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Thread: Vaishnavism with Shaivism

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    Vaishnavism with Shaivism

    Namaste folks,

    In history we find kings who built Vaishnava temples inspite of being staunch Shaivites - King Ko Chengan Chozhan, for examples, built 70 Shaivite temples along with 1 Vaishnava divyadesam - the temple at 'Thirunarayur'.

    (It is said Vishishtadvaita and Advaita are 99% the same, only the last 1% different!). In our temple, the Vaishnava purohits also do archana and abhisheka to Shaiva murthies such as Ganesha and vice versa.

    You can say I'm following their footsteps - although having not 1 or 2, but 3 personal favorite Vaishnava deities (Rama, Narasimha and Ranganatha), my love for deities also stretches into those of the Shaivite pantheon - I love Shiva and Muruga! And into the Shakta tradition too - I love goddess Mariamma.

    Also, someone from Shaivite tradition told me that whenever I pray, I should, regardless of being a Vaishnava, first offer my obeisance to Lord Shiva, as he is elder to Vishnu.

    So in my daily devotional practice, I first recite hymns and then offer food for deities in the following order -

    Ganesha, Nataraja, his consort Sivakami, Thiruvannamalaiyappa, Medha Dakshinamoorthy, Sri Anjaneya, Sri Rama, Sita, Srimad Ramanuja, Sri Lakshmi Narasimha, his consort Rajyalakshmi thaayaar, Tirupathi Balaji, his consort Alarmelu manga, Ranganatha, his consort Mahalakshmi, Krishna, his consort Rukmini, Muruga, Deivayanai, Valli, Karumariamma, Meenakshi, Raghavendra, SuryaNarayana, and finally my late grandmother, my late father, my late in-laws!

    And I offer the same food as naivedyam to each of the above deities. I mentally say 'Naivedyam samarpayami, shodasopachaaram samarpayami' and offer the food.

    Do any of you, being staunch Vaishnavite or Shaivite, include gods from the other sect in your daily spiritual practice thus? Is it correct for me to say, 'shodasopachaaram samarpayami' although I am not doing the shodasa or 16-fold upacharas or respects? Is there any alternative term you use? Kindly explain.

    Also what is the procedure for your worship? I'm curious to know if there are any other steps included in the process that I can incorporate.

    Thank you.
    jai hanuman gyan gun sagar jai kapis tihu lok ujagar

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    Re: Vaishnavism with Shaivism

    Namaste.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aspirant01 View Post
    Do any of you, being staunch Vaishnavite or Shaivite, include gods from the other sect in your daily spiritual practice thus? ...

    Also what is the procedure for your worship? I'm curious to know if there are any other steps included in the process that I can incorporate.

    Thank you.
    Shivasya hridayam Vishnur Vishnoscha hridayam Shiva - "Vishnu is the heart of Shiva and likewise Shiva is the heart of Vishnu". That I believe is from the Skanda Purana. Vishnu is milk, Shiva is yogurt. Both are different forms of the same substance. I think Srila Prabhupada said that.

    I pray to the other deities: Maa Kali, Maa Durga, Lord Murugan, Maa Saraswati, Lord Hanuman, Lord Ganesha, for example. The prayers consist of short praises and/or requests for their special blessings. I also occasionally do japa on a rudraksha mala to Lord Shiva. I do this because I believe He will help me in my meditation and steadfastness in devotion.
    śivasya hridayam viṣṇur viṣṇoscha hridayam śivaḥ

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    Re: Vaishnavism with Shaivism

    Quote Originally Posted by Jainarayan View Post
    Namaste.
    I also occasionally do japa on a rudraksha mala to Lord Shiva. I do this because I believe He will help me in my meditation and steadfastness in devotion.
    I too need divine help in this area, Jai-ji! While reciting prayers and especially while reciting the Sri Rama-raksha mantra 108 times, my thoughts seem to wander aimlessly! BUT, amazingly, whenever I try to focus on Shivalinga, I find a definite improvement with my concentration! I just do not do it though because it would then become way too lengthy worship and I would have to cut short on other prayers! Is something with the idea of presenting Shiva in the linga form - does it benefit yogis in better concentration? Do not know.
    jai hanuman gyan gun sagar jai kapis tihu lok ujagar

