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Thread: Mind v/s Self in dream

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    Mind v/s Self in dream

    Hi everyone,
    Today before I woke up I was dreaming and the second the dream collapsed my neck started aching (stiff because of cold weather) very badly I couldn't even move for few mins. I know to a large extent that pain is in the mind or mind creates pain to prevent body from getting injured and I didn't feel anything till the dream collapsed, so I'm assuming the mind wasn't present till the dream collapsed and I became conscious.

    So was the Self that was dreaming or some aspect of mind?
    ॐ महेश्वराय नमः

    || Om Namo Bhagavate Rudraya ||

    Hara Hara Mahadeva Shambo Shankara

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    Re: Mind v/s Self in dream

    Quote Originally Posted by realdemigod View Post
    Hi everyone,
    Today before I woke up I was dreaming and the second the dream collapsed my neck started aching (stiff because of cold weather) very badly I couldn't even move for few mins. I know to a large extent that pain is in the mind or mind creates pain to prevent body from getting injured and I didn't feel anything till the dream collapsed, so I'm assuming the mind wasn't present till the dream collapsed and I became conscious.

    So was the Self that was dreaming or some aspect of mind?
    Namaste,

    When you dream, the consciousness is not in the physical body, but in the dream world, which is the projection of mind (as I understand).

    It is the consciousness that matters, which is responsible for sensitivity and perception. If the consciousness is not in physical body, then thieves can rob your house and you are enjoying your dream.

    Same thing happens when we are too much involved in any movie or TV serial. We are not aware of our body position, until our concentration breaks and we once again become aware of our body.

    During this time too, we do not experience body pain. So the pain might be there, but brain is not registering it or say mind is not reacting to it, as it is busy with another thing.

    Self is nothing but consciousness. Even in dream, Self, as consciousness, knowledge, is always present, which does not break, when you wake up, as you say, I was dreaming.

    Aum
    Only God Is Truth, Everything Else Is Illusion - Ramakrishna
    Total Surrender of Ego to SELF is Real Bhakti - Ramana Maharshi

    Silence is the study of the scruptures. Meditation is the continuous thinking of Brahman which is to be meditated upon. The complete negation of both by knowledge is the vision of truth – sadAcAra-14 of Adi SankarAcArya

    namah SivAya vishnurUpAya viShNave SivarUpiNe, MBh, vanaparva, 3.39.76

    Sanskrit Dict | MW Dict | Gita Super Site | Hindu Dharma

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    Smile Re: Mind v/s Self in dream

    Quote Originally Posted by Indiaspirituality Amrut View Post
    Namaste,

    When you dream, the consciousness is not in the physical body, but in the dream world, which is the projection of mind (as I understand).

    It is the consciousness that matters, which is responsible for sensitivity and perception. If the consciousness is not in physical body, then thieves can rob your house and you are enjoying your dream.

    Same thing happens when we are too much involved in any movie or TV serial. We are not aware of our body position, until our concentration breaks and we once again become aware of our body.

    During this time too, we do not experience body pain. So the pain might be there, but brain is not registering it or say mind is not reacting to it, as it is busy with another thing.

    Self is nothing but consciousness. Even in dream, Self, as consciousness, knowledge, is always present, which does not break, when you wake up, as you say, I was dreaming.

    Aum
    O.K....? What?? The self/consciousness was not in the body and in a "dream world?" I always thought the mind created a dream world (like this virtual world). So it's a separate world now? A Different dimensions. Have I misunderstood something up there? Coming to the T.V serial part of the post... When you watch T.V, you/I become unaware of surroundings, but that doesn't mean we enter the show and be a part of it... What I mean to say is that our attention is on the show/dream and not on ourselves, so we fall into the"ILLUSION" or maya that we've outside somewhere else. But, we're actually swimming into the realms of our inner selves. I'm right unless me sitting in front of a computer and typing this is an illusion.

    To the original post,
    In a Freudian perspective, dreams are said to be the manifestations of the suppressed desires and fears of a person which have been suppressed into the unconscious aspect.....
    But, according to what you've said... I think that the neck pain due to the cold woke you up. I agree with the second post in the following respect... Mind is always present, (I hope you haven't taken mind = manah of sanskrith) because mind is a function of the soul. Like soul's like a software and mind and other mental processes are functions of the soul in my view.

    I hope my answer is satisfactory
    I don't know who I am, nor what I am.
    I don't know what I need to know.
    I don't know who you are, nor what you are.
    All I know is that you love me, Oh Sarvathma.
    Lead me on the righteous path, so that I may reach you.

