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Thread: For Proper Understanding of Srila Prabhupada's Books

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    For Proper Understanding of Srila Prabhupada's Books

    Namaste!

    I got the idea of this thread after reading the thread A.C. Bhakitvendenta Swami prabhupada is misogynistic

    In the following link the gaudiya-vaishnava guru Srila Bhaktivedanta Narayana Maharaja defends Srila Prabhupada:
    For Proper Understanding of Srila Prabhupada's Books

    Pranama

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    Re: For Proper Understanding of Srila Prabhupada's Books

    Namaste

    It is customary for inappropriate statements made by a person in the spotlight to be relativized by one or more speakers.

    Prabhupada's despising words about women cannot be whitewashed.

    But we have to consider

    He was born in 1896, came to the West in 1965 – what could be expected from a 70 years old man, coming from a totally different culture, talking in a foreign language? I, too, express myself more eloquently in my mother tongue than in English.

    He came to the West, when the man/woman relationship was still different. In the West too, women were subordinate to men, thus his statements did not bother anyone. For example women's suffrage was introduced in Germany in 1918, in Switzerland in 1971.

    The women’s so called ‘fight for their rights’ began in the early 1970s.

    Much of what Prabhupada said and foretold regarding Western society was and became true. He just expressed himself clumsily.

    Next point is a statement from the attached link

    If ladies are so low-class and so low in intelligence, how could the gopis have defeated even Lord Sri Krsna?

    On boloji I recently found an interesting essay

    Arjuna was a Kshatriya, perceived to be the second highest rung of the Hindu caste-ladder (below Brahmins but above Vaisyas), Krishna, Vyasa as well as Sanjaya were Shudras, the supposedly low end of it.

    https://www.boloji.com/articles/5242...s-caste-biases

    Enjoy reading!
    Pranam
    Dance with Shiva - live with Shiva - merge with Shiva

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    Re: For Proper Understanding of Srila Prabhupada's Books

    Namaste

    Turkish President banished a women to the sofa.

    https://www.politico.eu/article/sofa...ayyip-erdogan/

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4OEm_gUi8gY

    Pranam
    Dance with Shiva - live with Shiva - merge with Shiva

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    Re: For Proper Understanding of Srila Prabhupada's Books

    Namaste

    Just to hold you up to date - the scandal is still going on, becoming a burlesque and showing so clearly the condition of the EU. Meanwhile Sofagate is even to be found on wikipedia.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sofagate

    Erdogan again and again succeeds in provoking the EU. It would have been wise by a person in such a high position as von der Leyen (president of EU commission) just not to react. But she cannot find peace. Now she blames Michel from Belgium to be the one who allowed that she had been treated so badly because he did not intervene.

    EU Commission President Ursula von der Leyen does not want to accept such treatment again. In a conversation with Charles Michel, von der Leyen made it clear that she would never allow such a situation again, according to the EU Commission on Monday evening in Brussels. Michel explained that such an incident should not be repeated from his point of view. A spokesman announced that the Belgian would once again express his deep regrets at a meeting with representatives of the European Parliament on Tuesday (April 13).

    I would like to know what Indians think when they read about it.
    https://www.hindustantimes.com/world-news/eus-michel-says-he-s-sleeping-badly-after-sofa-gaffe-in-turkey-101618052228960.html

    When Prabhupada came to the West problems like this did not exist. Women had their pride and didn't care if someone called them little intelligent. What would happen today with him …???

    Pranam
    Dance with Shiva - live with Shiva - merge with Shiva

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    Re: For Proper Understanding of Srila Prabhupada's Books

    Namaste

    Continuation

    Although meanwhile everyone knows

    The President of the EU Council (Charles Michel (m)) ranks ahead of the President of the Commission (Ursula von der Leyen (f)). According to the EU's protocol-based hierarchy, the President of the European Council (Charles Michel (m)) is virtually the head of state and the EU Commission President (Ursula von der Leyen (f)) is the head of government.

    Monday this week von der Leyen again vented her anger on the stage of the EU Parliament. She believes that she was treated like this because she was a woman: ‘I felt hurt and left alone, as a woman and as a European’, was her conclusion, with which she again blamed Council President Michel.

    Since 3 weeks nobody dares to say anything - correcting a woman, no matter how justified, would be the greatest possible faux pas.

    Only her predecessor, Jean-Claude Juncker, who has nothing to loose, stated: ‘It was clear to everyone that from a protocol point of view, the President of the Council is number one, I usually had a chair next to the President's chair, but sometimes I sat on a sofa.’

    I am a woman and I have had a successful professional life. I have never felt disadvantaged and generally got on better with men than with women. With the rise of feminism, the balance became disordered because women in principle claimed the role of victim for themselves and were successful with it. Women like Ursula von der Leyen are immature, not suitable for such a high office. Men never make such a fuss about themselves.

    If someone is interested in her complete speech
    https://ec.europa.eu/commission/pres...SPEECH_21_1965

    May be to be continued ...

    Pranam
    Dance with Shiva - live with Shiva - merge with Shiva

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    Re: For Proper Understanding of Srila Prabhupada's Books

    Namaskar!

