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Thread: Punjabi Sikh Toasts in the UK: "Jatt Girls Going Down the Drain"

  1. #1

    Punjabi Sikh Toasts in the UK: "Jatt Girls Going Down the Drain"

    I would like to share what is on my mind.

    Greetings,

    This article is a little old (okay: it's two years+ old), but I thought it was worthy to post it in the canteen, because it's kind of mind-boggling, and at times: tsk-tsk-worthy.

    Wait a minute, this isn't about that terrible UK institution known as the British Class System, which is “the most class-ridden society under the sun”?

    Nope.

    Nor is it about the horrid Indian Caste System*?

    Not really. Well, kind of.

    But, at least the Indian Caste System didn't derive the ire of Orwell. And yes, I'm being satirically sarcastic.

    Anyways, this article would be amongst the first in which I would recommend that readers read-between-the-lines.

    It seems that a Sikh (ironic?) Punjabi Jatt girl wanted to marry a Dalit. And, both worked at the same firm. However, the two claim that it was caste-discrimination that resulted in the Jatt girl's future-husband to be fired, and she resigned shortly after.

    The first thing that pops into my mind is the following question:

    If the "casteist" (and, did I mention Sikh**?) hirers knew the "caste" of the male, then why did they hire Mr. Begraj in the first place?

    I think that a full story would do justice, because we are only reading about the side of the couple, and not the side of the firm in said question, who dismissed the allegations as "outrageous".

    Thoughts?

    - - - - - - - - - -

    *Instead of the misnomer, "Hindu Caste System", I used "Indian Caste System" because: "The Sachar Committee report of 2006 revealed that scheduled castes and tribes of India are not limited to the religion of Hinduism." -retrieved from: Sachar, Rajindar (2006). "Minority Report" (PDF). Government of India. Retrieved 2008-09-27.

    **Sikhism decries caste.

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    Re: Punjabi Sikh Toasts in the UK: "Jatt Girls Going Down the Drain"

    Quote Originally Posted by Sudas Paijavana View Post
    Thoughts?

    - - - - - - - - - -
    Caste bias does exist to an extent among many members of the Sikh community, especially among Jats. My parents used to use the word chamAr as an insult, although I would never do so.
    படைபோர் புக்கு முழங்கும்அப் பாஞ்சசன்னியமும் பல்லாண்டே
    May your pA~nchajanya shankha which reverberates on the battlefield, last thousands upon thousands of years...
    http://archives.mirroroftomorrow.org...anchajanya.jpg

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    Re: Punjabi Sikh Toasts in the UK: "Jatt Girls Going Down the Drain"

    **Sikhism decries caste.
    A few things I will like to mention. No society is free from discrimination. In sikhism there are dalit Sikhs and Jat Sikhs. In Muslims of south Asia, there are higher castes like Syed, Ashraf, Pathan; middle castes like malik, so called lower castes like zulaha, Pasmanda, Rangrez, Momin etc. The social and economic distinctions between these Muslim castes are much more wider than social distinctions between various castes of Hinduism. Most of the land owned by Muslim community is owned by their upper castes. Same within other religious people. I see that Buddhists talk about caste system as evil in Hinduism. Well they should know about social stratification and untouchability in Tibet society and of course you can see in Japanese movies of Mizoghuchi and Masaki Kobayashi that how lower class people were treated in Shinto and Buddhist societies of Japan.

    Now I will like to talk about UK. Last year a night club dancer was refused to have a wedding at a hotel, whose owners claimed that they don't want to have cheap people at their place. This is a serious denigration of any human being. A society which claims to be liberated cannot look down upon it's members because of their profession. The same britishers have been successful in spreading a myth that 'Hinduism' supports and breeds casteism. Yes, I accept casteism is a very very big social issue in South Asia, but it is not limited to Hinduism. It happens because of bad people, senseless people, illiteracy, tribalism, poverty and many other reasons. But it is prevalent in people of all religions. Also, even outside South Asia there are class discriminations. As a human being we should fight against any form of class discrimination.
    Last edited by isavasya; 06 December 2013 at 09:51 PM.
    When the light has risen, there is no day, no night, neither existence nor non-existence; Siva alone is there. That is the eternal, the adorable light of Savitri, - and the ancient wisdom proceeded thence (Svetasvatara Upanishad IV-18). :)

