Is the cow more valuable than some people?

[Little-Bear]

I seem to have a thing for stirring up a hornet's nest on here, so here goes. I know that Hindus revere the cow and see it as sacred. I am also aware of how some Hindus see untouchables. If you look at how some people are treated in India and how cows are treated, it's not unreasonable for one to think that Hindus believe that cows are in fact more valuable than some people. What are your thoughts on this?

Note: I put some. This is what happens when I go on forums late at night.

[Jaskaran Singh]

Praṇām,

I seem to have a thing for stirring up a hornet's nest on here, so here goes.

'Tis ok...

I know that Hindus revere the cow and see it as sacred.

Yes indeed, Gomātā is aghnyā "not to be hurt" and appears throughout the śāstra-s as a goddess (such as in the case of the birth of Kāmadhenu during the Samudra-manthanam or when Pṛthu Mahārāja chased Pṛthvī to no avail, and then promising to be her guardian). Since one drinks the milk from a female cow, she effectively serves a similar function to a mother, and a mother is like a god (मातृदेवो भव).

I am also aware of how Hindus see untouchables.

Using the term "Hindus" generally like that makes it seem like a broad statement. I'm sure there are many that who do have a negative view of dalit-s (even some "Hindu" texts [such as the Manu-smṛti] are quite casteist and apply a totally different standard for the antyajāḥ). However, true devotees transcendent to the traiguṇyaḥ should not discriminate based on caste:

विद्याविनयसम्पन्ने ब्राह्मणे गवि हस्तिनि।
शुनि चैव श्वपाके चपण्डिताः समदर्शिनः॥५.१८॥

vidyāvinayasampanne brāhmaṇe gavi hastini।
śuni caiva śvapāke capaṇḍitāḥ samadarśinaḥ॥5.18॥

"And (ca) learned paṇḍit-s (paṇḍitāḥ) [should] see (darśinaḥ) equally (sama) a brāhmaṇa (brāhmaṇe) endowed with (sampanne) humility (vinaya) and knowledge (vidyā), a cow (gavi), an elephant (hastini), a dog (śuni) and (ca) similarly (iva), a dog-eater (śvapāke)" [Bhagavad Gītā 5:18]

If you look at how some people are treated in India and how cows are treated, it's not unreasonable for one to think that Hindus believe that cows are in fact more valuable than some people. What are your thoughts on this?

Again with with generalization of "Hindus believe such and such..." A bunch of adhārmika stuff goes on in Bhārat, such as the 700,000 girls who are murdered each year due to either sex-selective abortion, female foeticide, etc. (the only country which has a higher female death rate in China, with approximately 1.2 million girls being reported missing each year). Does this have anything to do with Hinduism though? No. While untouchability has historically been connected with Varṇāśrama-dharma, it [untouchability] is not sanctioned in the śāstra-s, so untouchability is a cultural [not a religious] topic. Also, considering how many posts here on HDF have already been focused on varṇa, I really don't see the purpose of your post (well, unless your intention is to troll).

Jaya Śrī Kṛṣṇā!

[Anirudh]

Does this have anything to do with Hinduism though? No. While untouchability has historically been connected with Varṇāśrama-dharma, it [untouchability] is not sanctioned in the śāstra-s, so untouchability is a cultural [not a religious] topic.

Namaste Jaskaran Singh,

Thank you very much for the information shared.

Hopefully I am not dragging this thread to a different tangent.

Most of the Indian Hindus (those who don't have clear knowledge of the Vedic scriptures) often bullied by similar questions raised here. In such cases they either give into the onslaught of brain washing or continue to carry a very weak distorted opinion about Hinduism.

You insight on dealing this menace will be greatly appreciated.

[jignyAsu]

Namaste,

shAstrAs uphold both compassion to fellow humans and also special reverence to cows.Given that we have had revered saints from all the varnas and untouchability as we see today is alien to sanathana dharma, why not work towards the betterment of both cows and untouchables?

