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Thread: Sita is Sri Kamakshi Amman..

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    Sita is Sri Kamakshi Amman..

    Namaste,

    Sri Adi Shankara in his 'Kamakshi Stotram' calls Kamakshi as क्षोणी_भृत्_तनयेति Kssonnii_Bhrt_Tanayeti meaning 'the "Earth Born Daughter" (Devi Sita) and Who is the Voice behind the Shrutis (Upanishads)'.

    If Sita is Kamakshi Amman, Sri Rama then should really be the amsa of 'Kameshwara' -- a form of Shiva, is it not? (For Kamakshi's husband is Kameshwara).

    Has any work been done in this regard, that is, to find if there is any link between Sri Ram and Shiva?

    It might interest some to know that one Mr. PVR Narasimha Rao, astrologer and spiritualist writes in his Yahoo group 'Vedic-wisdom' that Sri Rama is Vishnu tattwa + Shiva tattwa (and that Sri Krishna is Vishnu tattwa + Uma tattwa). Pl. see the posting http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/v.../messages/9305.

    What do members feel about this? Any more insights can be provided regarding this?

    Thank you.
    jai hanuman gyan gun sagar jai kapis tihu lok ujagar

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    Re: Sita is Sri Kamakshi Amman..

    Namaste Viraja,
    If Sita is Kamakshi Amman, Sri Rama then should really be the amsa of 'Kameshwara' -- a form of Shiva, is it not? (For Kamakshi's husband is Kameshwara).


    guess this posting should go to Shaiva forum


    Is there any special reason to convert Shree Raama into a Shaivite deity?


    PS : If it were not my first post in 2014, I would have sued you 50 billion euro's like Paresh Rawal of OMG

    Anirudh...

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    Re: Sita is Sri Kamakshi Amman..

    Quote Originally Posted by Anirudh View Post
    Namaste Viraja,



    guess this posting should go to Shaiva forum


    Is there any special reason to convert Shree Raama into a Shaivite deity?


    PS : If it were not my first post in 2014, I would have sued you 50 billion euro's like Paresh Rawal of OMG

    Namaste, Anirudh:

    I do not think that Viraja is misappropriating Shri Ramachandra into a Shaivite deity, even though I agree that this thread should be in a different forum, not necessarily in the Shaiva section but perhaps in the God In Hindu Dharma section.
    Last edited by Sudas Paijavana; 05 January 2014 at 12:34 PM.

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    Re: Sita is Sri Kamakshi Amman..

    Namaste Sudas,

    I am not ridiculing her in any way but found it funny to see Shree Raamachandra Prabhu as Shiva. My opinion is lets not not do things just to do things.

    I have seen many a times that these kind of discussion create unwanted heated exchanges. Have made comments on the topic and not on the person behind.
    Anirudh...

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    Re: Sita is Sri Kamakshi Amman..

    Quote Originally Posted by Viraja View Post
    Namaste,

    Sri Adi Shankara in his 'Kamakshi Stotram' calls Kamakshi as क्षोणी_भृत्_तनयेति Kssonnii_Bhrt_Tanayeti meaning 'the "Earth Born Daughter" (Devi Sita) and Who is the Voice behind the Shrutis (Upanishads)'.

    If Sita is Kamakshi Amman, Sri Rama then should really be the amsa of 'Kameshwara' -- a form of Shiva, is it not? (For Kamakshi's husband is Kameshwara).

    Has any work been done in this regard, that is, to find if there is any link between Sri Ram and Shiva?

    It might interest some to know that one Mr. PVR Narasimha Rao, astrologer and spiritualist writes in his Yahoo group 'Vedic-wisdom' that Sri Rama is Vishnu tattwa + Shiva tattwa (and that Sri Krishna is Vishnu tattwa + Uma tattwa). Pl. see the posting http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/v.../messages/9305.

    What do members feel about this? Any more insights can be provided regarding this?

    Thank you.
    Namaste,

    Advaita always says all Gods are equal. So equating Devi Kamakshi with Sita devi and Sarasvati devi and other Gods simply indicates non-difference.

    In this stotra, Devi Kamakshi is portrayed as the supreme godhead

    Aum
    Only God Is Truth, Everything Else Is Illusion - Ramakrishna
    Total Surrender of Ego to SELF is Real Bhakti - Ramana Maharshi

    Silence is the study of the scruptures. Meditation is the continuous thinking of Brahman which is to be meditated upon. The complete negation of both by knowledge is the vision of truth – sadAcAra-14 of Adi SankarAcArya

    namah SivAya vishnurUpAya viShNave SivarUpiNe, MBh, vanaparva, 3.39.76

    Sanskrit Dict | MW Dict | Gita Super Site | Hindu Dharma

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    Re: Sita is Sri Kamakshi Amman..

    Namaste Anirudh ji,

    This type of thinking (of analyzing Shri Ram to be a mix of Vishnu and Shiva tattwas) is not really new.

    i) Some people have opined that Sri Rama and Sri Krishna being poornavataras, must have been present even before their manifestation on this earth, and not really just as Sri Vishnu, but present in their own unique identity.

    ii) If you analyze the name of Sri Rama, you can find that it is called the Thaaraka mantra and is a combination of Namasivaya mantra and the Om Namo Narayanaya maha mantra thereby representing the merger of Shiva and Narayana.