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    Re: Vaishnavism with Shaivism

    Quote Originally Posted by Aspirant01 View Post
    I too need divine help in this area, Jai-ji! While reciting prayers and especially while reciting the Sri Rama-raksha mantra 108 times, my thoughts seem to wander aimlessly! BUT, amazingly, whenever I try to focus on Shivalinga, I find a definite improvement with my concentration! I just do not do it though because it would then become way too lengthy worship and I would have to cut short on other prayers! Is something with the idea of presenting Shiva in the linga form - does it benefit yogis in better concentration? Do not know.
    For ritual purpose invoking many deities is fine. For Japa one is enough.

    Selecting a God depends upon your nature. Being attracted to a deity is the main thing. In your case, it is Lord Rama. It is not a problem or any kind of fault if other deities do not influence you.

    All deities are equally powerful.

    So if Rama's life, his persona and the deity is appealing to you, then it is the best that suits you and you do not need to go to any other temple or God

    Similarly if by chanting Lord Shiva's name and doing his worship, your mind calms down, then Lord Shiva suits you.

    Whatever name touches your heart and calms your mind is 'the best for you'.

    Nirakara Brahman is like ocean and Ice is like sakar Ishwara. It is water itself. Just like by the cold, water is frozen into ice, by bhakti-cold, formless God takes form and appears in front of devotee.

    Same God (Tatva) is called Brahma when he is creating, same God is called Vishnu ....

    So depending upon the work they do, they are assigned a particular name. Also a personality is attached to them. If it influences you or matches you, then it is your ishta-devata. Forget books, forget your birth caste and religion. Forget your path that you have earlier selected. Just clear you mind.

    No God says I am superior. Shiva himself does not say he is superior to Vishnu. It is the devotees that say and fight over supremacy. My God is the best is OK, but other is inferior is not a good sign for spiritual progress says Sri Ramakrishna.

    Sometimes, practical approaches are taken to avoid fights.

    Like a Shaiva King building Vishnu temple and vica versa. It is by respecting other paths that harmony is attained and preserved. So Shaiva king and priests with praise Vishnu and in turn Vaishnav King and priest will praise Shiva. People will leave in harmony and not waste their precious time in fighting, but in spirituality.

    Some are naturally attracted to Devi, Adi Shakti or some to Ganesh. It all depends upon your nature. Let God decide what is best for you. Be open. Do not rigidly stick to Vishnu or Rama is Shiva's name can calm you.

    Shiva is all powerful, a yogi, a householder, an ascetic, and is a symbol of Jnana. He is the remover of ignorance, a tapasvi, an ideal family man - a good husband and father.

    Shiva Ling is the representation of Shiva but not with form. It represent formless aspect of him. You can easily go beyond this samsara if you worship Lord Shiva.

    As you will progress, you will find that whomsoever God you worship, you will be filled with bhakti. Every God will influence you. Shiva Tandava Stotra will influence you and so will Vishnu's hymms.

    But Shiva will always be special.

    Aum
    Only God Is Truth, Everything Else Is Illusion - Ramakrishna
    Total Surrender of Ego to SELF is Real Bhakti - Ramana Maharshi

    Silence is the study of the scruptures. Meditation is the continuous thinking of Brahman which is to be meditated upon. The complete negation of both by knowledge is the vision of truth – sadAcAra-14 of Adi SankarAcArya

    namah SivAya vishnurUpAya viShNave SivarUpiNe, MBh, vanaparva, 3.39.76

    Sanskrit Dict | MW Dict | Gita Super Site | Hindu Dharma

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    Re: Vaishnavism with Shaivism

    Quote Originally Posted by Jainarayan View Post
    Namaste.

    Shivasya hridayam Vishnur Vishnoscha hridayam Shiva - "Vishnu is the heart of Shiva and likewise Shiva is the heart of Vishnu".
    True very true.