I have heard this question from even some notable Hindu gurus but fail to undertand the need of dragging these poor creatures into this issue. Unlike men whose appetite for enjoyment never ceases, all that the cows do is to feed on God given grass, give milk and be a part of our cultural festivals. The plight of cows is getting only worse in India. Mentioning "all hindus" here is blowing things out of propotion but if certain uncompassionate Hindus had retained special compassion only to cows, I only see it as a positive because it is better than being uncompassionate to every living creature.

[Sudas Paijavana]

Namaste,

I seem to have a thing for stirring up a hornet's nest on here, so here goes.

An honorable member once advised me that before posting on HDF, one should refine one's post either on Office:Word or any other word processing software. This hinders any prospects of making a post either in quick haste which would entail a controversial tone or approach. This would also hinder making a post that may express an indirect agenda to not propose a well-rounded discussion, but spur Jalpa-like (pointlessly argumentative) debating that will futilely eradicate any prospects of having an honorable thread-discussion.

I know that Hindus revere the cow and see it as sacred.

The cow is dawn. The cow is the morning. The cow is the fire. The cow is the river. The cow is the ocean. As per the most high and most noble Rig Veda, the cow is symbolic for light. The cow gives us the elixir known as milk; the cow is wealth to the poor cow-herder in remote villages. The cow is not only a mother, but a father. The cow is also a river, because the cow curries us with the elixir of milk just as how the river houses the fish. The cow is also a river, because She cuts into our lives like how the river cuts through stone to make its path, flowing in its own hearted journey. The cow is like dawn since dawn signifies a rebirth of the incoming Sun - the all shining light. The cow symbolizes this birth of light. And, thus: the cow giving us poor farmers the elixir of milk is able to keep us alive and staying alive is rebirth in and of itself - a rebirth of spiritual refining, a rebirth of continuous survival throughout the generations.

If you look at how some people are treated in India and how cows are treated, it's not unreasonable for one to think that Hindus believe that cows are in fact more valuable than some people. What are your thoughts on this?

Please understand that "untouchability" encompasses non-Hindu religious groups as well:

"The Sachar Committee report of 2006 revealed that scheduled castes and tribes of India are not limited to the religion of Hinduism." -retrieved from: Sachar, Rajindar (2006). "Minority Report" (PDF). Government of India.

And, the cow is "aghnya", She Who Is Not to Be Harmed. Out of all the animals, humans included, mentioned in the most high and most noble Rig Veda, She along with the Horse are They Who Are Not to Be Harmed.

[hinduism♥krishna]

I am also aware of how Hindus see untouchables.

Namaste , As i see your name little-bear, your name is jasbeer. Am i right? Yes, i know it's very difficult for non-hindu to know what is our sanatana Hindu dharma. So it's better not to conclude anything without knowing it fully.

As far as untouchability is considered, it's a vedic rule for bramhana. According to varna principles, bramhan shouldn't touch a Shudra. Bramhan should live his life very purely and should follow all vedic principles strictly without excuse.

In sanatana dharma, cows and bramhans are worshipped, BECAUSE they are representatives of God ( bhagavan). This is the understanding. This doesn't mean 'cow is higher than man so we should worship cow only'.

The best example is of bhagavan shri Krishna ! Krishna was a hindu and i think you know how much he loves cows and bramhans ! Bhagavan krishna himself says that one should worship cows and bramhans before worshipping me.

Dhanyavad ! Jai shri hari govinda narayana !

―�―�―�―�―�
hinduism♥krishna™

[Omkara]

As far as untouchability is considered, it's a vedic rule for bramhana. According to varna principles, bramhan shouldn't touch a Shudra.

Nonsense. Untouchabilty has always been practiced against people outside the varna system, not Shudras.

The best example is of bhagavan shri Krishna !

Sri Krishna rewards Rantudeva for sharing his food with a chandala. A rishi was denied moksha by Sri Krishna for refusing to take water from a chandala.

[Eastern Mind]

I seem to have a thing for stirring up a hornet's nest on here, so here goes. I know that Hindus revere the cow and see it as sacred. I am also aware of how Hindus see untouchables. If you look at how some people are treated in India and how cows are treated, it's not unreasonable for one to think that Hindus believe that cows are in fact more valuable than some people. What are your thoughts on this?

