Lets Meditate The Right Way

[silence_speaks]

Dear Necromancer,


Ill summarize ... [and i guess all such posts as this will be counted too ]

" Self Knowledge leads to living in meditation 24 7 and Self Knowledge can be conveyed through words ... tangibly ... provided student has a beginners mind. The proof of the pudding is in eating, tangibly, its possible to use shabda pramana [scriptural teachings as pramana] to lead one to see oneself."

Love!
Silence

[Necromancer]

Dear Necromancer,


Ill summarize ... [and i guess all such posts as this will be counted too ]

" Self Knowledge leads to living in meditation 24 7 and Self Knowledge can be conveyed through words ... tangibly ... provided student has a beginners mind. The proof of the pudding is in eating, tangibly, its possible to use shabda pramana [scriptural teachings as pramana] to lead one to see oneself."

Love!
Silence

Namaste.

Thank you!

I guess this will also serve to placate Yajvan (maybe). LOL

So, what you are talking about is awareness, no?

Like Shamatha...mindfulness?

About bringing that meditative awareness into everyday life?

Aum Namah Shivaya

[silence_speaks]

Dear Necromancer,

About bringing that meditative awareness into everyday life?

Yes and No.
One has to remain in "meditative awareness"... but not as a practice.
I am talking about a cognitive change which would leave you in meditation 24 7 ... irrespective of what you are doing.

A Cognitive Change.

Love!
Silence

[Necromancer]

Dear Necromancer,




Yes and No.
One has to remain in "meditative awareness"... but not as a practice.
I am talking about a cognitive change which would leave you in meditation 24 7 ... irrespective of what you are doing.

A Cognitive Change.

Love!
Silence

Namaste.

...and what is the exact nature of this 'cognitive change'?

I mean, sure...I could say that I have 'realised Brahman' but that is only paying lip service. It is all experiential - like Yajvan has said.

There's also a difference between being mentally aware through cognitive process and being spiritually aware through meditative process.

My mind and heart knows "I am Siva"...but as for realising/experiencing it, that's a different kettle of fish entirely.

...and if my 'past experience' is anything to go by, it's not all sunshine and rainbows as everybody makes it out to be.

It is painful and it hurts...maybe that's just me.

Aum Namah Shivaya

[silence_speaks]

Dear Necromancer,


1. Any Experience is as good as your interpretation of it. You may be seeing Siva himself, but interpret him as only ordinary person.

2. Given that God is omnipresent, it would mean that it cannot happen that you have never met God !

3. Given 1 and 2, whats missing ? Your interpretation , its your interpretation ... your conclusions that are blocking you to "Recognize" the Presence of God ... though you are experiencing him every moment !

So what do you need ? A proper Recognition or an Experience?
You are Experiencing God 24 7!
Recognition is what is missing.

This is the Cognitive change I am speaking about !

Love!
Silence

[Necromancer]

Dear Necromancer,


1. Any Experience is as good as your interpretation of it. You may be seeing Siva himself, but interpret him as only ordinary person.

2. Given that God is omnipresent, it would mean that it cannot happen that you have never met God !

3. Given 1 and 2, whats missing ? Your interpretation , its your interpretation ... your conclusions that are blocking you to "Recognize" the Presence of God ... though you are experiencing him every moment !

So what do you need ? A proper Recognition or an Experience?
You are Experiencing God 24 7!
Recognition is what is missing.

This is the Cognitive change I am speaking about !

Love!
Silence

Namaste.

I am going to fall back on 'Neti Neti' here.

If the ultimate experience...the peak experience can in any way be 'interpreted' then it is not the ultimate experience.

"Are you quite done yet? Let's move on, shall we?"

I don't think about Siva as a person...well, if you discount my belief that Brahman is totally impersonal, then I do.

I have come 'unstuck' about this many times on here and despite being involved in infy conversations about it, I still cannot understand how Brahman can be 'personal'...I mean, for all the time I have spent as a Vedantist at ISKCON...I was forever asked: "How can you worship something as impersonal as Brahman?"...yeah, so go figure. lol

I really don't know how I 'interpret' Lord Siva. He is who He is and I just accept it...I do think of Him as a 'friend' though, but not in any way that 'friend' relates to a human 'friend'.

About this 'recognition' thing...

What 'recognises' it?

Aum Namah Shivaya

[silence_speaks]

Dear Necromancer,

You do not "interpret Lord Siva"
you interpret "YOUR SELF"
and that interpretation is wrong.
wrong conclusions ... leading to wrong "Seeking"
and that interpretation is "negated".

As you speak of Neti , Neti ... the question is ... can you negate your "Experience" . What is Neti , Neti needs a lot more understanding than most people think ... Neti , Neti is equivalent to Sravana, Manana,Nidhidhyasana. Do you see this ?

Love!
Silence

[Necromancer]

Dear Necromancer,

You do not "interpret Lord Siva"
you interpret "YOUR SELF"
and that interpretation is wrong.
wrong conclusions ... leading to wrong "Seeking"
and that interpretation is "negated".

As you speak of Neti , Neti ... the question is ... can you negate your "Experience" . What is Neti , Neti needs a lot more understanding than most people think ... Neti , Neti is equivalent to Sravana, Manana,Nidhidhyasana. Do you see this ?

Love!
Silence

Namaste.

Please forgive me if I misunderstand you at this point.

Of course you can negate your experience!

My favourite line from Atmashtakam by Adi Shankaracharya goes thus:

न मे द्वेषरागौ न मे लोभमोहौ, मदो नैव मे नैव मात्सर्यभावः ।
न धर्मो न चार्थो न कामो न मोक्षः, चिदानन्दरूपः शिवोऽहम् शिवोऽहम् ।। 3 ।। )

na me dveşarāgau na me lobhamohau
mado naiva me naiva mātsaryabhāvaḥ
na dharmo na cārtho na kāmo na mokşaḥ
cidānandarūpaḥ śivo'ham śivo'ham

Now, how can I reconcile Bhakti with Advaita?

You tell me and we'll both know it. lol

Aum Namah Shivaya

[silence_speaks]

Dear Necromancer,


Please take the wonderful verse you just pointed to.

न मे द्वेषरागौ न मे लोभमोहौ, मदो नैव मे नैव मात्सर्यभावः ।
न धर्मो न चार्थो न कामो न मोक्षः, चिदानन्दरूपः शिवोऽहम् शिवोऽहम् ।। 3 ।।
Exceptional isn't it ?

... How do you see yourself as this ?
Not ... whether its true or not.
I should be able to see myself as this !

Love!
Silence

[Necromancer]

Dear Necromancer,


Please take the wonderful verse you just pointed to.

न मे द्वेषरागौ न मे लोभमोहौ, मदो नैव मे नैव मात्सर्यभावः ।
न धर्मो न चार्थो न कामो न मोक्षः, चिदानन्दरूपः शिवोऽहम् शिवोऽहम् ।। 3 ।।
Exceptional isn't it ?

... How do you see yourself as this ?
Not ... whether its true or not.
I should be able to see myself as this !

Love!
Silence

Namaste.

Yes, I see myself as this.

I can say "I am Shiva" until the proverbial Mother Cows come home.

So, now I know it, what's next?

Aum Namah Shivaya