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Thread: hare krishna mahamantra

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    hare krishna mahamantra

    Pranam

    Nam sankirtan is considered as the basic part of gaudiya vaishnab tradition. shri chaitanya mahaprabhu also emphasized the importance of nam sankartan in the spiritual life of a gaudiya vaishnab follower. shri chaitanya charitamrita is one the basic gaudiya vaishnab scriptures which speaks the path of vaishnabism preached by shri chaitanya mahaprabhu. presently it is seen that every sect of gaudiya vaishnab tradition talks about importance of hare krishna maha mantra which is said to have considered the only mantra for japa but to my utter surprise, I have not found a single word about hare krishna mahamantra in the pages of chaitanya charitamrita. I am confused to think that how a grantha like chaitanya charitamrita can skip hare krishna mahamantra. the vaishnaba of that period used to do nam sankirtan with hari haraye namah krishna jadavaya namah as found in the chaitany charitamrita. therefore could any one enlighten me why chaitanya charitamrita does not mention about hare krishna mahamantra for nam sankirtan.

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    Re: hare krishna mahamantra

    Namaste Jopmala

    According to my knowledge, Chaitanya Mahaprabhu recommended the chanting of the name of Krishna (the mantra you mentioned contains Hari and Krishna - hari haraye namah krishna jadavaya namah) but he is not the propagator of the Mahamantra. It is customary, that various works and deeds are attributed to saints.

    Let me show just one example - CC Ādi 17.22

    kali-kāle nāma-rūpe kṛṣṇa-avatāra
    nāma haite haya sarva-jagat-nistāra

    Synonyms
    kali-kāle — in this Age of Kali; nāma-rūpe — in the form of the holy name; kṛṣṇa — Lord Kṛṣṇa; avatāra — incarnation; nāma — holy name; haite — from; haya — becomes; sarva — all; jagat — of the world; nistāra — deliverance.

    Translation
    In this Age of Kali, the holy name of the Lord, the Hare Kṛṣṇa mahā-mantra, is the incarnation of Lord Kṛṣṇa. Simply by chanting the holy name, one associates with the Lord directly. Anyone who does this is certainly delivered.

    The original text contains ‚the holy name‘ and ‚Krishna‘.
    In the translation ‚Hare Kṛṣṇa mahā-mantra‘ is added.

    https://vedabase.io/en/library/cc/adi/17/22/

    Kali Santarana Upanishad is considered the source. To me it is questionalbe how authentic this Upanishad is, seeming more like a Purana. And it is written 500 AD. The Upanishads are originated BC.

    https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8ZOc8b_ZHylU2pDemp0ZFhSTU9iRnlLSGZjZ1RXZw/view

    In my opinion the source of the Mahamantra is unknown.

    Pranam
    Last edited by Indialover; 23 February 2020 at 02:57 PM.
    Dance with Shiva - live with Shiva - merge with Shiva

  3. #3

    Re: hare krishna mahamantra

    Hare Krsna

    As far as I know the Hare Krsna mantra was first used by one baba ji in Jaganatha Puri, i did find some reference to it but didnt post anything. As far as I know there is controversy around its acceptance, and something about Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakur getting involved.

    Sri Chaitanya Mahaprabhu only really left Sri Siksastakam behind as his teaching in there it says

    namnam akari bahudha nija-sarva-shaktis
    tatrarpita niyamitah smarane na kalah
    etadrishi tava kripa bhagavan mamapi
    durdaivam idrisham ihajani nanuragaha

    I will leave a link at the end that takes a deeper look into
    Sri Siksastakam

    when he walked around India he just encouraged everyone to chant hari bol, this is far reaching and not limited to one mantra only, he didnt convert anyone or stop them doing what was already within their tradition. Sankirtan movement in Sri Chaitanya's time in Bengal was a reaction to Moghal rules on how they practised.

    Validity of the mantra from texts is from Kalisantaraṇopaniṣad, which according to online sources is a Vaishnava Upanishad, i cant be bothered to do more research.

    As far as I know the main Mahamantra is Omkara, this is much more universally accepted around India, Srila Prabhupada said that Hare Krsna Mahamantra is equivalent.

    Sankirtan is Turiya manifesting into the waking mind and sense consciousness, mostly mind and sense consciousness is covered by avidya, anyone can take part but usually its a group thing or something thats within public hearing, Kali yuga which is a state not a linear time phase is best suited for this state of consciousness to start with, any verbal external chanting alone or with others is helpful to control wandering mind and senses, one can transcend this more easily by external repetition because mind and senses are hard to control and this method of chanting and dancing and glorification of hari nam is the easiest and anyone can do it, one doesnt need to be from any gotra its available to everyone, so even outcastes ( whatever that means ) can take part, even a dog can take part as Srila Prabhupada said, but dogs are jnanis and carrier of Bhairava.

