Hare Krsna!

[hinduism♥krishna]

Namaste ,everyone.

I am extremely sorry ! But you can not disprove what I said about varna and worship.

Please take a look on Bhagavat purana verses in #18 post.

Thank you. Shri Hari ♥

[Jaskaran Singh]

Namaste ,everyone.

I am extremely sorry ! But you can not disprove what I said about varna and worship.

Please take a look on Bhagavat purana verses in #18 post.

Thank you. Shri Hari ♥

Namaste,
Yeah, and I proved that your AcArya was extremely casteist and quoted from the gautamadharmasUtra in regards to comparing shUdra-s to a shmashAna/cremation ground and supported pouring tin and lac down the ears of shUdra-s who listen to the vedAH. It makes sense that his "shiShya" would be similarly casteist...
oM namo nArAyaNAya

[Devi Dasi]

Namaste,

On the other hand, it actually may be a good way for the new member to adapt and become comfortable with the rigorous critical thinking type of discourse that occurs on HDF.

Introductions forum. Prabhuji, your words mask a contempt pretending to be rigorous critical thinking and discourse. Apart from challenging and invalidating everything I share, it would have been nice to have a simple introduction.

It is sad that in this world, despite all the wonderful, powerful and ecstatic spiritual teachings of the greatest Masters, people still find a way, in religion, to exclude, ostracize, humiliate, and unwelcome other human beings, who are in essence, a part of their very selves. Prabhuji, there is something greater than being "right" or "winning a debate" or even being exalted as a "scholar" by others...something far greater. If one day you are able to perceive who I really am, I will be enfolding you with arms of love.

You are my brother. You are my essence. You are my very self. In the interior of your being, though you don't know it yet, you are my friend.

[Devi Dasi]

Namaste , grames and devidasi
So please don’t put your personal claims about varna.This is our hindu-vedic tradtion .We hindus are protectors of veda and vedic traditions .It’s our first duty . So we know what we are and what is veda and its ancient tradions.

We don’t wana sacrifice our sacred varnashrama dharma and other vedic tradions just because of westerner’s and pseudo hindu’s mindsets...

Don’t alter our vedic tradictions which are being followed from ancient time. There was a prediction that mlechhas will try to destroy and alter hindu dharma according to their thinking and they will be the cause of end of hindu vedic dharma in kaliyuga . and it is happening now...

...Vishnu is hindu only .Though he is all pervading bramhan...

Hare Krsna prabhuji,

There is nothing I can say or do or believe which can hurt you in any way or damage the eternal truth.

Even if all you say were true, is this the right way of talking to people? On an introduction thread and go on about how they are invalid, unwelcome, unqualified, mlecchan, unfit for worship, ignorant of scriptures, etc. Even if all this were true, you would attempt to publicly humiliate people in order to elevate your own social standing?

Isn't this the reason we have had the appearance of so many saints and social reformers? People are divided into jati's, with the weakest and poorest literally spit upon, raped and abused, neglected, plundered in most adharmic ways? Isn't it true this section of Indian society now comprises many tens of millions who are aligning with anti-national movements in retaliation and for basic survival? Are you are oblivious to the catastrophe in this world extreme rejection is creating worldwide, not just in India?

Isn't the cause of such created sufferings our inability to love who we call God, our failure to simply love a human being and thereby create a proper, just, and enlightened Vedic society? Varna is not jati. Jati cannot give spiritual qualification nor can it be a bar. Your varna is not a mirror of your soul.

God is not Hindu. God cannot be for Hindu's alone. What ludicrous thought that God could be material or worried about contamination of the material or that anything in the material nature would be a qualification.

When I was a child, my mother made me learn a poem. It was one of her favorites.

"Shunned at the temple gates by the pious,
the outcastes and uninitiates
seek their God beyond the artificial,
inwardly, in midnight skies, in forest flowers,
in love, and in separation.

Their image of God is not manhandled,
or imprisoned by Temple walls.
Along the edge of the Padma,
whose waves sweep away old temples,
I have seen one of them,
alone with his Ektara
seeking his soul's companion
through songs.

"I am an outcast
whose offerings cannot reach
the imprisoned god."
I am the outcaste, the uninitiate.
Born in the household of exile,
I was rejected by the respectable.

I pursued my fancies
at the crossing of the roads.
For their worship they plucked flowers
prescribed by scripture
And left for me and my God,
the garden of blossoms blessed by the sun.

