Situations Regarding Negative Karma

[Equinox]

Vannakkam,


Karma affects each and every one of us in many ways. Nobody would want to accumulate 'bad karma'. So, honestly, how do you perceive these two situations and in what ways do you think they would affect one's karma?


1.) Shunning unwanted people.
- The type who emit bad auras and give you negative thoughts. They are loud mouths, show-offs, love competing with you and are just super annoying. You would never want to be around this type, especially if you're the opposite: peace-loving, simple, quiet type. They might even be talking about you behind your back, but put on a good act in front of you. So you limit interaction with them and mostly keep away. After realising this, they insist on coming forward and being nice to you, but this prompts you to ignore them completely in front of their face instead, and in front of everybody else present. You've been super tolerant and patient all this while and about to explode, but instead of saying or doing anything(which would definitely create more bad karma), you just stop talking to them completely and behave like they don't exist. And you do that forever and then feel the negative auras being projected directly onto you by these people because you shun them without giving them a reason. Although they've tried talking to you again, you just ignore them completely. Will this affect your own karma negatively instead? Because you rejected their 'nice' advances? But weren't you avoiding situations that could have been much worse in the first place which would have created more bad karma?


2.) Having negative thoughts in mind.
- Could be revenge, anger, ego, lust, etc. You just think of it but don't react to it in any way. Does this add to our bad karma too? I know we are told to reduce such thoughts. But what if they appear suddenly?


PS: These situations might be trivial, but I'm having a hard time reasoning to myself about where I stand (from the perspective of karma) in the aforementioned situations.


Aum Namah Shivaya

[Eastern Mind]

Vannakkam: #1 sounds pretty extreme, so I'm not sure if I've ever experienced it, but for me when similar happens, I'm cordial in public, but shun privately by being 'too busy' etc.

For #2, yes it happens, but I think the way to control it is seeing Siva in all. View them like babies. You wouldn't hit a baby, would you?
Probably no help, but what the heck.

Aum Namasivaya

[Jodhaa]

Namaste,

I think the determining factor in the first situation is whether or not you communicate your unhappiness with this person before cutting them off. I think everyone should do what they can to reduce the negative or toxic people in their lives. It doesn't help you, and you certainly can't save them.

The problem I see is that a lot of people in situations like this will just stop talking to these toxic individuals rather then tell them why before cutting off contact. I think whether or not you think they deserve an explanation isn't the point. They perceive your relationship as functional and in good stranding, and if suddenly this person who welcomed them or tolerated them suddenly cuts off contact, they are left wondering why. Hence the source of their negative energy directed towards you. They are angry because they are confused.

I have seen the struggle of many friends who have cut each other out due to some irreconcilable difference, without talking to each other. I don't mean trying to fix it. I mean just saying, "Hey, I know up until now I've put up with it, but I can't cope with your personality and it's effecting my well being and I think we need to part ways.". You don't have to do it in person either. Email, phone call etc works to get the point across. They may still be hurt, but you have been honest and as kind as one can be in this scenario and they aren't left wondering.

The alternative is that you either feel guilty for just "dumping" someone, or you are constantly dogged by their negative energy anyway because they don't understand enough of why you did what you did to offer forgiveness.

Now if they come to you with "I've changed." or "I want to make things right." It's up to you how many chances you give them. I say, if people seem genuinely interested in doing better, it's good to give them a second chance. After that? You being the brunt of their negativity doesn't help them change so it's best for all parties involved to seek friendships elsewhere.


As for #2 - I suppose it depends on how the thoughts are handled once they appear in the mind. Do you recognize them and try to immediately shift focus to something more positive, or do you allow yourself to dwell on them and give them more power? If you don't act on them, great - but they will still effect your well being. I don't know about karma - someone with more understanding would have to address that.


Shanti.

[yajvan]

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namast�

PS:[/b] These situations might be trivial, but I'm having a hard time reasoning to myself about where I stand (from the perspective of karma) in the aforementioned situations.

unfathomable is the course of action, says kṛṣṇa-jī ( bhāgavad gītā 4.17). There are so many moving parts. We are told ( in general ) there are 4 kinds�:

• nirvartya - when anything new is produced
• vikārya - when change is implied either of the substance and form
• prāpya - when any desired object is attained
• anīpsita - when an undesired object is abandoned

To get a firm grip on all this is a project indeed.

Shunning people
Svāmī Brahmānanda Sarasvatī was Śaṅkarācārya of Jyotirmath (from 1941-1953) . He informs us of the following:

Indifference is a very big astra (weapon). Anybody uttering unpleasantness or being disrespectful in any way then be indifferent to him, that is to say; withdraw one's own thought from his direction.

Negitive thoughts
They come and go... just pay them no attention. No need to act on them.

śivāya gamyatām (a prosperous journey to you)

words
4 kinds - yet there are other ways of looking at this also. Actions done in the past, the present , and those yet to come i.e. karma-pāka those actions that are ripening & growing.

[Equinox]

Vannakkam Eastern Mind,

For #2, yes it happens, but I think the way to control it is seeing Siva in all. View them like babies. You wouldn't hit a baby, would you?

Aum Namasivaya

Sounds great!


Aum Namah Shivaya

[Equinox]

Vannakkam Jodhaa,

Namaste,

I think the determining factor in the first situation is whether or not you communicate your unhappiness with this person before cutting them off. I think everyone should do what they can to reduce the negative or toxic people in their lives. It doesn't help you, and you certainly can't save them.

