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Thread: Isha Upanishad refutes Mayavada (Illusionism) by Shankara

  1. #21

    Re: Isha Upanishad refutes Mayavada (Illusionism) by Shankara

    I would like to bring to the notice of the readers that Ramana also had differences with some of the views of Aurobindo :

    http://selfabidance.blogspot.in/2013...urobindos.html

    Love!
    Silence
    Come up, O Lions, and shake off the delusion that you are a sheep

  2. #22
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    Re: Isha Upanishad refutes Mayavada (Illusionism) by Shankara

    Quote Originally Posted by silence_speaks View Post
    Dear savithru,




    You are welcome to your beliefs. Beliefs cannot be reasoned about ... coz they are just beliefs.
    neither can experiences be reasoned with .... since all experiences are states of mind ... any experience u might have had can be simulated in a neuro science lab!

    Liberated living is not a matter of experience ... more so since experiences are dumb and its your interpretation of the experience that matters !

    Anyways ... "Reject statements that lack reasoning whether by a aged person or sage sukha himself. Accept words that are logically correct even if they are from a bird or a kid"

    Love!
    Silence
    For those who make their own sruti and ignore God not much can be said about their arrogance. As I said those who worship Hiranyagarbha will receive the sublime wisdom and achieve immortality while the others remain in ignorance due to their pride.
    Last edited by savithru; 17 September 2014 at 02:21 AM. Reason: Changed Font

  3. #23

    Re: Isha Upanishad refutes Mayavada (Illusionism) by Shankara

    Quote Originally Posted by savithru View Post
    For those who make their own sruti and ignore God not much can be said about their arrogance. As I said those who worship Hiranyagarbha will receive the sublime wisdom and achieve immortality while the others remain in ignorance due to their pride.
    Dear Savithru ji,


    Sruthi does not contradict logic. Shabda pramana is not supposed to be in contradiction with anumana or arthapathi.

    So Logic is a valid means of knowledge for the areas it has access to. What is logically rejectable cannot be an opinion of the sruthi.

    Again, if you are claiming that Shankara himself created his own sruthi ... you need to substantiate that with sufficient reasoning and proper study ... it needs not just enough knowledge of logic but a proper understand of what shankara meant , first of all! that requires very elaborate study.
    if you claim i am creating my own sruthi ... i have no teaching of my own ... i present what shankara taught as i understand ... and yes what i present may be wrong ... and it can be corrected if proper reasoning is provided.



    God is not ignored ! that is also a wrong understanding of shankara's teachings.

    Love!
    Silence
    Come up, O Lions, and shake off the delusion that you are a sheep

  4. #24
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    Re: Isha Upanishad refutes Mayavada (Illusionism) by Shankara

    Quote Originally Posted by silence_speaks View Post
    Dear Savithru ji,


    Sruthi does not contradict logic. Shabda pramana is not supposed to be in contradiction with anumana or arthapathi.
    Shruthi is beyond logic, it is not necessary that Shruthi should be based on logic. Shruthi is Apaurusheya.


    So Logic is a valid means of knowledge for the areas it has access to. What is logically rejectable cannot be an opinion of the sruthi.
    If this was true then all logical positivists would have been knowers of Brahman by now.

    Again, if you are claiming that Shankara himself created his own sruthi ... you need to substantiate that with sufficient reasoning and proper study ... it needs not just enough knowledge of logic but a proper understand of what shankara meant , first of all! that requires very elaborate study.
    if you claim i am creating my own sruthi ... i have no teaching of my own ... i present what shankara taught as i understand ... and yes what i present may be wrong ... and it can be corrected if proper reasoning is provided.



    God is not ignored ! that is also a wrong understanding of shankara's teachings.

    Love!
    Silence
    Shankara simply put was a crypto-Buddhist whose views destroyed the whole importance and wisdom hidden behind the Purva Mimamsa.

    The correct view of Advaita do not consider Ishvara to be an illusionary construct or as a projection of one's mind. Ishvara is the controller of your mind how can he be a projection of your mind? There is a real world independent of the mind. Panchabhuthas and Tanmatras is not Maya, they are real not illusions and they exist independent of one's mind.

    The doctrine of Maya is not Sruthi and hence this theory by Shankara should be discarded completely as it is variance with Indian philosophy.

    Last edited by savithru; 17 September 2014 at 02:22 AM. Reason: Changed Font

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    Re: Isha Upanishad refutes Mayavada (Illusionism) by Shankara

    Quote Originally Posted by devotee View Post
    Namaste Savithru,

    You have used too much of bold and increased font in your posts. This makes one feel as if you are shouting through your posts.

