Hiranya Garbha-Agni-Rig Veda-Vedic Rain Goddess - Help

[Ram11]

Namaste,

In my study I came across two verses:

1.The Truth of Spaces Vast,Seed of the Universe orb...

The note given says:Refers to the 'Hiranya Garbha' and Agni described as 'retas' descending from the antariksha in the Rig Veda.
Could any member point out the mantra/mantras that speak about the Hiranya Garbha,Agni-Retas-Antariksha or elaborate about these?

2:...the Mother that sends down the rains..

Is there any Devata(female) mentioned in the Vedas who causes rains?

Not related to these questions but an other doubt I have had since a long time.

Who is the rain god acc. to the Vedas,Lord Indra or Lord Varuna?In some books Sri Varuna is called as the god of water/seas/oceans and in some others is Sri Indra is said to cause clouds to yield rain.(Sometimes Varuna Yajna/Varuna Japa is performed to obtain rains).Are there more than one rain Devatas lauded in the Vedas?

[Kalicharan Tuvij]

Namaste Ram11,

Goddess iLA is specifically mentioned as rain / causing rain [Yajur Veda (1.7.2.2)]. You might remember iLA from our last conversation.
(You also asked more about Her. IMO She is the Vedic name of goddess Kali)

Among other things (e.g., iLA the "Cow", or iLA-pada the foot of iLA, etc), iLA is said to be the mother of Agni in particular. ILA is Bhuvaneshwari (Antariksha) as well; so you can see the connection between Agni and iLA.

One more point; Vedic Sanskrit doesn't work the way other languages do. So, "rain" doesn't mean the physical rain. Roughly, it means (the act of/ sustenance of) creation.

Lord Varun, on the other hand, is indeed the presiding deity of (physical) waters. He rules over Life, hence karma.

[Ram11]

Namaste Ram11,

Goddess iLA is specifically mentioned as rain / causing rain [Yajur Veda (1.7.2.2)]. You might remember iLA from our last conversation.
(You also asked more about Her. IMO She is the Vedic name of goddess Kali)

Among other things (e.g., iLA the "Cow", or iLA-pada the foot of iLA, etc), iLA is said to be the mother of Agni in particular. ILA is Bhuvaneshwari (Antariksha) as well; so you can see the connection between Agni and iLA.

Namaste Kalicharan Ji,

Yes I do remember and later somewhere I found iLA devi is mentioned as one of the 11 Rudranis but I do not know if she is known as Shakti of the Vedic Lord Shiva(Lord R) in the Vedas,so I did not post a reply then.

I could not find a translation of the reference you gave,could you provide the translation?(Is it from Taittiriya KYV or from SYV)

Is the the Devi Bhuvaneshwari you are referring to a Shakta Vidya or a Vedic Devata by that name?
After searching for a while,I found some mantras where Devi iLA and Agni Deva are mentioned in the Rig Veda but I could not understand what was being conveyed.



3.29.3
Lay this with care on that which lies extended: straight hath she borne the Steerwhen made prolific. / With his red pillar-radiant is his splendour-in our skilled task is born the Son of Ila.

1.31.4

Agni thou madest heaven to thunder for mankind; thou, yet more pious, for pious Pururavas. / When thou art rapidly freed from thy parents, first eastward they bear thee round, and, after, to the west.

1.31.11

Thee, Agni, have the Gods made the first living One for living man, Lord of the house of Nahusa. / Ila they made the teacher of the sons of men, what time a Son was born to the father of my race.

3.55.13

Loud hath she lowed, licking the other's youngling. On what world hath the Milch-cow laid her udder? / This Ila streameth with the milk of Order. Great is the Gods'supreme and sole dominion.

1.128.2

Priest ne'er deceived, he sits in Ila's holy place, girt round in Ila's holy place. / We call that perfecter of worship by the path or sacrifice; with reverence rich in offerings, with worship rich in offerings.

7.64.2

Kings, guards of rrtighty everlasting Order, come hitherward, ye Princes, Lords of Rivers. / Send us from heaven, O Varuna and Mitra, rain and sweet food, ye who pour down your bounties.

10.110.8

Let Bharati come quickly to our worship, and Ila showing like a human being. / So let Sarasvati and both her fellows, deft Goddesses, on this fair grass be seated.

One more point; Vedic Sanskrit doesn't work the way other languages do. So, "rain" doesn't mean the physical rain. Roughly, it means (the act of/ sustenance of) creation.

How do we know how to interpret a word in Vedic Samskruta,has any one from the ancient past compiled a dictionary of all the Vedic words?Meaning associated with a word could have changed many times in the past,today can we know the real/original meaning as seen/heard by the Rishis?

Lord Varun, on the other hand, is indeed the presiding deity of (physical) waters. He rules over Life, hence karma.

Oh!What is the relationship between Lord Varuna and Karma?

[Kalicharan Tuvij]

Namaste Ram11-ji,

This is a good link to find consolidated information on iLA (also called iDA in Sanskrit), though I'd advise not to take opinionating of the authors too seriously. There are several chapters in the book listing out all references of Devi ILA. You will find, for example, references to the "foot of iLA", and Her deep connection to our Hotr priest (none other than Lord Agni ).

About the mention of Bhuvaneshwari, I had Shakta Vidya in mind. But I meant it literally, too. But the point was to speak Bhuvan as same as Antariksha (very important point, since Antariksha is one of the most misunderstood and mistranslated word).

Before we go into the meaning of Vedic rain, let me state a very important canon:
In the Veda, the Word is the basic unit of meaning, and the Pada (line) is the complete context.

This means, jumping ahead or back of a line in Veda doesn't help, and if a word is not understood, nothing is understood.

So this principle makes the Veda the densest text of Hinduism. I find it impossible to handle more than a or two of rica-s at one time.

Coming to "rain" the word is vrishTi. Rain is a downpour, of drops. It can mean "quantisation" process - production of finite from the Infinte. This is just one interpretation. I guess there is more to it, such as some correlation with srishTi, and so on.

If we don't get the words of Veda right, the whole of it sounds crazy. That is a good clue. Another is that, Veda can never be understood by the study of Veda. Hehe, that is true IMO.