percived only through the mind ( ultimately it is the Atman that percieves itself)

Mind in this context refers to the lower mind called the Manas, the Chitta or the memory bank, the intellect or the Buddhi and the ego or Ahamkara. It is this mind that can percieve the abstract Atman.We know that Atman is pure consciousness, so why is it unable to percieve.The reason is two fold.

The Mind is a mirror that can capture the image of the Atman. It is unable to do so, because a) it is impure and dusty b) it is shaky. It is impure due to wordly attachment and due to the kama krodha lobha mada matsarya etc. It is shaky due to the karma or the vasanas of the previous births.

So two things are to be done to capture the Atman on the mind. Remove the dust on it, and stop its constant shaking. The former requires the practice of Karma Yoga and a good religeous discipline. The latter requires meditation and samadhi. Both are absolutely essential to the success of Yoga and it is a failure without accomplishing both. Removing the dust is higher in priority and for this reason more emphasis is on Karma Yoga rather than on Jnana Yoga for most religions. Once the mind is purified, its shaking can be more easily stopped.


Note:
It is Atman that percieves and not the mind. But since Atman has no dust nor it shakes and is unchanging, its defects are relocated to the mind in this example.

[satay]

Hare Krishn Hare Krihsn, Krishn Krishn Hare Hare
Hare Ram Hare Ram, Ram Ram Hare Hare

Hare Krishn Hare Krishn, krishn Krishn Hare Hare
Hare Ram hare Ram, Ram Ram Hare Hare

Hare krishn Hare Krishn, Krishn Krishn Hare hare
Hare Ram Hare Ram, Ram Ram Hare hare

[cbrahma]

I have chanted the mahamantra in the past, a full sixteen rounds, following the regs. I since dropped the practice because the life-style it demands is impractical and complicated. The rules for eating offering etc...are enough to stress me out every time I need to cook a meal for myself , let alone friends. Then I come to a forum like this and find out about so many other requirements such as diksa, two inititiations and my urge is cured.
Thank you

[c.smith]

cbrahma

Thank-you for sharing your experiences and concerns. As you may have noted from some of my previous posts, I felt the same way for some time. As a result, I broke off from ISKCON and don't feel bad about having done so. I had a lot of questions that weren't getting answered (some I didn't even know how to ask) that I needed so I branched out on my own and got what I needed. Now I'm slowly returning to the Temple and associating with devotees, chanting the Mahamantra, etc. A sense of peace is overcoming me.

I can see that this certainly isn't everyones experience here. I treasure the different points of view that are shared here and value the moderator(s) for what they contribute.

My view? When it all comes down to it, we're all looking for the same thing and will one day all find the one answer.

Hare Krishna

Clayton

[yajvan]

Hari Om
~~~~~

I strongly agree that chanting aloud in groups is very powerful. Naturally, this is why you want to chant only in groups where everyone in the group is on the same page to enhance the vibration.

Namaste BYS (et.al)
If Chanting in large groups is benefical (agree), then tanscending in large groups must be equal or more powerful. It has been my experience thus so.

How so? when the group is transcending together, then they are touchnig the fabric of all beings at the same time. By this method the world would change in one week. We are all connected by consciousness. This is not a nice concept but the reality of this world.

Meet together, talk together, let your minds apprehend alike;
In like manner as the ancient gods concurring accepted their portions at the sacrifice.
Common be the prayer of these assembled worshippers, common be the acquirement, common the purpose, associated by the desire. I repeat for you a common prayer, I offer for you with a common oblation, common be your intention, common be the wishes of your hearts, common be your thoughts, So that there may be through union among you.
Rig Ved -10 Mandala, 12.40, the rishi is Samvanana, Agni is devata

pranams,

[Znanna]

Meet together, talk together, let your minds apprehend alike;
In like manner as the ancient gods concurring accepted their portions at the sacrifice.
Common be the prayer of these assembled worshippers, common be the acquirement, common the purpose, associated by the desire. I repeat for you a common prayer, I offer for you with a common oblation, common be your intention, common be the wishes of your hearts, common be your thoughts, So that there may be through union among you.
Rig Ved -10 Mandala, 12.40, the rishi is Samvanana, Agni is devata

"By the same mouth..."

http://www.io.com/~patrik/pennae.html




Namaste,
ZN

[c.smith]

I attended a japa workshop today and the guru stated that japa done in groups is very beneficial but since different people are at different stages of spiritual unfoldment, the sound vibrations (though potent) will have differing effects on each soul.

A couple of other things she mentioned that answer some of my own questions and doubts -

1. Many others have concentration problems while chanting. She suggests using then tounge and both lips in all of the pronunciation. Also suggests for some to put in ear plugs, so if chanting in a whisper the sound is magnified in ones head. Says both help with concentration and attention to the mantra.

2. Suggests using the picture of a deity or doing japa at ones altar.

3. Suggets chanting during the 1 - 1 1/2 hours before sunrise or just at sunset.

[yajvan]

Hari Om
~~~~~~

A couple of other things she mentioned that answer some of my own questions and doubts -

1. Many others have concentration problems while chanting. She suggests using then tounge and both lips in all of the pronunciation. Also suggests for some to put in ear plugs, so if chanting in a whisper the sound is magnified in ones head. Says both help with concentration and attention to the mantra.

2. Suggests using the picture of a deity or doing japa at ones altar.

3. Suggets chanting during the 1 - 1 1/2 hours before sunrise or just at sunset.

Namaste C.Smith,
May I ask what is your goal?
Chanting/japa and concentration as the goal? If this is your goal - it is very noble. To gain this goal, we nourish the root of thinking.
We get a concentrated mind ( clarity and one pointedness) not by straining the mind and concentrating , but by a natural process of refreshing and culturing the mind, for this one-pointedness to occur on its own.
Think about a fruit tree... we do not water each bud, or fruit blossom to make the tree bare fruit. What do we do? we water the root, and all parts of the tree benefit, and we are able to pick the fruit in due time.

Like that, for us we water the root of this consciousness; we bring our awareness to the ocean of your Being, to the silence within and all parts of the aspirant is nourished. The ability to concentrate, the closeness to the SELF, the expansion of awareness, closer to delight, like that one benefits. WE then come out and act - yogastha kuru karmani, as Sri Krsna has said. Established in yoga ( or union of the Divine) we perform actions ( karma). This bares the best fruit.

pranams,

[c.smith]

Concentration IS essential for me, but I chant out of love for Krishna. Even at times when I don't feel like chanting, the process of simply starting brings me closer to the Lord. It's simple and it reminds me just how close He is. It's kind of like the picture you get in your mind when a loved ones name is spoken.