    Can you use normal fonts ? This will make reading your posts easy. If there is something really special in any post, you may like to highlight that word/term used in the post.

    OM
    Oops! I am running from an ubuntu machine and for me the fonts were appearing quite readable and good but later when I checked my posts on a windows machine I realized that the font was all gibberish.

    I am really sorry I didn't knew this before.

  6. #26

    Re: Isha Upanishad refutes Mayavada (Illusionism) by Shankara

    Dear savithru ji,


    Shruthi is beyond logic, it is not necessary that Shruthi should be based on logic. Shruthi is Apaurusheya.
    Sruthi should not contradict logic does not mean it should be based on logic.

    For example when they say : There is a heaven ... that is beyond the "Realms of logic".

    But if they say, "earth is flat" or "a time dependent object does not die " etc ... that would be contradicting logic.

    Sruthi - Yukthi - Anubhavah .... thats how one realizes the truth.

    Yukthi has its place ... in rejecting wrong ideas.

    Rest of what you wrote comes from incomplete understanding of what Shankara said in the first place.

    Love!
    Silence
    Come up, O Lions, and shake off the delusion that you are a sheep

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    Re: Isha Upanishad refutes Mayavada (Illusionism) by Shankara

    Quote Originally Posted by silence_speaks View Post
    Dear savithru ji,


    Rest of what you wrote comes from incomplete understanding of what Shankara said in the first place.

    Love!
    Silence
    We very well understand the doctrine of Shankara and his theory of Maya as it currently stands is against the orthodox view of the Vedas and the Upanishads. Shankara's theory of Maya should be wiped out from the earth as he has misled all of us into untruth. The fact that you did not addressed my argument and simple brushed it aside shows that the truth was never on your side.

    Mayavada and Buddhism - Are they one and the same?

    Conclusion

    The concepts of maya, avidya, vyayaharika-satya and paramarthika-satya, advaya, prajna, the unreality of the universe and time and the attributeless Brahman are all Buddhist contributions, without which there would be no Advaita philosophy. It thus becomes obvious why Sankara was disinclined to launch an all out attack upon Sunyavada Buddhism when he and his predecessor Gaudapada had appropriated so much from that doctrine.


    In conclusion, by carefully analyzing the above points it would seem that Sankara’s detractors were correct in assessing that his philosophy was crypto-Buddhism. It can clearly be observed that Sankara and Gaudapada attempted to amalgamate Buddhist epistemology and psychology with the metaphysics of the Upanishads and Vedanta. Thus, from an orthodox standpoint, this automatically disqualifies Advaitavada (of Shankara) as a traditional school of Vedic thought.

  8. #28

    Re: Isha Upanishad refutes Mayavada (Illusionism) by Shankara

    Dear savithru,

    Whether truth was on my side or not is not the matter.
    the matter is what is the Truth. There is no place for personal feelings and emotions here.

    What do you want me to prove or disprove ?
    You have some views. you base them on belief ....
    I cannot prove or disprove your belief... since belief is a belief, not based on logical deductions.

    And then you claim Shankara taught buddhism ... if so what ? Buddha was an enlightened one ... its good that there are so many similarities ! That just goes to show that liberated living is nearly the same, expressions may be slightly different !

    From your quotations etc I get a doubt. Is Aurobindo's Advaita also called "Vishishtadvaita " ?

    Love!
    Silence
    Come up, O Lions, and shake off the delusion that you are a sheep

  9. #29

    Re: Isha Upanishad refutes Mayavada (Illusionism) by Shankara

    What matters at the end of the day is
    not where i am a dvaitin , vishistadvaitin , or advaitin.

    or even Buddhist.

    It does not matter whether i confirm to "Vedas" or "Koran"

    What matters is where i discover total Satisfaction ... and live a liberated life here and now or not !

    Whether i live like a Stitapragnya, here and now ... irrespective of whether i follow buddhism or dualism ... is all that matters ... since here and now ... if i am a stitapragya, i am free and reveling as myself.
    Come up, O Lions, and shake off the delusion that you are a sheep

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    Re: Isha Upanishad refutes Mayavada (Illusionism) by Shankara

    Namaste,

    Should we trust Sri Aurobindo ? What is his credentials on realisation of Truth ?

    Saying this, "Shankara's theory of Maya should be wiped out from the earth as he has misled all of us into untruth." can be seen as merely an outburst of an inflated ego ... unless who says this has realised the Truth.

    Savithru, are you Self/Brahman/Truth-realised ?

    OM
    "Om Namo Bhagvate Vaasudevaye"

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