The problem I see is that a lot of people in situations like this will just stop talking to these toxic individuals rather then tell them why before cutting off contact. I think whether or not you think they deserve an explanation isn't the point. They perceive your relationship as functional and in good stranding, and if suddenly this person who welcomed them or tolerated them suddenly cuts off contact, they are left wondering why. Hence the source of their negative energy directed towards you. They are angry because they are confused.

I have seen the struggle of many friends who have cut each other out due to some irreconcilable difference, without talking to each other. I don't mean trying to fix it. I mean just saying, "Hey, I know up until now I've put up with it, but I can't cope with your personality and it's effecting my well being and I think we need to part ways.". You don't have to do it in person either. Email, phone call etc works to get the point across. They may still be hurt, but you have been honest and as kind as one can be in this scenario and they aren't left wondering.

The alternative is that you either feel guilty for just "dumping" someone, or you are constantly dogged by their negative energy anyway because they don't understand enough of why you did what you did to offer forgiveness.

Now if they come to you with "I've changed." or "I want to make things right." It's up to you how many chances you give them. I say, if people seem genuinely interested in doing better, it's good to give them a second chance. After that? You being the brunt of their negativity doesn't help them change so it's best for all parties involved to seek friendships elsewhere.


As for #2 - I suppose it depends on how the thoughts are handled once they appear in the mind. Do you recognize them and try to immediately shift focus to something more positive, or do you allow yourself to dwell on them and give them more power? If you don't act on them, great - but they will still effect your well being. I don't know about karma - someone with more understanding would have to address that.


Shanti.

Great advice. Thank you!



Aum Namah Shivaya

[Equinox]

Vannakkam Yajvan,

Shunning people
Svāmī Brahmānanda Sarasvatī was Śaṅkarācārya of Jyotirmath (from 1941-1953) . He informs us of the following:

Indifference is a very big astra (weapon). Anybody uttering unpleasantness or being disrespectful in any way then be indifferent to him, that is to say; withdraw one's own thought from his direction.

Negitive thoughts
They come and go... just pay them no attention. No need to act on them.

About shunning people, yes, I do see it as a great weapon indeed. It gets the other person to know that what they are doing is wrong without us even mentioning anything. It magically communicates without the need to talk. Thank you!


Aum Namah Shivaya

[yajvan]

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namast�

About shunning people, yes, I do see it as a great weapon indeed. It gets the other person to know that what they are doing is wrong without us even mentioning anything. It magically communicates without the need to talk. Thank you!

Note that there is a difference between shunning (mental rejection) and indifference. With indifference one is just paying no mind, no interest; there is no active mind involved.
Let me offer this by example. Say you are walking down the street and some one then just happens to walk at the same pace you walk. For a few steps you are walking in concert with this person; then a few minutes later the person is gone, perhaps turning into the bakery. You paid that person ~ no mind ~.
No mental activity was given to the person. If you shunned him then there would be mental engagement and some type of internal dialog would occur.

See the difference ?

śivāya gamyatām

[Equinox]

Vannakkam,

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namast�




Note that there is a difference between shunning (mental rejection) and indifference. With indifference one is just paying no mind, no interest; there is no active mind involved.
Let me offer this by example. Say you are walking down the street and some one then just happens to walk at the same pace you walk. For a few steps you are walking in concert with this person; then a few minutes later the person is gone, perhaps turning into the bakery. You paid that person ~ no mind ~.
No mental activity was given to the person. If you shunned him then there would be mental engagement and some type of internal dialog would occur.

See the difference ?

śivāya gamyatām

Well, yes, I understand. I prefer the indifference method, although shunning has to happen too. But would it affect our karma in any way, be it shunning or indifference? Say, the person we choose to ignore attempts to speak to us, but we remain indifferent like they don't exist. Our bad karma has to increase because we didn't entertain them right?



Aum Namah Shivaya

[yajvan]

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namast�

. Our bad karma has to increase because we didn't entertain them right?

A more in depth conversation is needed... this notion of good and bad gets one in a pickle. ~Good~ action is still action , ~bad~ action is still action. Both are binding. So , if you are smiling and say ' oh, my good karma increased ( which I have no idea where that is stored)' it is still binding. It still keeps one within the wheel of birth and re-birth.

Actions bring impressions , these impressions manifest again to bring more actions. If they are good or bad (again I am not comfortable with this nomenclature) they are seeds for future actions. The wheel continues. We wish to be rid of this wheel, and it does not come by the absence of doing, but by knowledge of how things work. It comes by being established in the SELF, which is outside the field of action. This is the final answer that resolves the issue.

But that said, what do you do when the person comes to you ? The one that you wish to be indifferent to ? You harbor no ill feelings. You are of a balanced mind, of even-ness. If you engage in talk , it is not antagonizing.
Another example: The person that you wish to ignore comes to you and you are just simple. It is like drawing a line in a pond. The line is there for an instant , then it is gone. The person comes to you , makes this impression, yet you are the pond. It is there for a moment, then it is gone. This is the mind set of indifference. It is not being negative. If you engage with the person it is not antagonistic , it is without praise, it is just simple communication ( if needed) ; a business transaction at best.

iti śivaṁ