"Human" Is A Level Of Consciousness

[sarabhanga]

Fact! There is absolutely NO notion of 'lower' and 'higher' in the Darwinian theory of evolution by natural selection.

To say that Darwinian evolution by natural selection is progressive from 'lower' to 'higher' is simply an erroneous extrapolation made on teleological grounds.

Namaste Rishi,

In Biology, “low” means “advanced to a lesser degree, or having a simple or primitive organization”, and “high” means “advanced to a greater degree, or having a complex or more developed organization”.

A “lower” organism has more primitive characteristics (nearer to the original condition), and a “higher” organism has more advanced characteristics (more derived and distant from the original condition).

As random changes accumulate over time, some lineages of organism progressively advance to a more derived state that is more distant from their ancestral condition. And some lineages remain less changed over time and thus retain more of their primitive ancestral characteristics. And when one imagines the evolutionary tree of life, some branches are placed higher than others (which are naturally considered as lower).

Natural selection automatically directs all life towards perfection, and Darwin certainly did not consider that life was entirely without purpose!

I have made no erroneous extrapolations! It is only you who has imagined some implied judgment of relative validity in the words “low” and “high” ! varAha is certainly no less valid than nRsiMha or rAma or kRSNa ~ each one is a perfect expression for the particular conditions of his time.

And I used the words “high” and “low” in inverted commas in the first instance, to indicate that the words were being used in a particular sense, which you have chosen to ignore.

Rama descends in every treta yuga and Sri Krishna descends in every dwapar yuga.

But there are TEN archetypal incarnations, and only FOUR yugAni in a mahAyugam, so it is not possible for every avatAra to return in every mahAyugam (unless more than one avatAra shares the stage in each yugam).

There are even descriptions of Ramavatars from previous treta yugas recorded in the Puranas.

Are you sure? There are three rAmAvatArA (parashurAma, balarAma, and rAmacandra), and rAma will be a RSi in the next manvantaram.

The events of previous kalpas are also mentioned. For example, it is described in Srimad Bhagavatam that Varaha actually descended just before the beginning of this current kalpa over 2 billion years ago and saved Earth from the previous devastation. That was the first appearance of Varaha out of two in this kalpa and, once again, there were humans described during BOTH appearances of Varaha.

varAha appeared at the beginning of this kalpa, in the subtle “72nd manvantaram”, the “15th dawn” which is assumed at the commencement of every kalpa. This saMdhyA lasts for 1,728,000 years, and it was during this period of total dissolution that varAha rose from the cosmic flood with the earth itself on his tusks. Nothing can be known of the preceding “night of brahma”, and nothing is known with any certainty about the presumed “day of brahmA” before that.

And how could there have been living humans on the earth during this first dawning of creation? By what means were they supported? Perhaps they were just floating around the void in some indestructible space-ship that persists even through pralaya??

The saptarishi are not 'humans' as we understand them, they are UNIVERSALLY mentioned as 'celestial sages'. So their abode in any case is NOT the gross physical Earth.

Again, this is blatant nonsense! Every brAhmaNa is connected with a RSi, as a member of his ancient gotram. And for those who were actually born in a brAhmaNa family this is much more than just a spiritual connection with their preceptor, it is also a genetic inheritance that goes back to their familial patriarch, the greatest of all their grandfathers!

It is clear that you have never penetrated the daNDakAraNyam, where their original hermitages are quite evident.

33,750th of a second is called a 'truti' in Sanskrit and was the smallest known division of time in the ancient Vedic civilization.

A truTi is actually composed of 18 paramANu, and a paramANu is the smallest possible unit of time.

Srila Prabhupada, the world's most renowned Vedic scholar of the modern era

Hmmm…

Have you read the entire book or at least most of it?

I have read enough to track down the source of each of the “anomalies” that you mentioned.

[atanu]

Namaste Sarabhanga
--
Have you read the entire book or at least most of it? Many of the archaeological anomalies (such as various bones and artifacts) described are not limited to mere anecdotes in local newspapers and journals, but are actually on display even today in museums and exhibitions.