    @Amrut bhai,

    Just because Sri Shankara might be equating the status of Kamakshi with Sita or otherwise, it does not mean that all gods are the same. They might be equals, but not the 'same'. For example, in Kanakadhara stotram that Adi Shankara sings towards ma Lakshmi, he does not call her as 'Kamakshi'. Even in Sitashtottaram (not composed by Adi Shankara), Srimati Sita Devi is called as 'Visalakshi', which is another name for 'Kamakshi'. In Mahapashupatastra.blogspot.com, the author says Srimathi Sita Devi is essentially 'Lalitha Tripura Sundari' who is the same as Kamakshi. Thus arises the doubt that given only Sita devi is Kamakshi, what is the connection between Sri Rama and Sri Shiva.
    jai hanuman gyan gun sagar jai kapis tihu lok ujagar

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    Re: Sita is Sri Kamakshi Amman..

    Quote Originally Posted by Viraja View Post
    Namaste Anirudh ji,

    This type of thinking (of analyzing Shri Ram to be a mix of Vishnu and Shiva tattwas) is not really new.

    i) Some people have opined that Sri Rama and Sri Krishna being poornavataras, must have been present even before their manifestation on this earth, and not really just as Sri Vishnu, but present in their own unique identity.

    ii) If you analyze the name of Sri Rama, you can find that it is called the Thaaraka mantra and is a combination of Namasivaya mantra and the Om Namo Narayanaya maha mantra thereby representing the merger of Shiva and Narayana.

    @Amrut bhai,

    Just because Sri Shankara might be equating the status of Kamakshi with Sita or otherwise, it does not mean that all gods are the same. They might be equals, but not the 'same'. For example, in Kanakadhara stotram that Adi Shankara sings towards ma Lakshmi, he does not call her as 'Kamakshi'. Even in Sitashtottaram (not composed by Adi Shankara), Srimati Sita Devi is called as 'Visalakshi', which is another name for 'Kamakshi'. In Mahapashupatastra.blogspot.com, the author says Srimathi Sita Devi is essentially 'Lalitha Tripura Sundari' who is the same as Kamakshi. Thus arises the doubt that given only Sita devi is Kamakshi, what is the connection between Sri Rama and Sri Shiva.
    Namaste Viraja di,

    As I know, the tAraka mantra is OM and not RAma nAma or RAma mantra or any other combination. Author of Mahapashupatastra.blogspot.com also says the same, but my opinion of the independent of his, yet both are saying the same.

    As I understand, all Gods are same. Maa Sita and Maa Parvati are two names of same omnipresent entity. To me both Sri RAma and Sri Siva are same entities appearing as different. Technically there is no difference between them.

    One may worship another at one instance and vice versa. It is just to create faith and devotion in the devotees, nothing more.

    KanadhAra stotram says



    गीर्देवतेति गरुडध्वजसुन्दरीति
    शाकम्भरीति शशिशेखरवल्लभेति ।
    सृष्टिस्थितिप्रलयकेलिषु संस्थितायै
    तस्यै नमस्त्रिभुवनैकगुरोस्तरुण्यै ॥ १०॥

    We offer obeisance to the Goddess Mahalakshmi, the consort of Narayana, the preceptor of all the three worlds. She is variously known as Saraswati the Goddess of Learning, as Goddess Lakshmi, the Divine consort of Mahavishnu, as Shakambhari or as Parvati the consort of Lord Maheshwara. Verily it is she who is playfully engaged in creation, protaction and final destruction of the Universe || 10 ||

    There is no distinction between the three.

    Jai Shri Rama
    Only God Is Truth, Everything Else Is Illusion - Ramakrishna
    Total Surrender of Ego to SELF is Real Bhakti - Ramana Maharshi

    Silence is the study of the scruptures. Meditation is the continuous thinking of Brahman which is to be meditated upon. The complete negation of both by knowledge is the vision of truth – sadAcAra-14 of Adi SankarAcArya

    namah SivAya vishnurUpAya viShNave SivarUpiNe, MBh, vanaparva, 3.39.76

    Sanskrit Dict | MW Dict | Gita Super Site | Hindu Dharma

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    Re: Sita is Sri Kamakshi Amman..

    Namaste Amrut bhai,

    My understanding is that though Sri Shiva and Sri Vishnu are equals, they are not exactly the 'same'. This is spoken in the sense, there exist in the cosmos, 2 unique identities of deities, one as Sri Shiva and another as Sri Vishnu. The scope of this thread is essentially intended to those having similar faith, and who know further about Sri Rama tattwa to explore this tattwa further.

    It has been understood by scholars that similar to considering Sri Vishnu one with Sri Shiva, similarly Parvathi devi is considered one with Sri Lakshmi. However, it is to be noted that Sri Lakshmi (and ma Parvathi) are not necessarily 'Shakti' aka Kamakshi (Lalitha). (That Parvathi is different from SHAKTI and that Kamakshi amman is this Shakti are things that were given to me as understanding, in a few spiritual experiences I have been blessed with.)

