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Thread: The Inferiority-Complex of India & Bollywood

  1. #61

    Re: The Inferiority-Complex of India & Bollywood

    Avyaydya,

    I'm not saying that the companies that sell the product are racists. I'm saying that there is a high level of colorism in India.

    And, Dark Is Beautiful is addressing individual companies. But, keep in mind that I never said that the campaign is the best of the best, nor did I say it is the most well-suited to address the permeating problem of colorism in India.

    However, it is the only campaigning group that has taken on this issue as it relates to India and Indian society. In other words, while I'm typing about this problem, Dark Is Beautiful is actively doing something about it, while no one else really is.

    EDIT: And, for those that may be thinking that, "wait a minute, Sudas...you do know that this works both ways, right?".......yes, I'm quite well aware (and to suggest that I am not is distasteful) that this can work both ways, since discrimination is not secluded to one group, occurrence, field, etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. However, I have concentrated more on fair-on-dark discrimination rather than dark-on-fair discrimination, because it seems that the former is more vivid and tangible.

    EDIT#2: Colorism is extremely vivid in Pakistan: source.
    Last edited by Sudas Paijavana; 07 December 2013 at 01:15 AM.

  2. #62

    Re: The Inferiority-Complex of India & Bollywood

    Quote Originally Posted by Sudas Paijavana View Post
    Avyaydya,

    I'm not saying that the companies that sell the product are racists. I'm saying that there is a high level of colorism in India.

    And, Dark Is Beautiful is addressing individual companies. But, keep in mind that I never said that the campaign is the best of the best, nor did I say it is the most well-suited to address the permeating problem of colorism in India.

    However, it is the only campaigning group that has taken on this issue as it relates to India and Indian society. In other words, while I'm typing about this problem, Dark Is Beautiful is actively doing something about it, while no one else really is.

    EDIT: And, for those that may be thinking that, "wait a minute, Sudas...you do know that this works both ways, right?".......yes, I'm quite well aware (and to suggest that I am not is distasteful) that this can work both ways, since discrimination is not secluded to one group, occurrence, field, etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. However, I have concentrated more on fair-on-dark discrimination rather than dark-on-fair discrimination, because it seems that the former is more vivid and tangible.

    EDIT#2: Colorism is extremely vivid in Pakistan: source.
    Paijavana. I agree with you on many levels except maybe this title:
    The Inferiority-Complex of India & Bollywood

    with that you turn it in to a problem of Indian people. As you say: There is something inherently wrong with the current Indian psyche, especially when it comes to Bollywood. I think India has not been exposed to this psychological manipulation as long as western countries. That probably makes their psyche stronger, but also in need of developing a good defense. Consumer organizations attacking the notions that these companies spread are important, even then i find it dangerous to say something is wrong with the psyche. That is exactly what these companies want people to believe, that they need something extra to feel secure, confident, beautiful. The right message is: there is nothing wrong with you, you are being manipulated. But countering this constant manipulation is not easy. And you have to realize that it is a constant manipulation. If they stop advertising, the effect wears off, they know that, that is why they keep on bombarding people with their subliminal messages. To tackle problems we must go to the source and that is not the psyche of the people, it is the constant manipulation. It is dangerous to wrongly define a problem, then a good solution will become impossible. Please understand that white women are manipulated in exactly the same manner, but they use rouge and plaster their face to hide freckles in stead of whitening, Here they will suggest that a white pale face is not only unattractive but unhealthy, pointing to sickness coming from not protecting the skin . It is tremdously intelligent and sophisticated manipulation based on lots of scientific research and a long tradition of manipulation that started with Romans, who made it into a science.

    Colorism is not a good definition of the problem. That is my opinion.
    (But accusations of colorism, racism may be a very effective weapon!)







    Last edited by Avyaydya; 07 December 2013 at 12:45 PM.