By the contempt of the pious
I was thrust into the arms of man.
And I found solitary friends
whose light and voice
made history."

-Rabindranath Tagore

Sri Guru Vandana ~ Svarupa Damodara Das
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JAEDDy_DTlQ

Caste System Cast Out HD
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oxCRgG0eAYM

Forum sanga, please forgive my mistakes.

[Believer]

Namaste,

Everything, good or bad, comes through our posts - our humility, our arrogance, our thoughts about caste supremacy, our knowledge of the scriptures or lack there of, our justification of our thoughts with gross misinterpretations of the scriptures - it's all there for others to take a peek at our soul.

Pranam.

PS, If winning debates is all one cares about, here are some pointers to that game.
http://hindudharmaforums.com/showpos...84&postcount=1

[Jaskaran Singh]

Namaste,

Everything, good or bad, comes through our posts - our humility, our arrogance, our thoughts about caste supremacy, our knowledge of the scriptures or lack there of, our justification of our thoughts with gross misinterpretations of the scriptures - it's all there for others to take a peek at our soul.

Pranam.

Hey, I was just trying to troll hinduism♥krishna just to see his response. I don't literally believe that Adi sha~Nkara was casteist (although he [sha~Nkara] did use the trapu-jatubhyAM verse in his bhAShyam). Nonetheless, judging by hinduism<luv>krishna's inability to respond, I don't think he finds it morally reprehensible to pour molten tin down a person's ear as a punishment as if both Adi sha~Nkara and the dharmasUtra he quoted from agree on that and if he thinks it serves as pramANa, then it probably doesn't matter to him, even if it's inhumane and adhArmika.

[Sudas Paijavana]

Hey, I was just trying to troll hinduism♥krishna just to see his response. I don't literally believe that Adi sha~Nkara was casteist (although he [sha~Nkara] did use the trapu-jatubhyAM verse in his bhAShyam). Nonetheless, judging by hinduism<luv>krishna's inability to respond, I don't think he finds it morally reprehensible to pour molten tin down a person's ear as a punishment as if both Adi sha~Nkara and the dharmasUtra he quoted from agree on that and if he thinks it serves as pramANa, then it probably doesn't matter to him, even if it's inhumane and adhArmika.

Dude,

I'm the one being trolled. You're the lucky one. Look at how my postings have been misconstrued. Heck, I'm getting more slack for just merely asking about scriptural citations, than HLK whose persistent casteism goes unchecked, unmarked, unaddressed, "tolerated", blah blah blah.

Who would have thought, eh?

"Madam, may I know the verse number?"

"You shall go to the netherworld, you usurper!"

- - - - - - -

"What caste are you? You do know that only certain caste members can be Hindu, blah blah blah, right?"

".....[I'll answer this dude kindly, because he didn't ask for scripture]....."

Pure madness, I tell you! Madness!

[isavasya]

Hey, I was just trying to troll hinduism♥krishna just to see his response. I don't literally believe that Adi sha~Nkara was casteist (although he [sha~Nkara] did use the trapu-jatubhyAM verse in his bhAShyam). Nonetheless, judging by hinduism<luv>krishna's inability to respond, I don't think he finds it morally reprehensible to pour molten tin down a person's ear as a punishment as if both Adi sha~Nkara and the dharmasUtra he quoted from agree on that and if he thinks it serves as pramANa, then it probably doesn't matter to him, even if it's inhumane and adhArmika.

Dear Jaskaran Singh,

I must say I was hurt by your last post. But I am happy you were not serious. I will just like to say that, the stance of Sri Adi Shankaracharya, Ramanujacharya and madhvacharya are same as far as casteism is concerned. The Smartha, Srivaishnava and Madhva sampradaya believe the same regarding varna system. So it would be unfair if we single out any of them while blaming casteism on Acharyas. Also nobody can guarantee whether all texts ascribed to these acharyas were really written by them. I will not like to discuss though whether their stance is correct or not because last time I spoke against casteism, some members didn't liked my views. Another thing, India etc are political divisions merely. Aryavartha means land of noble people (potentially the whole world). I personally believe currently there is nothing special about India, which makes it better than many other countries. By the way Sindh pradesh will be part of Bharata under any description of Bharata.

