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Thread: Are our souls eternal like that of Brahman or created by Brahman?

  1. #1

    Are our souls eternal like that of Brahman or created by Brahman?

    These thoughts are always running in my mind.. Are we created by god or we exist eternally like that of god? If god created us who gave him the right to create us(because this world is full of suffering). It is like pinching a child and getting satisfied by comforting him. where is the mercy in that? why one should know god or oneself?
    or is it like...
    We exist on our own and god is helping us to get out of this suffering into eternal bliss? In that case I agree god is merciful and almighty.

  2. #2
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    Re: Are our souls eternal like that of Brahman or created by Brahman?

    Namaste

    1. "Our" existence is a phenomenon for which no one is to blame except "us" indirectly, but even then, blaming is wrong, Would you blame clouds for rainfall or lack of it? Do you blame the earth for rotating or stars for forming?

    2, First , we are the effect of mis-identification with prakruti despite being Brahman. So whom are you calling "we", "the child" or "us". "our" ?

    3. Now that we have misidentified like this, yes, BhagavAn is the form in which Brahman rescues Itself.

    There is no point in saying more until this is digested.

    || om namo bhagavate vAsudevAya ||
    || Shri KRshNArpaNamastu ||

  3. #3

    Re: Are our souls eternal like that of Brahman or created by Brahman?

    https://hinduism.stackexchange.com/q...-souls-created This gives great answer in Bagavadhgita krishna says that "there is no time that we did not exist and there is no time in future that we cease to exist" that means souls are not created. There is no birth or death for soul. But it is difficult to understand there is no starting point for soul. May be the time is an illusion. The concept is beyond human intelligence and I feel that can be only understood through meditation.

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    Re: Are our souls eternal like that of Brahman or created by Brahman?

    Namaste

    For all who are interested in complexity of creation according to the Veda, I recommend the following awesome work.

    I Conception of God arising in Vedic Literature
    The Aitareya Upanishad identifies Prajapati as Brahman, the Ultimate Reality. Prajapati is Saguna Brahman, identified with the whole creation; as well as he is the Nirguna Brahman, the unmanifest reality, one without the second.
    http://shodhganga.inflibnet.ac.in/bitstream/10603/67726/9/09_chapter%201.pdf

    II Prajapati in Samhita Literature
    It is the God Prajapati who has differentiated truth (satya) and falsehood (anrta) into two groups. He assigned the lack of faith (asraddha) to falsehood and faith (sraddha) to truth.
    http://shodhganga.inflibnet.ac.in/bitstream/10603/67726/10/10_chapter%202.pdf

    III Prajapati in Brahmana Literature
    Prajapati represents productiveness and he produced all thecreatures. He is the breath and everything here is after Prajapati. He, having created the living beings, enclosed them between the heaven and the earth. He was alone and wished to create and created. Prajapati is all the beings and he is everything. He assuredly is Brahman, for Prajapati is of the nature of Brahman. Prajapati stated as the Self (atma) and he is this universe.
    http://shodhganga.inflibnet.ac.in/bitstream/10603/67726/11/11_chapter%203.pdf

    IV Prajapati in Aranyaka Literature
    In the Aranyaka literature, Prajapati is identified with Atman and Brahman. The identification of Prajapati with Atman and Brahman in the Aranyakas leads to the concept of Prajapati’s identification with the Ultimate Reality as depicted in the Upanisadic literature. Prajapati is the Self (Atman), he is Brahman, Indra, all the gods, the five elements, earth, air, ether, water, fire.
    http://shodhganga.inflibnet.ac.in/bitstream/10603/67726/12/12_chapter%204.pdf

    V Prajapati in Upanishadic Literature
    Prajapati’s exalted position which overpowered the whole range of the Brahmanical literature has lost sight of in the principal Upanisads. We notice a new trend in the Upanjsadic literature. All the individual gods are made subordinate to the concept of Brahman who is the Absolute and Ultimate Reality according to the Upanisadic literature. It teaches the unity of the Brahman and Atman or the identity of the human Soul with the universal Self.
    http://shodhganga.inflibnet.ac.in/bitstream/10603/67726/13/13_chapter%205.pdf

    VI Prajapati alias Brahma: His emergence in Vedic Literature
    The Vedic Prajapati has merged into a new appellation ‘Brahma’ with his powers and activities which is noticeable in the Puranic literature.
    http://shodhganga.inflibnet.ac.in/bitstream/10603/67726/14/14_chapter%206.pdf

    VII Vedic Prajapati extolled as Brahma in the Puranas
    In the philosophical speculation, the impersonal Brahman or the ‘Universal Soul’ being Nirguna is eternal. While being Saguna, he manifests himself in his creation of matter and comprises within himself the three aspects of his creation, viz. Sattva, Rajas and Tamas. In the context of this material truth, this created universe is real and Brahman embraces all the three aspects of his material existence, i.e. Sattva, Rajas and Tamas.
    http://shodhganga.inflibnet.ac.in/bitstream/10603/67726/15/15_chapter%207.pdf

    Conclusion
    http://shodhganga.inflibnet.ac.in/bitstream/10603/67726/16/16_conclusion.pdf

    Source http://shodhganga.inflibnet.ac.in/handle/10603/67726

    Pranam
    Dance with Shiva - live with Shiva - merge with Shiva

  5. #5

    Re: Are our souls eternal like that of Brahman or created by Brahman?