  3. #63

    Re: The Inferiority-Complex of India & Bollywood

    One thing we can read from history is that although the looking up to Caucasian features (skin complexion, facial features) has been brought about by conquest after another, it is the dark skinned indigenous population of the subcontinent that has always brought it back up when they are removed from their shackles. I do not want to convert this to some Indian version of Stormfront or something, and I'm not south-Indian either. I'm just saying, the British completely economically demolished India. The Turco-Persian Mughals also economically plundered India and the fact that India was still #1/2 by the time of the British is a testament to how wealthy and prosperous it was pre-Islam than any sort of development the foreign Muslims did. Keep going back before that, Scythians and Huns were devastating north India from Central Asia in similar fashion to Turkish Muslims but not as bad as they didn't have a different religion. All these plunderers had no interest in development and civilization. Only until they would settle down (mix with the indigenous blood) did they start showing signs of development. And in saying this, I'm talking down my own genetics as my own father line is from the second wave out of Africa (not the first which is the indigenous people) as tested from the Nat Geo project. Going from destruction of Indus Valley to 1947, two things are linear, one is decline of India in global stage, and two is increase of Caucasian influence under one label or other on a larger level politically and on a minor-level genetically. Look, even post-1947 what is going on. The first ruler was a Kashmiri Hindu Pandit Nehru. That in itself is the most Caucasian of prehistorically settled Indian groups. His daughter marries a Zoroastrian. Their son marries Italian (whose puppet rule has by far been the most disastrous). Their son is dating a Colombian girl, and I'm sure she's not more than 5% non-white.

    By the way, these are not my personal views towards individuals of Caucasian heritage...I am remarking from a macro-group perspective of what their contribution has been to India, individuals are individuals at the end of the day.

    Dark skinned people of various genetic mixes in India need to be aware of their history. There is nothing particularly aesthetically pleasing about Caucasians or Central Asians or whatever. They/we think so because of conquest. Part of me wonders if the reason why Article 370 stays in place is to prevent "pollution" of dark-skinned mainland Indians into Kashmir.

    Anyway, there is no reason for these inferiority complexes to remain. India is returning to the global scene, sending missions to Mars on black Tamil brainpower LOL. Hopefully we can stop regularly understood norms like if you have a dark skinned daughter, you better save up extra for the high dowry money...

    By the way, this IS racial inferiority complex and not a matter of wanting what one doesn't have. Because there are tons of features that Indian people could strive for. Indians have straight hair, Africans have kinky tight-coiled hair. Are Indians putting chemicals in hair to get it like Africans? Indians barring north easterners have big wide eyes. Are Indians trying get eye reduction surgery? Let's be real here...

  4. #64
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    Re: Goddess does penanace for becoming fair

    Quote Originally Posted by Sudas Paijavana View Post
    That's kind of odd. Because, Shiva/Rudra is described as tawny (dark brown) and sometimes black colored in the Rig Veda. Thus, I find that passage from the Matysa Purana strange.
    Dear Sudas Bhai,

    The purport of putting that story from Matsya Purana was not to prove that the story was correct. Personally, I do not interpret Puranic stories literally. I will not believe that mother of this universe will do tapasya for becoming fair. The story in my opinion was just a form of romance and represented pyaar bhara fight of husband-wife. The reason I put the story was that I believe seeing fair complexion as superior is not a recent phenomenon. At the same time, I also agree with you that there was a time when dark complexioned woman were thought to represent greater beauty. I think it goes in waves. Remember, during Maurya and Gupta period there was a lot of influx of foreign traders and foreign settlers in India. For example, Chandragupta Maurya married married Seleucus Nicator's daughter. So it could have been foreign influence as you and I agree even during ancient times that could have led to writing of that story in Purana which glorifies fair complexion. On the same, there were many periods in which dark complexion was seen as more appealing, as we can see in the paintings put in the first post of the topic.
    When the light has risen, there is no day, no night, neither existence nor non-existence; Siva alone is there. That is the eternal, the adorable light of Savitri, - and the ancient wisdom proceeded thence (Svetasvatara Upanishad IV-18). :)

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