Vannakkam: If you've ever stirred up a real hornet's nest (and I suspect you have, at least a yellowjacket wasp nest), a metaphorical one is less by a lot in terms of action.

Hindus are a varied lot, some might think as you suggest, whilst others definitely don't. No doubt it is a social problem in India and elsewhere.

But even here in Canada the equivalent of the untouchable could be seen as native peoples. There are some Canadians I know who continue to speak very poorly of indigenous or first nations peoples, as you no doubt already know. So I'm really not sure if the religion is to blame in any sense at all.

Aum Namasivaya

[Little-Bear]

In hindsight, I should have not used such broad terms. I apologize for offending anyone. In my defence, one thing that can be problematic with ethnic religions is where the religious values and the cultural values part. Obviously, I was shown that in the case of Hinduism, it parts at the caste system. Also, cow reverence seems to have been part of many Indo-European cultural groups.

The reason I made this thread was to see where current members stand on this issue. It seems most people here are quite liberal when it comes to certain subjects, but I am curious if there is someone who thinks in more conservative terms. I also find discussions more engaging.

[ShivaFan]

Namaste

When I was a teenager, a paradigm shift began in society, a shift away from smoking tobacco. I do not blame any group for this habit, I do not blame the American Indian who introduced the habit to some Europeans who brought it back to Europe in the 1500s and 1600s, nor the Dutch who took up the habit like girls to ponies and spread their white clay tobocco pipes across the world. Tobacco leaves smell nice, but hold many poisons.

Why do I mention tobacco, and more specifically the demon called cigarettes (tobacco rolled in thin paper, removing even the need for a pipe)?

It is in relation to Cow killing. In the 1960s, literally crates and crates of Marlboro cigarettes were made available to the American soldiers in Vietnam. The "Marlboro Man" (who I believe later died of lung cancer) was an iconic cowboy figure appearing on commercials and collectible items and cigarette lighters.

If anyone were to say in 1967 that by the 1980s the large majority of Americans would be non-smokers, that Marlboro Man TV commercials would be outlawed, and that cigarettes would cost $4 a pack instead of 25 cents, you would have been called crazy.

Today Americans are non-smokers in large majority, a paradigm shift happened.

I have huge respect for American Indian and First Nations people. In my area of the world, they hunted for example Elk for meat, and up North it was caribou. This was not mass produced meat, processed food, that came from death factories which torture animals and cows, full of poisons like mass produced cigarettes full of chemicals to make the tobacco burn better in a rolled paper. Such "factory meat" was pushed on Americans as food by big industry, just as cigarettes.

In fact, prior to this, the common staple of food was not hamburger, it was potatoe. When the potatoe harvest failed in Ireland, you had the potatoe famine in Ireland. Corn and rice, barley and grain, nuts and fruits, this was the common staple of Euros and Americans, not prucessed beef.

I blame the big meat industry for poisoning America. But slowly, this will change in America, also thanks to Hinduism as well, just as we saw tobacco habits change. The meat industry is pushing a dangerous, unnatural drug on Americans for money. THIS WAS NOT THE CULTURE OF THE AVERAGE MAN IN EUROPE OR AMERICA, it was pushed as part of an addiction in modern times. This will take longer to withdrawl from than tobacco, but in will happen over the next 100 years.

The Cow is a animal pf renown and a mother to humans. The industry that kills Her literally is taking food out of the mouths of Americans, it is estimated the meat of one cow takes 10 times the amount of food away from America in terms of loss in milk and love of the Cow. They are feed corn and other items, stuffing them to get fat and then killed. The waste is enourmous, all part of an unhealthy, impure and irreligious drug pushing that is destroying children and families for the profit of a few.

The Cow is sacred, She is part of our Human Family, just as children are sacred.

If I had my way, cow butchers would go to prison. See this link on the Woodstock Farm and Sanctuary, they to good work:

http://www.woodstocksanctuary.org/20...-lucky-ones-2/

Om Namah Sivaya