Changing Gurus?

[devisarada]

Namaste All,

How does one respectfully tell one's Guru that one has outgrown him, and still maintain a good relationship?

[Madhavan]

Namaste Devi,

What is the meaning of "outgrowing a guru"?

Does it mean

a) becoming more knowledgeable than the guru
b) Having some spiritual experience not experienced by the guru?
c) Guru's teaching becoming irrelevant or obsolete
d) Having a difference of opinion with guru
e) something else

If it is b), c) or d), it can be mentioned to the guru in a humble tone, and if the guru is really a guru, then he will either understand you or try to convince you. If it is a), it is likely the guru was either an unworthy one, or the student is of an egoistic nature.

Whatever, if the guru is an authentic one, one can maintain a good relationship regardless of the cause of disagreement. Otherwise, such a guru is not worthy of being called a guru in the first place. All real gurus consider the world to be their friend and family, and a disciple can never really cause him unhappiness.

[satay]

Namaskar!

Namaste All,

How does one respectfully tell one's Guru that one has outgrown him, and still maintain a good relationship?

Just like one tells his parents that he is ready to move out of the house on his own...

In my opinion, a guru is like a mother or a father...just like a mother or a father would understand so should a guru...

just my humble opinion.

[devisarada]

Namaste Devi,
What is the meaning of "outgrowing a guru"?

Does it mean

a) becoming more knowledgeable than the guru
b) Having some spiritual experience not experienced by the guru?
c) Guru's teaching becoming irrelevant or obsolete
d) Having a difference of opinion with guru
e) something else

If it is b), c) or d), it can be mentioned to the guru in a humble tone, and if the guru is really a guru, then he will either understand you or try to convince you. If it is a), it is likely the guru was either an unworthy one, or the student is of an egoistic nature.

Whatever, if the guru is an authentic one, one can maintain a good relationship regardless of the cause of disagreement. Otherwise, such a guru is not worthy of being called a guru in the first place. All real gurus consider the world to be their friend and family, and a disciple can never really cause him unhappiness.

Namaste Madhavan,

E, something else, is the cause for my concern. My Guru as asked me a number of times if I believe that he is God, or if I think he is perfect. He is very unhappy when I say that he is not God, but my direct link to God, and that he is not perfect because as a human being, how can any one be perfect. Then he quoted " Gurur Brahma, Gurur Vishnur, Gurur Devo Mahehsvara" and said does that not show that he is God?

Then he gave me a shawl with Devangari script. I asked him what it said, he said "Shri Ramaya Namah"
well, later, at home I looked at the picture on it. It was of Lord Krishna and Radha. So I found a site on the
internet, and after some time was able to translate it to be "Shri Radhe Shyam"

Because of these things, I am having doubts of his authenticity as a spiritual Guru.

[Agnideva]

Namaste Devi,

E, something else, is the cause for my concern. My Guru as asked me a number of times if I believe that he is God, or if I think he is perfect. He is very unhappy when I say that he is not God, but my direct link to God, and that he is not perfect because as a human being, how can any one be perfect. Then he quoted " Gurur Brahma, Gurur Vishnur, Gurur Devo Mahehsvara" and said does that not show that he is God?

Then he gave me a shawl with Devangari script. I asked him what it said, he said "Shri Ramaya Namah"
well, later, at home I looked at the picture on it. It was of Lord Krishna and Radha. So I found a site on the
internet, and after some time was able to translate it to be "Shri Radhe Shyam"

Because of these things, I am having doubts of his authenticity as a spiritual Guru.

All of this sounds rather fishy and strange. Do you know if this guru belongs to any traditional and authentic lineage?

OM Shanti,
A.

[devisarada]

Namaste Devi,

All of this sounds rather fishy and strange. Do you know if this guru belongs to any traditional and authentic lineage?

OM Shanti,
A.

Namaste Agnideva,

Thank-you for your interest in my dilemma. My guru is a pundit from a Brahmin family whose last name is Doobay. He was taught by his grandfather.

[Madhavan]

Namaste Madhavan,

E, something else, is the cause for my concern. My Guru as asked me a number of times if I believe that he is God, or if I think he is perfect. He is very unhappy when I say that he is not God, but my direct link to God, and that he is not perfect because as a human being, how can any one be perfect. Then he quoted " Gurur Brahma, Gurur Vishnur, Gurur Devo Mahehsvara" and said does that not show that he is God?

Then he gave me a shawl with Devangari script. I asked him what it said, he said "Shri Ramaya Namah"
well, later, at home I looked at the picture on it. It was of Lord Krishna and Radha. So I found a site on the
internet, and after some time was able to translate it to be "Shri Radhe Shyam"

Because of these things, I am having doubts of his authenticity as a spiritual Guru.

Honestly I dont think any guru would force someone to beleive that he is God or that he is perfect. This guru does not appear too convincing...

Even Lord Krishna says to Arjuna:

For one whose mind is unbridled, self−realization is difficult work. But he whose mind is controlled and who strives by appropriate means is assured of success. That is My opinion. { 6.36}

There are numerous places where God himself states something and also adds that this is his 'opinion' so that it is left to Arjuna whether to accept it or not. When this is attitude of God of not forcing his 'beleifs' upon others, where does a human guru stand with respect to perfection?

[devisarada]

Honestly I dont think any guru would force someone to beleive that he is God or that he is perfect. This guru does not appear too convincing...

Even Lord Krishna says to Arjuna:

For one whose mind is unbridled, self−realization is difficult work. But he whose mind is controlled and who strives by appropriate means is assured of success. That is My opinion. { 6.36}

There are numerous places where God himself states something and also adds that this is his 'opinion' so that it is left to Arjuna whether to accept it or not. When this is attitude of God of not forcing his 'beleifs' upon others, where does a human guru stand with respect to perfection?

Namaste Madhavan,

I fully agree with you. I have been thinking seriously of dissolving this Guru - chela relationship , but I wanted someone else's opinion, because I believe that such a relationship is sacred and should not be broken lightly.

[satay]

Namaste Madhavan,

E, something else, is the cause for my concern. My Guru as asked me a number of times if I believe that he is God, or if I think he is perfect. He is very unhappy when I say that he is not God, but my direct link to God, and that he is not perfect because as a human being, how can any one be perfect. Then he quoted " Gurur Brahma, Gurur Vishnur, Gurur Devo Mahehsvara" and said does that not show that he is God?

'unhappy when you say that he is not God'... that's a rather red sign for me personally...If it were me, I would drop this relationship.

In my opinion, 'gurur brahma...' realization should come at its own not by guru insisting that he is brahma, vishnu and mahehsvara and then become unhappy if he was incapable of helping the sishya realize this truth!!

It is very easy to be a conman guru...

[meez]

Would it be too awkward to bring this up to him and explain your concerns? I ask because I certainly understand how these situations can be fragile.