    Meditation is automatic so thats not a practice, one will only sleep or just be caught in endless thoughts if that is imitated and karma khanda is reduced to doing business in kali yuga. So easiest way is sankirtana and chanting is very nice, sutra chanting and recitation of texts in ancient times is known as citta bhavana, which is the same as practising Bhakti yoga, so it doesnt matter what mantra one chants, they all stem from same source and have same power, if its given in shakipat then it will have more power, but at some point it has to go inwards to the subtle then one transcends kali yuga, even in this one life span, one can still engage in sankirtana even if one is not in kali yuga. As far as the hare krsna mahamantra being the identity of the gaudia Vaisnavism thats not exactly true, in Bengal, Vrndavana and Odisha many devotees of Sri Chaitanya dont even do so much japa, they may just sing bhajan all day and not always sing hare krsna, but due it being popularized they sing it, whats the problem, it has krsna name in it so its all good hare is shakti so if they want then its ok, Mahamantra is not limited to Hare Krsna Mahamantra, this is mistake that the preaching movement has made.

    Why Srila Prabhupada and the line linking with Bhativinode Thakur spread Hare Krsna Mahamantra is because its simple, and people with no background on veda and vedanta can simple chant and its enough to bring ones consciousness out of Kali Yuga, or at least its supposed to

    https://caitanyasympos.proboards.com...AgdsrVA_SALcrc
    Last edited by markandeya 108 dasa; 25 February 2020 at 01:42 AM.

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    Re: hare krishna mahamantra

    Pranam


    Indialover thank you for your comment. I agree with you that mahaprabhu is not the propagator of hare Krishna maha mantra. To me, chaitanya mahaprabhu has established that nama sankirtan is the only way for kaliyug but those who claims to have followed gaudiya vaishnabism of chaitanya mahaprabhu’s line preaches that hare Krishna hare ram which is regarded as mahamantra has been suggested by mahaprabhu for sankirtan . but the fact is that neither mahaprabhu nor any of his parikars or bhaktas of his time used hare Krishna maha mantra for chanting or sankirtan. Instead in their sankirtan they used to sing “hari haraye namah Krishna jadabay namah” which is evident from shri chaitanya charitamrita.

    I would like to share with you that in the kalisantaran upanished we get the verse as “ hare ram hare ram ram ram hare hare// hare Krishna hare Krishna Krishna Krishna hare hare” but now a days the mantra is chanted as “ hare Krishna hare Krishna Krishna Krishna hare hare // hare ram hare ram ram ram hare hare” the original first line becomes second and original second line becomes first. I do not find the reason behind this change.

    One more point I disagree with you is that the verse you mentioned says “ kali kale nama rupe krishna avatara”. I think this nama does not necessarily mean hare Krishna mahamantra . I reiterate that hare Krishna maha mantra does not find its place in the chaitranya charitamrita which implies that this mahamantra was not so popular till the grantha was written by krishnadas kabiraj as it is now.

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    Re: hare krishna mahamantra

    Pranam markandeya 108 dasa


    Thank you for your post. I do agree with you. One more point I would like to share with you . As you know right from bhakti vinod thakur to prabhupad and all their branches are dead against fish eating. In the other day I was reading the book written by das narottam “ brihat bhakti tattva sar”, in the chapter pashanda dalan quoting from padma purana he says “ stri sangi toil gaya, matsya Jodi khaya// tathapi vaishnabattva tar kobhu nahi jaya” . that means even if one eats fish, he does loss his vainabattva . in other way vaishnab can eat fish without any fear. We see prabhupada and his followers quotes from das narottam’s writings but I am surprised to find how they miss this important issue.

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    Re: hare krishna mahamantra

    ... that the verse you mentioned says “ kali kale nama rupe krishna avatara”. I think this nama does not necessarily mean hare Krishna mahamantra . I reiterate that hare Krishna maha mantra does not find its place in the chaitranya charitamrita ...

    That’s exactly what I wrote, jopmala, the translator did not stick to the original verse.

    The original text contains ‚the holy name‘ and ‚Krishna‘.

    In the translation ‚Hare Kṛṣṇa mahā-mantra‘ is added.