    Quote Originally Posted by Siddharth View Post
    https://hinduism.stackexchange.com/q...-souls-created This gives great answer in Bagavadhgita krishna says that "there is no time that we did not exist and there is no time in future that we cease to exist" that means souls are not created. There is no birth or death for soul. But it is difficult to understand there is no starting point for soul. May be the time is an illusion. The concept is beyond human intelligence and I feel that can be only understood through meditation.
    namaste
    you mean...na ih abhkram nashah..ch2
    so there is continuous process of life and death but it says for some time it may take brake too .
    many planets do not carry lives does not mean they were or will not be with lives .
    looking towards different creatures from insects to human how the life goes and with what content , is it soul or different thing for others ?
    also from rigveda..dwa suparna, means double winged bird in which one wing does not perform as pure soul and other as jeeva performs .
    there is no doubt in the existence of soul but what it all is about ?
    very much unbelievable .
    JSK

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    Re: Are our souls eternal like that of Brahman or created by Brahman?

    Quote Originally Posted by Siddharth View Post
    These thoughts are always running in my mind.. Are we created by god or we exist eternally like that of god? If god created us who gave him the right to create us(because this world is full of suffering). It is like pinching a child and getting satisfied by comforting him. where is the mercy in that? why one should know god or oneself?
    or is it like...
    We exist on our own and god is helping us to get out of this suffering into eternal bliss? In that case I agree god is merciful and almighty.
    Namaste,

    Did you know the story of Amarnath (snow lingam)?

    This is the place wherein mother Parvathi requested Lord Shiva to reveal her the secret of creation. To this Lord Shiva said, no one knows the secret of creation and it is not to be revealed to anyone as well. Nevertheless to Parvathi he will certainly tell the secret but nobody else should listen to it, and hence would reveal the secret in the most secluded spot. And he brings ma Parvathi to the Amarnath spot and he whispers the secret of creation in her ears.... but sadly, as per destiny, Parvathi falls asleep during the lecture from Shiva and fails to hear the secret of creation (how souls are created).

    I do not think any human, including Acharyas knows the secret of creation, that ma Parvathi herself does not know...

    Secondly, it is believed that originally the cosmic Purusha only existed and that because of excessive boredom, he created Prakriti and then duplicated himself into creation.

    It is also believed that no one, including Purusha himself, can resist the temptation from Prakriti to act... as maya is all too powerful (if she is an identity that is independent from Purusha).

    Certain sects of Hinduism, like Vaishnavism, believe that mukthi is not for all... certain so-called bonded jeevatmas are destined to live in bondage forever.
    jai hanuman gyan gun sagar jai kapis tihu lok ujagar

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    Re: Are our souls eternal like that of Brahman or created by Brahman?

    Namaste,
    Just been wondering about this statement. I am just curious how is that you are so sure about the existence of soul/atma?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dutta View Post
    namaste
    there is no doubt in the existence of soul but what it all is about ?
    very much unbelievable .
    JSK
    satay

  8. #8

    Re: Are our souls eternal like that of Brahman or created by Brahman?

    (dear Mods, I accidentally clicked post instead of Advanced to preview...)


    Namaste Satay,
    It's certainly true that we wonder about these things. Everything is Atman; everything is God, everything is Brahman. Everything is Atman; ok, what is it? What is the nature of it, and the nature of us? Hence, Atman Gnana, knowledge of Atman. And there is a process to this, path to attain this. To attain Atman Gnana or wisdom we should practice meditation, we have to practice mauna vrata. The greatest blessing on this path is Satsang, to be blessed.. How long does it take or is it quick? Some are always around it, and have it since birth. Being around pure love, since birth they are always blessed, and become musicians, or anything else and always have this beautiful knowledge of love of God with them. In other cases, we come to God through various paths and hang on like the baby monkeys to their mother. We always come to God one way or another. We have to sometime find the sea.

    Satsang is so important, and also we know about the science of health; of Ahimsa, of meditation, so many things.

  9. #9
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    Re: Are our souls eternal like that of Brahman or created by Brahman?

    Namaste,
    Thank you for the reply.
    satay

  10. #10

    Re: Are our souls eternal like that of Brahman or created by Brahman?

    No jeevatmas are not destined to live in bondage forever. Even if you are the worst among the sinners, you can evovle and attain moksha

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