Namaste Rishi,

I am a bit surprised that reliance on the words of a book, which purportedly proves the scientific evidences as hoaxes, has become the only proof against well searched out evidences of well meaning scientists. If the evidences mentioned in the book are on display (which you or me or Sarabhanga have not seen) so are on display many evidences of many scientists, who however do not claim that the concepts are foolproof or un-changeable.

Finding some flaws in the link of evidences do no not invalidate 'Natural Selection' concept, in favour of a pre-conceived notion, which is based on a particular style of scriptural interpretation.

To me, the point is not whether ID is more correct than NS or vice-versa, but whether ID can be taught in science classes or not?

ID proponents want it to be forced upon science classes. Is it necessary?

Srila Prabhupada, the world's most renowned Vedic scholar of the modern era, had this to say about human antiquity

Well, I think most ID assertions may be such assertions -- beliefs -- without evidence and un-verifiable.

--------------------------

Regarding Buddhi being Lord's nature, I must remind that Pragnya Ghana -- Shushupti, is Turya's nature and remains unchangeable and ONE, though manifesting various forms in dreams and waking states.


I thus object to your basic premise: ""Himavan" is a level of Consciousness". I would rather write: "Himavan is a level of awareness of the Conscious being, who is truly and actually pure consciousness"


Om

[sarabhanga]

But there are TEN archetypal incarnations, and only FOUR yugAni in a mahAyugam, so it is not possible for every avatAra to return in every mahAyugam (unless more than one avatAra shares the stage in each yugam).

In the kRta (or satya) yugam, there are four avatArAs ~ matsya, kUrma, varAha, and nRsiMha.

In the tretAyugam, there are three avatArAs ~ vAmana, parashurAma, and rAmacandra.

In the dvAparayugam, there are two avatArAs ~ balarAma and kRSNa.

And in the kaliyugam, there is one final avatAra ~ kalki.

[skhandelwal]

Sarabhanga, I really like you as a well-informed sage, but you have got to stop typing sanskrit...may be type its english in bracket....coz you have no idea about the hastle I have to go through, translating your posts....since you already know the meaning, may be you can do all of us a favor.

And Rishi, you deserve an applaud from me, at the age of 19, you have certainly achieved the feat. You may not be right about this argument, but the way you present your arguments, and conclude them is pretty impressive.

Now, for the argument itself, There are 14 senses(according to hinduism-senses: tools to precieve and comprehend reality), and buddhi, just like manas, is on of them....therefore, how can it remain fixed? It is my understanding that Rishi takes winner on this one.

14: gyanendriyas, the karmendriyas, manas, buddhi, chitta and ahankara

Now, about the evolution theory, it is similar to the big bang theory, the reason it exists is b/c it explains how we got here the best....doesn't mean its the fact, but it only means that it is the most consistent theory backed up by unrefutable evidence out there.

First thing is first, how the heck can an organism form w/o cells??? IT CANNOT.
Therefore, cells come first, their union makes organism. And it seems to be the most logical guess that they unionized to survive the atmostphere. Later, the most logical explanation of how all different varieties of species came into shape is mutation...you tell me another story which makes more sense....and I will believe your story Rishi. It was our accidental enlarged head shape and bent thumb which allowed us to use tools wisely.

Don't be disappointed Rishi for being bullied...it is just that on this forum, the smartest hindus get together and have discusions, so you have to be careful not to claim something you cannot totally backup.

[Znanna]

Namaste,

Back to the notion of "human is a level of consciousness" ...


What other levels of consciousness might there be aside from human?

And, do you define human as other than, say alien or Godz? Wherein are the differences?

Can humans have more than one level of consciousness, and if so, are they simultaneous or discrete in order of time?

Enquiring minds want to know



Love,
ZN

[Bob G]

Hello People,
I'm jumping in here quickly without study of all the other posts...please pardon me for that. Anyway, my quick take is that in Hinduism all the levels of consciousness can basically be correlated to or with the list of tattvas.

Om