    Pranam
    Dance with Shiva - live with Shiva - merge with Shiva

  7. #7

    Re: hare krishna mahamantra

    Quote Originally Posted by jopmala View Post
    Pranam markandeya 108 dasa


    Thank you for your post. I do agree with you. One more point I would like to share with you . As you know right from bhakti vinod thakur to prabhupad and all their branches are dead against fish eating. In the other day I was reading the book written by das narottam “ brihat bhakti tattva sar”, in the chapter pashanda dalan quoting from padma purana he says “ stri sangi toil gaya, matsya Jodi khaya// tathapi vaishnabattva tar kobhu nahi jaya” . that means even if one eats fish, he does loss his vainabattva . in other way vaishnab can eat fish without any fear. We see prabhupada and his followers quotes from das narottam’s writings but I am surprised to find how they miss this important issue.

    hare Krsna jopmala

    The king of Manipur was the first to introduce gaudiya vaishnava practice to Manipur in the line of narottam das thakur

    it is not uncommon for gaudiya vaishnava there to eat fish

    however this was a few hundred years ago and the market situation and trade is now very different, before diet was based on living off the land, now it’s part of a mass economy draining the natural resources

    In certain rural and coast lines they may have to depend on that diet for survival and for that I can’t see what’s wrong with it unless they are supposed to starve as they may have less choice

    srila Prabhupada spoke out against slaughter houses

    Gaudia math is an ashram based society which offers all bhoga to guru and murti so I wonder if there is anything said about meat fish or eggs being offered in that the way for prasadam

    so some discretion is needed to find the right balance

    hare krsna

  8. #8

    Re: hare krishna mahamantra

    Indialover

    Kali Santarana Upanishad is considered the source. To me it is questionalbe how authentic this Upanishad is, seeming more like a Purana. And it is written 500 AD. The Upanishads are originated BC.

    i wouldn’t be to concerned about dates as they are manufactured to fit into colonialism and their interpretations. vedas upanishads and the rest have very little to do with dates, they are all traced back to rishis whose origins are beyond linear timelines

    hare krsna

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    Re: hare krishna mahamantra

    Quote Originally Posted by markandeya 108 dasa View Post
    hare Krsna jopmala

    The king of Manipur was the first to introduce gaudiya vaishnava practice to Manipur in the line of narottam das thakur

    it is not uncommon for gaudiya vaishnava there to eat fish

    however this was a few hundred years ago and the market situation and trade is now very different, before diet was based on living off the land, now it’s part of a mass economy draining the natural resources

    In certain rural and coast lines they may have to depend on that diet for survival and for that I can’t see what’s wrong with it unless they are supposed to starve as they may have less choice

    srila Prabhupada spoke out against slaughter houses

    Gaudia math is an ashram based society which offers all bhoga to guru and murti so I wonder if there is anything said about meat fish or eggs being offered in that the way for prasadam

    so some discretion is needed to find the right balance

    hare krsna
    Hare Krishna markandeya 108 dasa


    I shall comment on last two lines only. Yes every sect has its discretion to decide ‘Dos’ and ‘Donts’ for its followers but from the point of view of day to day life and food habit, some ashram based societies like ram Krishna mission or bharat sebashram sangha and many others maintain a difference between the followers who are staying in their own house ( Grihi) and who are staying in the ashram itself. However, those staying in the ashram have to eat veg. such difference can not be seen in gaudiya math followers. the first and foremost condition of initiation ( diksha) in gaudiya math is ‘ ban on fish eating’ irrespective of where one staying , have no choice and they can not tolerate those who eat fish. I think Narottam Das thakur is a big name in the gaudiya vaishnab family and if he declares that one does not lose his vaishnabatta if he eats fish, it definitely bears some weight and should have been given due respect. Regarding rest of your post , I am with you.

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    Re: hare krishna mahamantra

    Namaste Markadeya 108 dasa

    … they are all traced back to rishis whose origins are beyond linear timelines.

    Definitely, but we cannot rule out subjective and ideological adjustments over the centuries, especially in translated Upanishads. Discussions between Brahma and Narada just make me question authenticity … Upanishads talk about Brahman and if they mention a Creator it is Prajapati.

    * * * * *

    Namaste jopmala

    Why should killing a chicken be different from killing a fish? Both are animals, creatures who feel pain. I was already confronted with the differentiation in childhood when on Good Friday meat was not allowed, but fish.

    There are vegetarians who refrain from meat, but eat fish. One can be vegetarian for health or ethical reasons. The ethical reason cannot exclude fish. Apart from exceptions, Markandeya mentioned … nowadays we do not eat animals to survive, but to satisfay the tounge. To reconsider centuries-old rules is not against the authority of whoever set it up that time.

    Pranam
    Dance with Shiva - live with Shiva - merge with Shiva

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