Purpose of Universe

[rishabhverma]

Namaste,
According to hindu cosmology, the universe keeps going through a big bang and big crunch and is consistent with Poincaré recurrence theorem. In such a case some questions arise,
1.) What is the purpose of this universe?
2.) What is our purpose in life?
3.) If everything is going to repeat it self, aren't all our actions already determined?

Please answer as I am really seeking an answer to these questions.

Thank you

[Twilightdance]

Namaste,
According to hindu cosmology, the universe keeps going through a big bang and big crunch and is consistent with Poincaré recurrence theorem. In such a case some questions arise,
1.) What is the purpose of this universe?
2.) What is our purpose in life?
3.) If everything is going to repeat it self, aren't all our actions already determined?

Please answer as I am really seeking an answer to these questions.

Thank you

From theistic viewpoints the purpose is sveccha or universal will of "God". Other's don't offer any explanation of eternity [including destruction & re-creation] of universe.

But I believe the problem is in the question "Why" which underscores an assumption [which I think is a delusion] that workings of the universe must be answerable to human emotions or the emotional distress of not having a meaningful rationale. This "why" frequently comes from theists who when offered a perfect explanation of a natural phenomena proceeds to ridicule it as to "why so".

Outside the realm of human mind and emotions, things are as they are. There is no distressed son to ask why, and no guardian father to console with a emotionally admissible explanation. "Why" is an entirely mind cooked up problem from our inability to accept things as they are. The only real & interesting "Why" is "How". Mystery of the universe will be known if one knew how exactly it is created, maintained and dissolved. KS[kashmir shaivism] proposes the vimarsha nature of consciousness...grammarians propose some existential eternalities or archetypes [I prefer something similar with 7 eternal matrikas, than KS], science has proposed some other theories which only admit a material universe.

[Kismet]

But I believe the problem is in the question "Why" which underscores an assumption [which I think is a delusion] that workings of the universe must be answerable to human emotions or the emotional distress of not having a meaningful rationale. This "why" frequently comes from theists who when offered a perfect explanation of a natural phenomena proceeds to ridicule it as to "why so".

I used to think this was illusory too, now I think there is more to humans assigning purposive meanings to the universe. In a way I suppose you could call this "properly basic" to humans.

As Prabhupad said, "nothing happens by chance" - such is "nonsense" - "everything has an arrangement."

I do not apologize for quoting Prabhupad in this context - I think he was wiser than people give him credit for.

[wundermonk]

Namaste,
According to hindu cosmology, the universe keeps going through a big bang and big crunch and is consistent with Poincaré recurrence theorem.

What exactly is this theorem saying, in your own words, please.

In such a case some questions arise,

Ok.

1.) What is the purpose of this universe?

To act as the effect of the previous universe and the cause of the next universe.

2.) What is our purpose in life?

To be happy/avoid pain?

3.) If everything is going to repeat it self, aren't all our actions already determined?

Who says everything is going repeat itself?

Please answer as I am really seeking an answer to these questions.

Done!

[TatTvamAsi]

The purpose of the (uni/multi)verse is to ENJOY!

So that "I" may know mySelf!

[rishabhverma]

In layman's terms, the theorem suggests that the universe undergoes cycles.
Twilightdance's answers were very thought provoking.
wundermonk's answers seemed a bit confusing.
If the purpose of this universe is to be the effect of the previous universe and this keeps going on all the way back to infinity, it appears that the universe is actually purposeless. And hence, your second answer of 'to avoid pain and search for happiness' is also purposeless. why search for happiness when that happiness is also purposeless in the end? Also, if killing people gives me happiness, do I engage in killing people just to find happiness?
If the universe is going to be formed again and again, then isn't it repeating itself?

[wundermonk]

In layman's terms, the theorem suggests that the universe undergoes cycles.

Okay. Universe, by definition, is all that exists.

wundermonk's answers seemed a bit confusing.

Let us delve deeper.

If the purpose of this universe is to be the effect of the previous universe and this keeps going on all the way back to infinity

One of the first mistakes people commit when attempting to argue against an infinite regress (which I think you are committing) is to presume that infinity is some point in the past or the future. It is neither. An infinite past simply means that time never began. The universe always was. I made a thread on that here. You posted an earlier question also along the same lines here.

As I indicated there and similar to the case here, Karma/Universe/Jivas/Prakriti never began. They always were and will always be. Do not assume that things need to have a beginning/end.

it appears that the universe is actually purposeless.

The universe is all that exists. We are part of the universe. We have a purpose. So, the universe is NOT actually purposeless. Is Poincare's theorem purposeless since it seems to say that the universe goes through cycles? Is not the theorem part of the universe? Did the theorem serve any purpose?

why search for happiness when that happiness is also purposeless in the end?

The universe does not have an end.

Also, if killing people gives me happiness, do I engage in killing people just to find happiness?

There are very many reasons secular and religious to not go about doing this.

If the universe is going to be formed again and again, then isn't it repeating itself?

Since time is linear nothing ever repeats itself in an absolute sense. If you disagree, explain.

[Twilightdance]

I used to think this was illusory too, now I think there is more to humans assigning purposive meanings to the universe. In a way I suppose you could call this "properly basic" to humans.

The purpose of "Purposive meanings" as you suggest, I am 100% certain, does not go beyond mind and emotions of being human - so there cannot be anything substantial in any absolute sense in the "purpose" questions or its answers. Both the question and how we answer it is a way to mentally and emotionally cope with existence and universe. I am certain it has little to do with what Universe really is. IMHO.

Prabhupada, Gaudiya vaishnavism and even vaishnavism in general try understand existence from a human emotional level, and propose stories which give emotionally satisfying [if you switch of your skeptical brain] answers to existential questions.

So yes, these questions are properly basic to humans. Its all about humans and his mind, and much less about the universe. Thus it may be more fruitful to ask why we ask such questions, we may be able to understand our mind a bit more and eventually go beyond this existential dilemma, which is purely the human's problem - not the universe's.

[Twilightdance]

If the purpose of this universe is to be the effect of the previous universe and this keeps going on all the way back to infinity, it appears that the universe is actually purposeless.

The word purpose itself may be meaningless outside the small box frame of human emotions most of us live in. So before one searches the limits of the universe, one needs to see the limits of the human and if he is really bound by concepts like purpose, happiness etc? Are they anything but concepts i.e are they anything substantial than some mental ideas which only the human has?

If your answers to above lead you to view most human dilemmas as to do with human concepts - don't expect much sympathy within current hinduism and particularly in HDF.

I believe all Hindu philosophies [at least the frame of mind with we approach them, may not be the philosophies themselves!] instead of knocking down the fairy tale world a man lives in goes on to reinforce his individual fairy tales to cosmic proportions. Thus instead of knocking down or challenging all the notions one is born with and taught through life by parents, society and his own mind - he goes on to build more super notions about cosmos and its ruling God. Within Hinduism only Shaktism is flexible enough to admit a non conceptual approach without the need to be bogged down by monasticism, discipline & dirty monk politics of buddhism.

[shiv.somashekhar]

Namaste,
According to hindu cosmology, the universe keeps going through a big bang and big crunch and is consistent with Poincaré recurrence theorem. In such a case some questions arise,
1.) What is the purpose of this universe?
2.) What is our purpose in life?
3.) If everything is going to repeat it self, aren't all our actions already determined?

Please answer as I am really seeking an answer to these questions.

Thank you

1. Why do you think there should be a purpose at all? it appears to be a foregone conclusion with most people that there must be a purpose to existence.

2. Same as above.

3. The cycle of time is supposed to repeat as in January comes once every year. It is not the case that all the events are the same each time.