The Doer

[Amrut]

My apologies. I shall make sure to quote the Bhagavad Gita next time or refrain from posting here.

Nothing to apologize. I told you from my experience. I derailed from the track too unless smaranam ji pointed out.

It's not that you are posting anything wrong info, but to just be on track in accordance to VA and Advaita, as OP is reading BG from VA POV.

Even I would have contradicted many statements, but that will not solve the purpose and may hurt the sentiment of VA devotees, which I do not want.

I practice Advaita Vedanta .

If you find any of my posts that are getting off-track, please do let me know

Aum

[satay]

Dr. S. M. Chari in 'The Philosophy of the Bhagavadgita', on page 179 clarifies Sri Ramanuja position on this.

In explanation of 18.4, he says,

Adhisthana or the seat refers to the physical body. Karta or the agent acc. to S [sankara], the empirical ego, the Self conditioned by the atahkarana, the limiting adjunct which is caused by avidya. For Ramanuja, karta is the jivatman. For Madhva karta is God...

Further he says, that there are several factors responsible for the accomplishment of an action, the Supreme being is the main cause of action. The individual self functions with the capacity endowed by Paramatman, out of its free will. The jiva is karta but its kartrtva is endowed by Isvara, as it is stated in the Vedantasutra (parattu tat 'sruteh).

Then he says, "if an individual thinks he is the doer it is due to his ignorance."

Again, I think here like Philosoraptor said earlier, it should be 'If an individual thinks he is the only doer it is due to his ignorance.

This answers the question for me. Thank you everyone for your explanations.

(emphasis in his quote above is mine)

[Amrut]

Dr. S. M. Chari in 'The Philosophy of the Bhagavadgita', on page 179 clarifies Sri Ramanuja position on this.

In explanation of 18.4, he says,



Further he says, that there are several factors responsible for the accomplishment of an action, the Supreme being is the main cause of action. The individual self functions with the capacity endowed by Paramatman, out of its free will. The jiva is karta but its kartrtva is endowed by Isvara, as it is stated in the Vedantasutra (parattu tat 'sruteh).

Then he says, "if an individual thinks he is the doer it is due to his ignorance."

Again, I think here like Philosoraptor said earlier, it should be 'If an individual thinks he is the only doer it is due to his ignorance.

This answers the question for me. Thank you everyone for your explanations.

(emphasis in his quote above is mine)

Nice to know that you have found the solution

Spirituality is one path in which we get happy when others get clarity and progress towards his/her goal.

Aum
IS

[smaranam]

Who is the doer ? The answer is Prakriti. The Purusha or Atman is not the doer. However, Prakriti cannot act on its own. "Desire" (one of vikaars) arising in Purusha brings Purusha to Prakriti and it makes Prakriti to act in such a way so as to fulfill the desire of Purusha.

Purusha being tinged with 'desire' forgets its True Nature and identifies itself with the Prakriti and gives rise to Jeeva and owns the doership wrongly. This wrong identification causes Jeeva being bound to the fruits of Karma and keeps him bound to the Prakriti.

Namaste

NOTE: The above quote is not in line with VishishThAdvaita of Ramanuja being discussed on this thread, and neither is what follows in this post. The premise is that of ONE AtmA pervading the entire existence and beyond.

Given the words in red, is the purusha supposed to cross His fingers and pray that a vikAr (blemish) does not arise in Him? Pray to whom?
Is the ONE and ONLY Purusha/AtmA not the Self-same before and after jnAna? Then what is the guarantee that these vikAr will not arise again?

Is the implication that this Purusha "turns into" Uttam Purusha? But that cannot be, since this Uttam Purusha, or Purushottam NEVER EVER gets deluded, NEVER throttles Himself, NEVER gets 'tinged' with vAsanA (desire).

"VikAr arises in Purusha/AtmA"
"Purusha/AtmA gets tinged with vAsanA"
"Shiva throttles Himself to become the Universe and living beings"

So much for "JnAna is permanent" I would say.
It is crystal clear from the above that jnAna alone cannot be permanent.
Without Ishwar/Bhagvan's help anyway. But Bhagvan is diliberately unseen and unacknowledged in this case.

One possibility is, these statements are too casually carelessly made and inaccurate.
What I mean is, who owns those sanchit karma?
VikAr and vAsanA arising in Purusha show that NEW karma is manufactured before sRshTi. Because the repository of sanchit karma that BramhA utilizes for sRshTi (manifesting of material world), already has a candidate chosen to be dispatched - A broken piece of Purusha known as the transmigrating jiva. So sanchit karma are mapped one-on-one to transmigrating jivas each.

Then what are these NEW stand-alone vAsanAs? Dangerous. Very dangerous.

IF that is the case, would it not be better to let the Uttam Purusha be, untouched, untainted like the kamala patra (Lotus Leaf) and let jiva continue its role of pure devotion?

sigh

He KRshNA karuNAsindho dIna-bandho jagatpate
gopesha gopikA-kAnta rAdhA-kAnta namostute _/\_ _/\_ _/\_