    Quote Originally Posted by Indialover View Post
    On boloji I recently found an interesting essay

    Arjuna was a Kshatriya, perceived to be the second highest rung of the Hindu caste-ladder (below Brahmins but above Vaisyas), Krishna, Vyasa as well as Sanjaya were Shudras, the supposedly low end of it.

    https://www.boloji.com/articles/5242...s-caste-biases

    Enjoy reading!
    Pranam
    Please note that it is not true that Krishna was a shudra.
    Actually He was born in a kshatriya family: his true parents were Vasudeva and Devaki.
    Shortly after birth He was adopted by a vaishya family: Nanda and Yashoda.
    Anyway He was a true kshatriya,in fact He ruled the city called Dvaraka.

    Furthermore the caste system was rejected more than 500 years ago by Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu,the founder of gaudiya-vaishnavism.
    According to gaudiya-vaishnavism,there should not be prevarication among the four varnas but total cooperation for material and spiritual progress.

    A great example of Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu's mercy is that he accepted a born muslim as his disciple,despite the birth in a muslim family was considered a disgrace by vaishnavas that lived in their time.
    Last edited by orlando; 14 June 2021 at 11:24 AM.

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    Re: For Proper Understanding of Srila Prabhupada's Books

    Namaste

    No Indian has to justify the wrongly so called caste system. The term caste was brought by the Portugueses to India, it derives from their word casta.

    The source of varna is Purusha Sukta, how could varna be rejected? What society makes of it is a different matter …

    Christian society was structured according to three classes - clergy, knight, peasant – what is exactly brahmana, kshatriya, vaishya. The link shows a famous picture where Jesus assigns the tasks to the three classes.

    https://www.kleio.org/de/geschichte/.../alltag/kap_i/

    On the left the pope, tu supplex ora - you pray. On the right the emperor, tu protege - you protect. In the middle two farmers, tuque labora - and you work.

    In ancient Rome, the proletariat (shudra) referred to the social class of landless and propertyless wage-dependent citizens.

    Today’s society is different but still fourfold clergy, government, industry/traders/farmers, employed/workers.

    Pranam
    Dance with Shiva - live with Shiva - merge with Shiva

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    Re: For Proper Understanding of Srila Prabhupada's Books

    Namaste,

    Thank you for describing the European stratification of society.

    Regarding the disrespect shown to EU Commision President, it is a battle of wills - her not letting it go and Erdogan, the bully not offering an apology.

    On a side note, Turkey was a progressive, secular Islamic country and the army ensured that it was run that way. With Erdogen coming to power, the army and civil service were purged of the secular generals/officers and only Islamic leaning, Erdogen supporters were allowed to continue. He has become something of a strongman who makes sure that only he and his cronies win every election. He has solidified his connection with the Muslim world while telling Europe that Turkey should be considered a European nation. Because of political and geographical compulsions, EU continues to ignore lack of freedoms and radicalization of society in Turkey and accepts Erdogen as a leader instead of considering him a thug that he really is.

    Pranam.

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    Re: For Proper Understanding of Srila Prabhupada's Books

    @Believer ji,

    Your knowledge of current affairs, international politics, and in general all your threads here are so informative! Kudos.

    @OP,

    Yesterday I had some thoughts about acharyas in general and I was reminded of this thread.

    Acharyas, even if they had profound exposure to god/godliness and had direct revelations, they are still bound to personal bias on certain fronts, pertaining to their up-bringing and belief system. For example, Srimad Ramanuja, the great South Indian Srivaishnava saint declared Shiva to be a 'demigod', but what I know of Shiva from reliable sources, proves to me he is a supreme god. Not at all a demi or semi god.

    Acharya Srila Prabhupada is a noble sant. HG Amarendra Dasa in one of his lectures, talks about how ISKCON flourished with acharya's efforts from the ground-up with no financial contribution from acharya on his behalf........... how when one of the founders of ISKCON was praying for money for the organization when some bird (presumably a pigeon) dropped a bagful of money on his doorfront, and so forth! Yes, this truly happened, I am searching for the lecture, and will add to the thread, when found. It all happened with sant Prabhupada's effort, he has really done tremendous service to the world by his mission and advocating 16 rounds of mahamantra japa each day and coming upon truly wonderful set of guidelines for ISKCON devotees. But that said, even he is subject to personal bias and cognitive bias in understanding some revelations, and therefore some comments can be dismissed.

    To me, a man is worthy of followership when he is duty bound, and has led a pure life. Sant Prabhupad ji is that and much more!

    Regards and best wishes.
    jai hanuman gyan gun sagar jai kapis tihu lok ujagar

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    Re: For Proper Understanding of Srila Prabhupada's Books

    Hello Viraja ji,

    After reading your message, my wonder..

    Do we even go to the heights of judging acharyas with our limited undertsanding and knowldge? Or accept and realize they have real knowledge and blessings of the Lord - for their philosophical positions?? I prefer to the take the words of Acharyans as the final and will do my best to adjust my opinions ( or call it improve the quality and standards of my opinions).

    In the schools of Shri Ramanuja - there can be only one Supreme Lord!

    Hare Krshna

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