[Jaskaran Singh]

namaskAram,

Dude,

I'm the one being trolled. You're the lucky one. Look at how my postings have been misconstrued. Heck, I'm getting more slack for just merely asking about scriptural citations, than HLK whose persistent casteism goes unchecked, unmarked, unaddressed, "tolerated", blah blah blah.

Who would have thought, eh?

"Madam, may I know the verse number?"

"You shall go to the netherworld, you usurper!"

- - - - - - -

"What caste are you? You do know that only certain caste members can be Hindu, blah blah blah, right?"

".....[I'll answer this dude kindly, because he didn't ask for scripture]....."

Pure madness, I tell you! Madness!

LOL, that is hilarious.

Dear Jaskaran Singh,

I must say I was hurt by your last post. But I am happy you were not serious. I will just like to say that, the stance of Sri Adi Shankaracharya, Ramanujacharya and madhvacharya are same as far as casteism is considered.The Smartha, Srivaishnava and Madhva sampradaya believe the same regarding varna system. So it would be unfair if we single out any of them while blaming casteism on Acharyas. Also nobody can guarantee whether all texts ascribed to these acharyas were really written by them.

I don't remember madhvAchArya ever making a statement to the extent that tin should be poured down a shUdra's ear for listening to the vedAH, if you could provide the verse that would be nice. However, Adi sha~Nkara and rAmAnujAchArya did make statements to that effect. Regardless, I'm not a part of any of their (Adi sha~Nkara, rAmAnujAchArya, or madhvAchArya) sampradAya-s so it honestly doesn't matter to me whether they quote from such and such dharmashAstra and that won't influence my view on birth-based varNAshrama. I don't consider Adi sha~NkarAchArya any more casteist than the mImAMsaka-s or even bauddha-s of his time, yet he still made some very rude comments and quoted some of the strictest caste-based verses from the manusmR^iti, and that is undeniable. I was talking about him rather than rAmAnuja because H<heart>K was an advaitin and I'm pretty sure that talking about rAmAnuja wouldn't really provoke a response from him.

I will not like to discuss though whether their stance is correct or not because last time I spoke against casteism, some members didn't liked my views. Another thing, India etc are political divisions merely. Aryavartha means land of noble people (potentially the whole world). I personally believe currently there is nothing special about India, which makes it better than many other countries.

Well then; that's too bad for them, isn't it. I guess they'll just have to suck it up. If comments such as this one by Mahahrada aren't moderated, then I don't think my post (which merely quotes from sha~Nkara's brahmasUtrabhAShyam) will get deleted.

By the way Sindh pradesh will be part of Bharata under any description of Bharata.

Would you like to go to Sindh and ask whether Sindhi-s consider themselves to be bhAratvAsI-s? They would most likely say no...

[isavasya]

namaskAram,
I don't remember madhvAchArya ever making a statement to the extent that tin should be poured down an shUdra's ear for listening to the vedAH, if you could provide the verse that would be nice. However, Adi sha~Nkara and rAmAnujAchArya did make statements to that effect. Regardless, I'm not a part of any of their (Adi sha~Nkara, rAmAnujAchArya, or madhvAchArya) sampradAya-s so it honestly doesn't matter to me whether they quote from such and such dharmashAstra and that won't influence my view on birth-based varNAshrama. I don't consider Adi sha~NkarAchArya any more casteist than the mImAMsaka-s or even bauddha-s of his time, yet he still made some very rude comments and quoted some of the strictest caste-based verses from the manusmR^iti, and that is undeniable. I was talking about him rather than rAmAnuja because H<heart>K was an advaitin and I'm pretty sure that talking about rAmAnuja wouldn't really provoke a response from him.

Dear Jaskaran ji
Sorry, I do not have any quote with me. My post wanted to convey that all these schools of Vedanta strictly preach birth based varna dharma. I learned it from 3 years of debating with knowledgeable members of these 3 sampradaya. Manu smriti does contains violent and discriminatory verses for one community and all these schools adhere to Manu smriti to my knowledge.

Regarding my comment on Sindh. It is not I who want to dictate which is part of Bharata or which is not. I was merely saying that Puranas and Smritis mention Sindh as part of Bharata. These books have already been written so cannot be changed. Though in my personal opinion, Bhagwan can incarnate anywhere in the world. I strongly attest to feeling that all the worlds are my country. Svadeso Bhuvanatrayam.