    Namaste
    Only God Is Truth, Everything Else Is Illusion - Ramakrishna
    Total Surrender of Ego to SELF is Real Bhakti - Ramana Maharshi

    Silence is the study of the scruptures. Meditation is the continuous thinking of Brahman which is to be meditated upon. The complete negation of both by knowledge is the vision of truth – sadAcAra-14 of Adi SankarAcArya

    namah SivAya vishnurUpAya viShNave SivarUpiNe, MBh, vanaparva, 3.39.76

    Sanskrit Dict | MW Dict | Gita Super Site | Hindu Dharma

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    Re: Vaishnavism with Shaivism

    Quote Originally Posted by Indiaspirituality View Post
    True very true.

    Namaste
    It's nice to get it right once in a while.
    śivasya hridayam viṣṇur viṣṇoscha hridayam śivaḥ

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    Re: Vaishnavism with Shaivism

    Thank you, IndiaSpirituality!

    Like a Shaiva King building Vishnu temple and vica versa. It is by respecting other paths that harmony is attained and preserved. So Shaiva king and priests with praise Vishnu and in turn Vaishnav King and priest will praise Shiva. People will leave in harmony and not waste their precious time in fighting, but in spirituality.
    Like the story of Tulsi - the devout Rama bhakta, on his pilgrimage to Rameshwar, is stopped by Shiva in the guise of a Shaiva pundit, who tells Tulsi he can't enter the temple because he is a Vaishnavite, then upon testing Tulsi, gives darshan to him!

    Shiva and Vishnu are in a very pleasant harmony with each other! It is only us, devotees!
    jai hanuman gyan gun sagar jai kapis tihu lok ujagar

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    Re: Vaishnavism with Shaivism

    LOL, I am a staunch Vaishnavite, because it is my religion and culture, and it is what I was taught and brought into. But I know in my heart that it doesn't matter what form of God you believe in, as long as you have sincerity! All the different forms and conceptions of God are to me the totality and mercy of Sri Vishnu, and His form in other forms.

    Srila Bhaktivinod Thakur, a Vaishnavite acharya in my sampradaya, said in his book 'Jaiva-Dharma' that everyone practices Vaishnava Dharma, because all Dharmas in this world, Shaiva, Shakta, Christian, Muslim, Baha'i, Sikh, etc. are all different forms of of the same aspiration: to come to God as a humble soul and child of His.

    True Vaishnava Dharma is nonsectarian and liberal, says Srila Bhaktivinod, and is Jaiva-Dharma. And what is Jaiva-Dharma, but the true Dharma, to surrender one's self completely to the conception of Godhead (sarva dharman parityajya).

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    Re: Vaishnavism with Shaivism

    Namaste

    Quote "Do any of you, being staunch Vaishnavite or Shaivite, include gods from the other sect in your daily spiritual practice thus?"

    I am a Saiva - but no matter what "sect" you consider, whether you woship Surya, or Indra, or be a Shakta, or Vaishnava, and many other examples of this large family we conveniently call "Hinduism", most Hindus give respects, mantra, puja, bhajan, etc to Lord Ganesha. Certainly there are exceptions, but Ganapati is part of the life events and daily spiritual devotions of countless Hindus and beloved by the "common man". I too, as it was Ganapati Who first called me when I was 8 years old.

    My Ishta Lord is Hanuman.

    I engage in exploration, reading, study, devotion, even trivia related to Ramayana very often, hardly a day does not go by without Ramayana.

    I can give other examples where Durga or Kali are part of devotions, as well as Saraswati. Some may consider these as Shakta.

    I can give many examples, but within this Family, the examples are vast and found across the practitioners of Hinduism.

    Om Namah Sivaya

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    Re: Vaishnavism with Shaivism

    I thank everyone for replies.

    Somehow I was curious to hear the devotional routines you do, whether you do daily abhishekam, or pray more than once a day, recite anything specific each day... like I know someone who does daily fire ritual (homam) waking up at 4:45 am each day.. and he is ready to share details of it everytime... Somehow I couldn't get this info Guess I am not good at wording precisely. But, I again thank everyone for the knowledge shared. I wish heartfelt good luck with your spiritual pursuits!
    jai hanuman gyan gun sagar jai kapis tihu lok ujagar

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