  4. #4

    Re: Punjabi Sikh Toasts in the UK: "Jatt Girls Going Down the Drain"

    Quote Originally Posted by Jaskaran Singh View Post
    Caste bias does exist to an extent among many members of the Sikh community, especially among Jats. My parents used to use the word chamAr as an insult, although I would never do so.
    Yeah, you would never call someone, "chamAr" (whatever the hell that means, I'm guessing it's something bad)...but, you throw around the word, "mleccha", like a gift basket. LoL

    But, how bad is caste bias in the Jatt Sikh community, do you know?

    Quote Originally Posted by isavasya View Post
    A few things I will like to mention. No society is free from discrimination. In sikhism there are dalit Sikhs and Jat Sikhs. In Muslims of south Asia, there are higher castes like Syed, Ashraf, Pathan; middle castes like malik, so called lower castes like zulaha, Pasmanda, Rangrez, Momin etc. The social and economic distinctions between these Muslim castes are much more wider than social distinctions between various castes of Hinduism. Most of the land owned by Muslim community is owned by their upper castes. Same within other religious people. I see that Buddhists talk about caste system as evil in Hinduism. Well they should know about social stratification and untouchability in Tibet society and of course you can see in Japanese movies of Mizoghuchi and Masaki Kobayashi that how lower class people were treated in Shinto and Buddhist societies of Japan.

    Now I will like to talk about UK. Last year a night club dancer was refused to have a wedding at a hotel, whose owners claimed that they don't want to have cheap people at their place. This is a serious denigration of any human being. A society which claims to be liberated cannot look down upon it's members because of their profession. The same britishers have been successful in spreading a myth that 'Hinduism' supports and breeds casteism. Yes, I accept casteism is a very very big social issue in South Asia, but it is not limited to Hinduism. It happens because of bad people, senseless people, illiteracy, tribalism, poverty and many other reasons. But it is prevalent in people of all religions. Also, even outside South Asia there are class discriminations. As a human being we should fight against any form of class discrimination.
    Don't forget Burakumin in Japan, which is vividly alive in Japan even today.

    But, to be denied a wedding procession because of the background of the profession? That's absolutely horrid!

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    Re: Punjabi Sikh Toasts in the UK: "Jatt Girls Going Down the Drain"

    Quote Originally Posted by Sudas Paijavana View Post
    Yeah, you would never call someone, "chamAr" (whatever the hell that means, I'm guessing it's something bad)...but, you throw around the word, "mleccha", like a gift basket. LoL

    But, how bad is caste bias in the Jatt Sikh community, do you know?
    I meant that I would never use it in a derogatory sense, because it shouldn't be derogatory, as it's a class of people. To use the title in a derogatory sense implies that you view that caste as inferior. Regarding the second part, I call anti-Hindu trolls (especially if they happen to be Christian or Muslim) "mleccha" because I find it funny. Besides, if people who are considered holy, like caitanya or shrImanta sha~Nkaradeva, used the term mleccha, then why can't I, ? Also, caste bias isn't any worse among the Jat community than among others.
    படைபோர் புக்கு முழங்கும்அப் பாஞ்சசன்னியமும் பல்லாண்டே
    May your pA~nchajanya shankha which reverberates on the battlefield, last thousands upon thousands of years...
    http://archives.mirroroftomorrow.org...anchajanya.jpg

  6. #6

    Re: Punjabi Sikh Toasts in the UK: "Jatt Girls Going Down the Drain"

    I found something interesting to post:

    Is any one here on HDF from the UK? I'm sure there are many here that are from the UK, I'm assuming. Anyways,

    Apparently there is an anti-caste-discrimination bill in the works in the UK, but the report that the House of Lords used was not reliable....

