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Thread: Should I totally avoid shaking hands?

  1. #21
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    Re: Should I totally avoid shaking hands?

    Namaste India Lover,

    Quote Originally Posted by Indialover View Post
    That's what I question. Who defines self-realized and who recognizes in a human that he is self-realized?

    There we have the highly praised spiritual teacher Eckhart Tolle. Is he more realized than you and me? He has the ability to talk smart, to write books in easy language and to inspire the crowd. Yes it’s great what he has to say, but, in my eyes, he talks about psychology, not about spirituality. People hang on his lips because they seek help for repairing their life.
    It is difficult to judge these days. But there are some signs :

    a) Self-Realized will never have weaknesses for carnal pleasure. Unless the carnal desires die out completely, one cannot be Self-realised.
    b) He must be from a well accepted Guru-Shishya parampara as Shankara's orders of monks. His Guru must be a well accepted Self-realized Guru. There are very exceptions to this rule e.g. Ramana Maharishi is one.
    c) He must be selfless. Should be simple hearted, down-to-earth guy who is easily approachable but who is strict on discipline and rules.
    d) He should not be keen on making a number of disciples just to increase his clout and wealth.

    Anyone who desires to build his/her empire, wants to be given grand welcome/treat, wants your money, wants company of people of other sex, wants tamasic/intoxicating food, lavish lifestyle a big red flag. One should stay from such people who are none but thugs in the garb of saints.

    OM
    "Om Namo Bhagvate Vaasudevaye"

  2. #22

    Re: Should I totally avoid shaking hands?

    Namaste Indialover

    I am not saying that your black and white but highlighted what I see as a common problem to not see middle areas, if you took in that way it was not intentional and I apologize, although its a common inherent problem.

    So making wholesale conclusions may not reflect the complete picture. I have my certain issues with things which I voice sometimes but at the same time try to keep it more impersonal as nothing is really black and white.

    Some external showcase gurus maybe be totally bogus, but some of the followers may get a certain amount of something good from it, some people are adamant Osho, Srila Prabhupada, Swami Vivekanda and almost everyone even Ramana Maharshi are not Self Realized. If everything is only seen by externals everything becomes very confusing. Thats why I have found its best to sometimes just take the inspiration from its own source and not hold onto the image, other more complex things when it falls into the world of personal opinions are best left alone.

    I dont like the monotheistic concept and the very negative influence and impact its had on the world as a whole, but I dont hate all people from the Abrahamic traditions and faiths, so the argument is again impersonal and directed at the negative impacts and causes rather than people. Many Christians are nice people, just ordinary people getting through life , same as everyone else.

    How do we define spiritual, I cant see spiritual being trapped by any of our perceptions but at the same there are ways to communicate some things, thats part of our shared common experience as social beings, where communication becomes essential part of life.

    Is silence really silence, or maybe its just silent in a certain domain, mostly within sense and mind consciousness, but even then there has to some something that breaks through in to that realm to help it rise above the limiting conditions, other wise how will we ever start to transcend, if it always something abstract and out of reach.

    How do we know anyone is Self Realized, as most of are us not and if its said that only Jnani knows a Jnani then this logic is flawed from the start to seek out a Self Realized Guru a bit like looking for the Sun at night.

    But there is always a common theme within all traditions and within the human culture, its good to first build up on these themes, some may have natural inclination for this, then there seems a natural guidance beyond ordinary appearences.

    If we say people just read books and define spirituality by book knowledge, there is a problem with this, because that's how most people are taught to learn, so I see this as an unfair statement. And many learned advanced people will always refer to texts as authority rather that just claim it as their own special unique realization. The same type or people will criticize if they dont know the things from the books, so its more of an inherent defect in the psyche rather than anything in reality.

    I agree with what devotees says, study the person if your looking for it in a person, there is no need for it to be rushed. We can associated with Gurus from the past in the texts. Its again this monotheistic concept of relying on an external Savior which is causing the probelm.

    Whats helped me is to always trace out more ancient routes, ancient meaning timeless, what worked then is still applicable to this day. Adi Shankara, Buddha, Bhagavad Gita, Mahabharata is just as applicable today and any time in the future as they are within the linear timeless, the application of something may change due to identities and conditions in society change but the essence remains the same. Vipassana today is the same practice as it was thousands of years ago, same with chanting and puja, reflecting on slokas. Be happy with the practice and let the rest unfold.

    Most the meanings in our spiritual development is between the words in the ability to reflect, thats where real growth and transformation seems to take place.

    Hare Krsna
    Last edited by markandeya 108 dasa; 10 August 2018 at 08:58 AM.

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