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    Re: Mind v/s Self in dream

    Thanks Indiaspirituality Amrut and upsydownyupsy mv ss.

    I need to go back to reading Advaita
    ॐ महेश्वराय नमः

    || Om Namo Bhagavate Rudraya ||

    Hara Hara Mahadeva Shambo Shankara

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    Re: Mind v/s Self in dream

    hari o
    ~~~~~~
    namasté


    Quote Originally Posted by upsydownyupsy mv ss View Post
    O.K....? What?? The self/consciousness was not in the body and in a "dream world?"
    Let me add a bit of word-smithing to smooth out the understanding here. 'Consciousness not in the body' means not conscious OF the body. This slight change should make it more digestible.

    When one is in deep sleep there is no body awareness, there is no mind awareness. Yet we wake up and say ' I slept well'. This experience is that of NOT experiencing any thing... but just Being itself, stillness itself.
    We are use to experiencing objects. When one deep sleeps there is no object of experience - yet the next day we wake up and there we are again , the same person. Sleep is the experience of Being, without and object to experience. There is no experience OF the body, OF the mind, yet we are there, resting.

    iti śivaṁ


    यतस्त्वं शिवसमोऽसि
    yatastvaṁ śivasamo'si
    because you are identical with śiva

    _

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    Re: Mind v/s Self in dream

    Quote Originally Posted by yajvan View Post
    hari o
    ~~~~~~
    namasté




    Let me add a bit of word-smithing to smooth out the understanding here. 'Consciousness not in the body' means not conscious OF the body. This slight change should make it more digestible.

    When one is in deep sleep there is no body awareness, there is no mind awareness. Yet we wake up and say ' I slept well'. This experience is that of NOT experiencing any thing... but just Being itself, stillness itself.
    We are use to experiencing objects. When one deep sleeps there is no object of experience - yet the next day we wake up and there we are again , the same person. Sleep is the experience of Being, without and object to experience. There is no experience OF the body, OF the mind, yet we are there, resting.

    iti śivaṁ

    Namaste Yajvan ji,

    Thanks for better substitution of words

    OM Tat Sat
    Only God Is Truth, Everything Else Is Illusion - Ramakrishna
    Total Surrender of Ego to SELF is Real Bhakti - Ramana Maharshi

    Silence is the study of the scruptures. Meditation is the continuous thinking of Brahman which is to be meditated upon. The complete negation of both by knowledge is the vision of truth – sadAcAra-14 of Adi SankarAcArya

    namah SivAya vishnurUpAya viShNave SivarUpiNe, MBh, vanaparva, 3.39.76

    Sanskrit Dict | MW Dict | Gita Super Site | Hindu Dharma

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    Re: Mind v/s Self in dream

    hari o
    ~~~~~~
    namasté

    Quote Originally Posted by yajvan View Post


    When one is in deep sleep there is no body awareness, there is no mind awareness. Yet we wake up and say ' I slept well'. This experience is that of NOT experiencing any thing... but just Being itself, stillness itself.
    We are use to experiencing objects. When one deep sleeps there is no object of experience .
    Now is there any support for what is offered here ? Yes, we find this in patañjali’s yogadarśana (the yoga sutras of patañjali), 1st chapter.
    The 10th sūtra of the sāmadhi pāda says the following:
    abhāva pratyayālkambanā vṛttir nidrā ||
    • abhāva = non-existence , nullity , absence
    • pratyayālkambanā = pratyaya + ālkambanā = consciousness, ascertainment + support , sustaining , resting on
    • vṛttir = vṛttiḥ = state , condition ; in yoga it is considered a modification type ( or fluxuation)
    • nidrā = sleep
    Hence this says , the state or condition (vṛttir) of sleep (nidrā) is supported/rests upon (ālkambanā) the cognition (pratyaya)
    of nothing-ness (absence - abhāva)

    Said slightly differently , sleep is the cognition of nothingness. Why cognition ? Because you still exist. you are just not attentive (pratyaya) to objects. It is the objectless state of being. Yet note that 'being' is still there and there is no external object within awareness, it just rests in itself.
    This comprehension takes a bit of thought to get use to, but if one puts their intellect on this for just a bit you will find this to be a reasonable assessment of this condition.


    iti śivaṁ
    यतस्त्वं शिवसमोऽसि
    yatastvaṁ śivasamo'si
    because you are identical with śiva

    _

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    Re: Mind v/s Self in dream

    As always thanks for your expertise yajvanji
    ॐ महेश्वराय नमः

    || Om Namo Bhagavate Rudraya ||

    Hara Hara Mahadeva Shambo Shankara

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