    Also, for god worshiped in Saguna swaroopa, Rama nama is the Taraka mantra, whereas for god worshiped in Nirguna swaroopa, OM is the Taraka mantra:

    "Rama Nama gets exactly the same importance in Saguna Upasana (worshipping the Absolute Truth as a Being with a form) as does the Pranava ('Om') Mantra in Nirguna Upasana (worshipping the Absolute Truth as formless)." (From: http://www.namadwaar.org/articles/gloryoframanama.html).

    This thread is not for discussing the Taraka mantra though, even if not considering Rama nama as Taraka mantra, it is known that 'Rama' is a combination of Narayana nama and Shiva nama, as stated already.
    Last edited by Viraja; 02 January 2014 at 11:51 AM.
    jai hanuman gyan gun sagar jai kapis tihu lok ujagar

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    Re: Sita is Sri Kamakshi Amman..

    Namaste

    Here is something (which I have always have understood) which may be of interest and pertinent to the "Earth Born" Devi (and consort of Rama, etc.).

    In my teaching, Vishnu has more than one consort.

    This is includes Sri Devi, and also Bhu Devi. These are two manifestations of the Shakti associated with Vishnu. Shree is Lakshmi, and Bhu is relation to Bhumi. They are not exactly the same, two different manifestations, much like Parvati and Annapurna are two different manifestations of Shakti associated with Shiva.

    So here we see two (almost identical) of Sri Devi and Bhu Devi from 1000 AD:



    Bhu Devi is the "Earth Born" Devi (on the right). Of course, Sita is also the "Earth Born" Devi. Sita was the consort of Ram.

    Therefore, what I am saying is Sita was NOT Lakshmi but in a sense a manifestation of but different. Sita was a Bhu Devi, She was a emanation (slightly different from manifestation) of Bhu Devi, Bhu Devi was a Daughter of Bhumi Mother Earth and a consort of Vishnu, Bhu is a manifestation of Vishnu's Shakti. This may explain what was being said in the verse. Kamakshi *(Jai!) is indeed a manifestation of Bhu Devi.

    Om Namah Sivaya

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    Re: Sita is Sri Kamakshi Amman..

    Thank you for the insight, ShivaFan ji.

    Although most people do not know the distinction between the devis/amsas of Parvathi and Shakti, there does exist such a distinction. Their forms are different, their yantras and the means of propitiating them are different. One does not end up propitiating goddess Matangi, for instance, by having a picture of 'Kamalathmika' and reciting mantras for Kamalatmika. Mostly, these devis all emanated from the 10 different amsas 'Sati' the 1st wife of Shiva took. These are also classified as 'Dasamahavidyas' and Shri Lalitha is also one of them, known as 'Shodasi mahavidya'.

    Sri Adi Shankara, as already stated in OP, calls Kamakshi as 'Sita' in Sri Kamakshi Stotram -> this is a very, very important reference because no Acharya in his invokation of a Shaiva deity, calls her as a Vaishnava deity, Sri Adi Shankara definitely conveys the message clear enough in calling Kamakshi as Sita as such in this sloka. In Lalitha Sahasranama, he calls Sri Lalitha as 'Kamakshi' (* 62 * Kamakshi - She who fulfills desires by her sight), so we know Lalitha Tripura Sundari Devi, is Kamakshi who is also Sita. In Lalitha Sahasranama, Sri Lalitha Devi is also called as Mahalakshmi (* 210 * Maha lakshmi - "She who takes the form of Mahalaksmi, the goddess of wealth"), but this I think is because Sri Kamakshi (aka Lalitha) is a combination of Sri Lakshmi and Sri Saraswati and Sri Durga (Parvathi). Hence in another instance, Sri Lalitha is called as 'Parvathi' in Lalitha Sahasranama.

    When we see the similarities, we find that Sri Lalitha is born of fire, and Sita is born to Bhooma who has formerly given birth to Agni. I believe that owing to Agni-tattwa of Sri Lalitha, Sita is born 'Ayonija' to Bhooma.

    What I see as the 'difference' in Lakshmi being called 'Parvathi' vs. Kamakshi being called 'Sita' is that Lakshmi existed all along, she could have been manifestation of Parvathi but she held on to her existence from times immemorial. Whereas Sita came into existence during Treta yuga, as daughter of Janaka. This suggests to me that she is very much the 'poornavatara' of goddess Tripura Sundari Devi (Kamakshi).

    Besides this, the author Santosh Kumar Ayalasomayajula has done some research work into why Kamakshi Amman is Sita in his work at 'http://mahapashupatastra.blogspot.com/2011/08/sita-rama-tatwam-replica-of-shiva.html'.

    To me, this research is of high importance, because instead of looking at Ma Lalithambika as some Shakta deity unrelated to Vaishnavam in any way, now I see her as ma Sita, and my Sadhana then should include paying respects to Tripura Sundari Devi, the Kamakshi.

    I would like to end the note that I would appreciate any insight provided from stotras or otherwise that supports the above view.

    jai hanuman gyan gun sagar jai kapis tihu lok ujagar

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