    More information can be acquired from this link: source.

    Also, can someone confirm if there are 400,000 Dalits in the UK or not? Or, was that number fabricated out of thin air?
    Last edited by Sudas Paijavana; 29 December 2013 at 02:22 PM.

  7. #7

    Re: Punjabi Sikh Toasts in the UK: "Jatt Girls Going Down the Drain"

    Quote Originally Posted by Jaskaran Singh View Post
    Also, caste bias isn't any worse among the Jat community than among others.
    I found something interesting as it pertains to caste-discrimination in the UK:

    "Most of the examples cited of discrimination are from the Sikh community."

    Briefing on Caste Legislation
    Prof. Gavin Flood
    Professor of Hindu Studies and Comparative Religion, University of Oxford
    Last edited by Sudas Paijavana; 06 December 2013 at 11:24 PM.

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    Re: Punjabi Sikh Toasts in the UK: "Jatt Girls Going Down the Drain"

    Quote Originally Posted by Sudas Paijavana View Post
    I found something interesting as it pertains to caste-discrimination in the UK:

    "Most of the examples cited of discrimination are from the Sikh community."

    Briefing on Caste Legislation
    Prof. Gavin Flood
    Professor of Hindu Studies and Comparative Religion, University of Oxford
    Still, I've never actually met a Sikh who has gone to large lengths to defend casteism, as some Hindu-s, like HLK, have done.
    படைபோர் புக்கு முழங்கும்அப் பாஞ்சசன்னியமும் பல்லாண்டே
    May your pA~nchajanya shankha which reverberates on the battlefield, last thousands upon thousands of years...
    http://archives.mirroroftomorrow.org...anchajanya.jpg

  9. #9

    Re: Punjabi Sikh Toasts in the UK: "Jatt Girls Going Down the Drain"

    Quote Originally Posted by Jaskaran Singh View Post
    Still, I've never actually met a Sikh who has gone to large lengths to defend casteism, as some Hindu-s, like HLK, have done.
    It seems that they obviously don't go to large lengths to defend casteism, but that they in real life suffer from it the most, as it pertains to caste-discrimination in the UK - since "most of the examples cited of discrimination are from the Sikh community", practicing either indirectly or directly caste-based (and biased) discrimination amongst themselves.
    Last edited by Sudas Paijavana; 07 December 2013 at 12:14 AM.

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    Re: Punjabi Sikh Toasts in the UK: "Jatt Girls Going Down the Drain"

    Quote Originally Posted by Sudas Paijavana View Post
    It seems that they obviously don't go to large lengths to defend casteism, but that they in real life suffer from it the most, as it pertains to caste-discrimination in the UK - since "most of the examples cited of discrimination are from the Sikh community", practicing either indirectly or directly caste-based (and biased) discrimination amongst themselves.
    So what, according to that same report, Muslims also practice heavy caste discrimination in the UK:

    "Indeed, even the primary association of caste with Hindu communities needs to be scrutinized as the NIESR report mostly cites cases of caste discrimination among Sikhs and Muslims."

    By the way, don't you find it funny how Muslims always blame Hindus for varNAshrama and claim that their religion is more "egalitarian" (lol) despite the fact that Arabs, Persians, and Turks (i.e. Muslims) were the ones who enslaved people and looted all the way from the Danish Coast in the west to China in the East and were also responsible for the enslavement of over 120 million Africans (much more than the 14 million Africans enslaved in the transatlantic slave trade, which was still horrifyingly gruesome); at least Sikhs and Hindus never enslaved anyone; in addition, why doesn't anyone ever acknowledge the genocide of 80 million Hindus and Buddhists in South Asia by Muslim mleccha-s from the period of 1200 AD to 1500 AD? "Religion of peace" my bu**!
    படைபோர் புக்கு முழங்கும்அப் பாஞ்சசன்னியமும் பல்லாண்டே
    May your pA~nchajanya shankha which reverberates on the battlefield, last thousands upon thousands of years...
    http://archives.mirroroftomorrow.org...anchajanya.jpg

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